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Old 07-12-2018, 01:00 AM   #61
elysiantraveller
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Originally Posted by newtothegame View Post
This year our GDP is something like 18.6 TRILLION! Saving 1.5% of that could go a long way towards helping our own problems!
Then why the hell do you support a candidate who campaigned on increased military spending?

Now we spend too much?

This is trying to have it both ways...

Just vote a candidate that will cut military spending and teach those European bastards a lesson!!!

Unlike, apparently, you I don't have a problem with our military spending.

I think having a strong military to protect American interests throughout the globe ultimately benefits us here at home.

I think having a large economy across the pond that is more or less subserviant to us because it relies on us for defence is in our best interest.

I don't think entering into trade spats and attempting weaken that bloc is in our best interest.

See how I've successfully inferred a point you tried to make and put a bunch of words into your mouth? This is what happens when you follow team Trump down the rabbit hole of incoherence.

Last edited by elysiantraveller; 07-12-2018 at 01:01 AM.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:19 AM   #62
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Call me when Trump is finished destroying the USA and the world at large.

We'll tally up then.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:25 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by elysiantraveller View Post
Then why the hell do you support a candidate who campaigned on increased military spending?

Now we spend too much?
Never said we spend to much (for ourselves). However, I do have a problem when others are living up to the agreements they agreed to.

This is trying to have it both ways..
See above because obviously your attempting again to change what I said..

Just vote a candidate that will cut military spending and teach those European bastards a lesson!!!
Cutting military spending is different the living up to our obligations (which we are) and then some.
Unlike, apparently, you I don't have a problem with our military spending.
Neither do I when its for us and not to protect those who only wish to take advantage of the situation, knowing our interest.
I think having a strong military to protect American interests throughout the globe ultimately benefits us here at home.
True...never disagreed with this
I think having a large economy across the pond that is more or less subserviant to us because it relies on us for defence is in our best interest.
Again, subservient means they should pay the little we ask them too...
I don't think entering into trade spats and attempting weaken that bloc is in our best interest.
Military spending is NOT trade so lets not deflect....
See how I've successfully inferred a point you tried to make and put a bunch of words into your mouth? This is what happens when you follow team Trump down the rabbit hole of incoherence.
lol....again you attempt to be "right" with your last statement. You should of just said "I can tell you what to think and say it for you"...would of saved you a lot of hot air.....
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:25 AM   #64
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I think it is a dumb thing for us to do. We are rocking the boat for a few dollars more - dollars that amount to peanuts compared to the human and $ cost of another world war to the USA.
I would think you would rather the 'extra money' go to help a neighbor up the street rather than one across the Atlantic Ocean.

Maybe it is just a mental disorder the far left have, having fun giving away other people's money.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:30 AM   #65
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Call me when Trump is finished destroying the USA and the world at large.

We'll tally up then.
Call me when he accomplishes something.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:37 AM   #66
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Originally Posted by newtothegame View Post
However, I do have a problem when others are living up to the agreements they agreed to.
STOP

Right there...

Wales Summit Declaration
Issued by the Heads of State and Government participating in the meeting of the North Atlantic Council in Wales


Quote:
We agree to reverse the trend of declining defence budgets, to make the most effective use of our funds and to further a more balanced sharing of costs and responsibilities. Our overall security and defence depend both on how much we spend and how we spend it. Increased investments should be directed towards meeting our capability priorities, and Allies also need to display the political will to provide required capabilities and deploy forces when they are needed. A strong defence industry across the Alliance, including a stronger defence industry in Europe and greater defence industrial cooperation within Europe and across the Atlantic, remains essential for delivering the required capabilities. NATO and EU efforts to strengthen defence capabilities are complementary. Taking current commitments into account, we are guided by the following considerations:
Allies currently meeting the NATO guideline to spend a minimum of 2% of their Gross Domestic Product (GDP) on defence will aim to continue to do so. Likewise, Allies spending more than 20% of their defence budgets on major equipment, including related Research & Development, will continue to do so.
Allies whose current proportion of GDP spent on defence is below this level will:
halt any decline in defence expenditure;
aim to increase defence expenditure in real terms as GDP grows;
aim to move towards the 2% guideline within a decade with a view to meeting their NATO Capability Targets and filling NATO's capability shortfalls.
Besides I find it funny that you guys are complaining about not living up to the terms of international agreements (they are) in light of our recent administration's policies (we haven't).

Which you guys applaud by the way.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:43 AM   #67
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Military spending is NOT trade so lets not deflect....
Sorry this little gem was too good to pass up on...

What was the justification for our steel and aluminum tariffs again?

More proof you guys will say literally ANYTHING to further incoherence.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:43 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by newtothegame View Post
Not about winning.....I don't think there is a win. Its more of a debate where we both express our opinions (even if we disagree)..
I agree.
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:49 AM   #69
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Originally Posted by elysiantraveller View Post
STOP

Right there...

Wales Summit Declaration
Issued by the Heads of State and Government participating in the meeting of the North Atlantic Council in Wales




Besides I find it funny that you guys are complaining about not living up to the terms of international agreements (they are) in light of our recent administration's policies (we haven't).

