20 of the leading tracks announce plans to phase out race-day meds

[12/ALL/ALL]

While gradually reducing the role of drugs in North American is probably a good thing, the greatest damage to thoroughbreds has been done by the nature of American racing itself. Dirt racing over rewards speed and under rewards stamina. Not surprisingly, breeders have taken notice and more and more speed has been bred into horses without regard to soundness over the decades. A horse should not have legs this thin. Races are also too short and require too much stressful rapid acceleration from a standing start. From my point of view, all racing should be conducted on grass at distances greater than a mile even for 2 year olds. This would of course require the seasonal closing of northern tracks plus the permanent closing of bullring tracks and is never going to happen on this side of the Atlantic Ocean. There would be fewer tracks left but the quality of racing would be incredible with full fields of sounder horses. I'm allowed to dream.

[highnote]

Originally Posted by 12/ALL/ALL

While gradually reducing the role of drugs in North American is probably a good thing, the greatest damage to thoroughbreds has been done by the nature of American racing itself. Dirt racing over rewards speed and under rewards stamina. Not surprisingly, breeders have taken notice and more and more speed has been bred into horses without regard to soundness over the decades. A horse should not have legs this thin. Races are also too short and require too much stressful rapid acceleration from a standing start. From my point of view, all racing should be conducted on grass at distances greater than a mile even for 2 year olds. This would of course require the seasonal closing of northern tracks plus the permanent closing of bullring tracks and is never going to happen on this side of the Atlantic Ocean. There would be fewer tracks left but the quality of racing would be incredible with full fields of sounder horses. I'm allowed to dream.

Excellent points.

At NYRA they could greatly increase the number of turf races by alternating BEL and AQU every two days. Two days at BEL. One day off. Two days at AQU. One day off. That would be 24 days of racing per month.

Close AQU and BEL from Dec 15 (weather permitting) to March 1 (weather permitting). Or deepen the Aqueduct Inner track and make it like a turf course. It doesn't matter how fast the final time is. All that matters is that there is a winner and people can bet the race. No one cares if a mile is run in 1:36 or 1:43.

Get rid of sprint races on the dirt and only have dirt races at one mile or more.

American thoroughbred racing is trending toward quarterhorse racing.

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by highnote

At NYRA they could greatly increase the number of turf races by alternating BEL and AQU every two days. Two days at BEL. One day off. Two days at AQU. One day off. That would be 24 days of racing per month.

If this is an example of one of your ideas to save racing, many of us can breathe a sigh of relief that we aren't missing anything ( other than a good laugh ) from the endless tomes you post here. To dismiss the costs involved with doing something with nary a thought is as ludicrous as your constant comparisons between US racing and Hong Kong racing. Keeping two plants open simultaneously, at double the expense of much of the equipment, would be a laughably poor business decision. It's stunning that this isn't obvious to you.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by the little guy

If this is an example of one of your ideas to save racing, many of us can breathe a sigh of relief that we aren't missing anything ( other than a good laugh ) from the endless tomes you post here. To dismiss the costs involved with doing something with nary a thought is as ludicrous as your constant comparisons between US racing and Hong Kong racing. Keeping two plants open simultaneously, at double the expense of much of the equipment, would be a laughably poor business decision. It's stunning that this isn't obvious to you.

Yep. They do this in Hong Kong, but they have 70,000 live attendance and $15m handle per race, which makes a lot of things possible. But even then, it's something of an extravagance and is probably done to keep the old Happy Valley plant open.

You can't do it here and wouldn't want to.

And also, NYRA does a really good job on this issue anyway. All of its plants have three turf courses, which protects the grass.

[Jeff P]

Originally Posted by the little guy

If this is an example of one of your ideas to save racing, many of us can breathe a sigh of relief that we aren't missing anything ( other than a good laugh ) from the endless tomes you post here. To dismiss the costs involved with doing something with nary a thought is as ludicrous as your constant comparisons between US racing and Hong Kong racing. Keeping two plants open simultaneously, at double the expense of much of the equipment, would be a laughably poor business decision. It's stunning that this isn't obvious to you.

I'm not suggesting that NYRA close one or the other --

But aren't Aqueduct and Belmont just a few miles away from each other?

[Tom]

Hey, that is an idea....they could buy the old grandstand on wheels that Gulfstream used to have during the renovations, and just have everyone show up at Belmont every day and then drive the seats over to Aqueduct for the actual racing!

Wow!
I can see it now........

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by Jeff P

I'm not suggesting that NYRA close one or the other --

But aren't Aqueduct and Belmont just a few miles away from each other?

