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Poll: Will Monmouth Park still be racing in 2025?
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Will Monmouth Park still be racing in 2025?

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Old 05-26-2017, 06:20 PM   #16
alhattab
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Originally Posted by reckless View Post
castaway... I'll let lambo speak for himself, but it was NOT an internet rumor by any means.

It wasn't a direct purchase and takeover per se, but the plans were for The Stronach Group to run and manage Parx. This is a fact. You may or may not know but for about a year now, all entries made for Parx racing were made through the Laurel-Pimlico racing office. I repeat, what lambo originally said was not a crazed Internet rumor. So, how could that be if no understanding of a deal of such magnitude not be in place?

Also, this 'deal' is/was true because for many months now I have heard from very, very reliable sources that The Stronach Group wouldn't finalize anything unless and until Parx cleared up all current lawsuits and some future liabilities. Parx either refused or dragged their feet on this matter. I don't know.

The Stronach Group wanted to rid the place of the 3-4 trainers and owners that have had multiple illegal-drug related infractions -- they wanted to bar them from the track totally. Parx refused to do this because they didn't want any lawsuits from these crumb-bums.

The Pennsylvania Horse Owners Assc. also threw a monkey wrench into the negotiations. To what extent I do not know. My guess is that horse owners like, want and prefer a protected and corrupt racing industry that serves their purpose only and let the betting public be damned.
Agreed and I will add that part of the impetus I believe is that the Parx owners are behind the Phila sports complex casino, and I believe under state law coudnlr run both that facility and Parx.

As far as the Guv, he has been pushing sports betting but he has not supported racing he is the main reason the AC shakedown is no longer in place
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Old 05-26-2017, 06:37 PM   #17
onefast99
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Originally Posted by PowerUpPaynter View Post
Just so I know who to hate can someone explain to me who the hold up is with sports better and/or slots... I know Christie is all for saving Monmouth and he is the HNIC, so whats the hold up?
As of yesterday a new push to have sports wagering a reality at MP is underway.
The GAME act as it is called has a clause in it as follows "The key phrase is in Section 2(a), stating that people or entities are “not subject to civil or criminal liability under any provision of Federal law for engaging through a gaming facility in gaming activity that is lawful under the law of the State.”
This is the reason Drazin didnt just start taking bets at MP. But with the help of Frank Pallone there is light at the end of the tunnel. As now many are saying it isnt "if" it is going to happen it is now when!
Hopefully the powers that be can make this happen at MP.
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Old 05-26-2017, 07:04 PM   #18
SuperPickle
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As of yesterday a new push to have sports wagering a reality at MP is underway.
The GAME act as it is called has a clause in it as follows "The key phrase is in Section 2(a), stating that people or entities are “not subject to civil or criminal liability under any provision of Federal law for engaging through a gaming facility in gaming activity that is lawful under the law of the State.”
This is the reason Drazin didnt just start taking bets at MP. But with the help of Frank Pallone there is light at the end of the tunnel. As now many are saying it isnt "if" it is going to happen it is now when!
Hopefully the powers that be can make this happen at MP.
I don't get why this is "hopefully" it seems like a hail mary. Basically the horsemen are down to using a legal strategy never successfully pulled off. The sounds more desperate than hopeful.

And even if they hit the lottery and it works its sports wagering. Any casino exe can tell its pennies. It's high risk and low profit. Casinos operate sports book to get people to spend money elsewhere. Sports wagering as a free standing business is tough go. You need massive volume. You essentially need other games of chance to mitigate the risk. A bad Super Bowl can crush you.

And then there's this...

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...3db4ee19d.html

Basically Gural conceded he doesn't have near term support for a casino so he's going to wait. The problem is without him Monmouth is screwed. He's in the middle of a state owned sports center with a profitable track and a more or less flat handle. Monmouth has lost 50% of it's handle in 36 months.

I honestly don't mean to single you out and you seem like a nice guy and I get you support Monmouth and run there. But every thread on Monmouth involves you with some winning Golden Ticket idea from Willy Wonka.

But what's odder is you blow past the current reality. Gural essentially broke rank with Monmouth and Drazin. They can't wait six years. He knows this. They know it. But he doesn't care. The best thing Monmouth had in its corner was Gural. He has the cash and respect as a guy who operates multiple racinos.

Also he has an out in his lease. The only leverage anyone on the pro-Casino side is him. He can threatened to walk away form a lease on a building the state spent $100 million building. There's real harness racing jobs in the state at Showplace and Gateway and other farms that go away with no harness racing in NJ. Its not a ton of leverage but he has some. The Monmouth horseman have zero.

