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03-19-2016, 02:53 PM
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#1
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,163
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Obamacare Rocks! (aka Keep Flushing That Toilet!)
An interesting piece sent to me by our long lost pal, JustRalph:
All of that tax money you loaned to the Obamacare co-ops? That’s probably gone
http://hotair.com/archives/2016/03/1...probably-gone/
Quote:
The key thing to observe here, which I alluded to above, is that this was not the cost of the program as an approved spending initiative. If the House of Representatives had approved that money as spending and it went south, well… you can’t win ’em all. But much like the Detroit auto industry bailout, these were taxpayer backed loans which were expected to be repaid with interest. Another parallel is the Export Import Bank which makes taxpayer backed loans on a regular basis, though with an admittedly far better record of repayment. If the loan goes bad and the money isn’t returned, that’s our taxpayer dollars gone down a rat hole with no return.
When you combine the shaky nature of the investment which Ed described with the political climate surrounding it, the results are clear. This was a program which a first year economics student should have been able to identify as a sinking ship, but the Democrats were motivated by political reasons to keep flushing cash into it to preserve the tale they were spinning about the American healthcare market. Those assumptions proved false and now a billion dollars of your money has sailed off into the sunset.
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03-19-2016, 03:14 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
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so can we all drop off emails to you and have you post them? Would save time logging in. Two posts in a row I've looked at, and they are both by you acting as proxy for Ralph. Why doesn't Ralph just suck it up and log in and post himself?
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03-19-2016, 03:18 PM
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#3
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PA Steward
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Del Boca Vista
Posts: 88,163
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Awesome contribution bro
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03-19-2016, 04:13 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
Awesome contribution bro
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It would be nice to engage JustRalph in thread convo. Nothing against you, but that can't be done through proxy. Didn't mean to slam you, but when I came across two in a row, I was like, seriously?
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03-19-2016, 04:18 PM
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#5
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The Voice of Reason!
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canandaigua, New york
Posts: 112,446
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Ralph didn't write either of those pieces.
What do you think you would get from him you are missing?
__________________
Who does the Racing Form Detective like in this one?
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03-19-2016, 04:42 PM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom
Ralph didn't write either of those pieces.
What do you think you would get from him you are missing?
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I think I know that. It would be nice to converse with the person and not the article.
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03-19-2016, 05:09 PM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucker6
I think I know that. It would be nice to converse with the person and not the article.
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I never knew that conversing with an article was even possible. You wouldn't mind sharing that trick with us, would you?
__________________
Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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03-19-2016, 05:42 PM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,959
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxcar
I never knew that conversing with an article was even possible. You wouldn't mind sharing that trick with us, would you?
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don't you have a bible verse you need to misinterpret. It is interesting how many butthurt people there are over a fairly obvious point. Carry on.
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03-19-2016, 05:47 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 46,883
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucker6
don't you have a bible verse you need to misinterpret. It is interesting how many butthurt people there are over a fairly obvious point. Carry on.
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You should focus more on your writing skills than any supposed misinterpretations of mine. By the way, have you ever had an article talk back at you?
__________________
Consistent profits can only be made on the basis of analysis that is far from obvious to the majority. - anonymous guru
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03-19-2016, 07:34 PM
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 7,727
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From the article:
This was an experiment which has proven little more than the fact that Washington is barely able to manage the budget for mowing the lawn.
Perhaps the writer misses the fact that at least 15 million Americans were able to secure health insurance since 2009 who did not have it previously. Or maybe he just doesn't care. Either way, for the price of a week in Iraq, we made sure 15 million Americans were able to secure health insurance for at least the last 5 years. Sounds like a phenomenal deal to me - especially when you think about what we got for a buck in Iraq.
Check these Iraq War expenses out and then come back and cry some more about the "insanity" of Obamacare costs:
$1.7 trillion: Amount in war expenses spent by the U.S. Treasury Department as through Fiscal Year 2013.
$5,000: Amount spent per second.
$350,000: Cost to deploy one American military member.
$490 billion: Amount in war benefits owed to war veterans.
$7 trillion: Projected interest payments due by 2053 (because the war was paid for with borrowed money).
$20 billion: Amount paid to KBR, contractor responsible for equipment and services.
$3 billion: Amount of KBR payments Pentagon auditors considered "questionable."
$60 billion: Amount paid for reconstruction, (which was ruled largely a waste due to corruption and shoddy work.)
$4 billion: Amount owed to the U.S. by Iraq before the invasion.
