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Old 09-08-2006, 01:38 AM   #16
chickenhead
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoyTwoTC
Only if it predicts win probabilities better than Dr. J's program does over an extended sample of races (he used 300K).
I can do that with one equation.
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Old 09-08-2006, 10:16 AM   #17
JohnBoyTwoTC
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The Proof Is In The Pudding!

Quote:
Originally Posted by chickenhead
I can do that with one equation.
Where's the pudding?
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Old 09-08-2006, 10:33 AM   #18
banacek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoyTwoTC
Only if it predicts win probabilities better than Dr. J's program does over an extended sample of races (he used 300K).
You said: "Where's the pudding?"

EXACTLY. That's what we have been asking Dr. Johnson for for weeks!

One of the most famous polls in history is the Literary Digest poll of the Presidential race of 1936. It said Alf Landon (who?) would beat Roosevelt(now him I've heard about) easily. Poll size (I think) was 2.4 million. Problem was they didn't bother to poll poor people. So don't get so worried about sample size. Make sure your technique is correct to start.

If I have a thousand races with a VERIFIED odds line that works, I'll put money on that, but I wouldn't put a dime on 300,000 races if it isn't properly tested. It may well work. But until you VERIFY that it works, it is just another odds line. (And verifying is not just checking to see if 50% of 1-1 shots win, etc., etc. - something I am astounded that someone with Dr. Johnson's academic background - which isn't dissimilar to mine - doesn't understand)

Last edited by banacek; 09-08-2006 at 10:36 AM.
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Old 09-08-2006, 10:33 AM   #19
ryesteve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoyTwoTC
Where's the pudding?
I'm guessing he meant something like, P = .84/(odds+1)


BTW, you guys have practically the same avatar
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Old 09-08-2006, 11:26 AM   #20
xtb
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryesteve

BTW, you guys have practically the same avatar

No offense intended but I thought it was Kramer at first.
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Old 09-08-2006, 12:01 PM   #21
Lefty
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Holy Cow, Batman, just cut to the friggin chase. 3-4 threads on same subject and you do not illustrate your "perfect" line has made a profit. Just give us the number of races you have bet either for real or mythically, the profit on a $2 bet and leave it at that. I'm surprised PA has demonstrated so much patience here when he had none in the software thread about QuickHorse.
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Old 09-08-2006, 03:46 PM   #22
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Thumbs up VALUE BETTING AT THE RACETRACK

Dear Banacek:

I DO UNDERSTAND!

I ask you to re-read my opening (the # 1) post in THIS PART III POSTCRIPT
thread. Thank you.
___________________________

YOU opened this whole scenario in Part iOne by replying to me with a wholesome comment.

Now, we're past the end.

TO ALL:

As I said in "adieu" I expect to report back to you - and the group - with specific ROIs derived from The Valuline (my betting line)
relative to (identifying) specific racetracks and race types.

It is my observation, so far, that particular race conditions & types ("The Bet Analyzer" Figure III) in my Book produce different ROI results at different racetracks. This is based on my "manual" use of my computer's Bet Analyzer
explained below.

Since you admit you haven't read my book, I will answer you here to the
best of my ability - so that you (and others) may more fully understand why
I have not yet listed my findings.

You must realize that I am converting my "Bet Analyzer" to an AUTOMATIC VERSION to evaluate ALL CONDITIONS AND COMBINATIONS AT THE 87 thoroughbred racetracks handicapped by The Valuline.

(The vast majority of combinations of factors so far queried show losers, of course. HOWEVER, there are a surprising number of particular race type/track situations that seem to be producing profitable ROIs, and of sizable percent (e.g. above 25 percent). These are the ones - providing the win percentage and sample size is high enough - that I am subjecting to intensive and extensive testing (I have 5 years, 300,000+ races, at almost all North American thoroughbred racetracks) in my databse.

This is an IMMENSE JOB and, for this reason only, I can't/won't in good conscience present (or share), PRE-MATURE findings!

(Since you and others have requested explanations repeatedly, I am now taking the time to explain my reasoning to you. I had expected my Book to do it - but, of course, for those of you who refuse to read it, this will not happen).

THEREFORE, I'll finish with an outline or "short answer" for the time being, and LET'S PART COLLEAGUES:

Try to visualize the screen of my "Bet Analyzer" ,as it is printed in my
Book. You will see the thousands of combinations of factors SUCH AS as win contender ranking, TVL odds, Morning LIne odds, Track odds, Public Choice ranking, Sex,Age,Surface,Track Condition, Distance, Race Type (Maiden, Non-Maiden, Allowance, Claiming, etc.), Claiming Price, Horse Starts,Jockey Starts,Trainer Starts,Horse Win Percentage, Jockey Win Percentage, Trainer Win Percentage, Post Position, Race Grade (program determined), Field Size,Purse,Gross Points of The Valuline win contenders, (program determined), Overlay percentage.

After all the combinations of all of the above plus a few other factors are
analyzed, the Automatic Bet Analyzer will produce its results in terms of ROI by rank of win contender, by overlay, etc.

This will yield my "Daily Bets" List (Table IV) in my Book. It will be a list
of bets to be made for each day, by post time, track, race and program number, horse name, and bet type. Bet type will be win and/or specific exotic,with also a bet designation: !x, 2x, 3x etc. compared to a normal bet
(1x).

Perhaps, NOW, you can understand what I'm all about, and why I've set a
date of next year's Kentucky Derby to complete my testing.

Sincerely,
Dave Johnson
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Old 09-08-2006, 06:48 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty
I'm surprised PA has demonstrated so much patience here when he had none in the software thread about QuickHorse.
Well, to be fair, this entire drama was started by a poster who has been here quite some time and has contributed much to the board.

The QuickHorse thread was started by a guy with zero posts (that was his first) and was quite the blatant ad, highlighting almost every "fantastic" feature of the program, right down to the "amazing" customer service....
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Old 09-08-2006, 08:08 PM   #24
Lefty
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Pa, I understand. I subscribed to the free trial 4 days ago, had several q's and the guy was most promp in getting bk to me. So customer service may be quite good.
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Old 10-09-2007, 12:09 PM   #25
mgroves
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Thanks Lefty.

Mike
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Old 10-09-2007, 12:23 PM   #26
chickenhead
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It just won't die!

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !
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Old 10-09-2007, 02:49 PM   #27
Figman
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I don't know too much about QuickHorse but I do know about their QuickDog.
QuickDog is fabulously maintained!
And the same people produce both.
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Old 10-09-2007, 03:47 PM   #28
shanta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chickenhead
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !
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