NEW York "Stewards"

[NY BRED]

I have constantly stated to my friends, that in NY, if the stewards
don't call for an inquiry, and there is only a jockey or trainer's
objection, the original finish is almost never reversed.

The first race in NY unfortunately proved that point despite a blatant
foul where the favorite took the path of the second horse.

Alan Garcia makes the call, about 100 people in the handicapping room at MTH agree the fav should be placed second, but as usual the horse stays.


Importantly, the stewards never even made the call which is mind boggling.


The second horse at 15-1, would have given me a major lead in a contest,
and yes that's bad luck and racing and yada yada, but this scenario
has become quite common in NY which really requires correction.

My next letter goes to NYRA and the DRF and hopefully the owners of the second horse follow that move.

[The Bit]

I am always interested in how these situations are handled so differently circuit to circuit.

I'm not too familiar with at NYRA tracks, even though I play them often. I just haven't noticed it one way or another.

At Philly Park, you need to commit a homicide or armed robbery to come down. You can switch paths, swerve the length of the stretch, and so long as the cops aren't waiting for you in the winners circle your staying up.

At Charles Town, half the races on a 10 race card will have jockey's holds and/or stewards inquiries and more often than I think is needed or normal horses come down.

Penn National seems to take more horses down for infractions as the gate opens than any other place I've played.

Of the places I play or follow closely, Laurel is the most sensible in my opinion.

[exiles]

In the 9th yesterday Arroyo, almost killed Hill, going into the 1st turn cut in front of him,a blatant foul the 3 stooges looked at it but they decided it was ok A travesty.

[NY BRED]

Thanks to both of you for your feedback, and yes, I did get hurt in the
9th as I needed # 6 horse who broke down.

While I realize track stewards can vary in their reasons for a DQ, they
owe the public and as important, the jockeys and owners a duty
to monitor the actions of riders and/or horses which can
affect results, or potentially lead to serious injury.


INMHO, there should be an outside committee to review the
actions of these judges to level the playing field.

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by exiles

In the 9th yesterday Arroyo, almost killed Hill, going into the 1st turn cut in front of him,a blatant foul the 3 stooges looked at it but they decided it was ok A travesty.

I don't know. I watched the head on more than a few times and at the most it's inconclusive. If stewards anywhere start taking horses down on what they " think " happened then all horseplayers are in even worse trouble than we're already in.

[bishlap]

anything's better than california where a jock farts and the horse is pulled down. I've lost literally thousands @ hollyweird on bogus takedowns. I prefer no autopsy - no foul.

[JPinMaryland]

PIM is traditionally a no harm no foul type of track, but I dont watch it day to day. Just my impression historically.

[skate]

Very much, a foul is different from track to track.


Not sure about the east coast, but Cal. will Look into (objection) more times in a day than All other (exclude East Coast) tracks combined.

[thespaah]

Originally Posted by NY BRED

I have constantly stated to my friends, that in NY, if the stewards
don't call for an inquiry, and there is only a jockey or trainer's
objection, the original finish is almost never reversed.

The first race in NY unfortunately proved that point despite a blatant
foul where the favorite took the path of the second horse.

Alan Garcia makes the call, about 100 people in the handicapping room at MTH agree the fav should be placed second, but as usual the horse stays.


Importantly, the stewards never even made the call which is mind boggling.


The second horse at 15-1, would have given me a major lead in a contest,
and yes that's bad luck and racing and yada yada, but this scenario
has become quite common in NY which really requires correction.

My next letter goes to NYRA and the DRF and hopefully the owners of the second horse follow that move.

I have to concur ewith your assertion..I have been attending NYRA races for over thrity years. it ios very rare that a jock's objection causes a change in the finish

[northerndancer]

There are not enough camera's in place therefore the stews do not get a good look......... they know what happened but unless the can actually see it take place they will not take action.

The jocks know where the stews lose the camera angle going into and out of the turns...... therefore you will always see a rider with outside position drop down on that horse inside of them..... I have been caught with this move many times becuase I tend to ride apprentices and they have not learned the trick or the art of countering the attack..... therefore it is the riders themselves who are to blame..... a rider who has inside position has to get the horse in a position where a rider dropping down on them can not force them to step on the brakes.

