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10-08-2010, 04:15 PM
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 23
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Was Secretariat the greatest?
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10-08-2010, 04:18 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 707
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For two races, probably.
The rest of it I believe other horses could replicate.
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10-08-2010, 05:37 PM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,034
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Surely the greatest. Turf races were great too and Laurin said Sec was probably better on turf.
In his maiden loss, he was inpeded.
In the Champagne, he was disqualified while winning by 2.
In the Wood or Whitney(not sure) he lost while running a fever. Supposedly Turcotte and the barn hands where really against him running but obviously they didn't make the final decision.
Last edited by tzipi; 10-08-2010 at 05:45 PM.
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10-08-2010, 06:26 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2010
Location: OKC, OK
Posts: 609
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Citation and Secretariat were two of the greatest three year olds of the modern era. Beyond that, you get into a gigantic problem of comparing apples to oranges.
The Richard Sowers book on Throughbred Racing goes into alot of detail on how to differentiate...
Kelso ran the fastest one and five eigths of a mile by a three year old in the (2:40 4/5) in the 1960 Lawrence Realization Stakes, also the fastest two miles (3:19 1/5) in the 1964 Jockey Gold Cup-
So, that makes him faster than Secretariat right? Well, hard to say. Secretariat didn't race those distances on the dirt.
Also, Secretariat won the Belmont the fastest 12 furlongs on dirt (2:24). So, that makes him the fastest right?
Well, Kelso never raced 12 furlongs on the dirt. Who knows?
This is just one small example of the kind of problem you get into comparing these apples to oranges.
OK, cut out the bull, you say. They've all ran a mile and a quarter, so Secretariat is the World Record holder for that.... right?
Wrong!
Spectacular Bid holds that record - 1:57 4/5 at Santa Anita 3 Feb-80. Yeah, but isn't (or wasn't) Santa Anita a faster, glibber surface than Churchill Downs?
Probably, so you are back to square one.
Last edited by Bullet Plane; 10-08-2010 at 06:28 PM.
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10-08-2010, 06:27 PM
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#5
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douglasw32
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Horseheads, NY
Posts: 1,630
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Yes
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10-08-2010, 06:31 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2004
Location: New Hampshire
Posts: 14,478
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I would have to agree with Doug, I wish they had Bris files going back that far because I sure would like to load some of his races.
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10-08-2010, 06:58 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Houston , Tx.
Posts: 9,588
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He was so intelligent . He did it when he wanted to . When he wanted to he was second to none .
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10-08-2010, 08:25 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,036
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I think he was. In the Kentucky Derby, he ran each quarter mile faster than the previous one. That's simply amazing! His 31 length win and 2:24 final time in the Belmont Stakes will never happen again. Like someone else mentioned earlier, there were very legitimate excuses in at least three of his four defeats. He was one of a kind.
Turkoman
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10-08-2010, 08:34 PM
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#9
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Veteran
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 209
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The greatest horse to ever set foot on a race track was:
DR. FAGER
End of discussion.
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10-08-2010, 08:56 PM
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#10
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Lacrimae rerum
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: at my house
Posts: 7,308
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I have no idea, but his Preakness was astounding. I've never seen a winning horse make a move like that.
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10-08-2010, 08:57 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2010
Location: 6 Acres of Peace Not Too Far From Pimlico
Posts: 167
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Yes 
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10-08-2010, 09:19 PM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,034
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sericm
The greatest horse to ever set foot on a race track was:
DR. FAGER
End of discussion.
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Well I'll say this. Love Dr Fager and he was a GREAT horse but he had his limits. I noticed that when he ran long distances(1 1/4), if he had to run 1:09.2 or faster upfront he folded in the stretch(twice). Both times it was Damascus who went up to him upfront and beat him. Secretariat could run 1:09 and change in a 1 1/2 race for 6F and win huge. Again LOVED the Doctor. Great horse and athlete but I can't say better than Secretariat because I think Dr had his limits.
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10-08-2010, 09:23 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: The Big Apple
Posts: 4,252
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by WillA
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To answer that question you should first list what you think are the parametric determinants of greatness for a thoroughbred race horse.
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"Science is correct; even if you don't believe it" - Neil deGrasse Tyson
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10-08-2010, 10:06 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 2,036
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by chickenhead
I have no idea, but his Preakness was astounding. I've never seen a winning horse make a move like that.
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That was an incredible move. I think he went from last to first in 1/16 or less? Not sure, but I've never seen anything like it.
Turkoman
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10-08-2010, 10:15 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,394
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Turkoman
That was an incredible move. I think he went from last to first in 1/16 or less? Not sure, but I've never seen anything like it.
Turkoman
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And it was around a turn. Have you ever watched his first race? He comes flying down near the wire after getting slammed at the start. rbj
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuATpq0t62E
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Last edited by RaceBookJoe; 10-08-2010 at 10:18 PM.
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