Cheating in Racing Today

[upthecreek]

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ra...9PM05A.twitter

[BCOURTNEY]

Originally Posted by upthecreek

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ra...9PM05A.twitter

I personally believe that EPO doping could be detected after the 3 day period by testing the animal's hemoglobin and hemocrit values. A statistical analysis of a owner/trainers horses could show variance against the norm.

[EasyGoer89]

If you can steal money in racing with no threat of jail, there's not much serious deterrent for the criminals. Trainers know that they can 'free roll' everyone and most likely the worst punishment will be a 30 or 60 day vacation on the golf course or beach (pina colada anyone?) without the threat of losing clients.

jocks too, they can play games all they want, nobody seems to care, jocks Teflon all they need to do is say the horse felt funny and get away with pretty much anything. Even certain hall of fame jocks continue to this very minute, not ride out mounts, some of these guys are averaging one or 2 'pull ups' a day and nobody does a thing about it.

[HalvOnHorseracing]

If you want to expose this "culture of cheating" the first thing you need to do is cite statistics. How many violations are actually occurring each year? How many of these violations were for legal therapeutics and how many were for illegal PED's?

Gorajec talks about out-of-competition testing at Indiana Grand. 10% of the testing was out-of-competition testing and the number of positive tests was...that's right, he didn't say. He just got someone from the UFC to tell us that without out-of-competition testing human athletes would run rampant, with the implication that is exactly where horse racing is.

Whether or not drugs/medications are the scourge Gorajec believes, the perception on the part of many people is that they are racing's number one problem. But you don't solve the problem with misinformation, no statistical backup, and an indictment of all horsemen. If there is an endemic problem there are ways to go about fixing it. I'd be far more interested in an editorial about that.

Here was a piece after Joe Gorajec was fired in Indiana.

http://halveyonhorseracing.com/?s=Gorajec

[cj]

Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing

If you want to expose this "culture of cheating" the first thing you need to do is cite statistics. How many violations are actually occurring each year? How many of these violations were for legal therapeutics and how many were for illegal PED's?

Gorajec talks about out-of-competition testing at Indiana Grand. 10% of the testing was out-of-competition testing and the number of positive tests was...that's right, he didn't say. He just got someone from the UFC to tell us that without out-of-competition testing human athletes would run rampant, with the implication that is exactly where horse racing is.

Whether or not drugs/medications are the scourge Gorajec believes, the perception on the part of many people is that they are racing's number one problem. But you don't solve the problem with misinformation, no statistical backup, and an indictment of all horsemen. If there is an endemic problem there are ways to go about fixing it. I'd be far more interested in an editorial about that.

Here was a piece after Joe Gorajec was fired in Indiana.

http://halveyonhorseracing.com/?s=Gorajec

Just to be clear, Rich admits his bias against the writer of the Paulick Report piece in the article he links.

I think Gorajec hits a very good point here. Drugs are being used that give long term benefits but can't be detected after a a short period. I'm not sure how anyone could even consider arguing that. Anyone that thinks this isn't going on today is, to be frank, a fool. This is EXACTLY what Ron Ellis was trying to do with Masochistic in my opinion. He just wasn't very good at it.

It is steroid juicing and blood doping. Drug testing in horse racing, as it is in most facets, is about two decades behind the rest of the world. People are exploiting the weak system that is in place. They will continue to do so as long as they can get away with it.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing

If you want to expose this "culture of cheating" the first thing you need to do is cite statistics. How many violations are actually occurring each year? How many of these violations were for legal therapeutics and how many were for illegal PED's?

Gorajec talks about out-of-competition testing at Indiana Grand. 10% of the testing was out-of-competition testing and the number of positive tests was...that's right, he didn't say. He just got someone from the UFC to tell us that without out-of-competition testing human athletes would run rampant, with the implication that is exactly where horse racing is.

Whether or not drugs/medications are the scourge Gorajec believes, the perception on the part of many people is that they are racing's number one problem. But you don't solve the problem with misinformation, no statistical backup, and an indictment of all horsemen. If there is an endemic problem there are ways to go about fixing it. I'd be far more interested in an editorial about that.

Here was a piece after Joe Gorajec was fired in Indiana.

http://halveyonhorseracing.com/?s=Gorajec

So...is this what you hold as an opinion now, as you survey the current drug-dominated racing landscape? That "mercy triumphs over judgement"?

[johnhannibalsmith]

His exposure of this cheating amounts to a compilation of stuff you read here. Complete with conjecture, hyperbole, and laughable blanket statements that are opinion masquerading as fact.

Don't get me wrong, exposing problems, or cheating, is not a bad thing. But there's not much here and what amazing insight he offers amounts to little more than his unyielding perspective. Yup, there's no such thing as a horseman that treated a horse in the way he describes to help the horse and of course it is done solely because he or she could get away with it. I have a hard time even reading past stupidity like that and taking it seriously. Sure, if it was impossible to get away with it, they wouldn't do it, but that hardly somehow makes the case that their motivation is simply that there is no deterrent. Otherwise, every horse would get treated as a bad bleeder or neurotic mess. Why not. Who cares if it doesn't help this horse, we can get away with it, might just as well. That's the picture he's painting unnecessarily (just one example) and it is nothing but a complete detraction from any sort of great exposure we're going to be treated to, maybe, I guess. Maybe they are helping the horse and doing it because they can get away with it. Why the nonsense about "code for helping"? How can you argue that your exact examples are done specifically to help a horse with the specific problems. The problem is that it is easy to get away with, that's the point you were making. Why we needed to cast all horseman as deceitful code-speakers that can't envision helping a horse... or whatever that irrelevant yellow journalism was all about. I know this will be unpopular here, but this guy is the wrong vessel for this message if this is any indication of what can be expected of his 'expose' work.