What would be nice is for additional cameras to be installed to catch the current blind areas.

Heck I had a horse who was 3/5 at PHA this year in a 7 horse field. There was one horse that had speed and was drawn to the outside of us. I was watching from home and all the way down the backside everytime my rider tried to drop back and let the other horse clear the crafty jock on the speed horse would grab a hold so that we could not get out of the rail position. We went into the turn 1/2 length off of the speed horse...... I was screaming at the TV in my office as I saw it coming....... the crafty rider dropped down my jock stood up lost all momentuem and what was a 1/2 length lead going into the turn was a 4 length lead coming out of the turn and we get beat by the horse by a diminishing head. My trainer claimed foul, our jockey claimed foul and the stews looked at it for 12 minutes and made no change....... it was the talk of the backstretch for days..... I even got a call from the jockey who schooled my jockey making sure there was no hard feelings.

[the little guy]

Excellent point about the dead spots. The journeymen know well how to take advantage of them and the responsibility is on the riders to not get trapped in those areas. I'm not condoning dangerous riding....but it works both ways. Sometimes what some people consider a foul is a rider being in a spot he ( or she ) has no business being in.

[TheGhostOfOscarB]

I don't think there are any dead spots in NY, other than the seats where the Stews sit.

I knew a guy years ago, that would offer good odds man to man , betting against jock takedowns.

This is a VERY old pattern.

sort of the 'Not Invented Here' syndrome.

[Hosshead]

I agree, some stewards just don't care. But:
It's hard to believe that we live in such a "digital video era" yet the stewards don't have the option of seeing a split screen replay of two camera angles that are exactly synchronized in time, so that they can freeze the video at the moment of alleged infraction and see both angles. (pan and head-on for example)

[DanG]

Originally Posted by northerndancer

There are not enough camera's in place therefore the stews do not get a good look......... they know what happened but unless the can actually see it take place they will not take action.

What would be nice is for additional cameras to be installed to catch the current blind areas.

A blurb in the New York Post; by Ed Fountaine;

http://www.nypost.com/seven/03022008...ocs_100101.htm

Filming of NYRA races, contracted out to Fla.-based firm Teleview Racing Patrol for last 12 years, is going in-house beginning with Belmont meet. Plans are to add camera angles and upgrade to digital image, with high-def a few years down road, making for much better viewing.

Let's hope there is an actual impact.

[thespaah]

Originally Posted by northerndancer

There are not enough camera's in place therefore the stews do not get a good look......... they know what happened but unless the can actually see it take place they will not take action.

The jocks know where the stews lose the camera angle going into and out of the turns...... therefore you will always see a rider with outside position drop down on that horse inside of them..... I have been caught with this move many times becuase I tend to ride apprentices and they have not learned the trick or the art of countering the attack..... therefore it is the riders themselves who are to blame..... a rider who has inside position has to get the horse in a position where a rider dropping down on them can not force them to step on the brakes.

What would be nice is for additional cameras to be installed to catch the current blind areas.

Heck I had a horse who was 3/5 at PHA this year in a 7 horse field. There was one horse that had speed and was drawn to the outside of us. I was watching from home and all the way down the backside everytime my rider tried to drop back and let the other horse clear the crafty jock on the speed horse would grab a hold so that we could not get out of the rail position. We went into the turn 1/2 length off of the speed horse...... I was screaming at the TV in my office as I saw it coming....... the crafty rider dropped down my jock stood up lost all momentuem and what was a 1/2 length lead going into the turn was a 4 length lead coming out of the turn and we get beat by the horse by a diminishing head. My trainer claimed foul, our jockey claimed foul and the stews looked at it for 12 minutes and made no change....... it was the talk of the backstretch for days..... I even got a call from the jockey who schooled my jockey making sure there was no hard feelings.

ok nice story..you'r right..Your jock got schooled..Unless the other rider caused his horse to take a path away or made contact with your horse, I see no harm.. Just good race riding. Besisdes, how would you have any idea the other guy was "riding your horse" as well as his?...What does this have to do with the alleged blind spots?..Do you believe that your horse was such a sure winner that day that the only plausable explanation is that the other rider MUST have caused your horse enough grief to keep him form having any chance?
Maybe you should use the guy who rode the other horse next time your horse goes. Just a suggestion.