What's your point Jeff?

[Jeff P]

Is that like the moving grandstand idea they're thinking about for a track in New Mexico?


-jp

.

[highnote]

Originally Posted by the little guy

If this is an example of one of your ideas to save racing, many of us can breathe a sigh of relief that we aren't missing anything ( other than a good laugh ) from the endless tomes you post here. To dismiss the costs involved with doing something with nary a thought is as ludicrous as your constant comparisons between US racing and Hong Kong racing. Keeping two plants open simultaneously, at double the expense of much of the equipment, would be a laughably poor business decision. It's stunning that this isn't obvious to you.

Well, let's hear your great ideas, hot shot.

If you don't like my endless tomes then block me.

You are like the rest of the oldsters on paceadvantage, you criticize, but offer no solutions. Like the George Harrison song goes, "It's easier to see the books upon the shelf that it is to see yourself."

Shifting racing is done all the time in England. They run a couple of days and then move on to the next track. Hong Kong alternates between two tracks. So stop making excuses and help find solutions.

There would be no reason to open up the entire Belmont plant all the time. The grandstand is practically empty most race days.

AQU is a busy place every day with the casino. I could be mistaken, but I thought it was the case that horses were stabled at both tracks year round and the tracks were open year round for training. If they aren't, they could be.

It can be done. It's just a matter of strategy and tactics.

To paraphrase Mayor Bloomberg -- NYRA is the only bookie I've ever seen that loses money.

[the little guy]

Originally Posted by highnote

Well, let's hear your great ideas, hot shot.

If you don't like my endless tomes then block me.

You are like the rest of the oldsters on paceadvantage, you criticize, but offer no solutions. Like the George Harrison song goes, "It's easier to see the books upon the shelf that it is to see yourself."

Shifting racing is done all the time in England. They run a couple of days and then move on to the next track. Hong Kong alternates between two tracks. So stop making excuses and help find solutions.

There would be no reason to open up the entire Belmont plant all the time. The grandstand is practically empty most race days.

AQU is a busy place every day with the casino. I could be mistaken, but I thought it was the case that horses were stabled at both tracks year round and the tracks were open year round for training. If they aren't, they could be.

It can be done. It's just a matter of strategy and tactics.

To paraphrase Mayor Bloomberg -- NYRA is the only bookie I've ever seen that loses money.

This is really stupid stuff....and that's being nice.

I am very comfortable with my contributions to the game. I work tirelessly to improve the quality of information that has been, and continues to be, imparted to the public. Some appreciate it and some don't. I'm OK with that. I also don't run around saying I have answers, or even that there are questions, so trying to drag me into your foolishness is completely nonsensical.

The comment, and I'm not sure whether Bloomberg said it or not ( and I certainly don't trust you because you get nothing right ), was about NYC OTB, and not about NYRA in any way. In fact, NYC OTB stiffed NYRA for over $22 million when they went bankrupt, something pretty much everyone conveniently ignored.

I will take your advice and never look at another word you post. It's excellent advice. Likely your first.

[highnote]

Originally Posted by the little guy

This is really stupid stuff....and that's being nice.

I am very comfortable with my contributions to the game. I work tirelessly to improve the quality of information that has been, and continues to be, imparted to the public. Some appreciate it and some don't. I'm OK with that. I also don't run around saying I have answers, or even that there are questions, so trying to drag me into your foolishness is completely nonsensical.

The comment, and I'm not sure whether Bloomberg said it or not ( and I certainly don't trust you because you get nothing right ), was about NYC OTB, and not about NYRA in any way. In fact, NYC OTB stiffed NYRA for over $22 million when they went bankrupt, something pretty much everyone conveniently ignored.

I will take your advice and never look at another word you post. It's excellent advice. Likely your first.

Good. Block me. You offer no solutions.

Bloomberg said it about OTB. That's why I said I am paraphrasing Bloomberg.

I agree you contribute with your commentary on the broadcasts. I like what I hear.

You call my stuff stupid, but offer nothing better. Why? Because you don't have anything better. You're happy to collect a paycheck long enough to reach social security age. Nothing wrong with that. Most people do the same.

But it would be nice if you offered ideas to improve the game instead of calling the ideas stupid of those of us who try. Then again, maybe the ideas are stupid and the criticism is warranted. One thing is for certain -- the ideas that are actually being implemented now in the racing industry must be stupid otherwise racing would NOT be spiraling down the toilet.