Now on top of everything he moved to the opposition side.
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Old 05-26-2017, 07:38 PM   #19
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Pickle
Thank you for sheding the light on some items that I think you are not very well versed on first and foremost Drazin and Gural never got along so let's get that clear. Secondly Gural built the new grandstand with $100 million in loans from the Hard rock in exchange for a 12% equity stake I've posted this at least 20 times. I am sure you will have a few followers that will believe some of the stuff you are writing but looking at many of the posts in regards to Monmouth Park , sports wagering a revenue stream and a casino at the Meadowlands you have been off base with most of your posts. Is sports wagering something that will save the track I've stated it before no but it is a start towards well needed money to a fuel the purses and make the track competitive it's very simple math if you offer good purses the horseman will come.
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Last edited by onefast99; 05-26-2017 at 07:42 PM.
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Old 05-26-2017, 08:46 PM   #20
alhattab
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I don't get why this is "hopefully" it seems like a hail mary. Basically the horsemen are down to using a legal strategy never successfully pulled off. The sounds more desperate than hopeful.

And even if they hit the lottery and it works its sports wagering. Any casino exe can tell its pennies. It's high risk and low profit. Casinos operate sports book to get people to spend money elsewhere. Sports wagering as a free standing business is tough go. You need massive volume. You essentially need other games of chance to mitigate the risk. A bad Super Bowl can crush you.

And then there's this...

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...3db4ee19d.html

Basically Gural conceded he doesn't have near term support for a casino so he's going to wait. The problem is without him Monmouth is screwed. He's in the middle of a state owned sports center with a profitable track and a more or less flat handle. Monmouth has lost 50% of it's handle in 36 months.

I honestly don't mean to single you out and you seem like a nice guy and I get you support Monmouth and run there. But every thread on Monmouth involves you with some winning Golden Ticket idea from Willy Wonka.

But what's odder is you blow past the current reality. Gural essentially broke rank with Monmouth and Drazin. They can't wait six years. He knows this. They know it. But he doesn't care. The best thing Monmouth had in its corner was Gural. He has the cash and respect as a guy who operates multiple racinos.

Also he has an out in his lease. The only leverage anyone on the pro-Casino side is him. He can threatened to walk away form a lease on a building the state spent $100 million building. There's real harness racing jobs in the state at Showplace and Gateway and other farms that go away with no harness racing in NJ. Its not a ton of leverage but he has some. The Monmouth horseman have zero.

Now on top of everything he moved to the opposition side.
At least there were jobs at Showplace. I think it closed 2 years ago or so
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Old 05-27-2017, 09:06 AM   #21
MonmouthParkJoe
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I can tell you its been tough sledding with entries. Suspending the draw to fill, wanting to run 11-12 races for this weekend and coming up with 10,9,9 all of which were a struggle. With Delaware opening up next weekend it will be even harder. Going to be a tough meet for sure. That being said, lots of empty stalls in most of the surrounding tracks.
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:05 AM   #22
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I can tell you its been tough sledding with entries. Suspending the draw to fill, wanting to run 11-12 races for this weekend and coming up with 10,9,9 all of which were a struggle. With Delaware opening up next weekend it will be even harder. Going to be a tough meet for sure. That being said, lots of empty stalls in most of the surrounding tracks.
Not pretty for sure.
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:40 AM   #23
charm city whizz
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Monmouth park is finished, like it was said by super pickle everybody tries to come up with a plan but nothing will do anything, still have no idea why people think sports betting will be the savior, maybe stronach can do something but that's prob about it, maybe lights could do something but that's stretching it

Very said indeed, lots of great weekends there with father and friends, I mean what's Salvatore grill look like now? What does the clubhouse reserved look like? Picnic area? Hard pill to swallow and I can see why people that love the place don't like what they are seeing
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Old 05-27-2017, 11:04 AM   #24
alhattab
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Originally Posted by charm city whizz View Post
Monmouth park is finished, like it was said by super pickle everybody tries to come up with a plan but nothing will do anything, still have no idea why people think sports betting will be the savior, maybe stronach can do something but that's prob about it, maybe lights could do something but that's stretching it

Very said indeed, lots of great weekends there with father and friends, I mean what's Salvatore grill look like now? What does the clubhouse reserved look like? Picnic area? Hard pill to swallow and I can see why people that love the place don't like what they are seeing
We can only hope Whizz. It was only a few years ago that I thought, and believe many thought, Maryland was nearly finished. Monmouth needs to hang on, get through the gubernatorial election and hope for the best.