Which you guys applaud by the way.
So what part did I say that was wrong ???
I said that Germany, can continue increasing ever so slightly, while never really achieving their 2% agreed to terms. Sure they can increase at whatever they wish as long as they are heading upwards...
But the point is that's CHICKEN SHIT! They are using a loop hole as they know our interest over there will keep us on the hook.
Sorry Charlie, let them keep buying their fuel needs from the country they are so afraid of!!! They send millions to the country they want us to protect them from???
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Old 07-12-2018, 01:50 AM   #70
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I agree.
Simple solution... just add Finland to NATO and let them handle Russia...

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Old 07-12-2018, 01:56 AM   #71
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Simple solution... just add Finland to NATO and let them handle Russia...

Funny you didn't use Greece or Poland who are meeting their 2%
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:01 AM   #72
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So what part did I say that was wrong ???
I said that Germany, can continue increasing ever so slightly, while never really achieving their 2% agreed to terms. Sure they can increase at whatever they wish as long as they are heading upwards...…
But the point is that's CHICKEN SHIT! They are using a loop hole as they know our interest over there will keep us on the hook.
Sorry Charlie, let them keep buying their fuel needs from the country they are so afraid of!!! They send millions to the country they want us to protect them from???
and

It's not a loophole. Its specifically written in there.



This is all wrong.

I linked a report on how Germans viewed the world a while ago.

It received a lot of "who cares" around here but it's pretty obvious by you guys didn't read it.

Russia ranks 4th or 5th on Germany's "concern" radar.

This is what happens when you take any administration's statement as gospel.

You can find it here: http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...72&postcount=1

Last edited by elysiantraveller; 07-12-2018 at 02:03 AM.
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:09 AM   #73
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Originally Posted by elysiantraveller View Post
and

It's not a loophole. Its specifically written in there.



This is all wrong.

I linked a report on how Germans viewed the world a while ago.

It received a lot of "who cares" around here but it's pretty obvious by you guys didn't read it.

Russia ranks 4th or 5th on Germany's "concern" radar.

This is what happens when you take any administration's statement as gospel.

You can find it here: http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...72&postcount=1
Where did I say anything about "concerns"??
I said Germany pays millions in funds to Russia for fuel!! Are you saying that's not true???
Next, now follow me here....What is Nato and what is it designed to do?
Who is the boogey man that Nato is worried about if not Russia? Maybe China??
There is a reason the Fins don't want to join Nato and pay up.....Putin has said he would reposition troops if they did so.....
So if the boogey man is Russia, whether or not they are in your top five list of concerns, I wouldn't be supporting them and paying Nato as well...ohhh wait, they don't pay Nato what they are supposed to...
Anyway mR Right, I will bid you a good night as day break comes early.
And I still say if it were me, which it isn't, I would tell Trump to back off incrementally payments the same amount the EU falls short of theirs.
They fall short 1%, we back off 1%...its simple math!!
The money I saved, would go towards the vets here at home who are struggling to make ends meet while we boost up EU economies instead
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:10 AM   #74
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Originally Posted by elysiantraveller View Post
and

It's not a loophole. Its specifically written in there.



This is all wrong.

I linked a report on how Germans viewed the world a while ago.

It received a lot of "who cares" around here but it's pretty obvious by you guys didn't read it.

Russia ranks 4th or 5th on Germany's "concern" radar.

This is what happens when you take any administration's statement as gospel.

You can find it here: http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...72&postcount=1
Written in or not, I saw in another post where someone mentioned good intentions or evil intentions.....
You can draw your own conclusions as to where I feel the Germans "Intentions" are on this.....
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Old 07-12-2018, 02:23 AM   #75
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Where did I say anything about "concerns"??
I said Germany pays millions in funds to Russia for fuel!! Are you saying that's not true???
Next, now follow me here....What is Nato and what is it designed to do?
Who is the boogey man that Nato is worried about if not Russia? Maybe China??
There is a reason the Fins don't want to join Nato and pay up.....Putin has said he would reposition troops if they did so.....
So if the boogey man is Russia, whether or not they are in your top five list of concerns, I wouldn't be supporting them and paying Nato as well...ohhh wait, they don't pay Nato what they are supposed to...…
Anyway mR Right, I will bid you a good night as day break comes early.
And I still say if it were me, which it isn't, I would tell Trump to back off incrementally payments the same amount the EU falls short of theirs.
They fall short 1%, we back off 1%...its simple math!!
The money I saved, would go towards the vets here at home who are struggling to make ends meet while we boost up EU economies instead
My God man this is getting tiring... you said:

"Sorry Charlie, let them keep buying their fuel needs from the country they are so afraid of!!! They send millions to the country they want us to protect them from???"

They aren't that afraid of Russia. Now you say you didn't say that?

The rest of your post is incoherent. The Finn thing was a joke not addressed to you.

NATO is a strategic defensive alliance. That's it.

Europe's concerns are not always going to coincide with ours.

Turkey and Greece (both NATO members) are concerns of theirs. As well as Libya and Syria which are of less concern to us by the minute.

Our concerns are different. More global and less regional.

Russia is OUR boogeyman. Unless you're Trump or a Trump supporter. Then they are or aren't depending on which way the wind blows... today though they are. And DAMMIT Europe we're not gonna protect you from them anymore!

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