And those of you who blame racing's decline on it becoming less popular. That's a cop out argument. Ask instead what can be done to make racing more popular.

How about ZERO takeout. That's what robinhood.com has for their commission fees. ZERO commission stock trading.

Racing doesn't like having customers so they may as well have ZERO takeout. That way they don't have to worrying about taking their customers' money and giving them something in return. But that will never happen. Why? Because racing wants to take money from bettors, but they also want to believe they are operating like they still have a monopoly on gambling and can take without giving great customer service in return.

Those days of monopoly are gone. Maybe in 30 years when the state takes over NY racing completely and turns the tracks into condos racing executives will wake up. Of course by then you and the executives will all be dead or retired having outlived the ability to contribute.

Maybe that's a bit harsh, but it's the reality racing in NY is headed for. Or maybe the AQU casino will provide enough milk to sustain life for another 30 years? I hope so for your sake and the sake of everyone else sucking on the hind tit.

[castaway01]

Originally Posted by highnote

Good. Block me. You offer no solutions.

Bloomberg said it about OTB. That's why I said I am paraphrasing Bloomberg.

I agree you contribute with your commentary on the broadcasts. I like what I hear.

You call my stuff stupid, but offer nothing better. Why? Because you don't have anything better. You're happy to collect a paycheck long enough to reach social security age. Nothing wrong with that. Most people do the same.

But it would be nice if you offered ideas to improve the game instead of calling the ideas stupid of those of us who try. Then again, maybe the ideas are stupid and the criticism is warranted. One thing is for certain -- the ideas that are actually being implemented now in the racing industry must be stupid otherwise racing would NOT be spiraling down the toilet.

And those of you who blame racing's decline on it becoming less popular. That's a cop out argument. Ask instead what can be done to make racing more popular.

How about ZERO takeout. That's what robinhood.com has for their commission fees. ZERO commission stock trading.

Racing doesn't like having customers so they may as well have ZERO takeout. That way they don't have to worrying about taking their customers' money and giving them something in return. But that will never happen. Why? Because racing wants to take money from bettors, but they also want to believe they are operating like they still have a monopoly on gambling and can take without giving great customer service in return.

Those days of monopoly are gone. Maybe in 30 years when the state takes over NY racing completely and turns the tracks into condos racing executives will wake up. Of course by then you and the executives will all be dead or retired having outlived the ability to contribute.

Maybe that's a bit harsh, but it's the reality racing in NY is headed for. Or maybe the AQU casino will provide enough milk to sustain life for another 30 years? I hope so for your sake and the sake of everyone else sucking on the hind tit.

Your solution is zero takeout? Yeah, just like casinos and the lottery have. Even your beloved Hong Kong has higher takeout than most North American tracks, and they ARE a monopoly so they could cut it to 1% if they wanted to because they don't allow competition. Funny how they don't do that.

Then on top of that, telling someone who has worked his ass off for racing that he's basically a leech and parasite is pretty low, even for you.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Originally Posted by castaway01

Your solution is zero takeout? Yeah, just like casinos and the lottery have. Even your beloved Hong Kong has higher takeout than most North American tracks, and they ARE a monopoly so they could cut it to 1% if they wanted to because they don't allow competition. Funny how they don't do that.

Moreover, Robinhood can charge zero commissions b/c of payment for order flow, something which obviously doesn't exist in the racing business model.

[dilanesp]

Originally Posted by the little guy

This is really stupid stuff....and that's being nice.

I am very comfortable with my contributions to the game. I work tirelessly to improve the quality of information that has been, and continues to be, imparted to the public. Some appreciate it and some don't.

As someone who has gotten into many scraps with Andy here, let me echo this point. I don't agree with all of his opinions expressed here, but his day job is providing extensive amounts of good information to the public and serving as an ambassador for the sport. He does an amazing job. We need more Andy Serlings, even if it does mean I get slapped down every now and then on the PA board.

[highnote]

Originally Posted by castaway01

Your solution is zero takeout? Yeah, just like casinos and the lottery have. Even your beloved Hong Kong has higher takeout than most North American tracks, and they ARE a monopoly so they could cut it to 1% if they wanted to because they don't allow competition. Funny how they don't do that.

Then on top of that, telling someone who has worked his ass off for racing that he's basically a leech and parasite is pretty low, even for you.

Obviously you missed that I was being facetious about zero takeout.

I went back and tried to find where I said he is a leech and a parasite. I couldn't find it. I guess when you can't win a debate your tactic is to make things up.

Still, you criticize, but offer no better solutions.

I'm patient. I'll wait to hear yours.