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11-04-2018, 10:17 AM
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#31
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dark Side of the Moon
Posts: 5,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Fischer
Good point.
Came to check on this thread, and see that it's now buried because Andy Asaro decided to once again start a new thread on an existing topic.
I do have to give Asaro credit for self-restraint, as he only pimped 8 'tweets' into that thread (thus far, at the time of this posting).
No time to dwell on trivial stuff, but thought it a slightly annoying trend.
Anyway, Justify is Bo Jackson, and Accelerate is Emmitt Smith. /football fans
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Barry was better than them both.
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11-04-2018, 10:27 AM
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#32
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clean money
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 23,558
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GMB@BP
Barry was better than them both.
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Barry Sanders could play today and still be the greatest of all time. He was on a different level. Can't use him in this stretch of a comparison
Bo was a physical marvel. Fans would tune-in/buy tickets to see him do something amazing. Was on his way to quite a career when he injured the hip.
Emmitt wasn't jaw-dropping, but his career numbers and big game victories put him in the conversation for top running backs.
__________________
Preparation. Discipline. Patience. Decisiveness.
Last edited by Robert Fischer; 11-04-2018 at 10:28 AM.
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11-04-2018, 02:18 PM
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#33
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Fischer
Barry Sanders could play today and still be the greatest of all time. He was on a different level. Can't use him in this stretch of a comparison
Bo was a physical marvel. Fans would tune-in/buy tickets to see him do something amazing. Was on his way to quite a career when he injured the hip.
Emmitt wasn't jaw-dropping, but his career numbers and big game victories put him in the conversation for top running backs.
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I still say Bo was the best pure athlete I have ever seen. Every tome he stepped on the field you felt something special could happen.
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11-04-2018, 02:36 PM
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#34
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 445
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I think that Justify's hoove problems were legit and him continuing to run would be risky and not worth it. IIRC Ghostzapper had same issues. Justify's physically superior and has a great aesthetic to him, just a marvelous animal to see even if just in photos and videos. Seeing him compete and test against older horses would be exciting as hell, but a potential catastrophic injury on track or training isn't worth it. The cynical thing is that they just don't want to risk him being a loser at any point or damage their breeding value/goods, but I don't think that's the full story. WTF do I know? Nothing. Just I have a hunch that he does have some fragility to him, even more than normal for a thoroughbred.
"of the year" is a good enough definition. Horse raced as a 3 or plus y.o that year they can be horse of the year, why not.
Justify isn't overrated. Real deal animal.
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11-04-2018, 03:05 PM
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#35
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self medicated
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: toga
Posts: 3,086
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His hoof issues are legit but hes physically superior? How the hell does that work? Which proves the hype and bias of the TC. If he was "Physically superior" , Accelerate would of been the one retired. Physically speaking, if ones career is 6 races, that's a problem.
The question should be, who did Justify beat? The three year olds were taking turns and looked awful yesterday in the classic. I think Catholic Boy and McKinzie are still out there (lol) and Mendelssohn was a rabbit target. The 3 yo's that survived, could not breathe on this horse. He was lengths, much the best yesterday.
His numbers through out the season were superior to everyone. I don't really go by them, but I look and its not even close. Justify would of had to step up during the fall, but we will never know. People forget he barely beat Bravazo in the Preakness...…..the crop was really not that great. Like I said in the beginning, the "hype" and fandom of the TC is evident and revealed by statements. "Physically Superior"???? ....he lasted 6 races? Horse of a generation????? What? 4 or 5 months? If that's the case, God help horse racing.
Hes a real physical specimen alright, lets breed a bunch of em like that....
Last edited by burnsy; 11-04-2018 at 03:15 PM.
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11-04-2018, 03:26 PM
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#36
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadVindication
I think that Justify's hoove problems were legit and him continuing to run would be risky and not worth it. IIRC Ghostzapper had same issues. Justify's physically superior and has a great aesthetic to him, just a marvelous animal to see even if just in photos and videos. Seeing him compete and test against older horses would be exciting as hell, but a potential catastrophic injury on track or training isn't worth it. The cynical thing is that they just don't want to risk him being a loser at any point or damage their breeding value/goods, but I don't think that's the full story. WTF do I know? Nothing. Just I have a hunch that he does have some fragility to him, even more than normal for a thoroughbred.
