Keeneland Handle Off 19.2%

[JustRalph]

I stopped playing it too.......... up until a year ago.........I tried.....Lord Knows I tried.......

[toussaud]

I admit to watching the live feed becuase important horses often run there, but I haven't thought about making a bet there in 2 years.

[Cangamble]

I've got a poll up on my newest blog post. So far "polytrack" isn't the number one answer. But it is early still:
http://cangamble.blogspot.com/2009/0...denot-yet.html

[horses721]

Originally Posted by hibiscus

Agreed. The surface. I used to play Keeneland but have not wagered a cent there since the switch to the Poly-crap.

Same here. Get rid of the surface.

[The Hawk]

I'm another who virtually stopped playing there when they installed the Polytrack.

Seems like a consensus here.

[point given]

50 % economy

30 % poly

10 % field size

10 % other

[toussaud]

i think it's a combo of 1 and 2. there are no field size problems at keeneland

[DJofSD]

Originally Posted by toussaud

i think it's a combo of 1 and 2. there are no field size problems at keeneland

Right. Which makes having the AWS so frustrating. While some prefer the smaller field sizes of SAX and HOL, I believe I get more value for my wagering dollar when I have large/full fields. KEE seemed to be doing better as far as field sizes go but with the AWS, I have to pass.

[andymays]

A few hours ago I had an exchange from an email I sent to Keenland. After the exchange Headlines on the Paulick report were:

WAS POLYTRACK MAJOR FACTOR IN DROP IN KEENELAND WAGERING?
By Ray Paulick

http://www.paulickreport.com/blog/wa...land-wagering/

Could be a coincedence but Jim Williams moved pretty fast. Here is my email pasted below! My words are my opinion of course. The article I pasted and sent to him was part of the email. I did delete my personal email info and his!

You have to read from the bottom up!

Thanks again for your additional comments. I will watch for the Aqueduct figures as suggested.

Jim Williams

________________________________________
From: Andy [mailto:onlyandy@]
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 10:32 AM
To: Jim Williams
Subject: RE: Comments

Mr. Williams thanks for responding. I obviously can’t stand synthetic surfaces and you should know that in a recent poll 65% of regular Horseplayers agree with me. This accounts for the handle trend on synthetic surfaces being down sharply compared to tracks like Oaklawn, Gulfstream, Fairgrounds, Monmouth, Hawthorne, and on and on. The only Tracks with dirt surfaces that I know are down sharply are in Maryland where Laurel was down 26% mainly because of increased takeout and quality of Racing. Aqueduct will come out today with their numbers and I am eager to see what they are. If you can provide me with numbers from popular Tracks that have shown the declines you are talking about I will take notice.

I like everything about Keenland except the synthetic surface and as in California the people who decided to install them are entrenched in the “synthetic ideology”. Horse Racing is about gambling and if not for gambling Horse Racing would be an equestrian event. Like the leadership in California it seems you will play this out till the bitter end and that’s a shame for Horse Racing.

Thanks,

Andy


Handle off sharply at Keeneland
Betting declines 19.3% despite large crowds
BY GREGORY A. HALL • GHALL@COURIER-JOURNAL.COM • APRIL 25, 2009
•
Keeneland Race Course in Lexington drew some of the largest crowds in its history this spring and also benefitted from its races being available on all major account-wagering platforms.
But those pluses weren't enough to offset sharp declines in betting during the thoroughbred track's 15-day meet.
Preliminary results showed a 19.3 percent drop in all sources handle to $117 million, with a 9.8 percent decline to $19.2 million in on-track handle for Keeneland's races.
Average daily on-track handle was $1,282,928, a 3.8 percent drop from last year's $1,333,106, when the track was open 16 days.
The total attendance of 240,755 was the third-highest in track history, down 1.1 percent from 243,606 last year. The 16,050 average daily crowd was up 5.4 percent from last year and was the second-highest in Keeneland history.
The meet saw two crowds of 30,000-plus, including the 33,680 on April 18 that was the second-largest in track history.
"We are very gratified by the great turnout from our fans," Nick Nicholson, Keeneland president and chief executive, said in a statement. "Three of the past four spring meets have been the best in Keeneland history, so this is a trend and not an aberration."
The meet was the first for Keeneland to be available on all four major national account-wagering platforms -- Churchill Downs' TwinSpires.com, TVG, XpressBet.com and Youbet.com.
Reporter Gregory A. Hall can be reached at (502) 582-4087.