1.6 million: Gallons of oil used by U.S. forces each day in Iraq (at $127.68 a barrel).
$12 billion: Cost per month of the war by 2008.
$7 billion: Amount owed to Iraq by the U.S. after the war (mostly due to fraud).
$20 billion: Annual air conditioning cost.
Link: http://www.businessinsider.com/the-i...numbers-2014-6
__________________
One flew east, one flew west,
One flew over the cuckoo's nest.
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03-19-2016, 07:44 PM
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#11
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Veteran
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 25,607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucker6
so can we all drop off emails to you and have you post them? Would save time logging in. Two posts in a row I've looked at, and they are both by you acting as proxy for Ralph. Why doesn't Ralph just suck it up and log in and post himself?
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I agree, where's Ralph. If he doesn't come back ill pass him in post count.
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03-19-2016, 07:45 PM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2014
Location: st louis
Posts: 2,951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Stinks
From the article:
This was an experiment which has proven little more than the fact that Washington is barely able to manage the budget for mowing the lawn.
Perhaps the writer misses the fact that at least 15 million Americans were able to secure health insurance since 2009 who did not have it previously. Or maybe he just doesn't care. Either way, for the price of a week in Iraq, we made sure 15 million Americans were able to secure health insurance for at least the last 5 years. Sounds like a phenomenal deal to me - especially when you think about what we got for a buck in Iraq.
Check these Iraq War expenses out and then come back and cry some more about the "insanity" of Obamacare costs:
$1.7 trillion: Amount in war expenses spent by the U.S. Treasury Department as through Fiscal Year 2013.
$5,000: Amount spent per second.
$350,000: Cost to deploy one American military member.
$490 billion: Amount in war benefits owed to war veterans.
$7 trillion: Projected interest payments due by 2053 (because the war was paid for with borrowed money).
$20 billion: Amount paid to KBR, contractor responsible for equipment and services.
$3 billion: Amount of KBR payments Pentagon auditors considered "questionable."
$60 billion: Amount paid for reconstruction, (which was ruled largely a waste due to corruption and shoddy work.)
$4 billion: Amount owed to the U.S. by Iraq before the invasion.
1.6 million: Gallons of oil used by U.S. forces each day in Iraq (at $127.68 a barrel).
$12 billion: Cost per month of the war by 2008.
$7 billion: Amount owed to Iraq by the U.S. after the war (mostly due to fraud).
$20 billion: Annual air conditioning cost.
Link: http://www.businessinsider.com/the-i...numbers-2014-6
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How is that a great deal when many got it for free. Why don't we make it the deal of the century and give everybody free health insurance that is currently uninsured.
__________________
You will never achieve 100% if 99% is okay!
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03-19-2016, 08:01 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 7,727
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zico20
How is that a great deal when many got it for free. Why don't we make it the deal of the century and give everybody free health insurance that is currently uninsured.
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As opposed to what? Watching them suffer and die?
__________________
One flew east, one flew west,
One flew over the cuckoo's nest.
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03-19-2016, 08:07 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2014
Location: st louis
Posts: 2,951
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NJ Stinks
As opposed to what? Watching them suffer and die?
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How about we get rid of medicaid and make everyone pay for their health insurance. I know you would hate that idea since the freebies would go away but you can't tax the middle class into oblivion to pay for your utopia society.
__________________
You will never achieve 100% if 99% is okay!
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03-19-2016, 08:54 PM
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#15
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: North Riverside, Il.
Posts: 16,047
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage
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Whoever wrote this article thinks the exchanges and the coops are the same thing. The exchanges are not failing. They have had some problems, but those are decreasing steadily. The exchanges don't have to pay back any loans because they were never given any loans. Expenses of the exchanges are paid through funds appropriated through the Affordable Care Act.
Quote:
When Congress passed the Affordable Care Act, it included $6 billion in loans to launch Consumer Owned and Oriented Plans. The vision was to create nonprofit health insurance companies that would provide low-cost, high quality policies to individuals and small businesses. Without the need to produce a return on investment, these enterprises would, in theory, be able to compete against the major generally for-profit players in the market. In fact, in places where competition was scant, these co-ops would help the market deliver better value for all consumers.
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The COOPs are non profit health insurance companies created to provide competition-or in some cases to take the place of-for the established companies.
This obviously worked better in theory than in practice, but stop saying that the Exchanges are failing. They are not. Also, half the coops have not failed.
__________________
"When you come at the King, You'd best not miss." Omar Little
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