Beware of 5Dimes horse racing

[GameTheory]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

Here's what i don't get.

Since this is not a pari mutuel book, they can essentially just "not pay" if there are any "irregularities". So, why not just permit betting on a 3 horse field and if everything is on the up and up, pay the winners.

In other words, the original reason for not accepting bets on 3 horse races isn't applicable to this book, because they can just 'not pay' if they don't want to.

Since they are not pari-mutuel, they care if you win or lose -- they want you to lose. I think the reason is simply they don't make money on the short fields, or they have the possibility of getting hammered on the favorite and not enough other horses to draw some other money. (They are paying rebates also, btw.)

[Stillriledup]

Originally Posted by GameTheory

Since they are not pari-mutuel, they care if you win or lose -- they want you to lose. I think the reason is simply they don't make money on the short fields, or they have the possibility of getting hammered on the favorite and not enough other horses to draw some other money. (They are paying rebates also, btw.)

I would think that eliminating bets on very short fields was due to their not wanting to get hammered for a large amount of money if the race is not on the up and up. But, like i said, they just can decide not to pay if they think something looks odd, so that's why i wasn't sure why they would care to have that 3 horse rule.

As far as them not making money on short fields, the breakage matters more in those races because there are no "longshots" almost all of the horses are going to be 2-1 or less, you can take advantage of the breakage in those situations, they should WANT 3 horse fields, its more money for them as they pay off the equivalent to the win price at the track which can be rounded down as much as 19 cents at most tracks.

[jettroofer]

I have a book I play with currently who I think stiffed me recently and did it on purpose. I have played with them for years since Texas sucks regarding ADW's and have cashed out smaller amounts of around a grand here and there. I hit a nice race for several k's at Belmont a few weeks back and commenced to cash out $4k. I received 2 separate checks. One for $1000 drawn off a bank in Canada and one for $3k drawn off of, I believe, the Bank of NY. Needless to say, the $3K check bounced and was back charged to my account. I started calling and emailing and they opened an 'issue' on the matter. They informed me that they would get to the bottom of it in 48 hours. Miraculously, I get an email about 2 days later that doesn't reference a thing about my 'dispute' but is informing me not to deposit the $3K check because there was a printing error so they voided it. The check actually didn't clear because of a stop payment. However, they were so nice to immediately add the $3k back to my account. I am very suspicious about it. I would like to tell you I tested them and immediately cashed it back out to test the system again for that amount, but like a dumbass I did exactly what they expected me to do and burned it up trying to double it. LOL. I'm not sure if it was just a happenstance or if the book meant to do it.

The moral of the story is that Texas gambling is horse sh*&&^ and should allow us to use legitimate online books to place our horse bets.

[Track Phantom]

I have used a lot of off-shores for sports and horses. I trust only ONE and that is GT Bets. You can withdraw (with a fee, which does suck) and the money will hit your bank account within 4-6 days.

I have had a good experience with their customer service and they have very solid rebates/bonuses. In fact, I've worked out a deal with them to give a reload bonus + $25 bet on any BC race for people that reference Track Phantom. Not earth shattering stuff but still free.

Once you have a platform you trust, I wouldn't consider any others.

(PM me if you want the details about reload which is 100% for a new player + $25 win bet).

[Dark Horse]

I've never had a problem with Bookmaker. And Heritage has been good for me as well, but it's been a while and I don't recall if they keep the races open until post time. As mentioned, 5D doesn't monitor the track at all, and very often closes a race five minutes before it goes off. That really drove me nuts during the short time I bet horses there. Today's cancellation, a literal punishment for playing at this book instead of elsewhere, was just the final drop. Offshore has gone downhill fast in recent years. One book stole thousands from me, so I'm cautious and hypersensitive these days to the ease with which they turn to cheating.

[Dark Horse]

Originally Posted by Stillriledup

Here's what i don't get.

Since this is not a pari mutuel book, they can essentially just "not pay" if there are any "irregularities". So, why not just permit betting on a 3 horse field and if everything is on the up and up, pay the winners.

In other words, the original reason for not accepting bets on 3 horse races isn't applicable to this book, because they can just 'not pay' if they don't want to.

The rule is bs. Throw in a 50/1 longshot and you have a 4 horse field.

