Looking at a horse on the track

[Suff]

Would anyone mind sharing thier knowledge and experience to explain what it is that they look for when they are "Looking at a horse on the track".... I look for a horse that is not overly sweating,, A horse that is "Prancing",, or shows LIVE FEET... I'm looking for Front or back bandages... but other than that... I'm a lil unkowledgable on the more specific Physical traits I should be aware of... Any insight would be appreciatted.

[crackers@NOLA]

check out what Joe Takich has to say. It is very informative on that angle.

[Suff]

Ok.. Thanks.. But where is he and where do I find his stuff? On the WWW?

[Larry Hamilton]

http://www.winsports.com/ATM/Atmfeat/Takach.htm

[Suff]

thanks larry... good read... Do you do alot of "WAIT, WATCH AND SEE" yourself... anything you've come up with over the years that works for you?

[crackers@NOLA]

I couldn't remember what website I read the articles on.

[Larry Hamilton]

absolutely! The problem is I cant get to a tv in my living room that captures the horse's image good enough to use Joe's stuff. However, when I used to go the track nearly every day. I found I couldnt use his stuff to qualify ahorse, but I sure as hell could use his stuff to DISQUALIFY one.

Some of the better stuff was: Ears alert, not mule ears, tail must stand away from the butt--limp tail, ill prepared horse, Dull parade in general, uninterested jock, feet not even in the stirrups. I cant tell you how many 4:5 horses I threw away successfully because of these rules. Get his video, much to learn there.

[tboles]

I tend to shy from horses that lean on the lead-horse.
Many times those same horses are hard to load in the gate
as well.

I like horses who are very alert and are interested in whats going on around them. Many of this nature will stop and look at the crowd. Rotating ears are a positive.

Horses who get out on the track and gallop soon after the post parade are always a plus. Often times this particular horse is the same horse you label with having "live feet". This is a horse thats ready for the business at hand.

Of course the wife says take the one with the
"lighter-load"

[PurplePower]

Originally posted by Sufferindowns
Would anyone mind sharing thier knowledge and experience to explain what it is that they look for when they are "Looking at a horse on the track".... .

Joe’s stuff is good, but uses words like “gravely”, “excruciating”, “ALWAYS” in contrast to his introductory statements that, “Face facts, EVERY handicapping angle has its shortcomings and absolutely NONE are 100% failure free! “
Here is the way I summarize observing the “physicality” portion of handicapping. I ask two questions. Is this runner “capable of doing what he is being asked to do?” and does this runner “want to do what he is being asked to do?”

Under “Capable of doing”, I observe factors such as Health (hair coat, brightness of eye), Condition (Muscle tone, body score) and Soundness (travel). Joe discusses those factors in detail. Body Score is a 1 to 10 rating developed by Texas A & M (and I won’t even suggest that as a reason the score only goes to 10!). Refugees rescued from starvation by the SPCA get a 1 and obese gets a 10. Most race horses score between 4 and 5.5. Research from A&M suggests that a BS of 6 (and Joe’s description of what he likes to see would fit a “6”) is best condition for a racehorse. Simulcast feeds generally don’t provide enough paddock “walk around” view on TV, but usually enough to get an initial estimation of Health and Condition. Post Parade is best time for final look at Hair Coat, Body Score and an estimation of “travel”.

Does this runner “Want to do what it is being asked to do?” When runners come on track for post parade, I watch for those that have their neck arched, ears forward, face perpendicular to ground. (Only nit-pick I have with Joe’s discussion of ears is his use of term “Flickering ears”. Those ears are only seen on lighted “yard art” - kind of like Rudolph’s “flickering” nose on Christmas decorations. Horses can rotate each ear 180 degrees, thus giving them a 360-degree “sonar”. Their hearing is acute – they can hear sounds up to a half-mile away, and they can hear frequencies that we cannot hear – But that is another thread.) They do “flick” their ears inquisitively and that is a “good sign”.
I agree with Joe’s description of tail carriage. I like to see a horse with tail out away from rump (looking where root of tail is attached to spinal cord, not free end near hocks). One thing that I’ve noticed over the years is that the shorter the distance of the race, the more space between the tail and rump there should be. Long distance horses may not show much “arch” and still perform well. Almost all Quarter Horses have some elevation of tail.