"of the year" is a good enough definition. Horse raced as a 3 or plus y.o that year they can be horse of the year, why not.
Justify isn't overrated. Real deal animal.
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My test for a "legitimate" injury is whether it is enough to retire a cheap gelding claimer.
By that definition, Justify's doesn't qualify.
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11-04-2018, 07:45 PM
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#37
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Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dark Side of the Moon
Posts: 5,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
My test for a "legitimate" injury is whether it is enough to retire a cheap gelding claimer.
By that definition, Justify's doesn't qualify.
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Mr Brooks may have qualified for you, not sure.
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11-04-2018, 07:52 PM
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#38
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 3,822
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
Absolutely.
It's like hitting for the cycle in baseball. It is amazing, hard to do, and isn't a career.
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That's a ridiculous comparison, since hitting for the cycle is one GAME vs. a 20-year career. For many of the Triple Crown horses the 2-year-old preps and Triple Crown season are a substantial portion of their career, for better or worse.
What you're doing is much more like saying Sandy Koufax is overrated because he retired young, but Jim Kaat pitched until he was 44 so he's better.
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11-04-2018, 09:01 PM
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#39
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self medicated
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: toga
Posts: 3,086
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That’s a ridiculous comparison but somehow it’s perfectly normal to compare a horse with 6 starts to a horse with 20, and the horse with 20 starts beat all the generations racing while the horse with 6 starts only beat one generation. Gee, I love the logic.
Last edited by burnsy; 11-04-2018 at 09:03 PM.
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11-04-2018, 09:32 PM
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#40
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
My test for a "legitimate" injury is whether it is enough to retire a cheap gelding claimer.
By that definition, Justify's doesn't qualify.
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Fair enough. Then there's the difference between a horse named Cheap Gelding Claimer or named Barbaro.
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11-04-2018, 09:46 PM
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#41
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by castaway01
That's a ridiculous comparison, since hitting for the cycle is one GAME vs. a 20-year career. For many of the Triple Crown horses the 2-year-old preps and Triple Crown season are a substantial portion of their career, for better or worse.
What you're doing is much more like saying Sandy Koufax is overrated because he retired young, but Jim Kaat pitched until he was 44 so he's better.
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OK, if you prefer, a TC is like a single season milestone like 50 home runs.
It's a milestone but having a 50 home run season and doing literally nothing else will not get you much recognition
And Koufax had FIVE GREAT SEASONS. No comparison to Justify's meaningless six race "career".
Last edited by dilanesp; 11-04-2018 at 09:47 PM.
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11-04-2018, 09:50 PM
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#42
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadVindication
Fair enough. Then there's the difference between a horse named Cheap Gelding Claimer or named Barbaro.
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If you are implying it is OK to risk the lives of cheap horses but not Barbaro, that doesn't fly.
There's one standard for fitness to race.
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11-04-2018, 10:03 PM
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#43
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
If you are implying it is OK to risk the lives of cheap horses but not Barbaro, that doesn't fly.
There's one standard for fitness to race.
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Not what I was implying. I meant the celebrity and high profile.
Should no one retire their runners so long as they are passing track vet checks?
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11-04-2018, 10:13 PM
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#44
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadVindication
Not what I was implying. I meant the celebrity and high profile.
Should no one retire their runners so long as they are passing track vet checks?
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There should be one standard for all horses.
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11-05-2018, 11:32 AM
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#45
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 4,285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dilanesp
If you are implying it is OK to risk the lives of cheap horses but not Barbaro, that doesn't fly.
There's one standard for fitness to race.
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Very few horses are without a problem of some sort. Any time you race a horse you are risking the horse's life. Just by owning and racing a horse you are implying that it is OK to risk its life. Only an idiot would apply the same standard to a $10,000 gelding as they would to a multi-million dollar stud prospect.
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