[cj]

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ra...oping-a-horse/

Just some info on EPO from a few years ago.

[HalvOnHorseracing]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

So...is this what you hold as an opinion now, as you survey the current drug-dominated racing landscape? That "mercy triumphs over judgement"?

Right before Gorajec was fired I was getting ready to do a piece on how he seemed to be interested in destroying the careers of those who wouldn't play ball with him. In Gorajec's world, he was most often unmerciful, even when mercy was called for. Like many zealots, he never believed their was a line that shouldn't be crossed. To quote Barry Goldwater, Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice!

CJ is right. I was not a Gorajec fan, but that had a lot to do with the myriad stories I heard from people who were railroaded by him. When he got fired, I believed he got what he deserved.

Thask, you did the same thing Gorajec did. The drug dominated landscape without the macro statistic to back it up. Citing Masochistic as Exhibit A doesn't prove rampant drug use. But for those who wish to believe it, the ARCI statistics - most importantly less than one-half of one percent of all tests come back positive and there are less than 100 Class 1 and 2 violations a year - are either made up or misleading.

One Masochistic gets more press than 100,000 races with negative tests. If you want to believe the sport is drug dominated, just provide the statistics. That's all I asked Gorajec to do.

[NorCalGreg]

Originally Posted by EasyGoer89

If you can steal money in racing with no threat of jail, there's not much serious deterrent for the criminals. Trainers know that they can 'free roll' everyone and most likely the worst punishment will be a 30 or 60 day vacation on the golf course or beach (pina colada anyone?) without the threat of losing clients.

jocks too, they can play games all they want, nobody seems to care, jocks Teflon all they need to do is say the horse felt funny and get away with pretty much anything. Even certain hall of fame jocks continue to this very minute, not ride out mounts, some of these guys are averaging one or 2 'pull ups' a day and nobody does a thing about it.

Here's a thought....learn the game the way it's played--and has been played for a hundred years--not the way you want it to be played.

Unless you prefer bitching to winning.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by HalvOnHorseracing

Right before Gorajec was fired I was getting ready to do a piece on how he seemed to be interested in destroying the careers of those who wouldn't play ball with him. In Gorajec's world, he was most often unmerciful, even when mercy was called for. Like many zealots, he never believed their was a line that shouldn't be crossed. To quote Barry Goldwater, Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice!

CJ is right. I was not a Gorajec fan, but that had a lot to do with the myriad stories I heard from people who were railroaded by him. When he got fired, I believed he got what he deserved.

Thask, you did the same thing Gorajec did. The drug dominated landscape without the macro statistic to back it up. Citing Masochistic as Exhibit A doesn't prove rampant drug use. But for those who wish to believe it, the ARCI statistics - most importantly less than one-half of one percent of all tests come back positive and there are less than 100 Class 1 and 2 violations a year - are either made up or misleading.

One Masochistic gets more press than 100,000 races with negative tests. If you want to believe the sport is drug dominated, just provide the statistics. That's all I asked Gorajec to do.

In the "hush-hush" world of the backstretch...we will all be dead and buried before any "proof" that could satisfy you could ever be uncovered. But...continue to repeat those ARCI stats...if it makes you feel better.

[onefast99]

Interesting article on this topic, how many trainers want to be 40% ITM rather than 11%, all of them do. You are under peer pressure in this game and those that have mastered their doping skills will never get caught until the day they do.

[aaron]

Originally Posted by NorCalGreg

Here's a thought....learn the game the way it's played--and has been played for a hundred years--not the way you want it to be played.

Unless you prefer bitching to winning.

Reminds me of Harvey Pack at the Paddock Club,many years ago. A bettor asked him what are you going to do about Oscar Barerra ? He answered,I don't know what you are going to do,but I am going to be betting on his horses.
You must know how the game is being played !!!

[NorCalGreg]

Originally Posted by aaron

Reminds me of Harvey Pack at the Paddock Club,many years ago. A bettor asked him what are you going to do about Oscar Barerra ? He answered,I don't know what you are going to do,but I am going to be betting on his horses.
You must know how the game is being played !!!

Aaron think we've both been around long enough to know the game. Other than the drugs nowadays....the game is definitely the same.

[HalvOnHorseracing]

Originally Posted by cj

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/ra...oping-a-horse/

Just some info on EPO from a few years ago.

I'm not going to suggest trainers don't use EPO. But, I think EPO is one of the most overblown issues in racing. This from the California boys, Scott Stanley and Rick Arthur

But the fact is that EPO positives are rarely triggered. California, which probably has the country’s most vigilant system in place to detect EPO use, hasn’t had an EPO positive in years. “It’s something we frequently look for and rarely see,” said Stanley. “It’s certainly a lot rarer than other drugs we’ve seen.”
Arthur agreed. “We have not seen any evidence of EPO use in California,” he said samples for EPO. Over the last six years, we've done well over 5,000 samples. And we've seen virtually no use of EPO use out here.”

Second, it is almost all but absent in thoroughbreds. If any trainer is using it, it is most likely for harness horses.

Third, I've mentioned this multiple times, although it is like pulling teeth to get people to believe it. Horses have contractile spleens. You can read about it here.

http://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com...ing-PartIV.pdf

The bottom line is that most vets and equine pharmacologists believe EPO doesn't have much effect if any, and the article cites the reasons why.