Any horse who breaks through gate prior to start should be scratched

[devilsbag]

One of the 92%ers:

YouTube

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by chadk66

Track vet makes 99% of all post parade/immediately prior to start decisions on scratching. They just make a radio call to stewards and say this ones out. Stewards don't argue with the track vet. And as stated above it's extremely rare, so much so that I would think you'd have a hard time establishing any real usable statistics from it. It's only happened to me twice. Once with a lightly raced horse that was probably 15 to 1 and she finished mid pack. One was with a solid horse that was 6-1 and he won after breaking through the gate. Out rider snatched him up immediately. It was more a fluke deal than him being a jackass or anything like that. Didn't really affect him at all.

Accurate. Truth be told most vet scratches are initiated by the jockeys themselves. They can detect something amiss that may not show up in the form of overt soreness in the warm up. They also know if one feels different from the times before. Talk about 99%. It's 100% when a jock wants one out. Not a vet in the world will take a chance of one going down and it later being found out the jock didn't want to ride the horse.

Another thing that's very common is when the vet see one that obviously, for all to see, is travelling really badly. He'll call the jock over to have the horse jog in front of him. But the rider will say don't worry doc. I know he looks really rough but that's just him. He'll be fine. I'll get him around there. Most times the vet will trust what the jock says and let the horse run.

Trainers will also tell the vet. Don't worry. He's really shaky early in the post parade but he'll warm up out of it. My jock knows what to do and he'll be fine during the race. They better be right. If it goes bad just one time credibility can be quickly lost.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by biggestal99

Most of them ran up the track.

One day I will pay dearly when one of those chalkies win.

But so far my luck has held out.

maybe 4 or 5 times total.

So when I do lose and the chalkie wins, I will have other players money to pay off.

Allan

Except you'll be paying 10-1 or 20-1 or 30-1 and you haven't been MAKING 10-1 or 20-1 or 30-1 laying bets...but you're pretty shameless with your exchange BS so you probably thought no one would notice that.

[biggestal99]

Originally Posted by castaway01

Except you'll be paying 10-1 or 20-1 or 30-1 and you haven't been MAKING 10-1 or 20-1 or 30-1 laying bets...but you're pretty shameless with your exchange BS so you probably thought no one would notice that.

If you can read. And can stop calling my exchange promotion BS for a moment or two or three"...I only bet if a chalkie runs though the gate beofore the start.
So I am laying 2-1 or less NEVER 10-1. I only bet when I have an edge and a horse running though the gate is a huge edge IMHO.

Read my entire posts for a change.

Allan

[chadk66]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

Accurate. Truth be told most vet scratches are initiated by the jockeys themselves. They can detect something amiss that may not show up in the form of overt soreness in the warm up. They also know if one feels different from the times before. Talk about 99%. It's 100% when a jock wants one out. Not a vet in the world will take a chance of one going down and it later being found out the jock didn't want to ride the horse.

Another thing that's very common is when the vet see one that obviously, for all to see, is travelling really badly. He'll call the jock over to have the horse jog in front of him. But the rider will say don't worry doc. I know he looks really rough but that's just him. He'll be fine. I'll get him around there. Most times the vet will trust what the jock says and let the horse run.

Trainers will also tell the vet. Don't worry. He's really shaky early in the post parade but he'll warm up out of it. My jock knows what to do and he'll be fine during the race. They better be right. If it goes bad just one time credibility can be quickly lost.

100% correct. I had a horse once that was so crooked legged his front legs looked like egg beaters when he ran. I always told the jock you'll be perfectly fine as long as you don't look down lol. Truth be told he was sound as a rock. And he had one of the biggest hearts in the barn. Put that heart in a horse with some ability and it would have been a stakes horse.

[v j stauffer]

Originally Posted by chadk66

100% correct. I had a horse once that was so crooked legged his front legs looked like egg beaters when he ran. I always told the jock you'll be perfectly fine as long as you don't look down lol. Truth be told he was sound as a rock. And he had one of the biggest hearts in the barn. Put that heart in a horse with some ability and it would have been a stakes horse.