Tying the two ends together is the runner’s overall expression of attitude and energy. This is in the “bounce”. I want to see a runner that is moving rhythmically, a little “I’m bad” type of strut with a bounce in its step, head bobbing confidently (this is not the head bob of a horse that is sore in which the head goes up when the sore leg bears weight), muscles rippling, announcing to other horses “I intend to kick your butt!".

Then this happens Saturday night: Some 500 new and regular fans are sitting in the SHRP free theater seats listening to my “stage show” about how to play the game and how to watch horses in the post parade (our theater seats are right in front of the 70 yard pole). Second race comes on track and my second choice looks a little dull, flat neck, ears in “neutral” and having a “bad hair day” as tail is hanging limp with no daylight visible. I suggest we throw that runner out of our exacta box and instead include my fourth choice that looked much better. Most of you know what happened. Old “I’d rather be anywhere than here” made spirited move to take lead going into far turn (mile-70 race) and was an easy winner. The “caveat”: Sometimes a talented runner going 80% can beat an inferior runner going 100%. As Joe says, “Horses can’t lie”. It's just that we don’t always understand what they are “saying”.

[crackers@NOLA]

It sure helps when you are there in the paddock. My trainer keeps notes on all horses and can notice the changes in appearance from week to week. Could be why he is winning at 29% this year. I have learned alot by just being with him on a daily basis looking them over. The best guys do there homework and this is why they are successful. Watching them on the simulcast is very tough to do. The tracks just don't give you the time to see the horses. Next time you all go to the track you should go down to the paddock and just look for the trainers who are there. I can almost guarantee you that you will see 5 of the top 10 trainers down there doing there homework, if not them then somebody from there stable.

[Suff]

Ya gotta love the internet.... Was thinking to myself... How long would I have to hang around the Paddock and meet the right people to accumulate all the information "Given" to me in 5 minutes of reading... Thanks to you all for sharing your knowledge.... Keep it coming...Thanks again.

[GR1@HTR]

This may sound gross or sound like a joke but it's not...Serious question:

What does the consistancy of horse poop supposed to look like? The reason being, if you feed a dog quality dog food the poop comes out dry and all held together....Feed your dog Kibbles and Bits and it comes out looking like wet cereal. A good nutritional diet with a solid work out program will lead to good results. Just wondering...

[delayjf]

If your playing SoCal, and can't tell much from the TV I would suggest subscribing to Joe's paddock services. When he says a horse if going bad or came back from a winning effort exhausted then that horse almost always bounced in his next start.
knowing what a horse looks like when he runs good is invaluable. If you take the time you can learn most of the stuff fairly quickly. The harder stuff like anaylising a horses conformation, stride, etc takes a more trained eye, but it can be done, if your willing to work at it. If you live in SoCal, you can hire Joe (or at least you could a few years a go) to show you exactly what he is refering to and where to focus. Bottom line, horses conditioning changes and the changes are visible if you know what to look for.

[socalsportsbook]

Did I miss something?

Joe Takach's information is on the HOME PAGE of THIS web site.

In the Reading Room.

[PurplePower]

Originally posted by GR1
This may sound gross or sound like a joke but it's not...Serious question:

What does the consistancy of horse poop supposed to look like? The reason being, if you feed a dog quality dog food the poop comes out dry and all held together....Feed your dog Kibbles and Bits and it comes out looking like wet cereal. A good nutritional diet with a solid work out program will lead to good results. Just wondering...

When I was training I expected my grooms to pay attention to the consistency of each horse's poop. As a rule, I preferred the consistency to be firm enough so that it exited the colon as round boluses (about the size of a tennis ball), soft enough that each bolus flattened about 50% as it hit the ground and moist enough that the entire excretion formed a single plop.

Hard balls of poop may indicate that a horse is a little dehydrated or that its diet was not providing as much protein as that particular horse may need. When a horse is getting adequate protein in its diet, the plop may actually look more like cow poop. Runny poop would indicate an upset stomach and be a "red alert" situation for a groom to call me, my assistant trainer and the veterinarian immediately.

When watching horses as they come to the paddock or in the post parade, remember that adrenalin causes "evacuation of the bowels". (Remember the bathroom run right before giving you first public speech?). Horses whose poop is hard balls in the paddock are usually poor risks at the windows. Similarly, horses whose poop is runny may be overly nervous and even more of a risk.
________________
Mac
C. Reid McLellan,
Racing Education Manager, SHRP
and author of Purple Power