In a three horse field a 2/1 horse beating a 3/5 horse is actually the longshot. In a larger field that horse wouldn't be 2/1. So .... what added risk does the book run? Everybody betting on the favorite?

I doubt the rule is about irregularities, because they can and do happen in any size field.

[thaskalos]

Originally Posted by Dark Horse

The rule is bs. Throw in a 50/1 longshot and you have a 4 horse field.

In a three horse field a 2/1 horse beating a 3/5 horse is actually the longshot. In a larger field that horse wouldn't be 2/1. So .... what added risk does the book run? Everybody betting on the favorite?

I doubt the rule is about irregularities, because they can and do happen in any size field.

The rule is in place to protect the book against a big bet in an easy-to-figure-out race. In a three horse field, the likely winner almost always sticks out...and the overseas book is not protected by the odds drop that a big bet on the likely winner would cause. Since the bet is kept out of the track's perimutuel pool...the only protection against this scenario that the book has is to refuse the wagers on these tiny pools.

[incoming]

Originally Posted by Dark Horse

I've never had a problem with Bookmaker. And Heritage has been good for me as well, but it's been a while and I don't recall if they keep the races open until post time. As mentioned, 5D doesn't monitor the track at all, and very often closes a race five minutes before it goes off. That really drove me nuts during the short time I bet horses there. Today's cancellation, a literal punishment for playing at this book instead of elsewhere, was just the final drop. Offshore has gone downhill fast in recent years. One book stole thousands from me, so I'm cautious and hypersensitive these days to the ease with which they turn to cheating.

I am a 5 Dime customer. When there is a difference between 5D race time and actual race time a browser refresh always solves my problem. They generally stop taking bets during the loading process. Yes, they even take bets on scratches but they have always been refunded. The scratches or clearly noted on the betting screen.

[judd]

I use heritage for golf & sports but stick with xpressbet FOR horses
no problems at all with heritage

[theiman]

If the race is
and then the is a Late Scratch do they accept the wager or refund it?

[raybo]

Originally Posted by theiman

If the race is
and then the is a Late Scratch do they accept the wager or refund it?

It is probably 3 betting interests, not 3 horses. Which in your scenario would be 3 betting interests and probably no race

[Dark Horse]

Originally Posted by thaskalos

The rule is in place to protect the book against a big bet in an easy-to-figure-out race. In a three horse field, the likely winner almost always sticks out...and the overseas book is not protected by the odds drop that a big bet on the likely winner would cause. Since the bet is kept out of the track's perimutuel pool...the only protection against this scenario that the book has is to refuse the wagers on these tiny pools.

Obviously, the rule is there to protect the book, but it's so arbitrary. They could lower the limit instead.

Here is the race, by the way. To get an idea why it p*ssed me off even more. It may have been a three horse race, but the finish was better than what most races offer.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-raci...sa-on-10-23-14

[Dark Horse]

Originally Posted by judd

I use heritage for golf & sports but stick with xpressbet FOR horses
no problems at all with heritage

Heritage is good. They used to be great back in the day, before Spiro sent over all the US players from the Greek. That put a damper on things.

[happy camper]

One of the best offshore places, if not the best.

Not too many places offer pick 6, pick 5, and pick 4 wagering with a respectable max payout. This place does. The betting denominations are lower vs mutual.

If you hit here, you don't have to worry about getting paid. Offshore is a risk, but if you play offshore, this would be the safest place.

They have two racing platforms. Which one locks up 5 minutes before races?

If it helps you identify which one it is, the plus 10% platofrm is DGS software.

DGS horses has a reputation for being asleep behind the wheel. I'm not talking about scratches either.

[happy camper]

I recall responding to this thread and I see I did.

I've been playing with 5Dimes pretty much for the past months.

I played the pick 5 and pick 4 at Aqueduct yesterday and was out after the first leg of each. I forgot about the rule Dark Horse mentioned since I gathered he played straight bets.

They refunded the pk5 and p4 bets since race 3 ended up with 3 runners.

It worked in my favor this time, but I have a feeling it will come back to haunt me down the road.

I see what Dark Horse meant by closing the races early. It seems they go the noted start time, but seldom leave it open past it. That is the rebate racebook. If you use the 10% rebate racebook, they remain open usually until the race goes off. Proceed with caution when using this software, DGS, because they leave races open sometimes and are prone to past betting, whether done on purpose or not.