" Don't look down " EPIC!

[bobphilo]

Originally Posted by devilsbag

One of the 92%ers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxP24eAq-zg

You could not have picked a worse example. Despite the narrow loss to Exceller, this was generally considered to be Slews best performance ever. After battling through suicidal fractions with Affirmed, who could not be rated when his saddle slipped, he left him for dead at the head of the stretch, he was caught by the excellently rated Exceller and was actually coming back at him at the end of the grueling mile and a half. just missing at the wire. If that's what breaking through does to a horse I'll bet on the breakthrough every time.

[bobphilo]

Originally Posted by bobphilo

You could not have picked a worse example. Despite the narrow loss to Exceller, this was generally considered to be Slews best performance ever. After battling through suicidal fractions with Affirmed, who could not be rated when his saddle slipped, he left him for dead at the head of the stretch, he was caught by the excellently rated Exceller and was actually coming back at him at the end of the grueling mile and a half. just missing at the wire. If that's what breaking through does to a horse I'll bet on the breakthrough every time.

Dinny,

When I reacted to your post with the Seattle Slew video I didn't realize it was you satirizing Zippy Chippys' crazy breakthrough theory and thought it came from him trying to defend it. Sorry for the mix-up if I sounded sarcastic.
Your post was one of the best satires exposing this nutty theory I've seen here.

[davew]

Originally Posted by ZippyChippy423

We have all seen and heard it before. Horse breaks through gate prior to start almost always loses the race. It’s true and factual.....well statistically it happens about 92% of the time. Why if you are the owner or trainer would you want that horse to run after a gate break? Are the starter or vet only allowed to make that call?

I have seen some break through the gate and the gate crew person has a snug hold and the horse only gets a head out, some get a few yards pulling the gate crew person as well, some get out and it takes the jockey a couple furlongs to stop, some break through and jockey falls off going half a lap before outriders catch the horse .... do you want to treat all the same and scratch them all?

[clicknow]

Originally Posted by bobphilo

You could not have picked a worse example.

I don't care.. he posted the race video, which made my morning, as I conveniently got to watch it again.

(one of those stop-to-smell-the-roses-moments).

[chadk66]

Originally Posted by v j stauffer

" Don't look down " EPIC!

What was even funnier was the horse was named "Fling It At Em"

[bobphilo]

Originally Posted by clicknow

I don't care.. he posted the race video, which made my morning, as I conveniently got to watch it again.

(one of those stop-to-smell-the-roses-moments).

That was truly a great race. I remember seeing it live that day. Thanks to You Tube we can see it whenever we want to bring back the moment.

[therussmeister]

Originally Posted by ZippyChippy423

We have all seen and heard it before. Horse breaks through gate prior to start almost always loses the race. It’s true and factual.....well statistically it happens about 92% of the time. Why if you are the owner or trainer would you want that horse to run after a gate break? Are the starter or vet only allowed to make that call?

Horses that don't break through the gate prior to the start almost always lose the race too.

[devilsbag]

Originally Posted by bobphilo

Dinny,

When I reacted to your post with the Seattle Slew video I didn't realize it was you satirizing Zippy Chippys' crazy breakthrough theory and thought it came from him trying to defend it. Sorry for the mix-up if I sounded sarcastic.
Your post was one of the best satires exposing this nutty theory I've seen here.

Bob,

I was happier when you attacked me and was sort of hoping we could engage in an all-out flame war. I'm looking for a way to earn a highly coveted PA red card without making it too obvious.

Regards,
Dinny


For all those who liked the video, this should interest you as well:

YouTube

A great feature that I wish NYRA had continued.

[o_crunk]

Some cobbled together stats on horses breaking through gate and having that denoted in charts. These stats go back about 10 years:

https://twitter.com/o_crunk/status/999296747548676096