From: Jim Williams [mailto:jwilliams]
Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 6:16 AM
To: Onlyandy@
Cc: Betsy Baxter
Subject: Comments


Thank you for taking time to write, expressing dissatisfaction with synthetic surfaces. Actually, average daily mutuel handle at Keeneland this spring was off 9.6 percent, which is less than the 13 percent that wagering was down nationally in March. Average daily mutuel handle on track was up one percent. Keeneland raced one day less—15 compared to 16 days last year—which is 6.3 percent less racing. And, thankfully, no horses suffered catastrophic injuries during the meeting. Again, thank you for your comments.

Regards,
Jim Williams

[JeremyJet]

My head is spinning reading about all these "reasons" for the declines at tracks with synthetic surfaces.

As it's been stated here recently ....

It's the surface, Stupid!

JeremyJet

[andymays]

Originally Posted by JeremyJet

My head is spinning reading about all these "reasons" for the declines at tracks with synthetic surfaces.

As it's been stated here recently ....

It's the surface, Stupid!

JeremyJet

"It's the surface" is right on the money in my book too!

If you have a point and send these guys an email they read it and respond as long as you present your case in a clear manner and aren't too rude.

[JeremyJet]

Originally Posted by andymays

"It's the surface" is right on the money in my book too!

If you have a point and send these guys an email they read it and respond as long as you present your case in a clear manner and aren't too rude.

I hear ya, Andy.

It's just too bad HANA didn't raise these issues. I could be wrong, but I don't think synthetic surfaces were even on HANA's radar when they began "handicapping" these tracks. It blows my mind how the surface issue wasn't one of their major sticking points.

Regards,

JeremyJet

[andymays]

Originally Posted by JeremyJet

I hear ya, Andy.

It's just too bad HANA didn't raise these issues. I could be wrong, but I don't think synthetic surfaces were even on HANA's radar when they began "handicapping" these tracks. It blows my mind how the surface issue wasn't one of their major sticking points.

Regards,

JeremyJet

I agree with you but HANA can't please us all. I agree with 90% of everthing so that's still OK by me. I have a feeling that next year the ratings might be figured differently. Horseplayers are definitely voting with their dollars.

[JeremyJet]

Originally Posted by andymays

I agree with you but HANA can't please us all. I agree with 90% of everthing so that's still OK by me. I have a feeling that next year the ratings might be figured differently. Horseplayers are definitely voting with their dollars.

Once again we agree, Andy. But the surfaces issue is a major topic. The surfaces some of these tracks employ is the only reason the players are turning away. So what does it matter if they're doing everthing else right if the players go bye-bye because of the surface?

Regards,

JeremyJet

[1st time lasix]

Personnally I have evolved and adjusted my handicapping. I take very little from those here who merely refuse to learn and just throw up their hands. Tey use any opportunity to bash the use of it. All evidence suggests the poly type surface is safer to the animal particpants--- period. That is clear and rather indisputable unless you are just plane pig headed. Of course OJ was aquitted of a double murder.....so i no longer say anything is absolute. Choose to play or don't play. Never understood the angry venom like disgust at the product. I have also never found a great handicapper yet who can't view races from several different angles. I am also not necessarily convinced that poly creates more "random chaos" than various grass conditions or low level claiming races. Some of the forum make it difficult to see how on earth players ever adjust their handicapping from dirt to grass? To each his own i guess. I will always play Keeneland and support their product precisely because they are much more fan friendly with lower takeouts. On the other hand....I wouldn't make an 3 entry exotic play horizontally or vertically at say- calder or philly where i am surely considered a sucker by their onerous rakes. Game is tough enough without the track scooping 5-12% more out of the pools. Just my 2 cents. Four more of those denominations and I could play a super! Ha!