I still believe that a shorter, high quality meet or a few mini-meets a la UK racing is the way to go. There would be so much more energy around 20-30 days of quality racing than there is now, and such a meet would distinguish Monmouth from the other Mid Atlantic tracks. There's nothing wrong with Keeneland's 30 days spread over two meets.
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Old 05-27-2017, 11:29 AM   #25
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We can only hope Whizz. It was only a few years ago that I thought, and believe many thought, Maryland was nearly finished. Monmouth needs to hang on, get through the gubernatorial election and hope for the best.

I still believe that a shorter, high quality meet or a few mini-meets a la UK racing is the way to go. There would be so much more energy around 20-30 days of quality racing than there is now, and such a meet would distinguish Monmouth from the other Mid Atlantic tracks. There's nothing wrong with Keeneland's 30 days spread over two meets.
Maryland was finished. The casino money saved them.
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Old 05-27-2017, 11:57 AM   #26
onefast99
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Originally Posted by charm city whizz View Post
Monmouth park is finished, like it was said by super pickle everybody tries to come up with a plan but nothing will do anything, still have no idea why people think sports betting will be the savior, maybe stronach can do something but that's prob about it, maybe lights could do something but that's stretching it

Very said indeed, lots of great weekends there with father and friends, I mean what's Salvatore grill look like now? What does the clubhouse reserved look like? Picnic area? Hard pill to swallow and I can see why people that love the place don't like what they are seeing
Stronach never had any interest so that rumor which started here is a dead one. Sports wagering can fuel the purses but it isn't a savior as I repeatedly stated here since 2013. It's up to Drazin to pull a rabbit out of the hat.
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Old 05-27-2017, 12:01 PM   #27
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We can only hope Whizz. It was only a few years ago that I thought, and believe many thought, Maryland was nearly finished. Monmouth needs to hang on, get through the gubernatorial election and hope for the best.

I still believe that a shorter, high quality meet or a few mini-meets a la UK racing is the way to go. There would be so much more energy around 20-30 days of quality racing than there is now, and such a meet would distinguish Monmouth from the other Mid Atlantic tracks. There's nothing wrong with Keeneland's 30 days spread over two meets.
the unique mini meet was purse fueled by state and casino funds so a mini mini meet could if purses are decent!
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Last edited by onefast99; 05-27-2017 at 12:14 PM.
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Old 05-27-2017, 07:20 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by PowerUpPaynter View Post
Just so I know who to hate can someone explain to me who the hold up is with sports better and/or slots... I know Christie is all for saving Monmouth and he is the HNIC, so whats the hold up?
Slots: Held up by Atlantic City casinos and their political representatives.
Sport Betting: Held up by the fact that it is not lucrative at all, and there is not enough money to be made to grease the skids with the leagues and politicians.
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Old 05-27-2017, 09:33 PM   #29
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What a sad topic for me to see.

My family vacationed near there many times when I was a kid.

Monmouth was the first "major" track I ever went to and I thought
it was so great.

Just another bad sign for the sport I so dearly love.

The value of the land it sits on is working against survival.
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Old 05-28-2017, 05:06 AM   #30
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for any type of gambling business the worst thing that can happen is contraction. once one place closes it leads to less and less interest.

for the many reasons stated here this game is at a very low point. all you have to do is look at Parx and you will see what this game is all about now.

but i witnessed the casino business in Nevada at a worse point of time back in the late 70's and 80's. those places were run by wise guys that used the junket system to get people into the dessert, cheat people out of their money and then send leg breakers over to those suckers homes to collect the money. the joints up and down the vegas strip were all going bankrupt. somehow they managed to keep the doors open in most of the places.

in comes some revolutionary new people that stepped up to the plate and revamped the whole business, they came up with the video machines and built massive resorts up and down the strip.

instead of cheating people out of their money, they operated on the square. they got rid of the junketeers, hookers in the hotel, and in comes family business stuffed with money spending it all over the resort hotels that popped up.

there are now about 5 times more rooms in that town than they had in 1970, and people pay top notch money to stay in them. the hotel operators don't have to cheat their customer's and they got lines of people waiting to check into the hotels.


the exact same thing will happen in horse racing once we get some bold new faces willing to step up to the plate and take some swings.
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