Do anyone win with Thorogragh

[topgun]

Hello,

I have bought these figs for the last month and I am not having any success. If there are winners using these number please PM me with how to win with these numbers, and by the way they are not cheap.

Topgun

[tbwinner]

I've used TG figs since 2011.

There is a huge learning curve to them, it's not just about the number - did you read all the materials on the TG site?

They are not the holy grail of finding winners. if they were, why would they be for sale? In conjunction with handicapping, I have found them great for identifying false faves and races to SKIP, as well as at "boutique"/short meets where you have shippers from many tracks in one race (think Keeneland, Kentucky downs, start of meets like OP, SAR, etc)

[Not4Love]

The competition are almost double the price. Yes they definitely work.

[eldee wins]

It’s a tool like all handicapping product. There is so much to learn, but basically if you were beginning, if you’re strictly going by the numbers, it’s all about patterns. The patterns will come when horses are progressing through the years. It can be helpful to see those numbers progress or decline. You will see horses coming in to form and going out of form. To start, I would say basically see if you can project a number for that Horse today off the last few races. if he is going forward or backwards. And then add in the other factors as far as pace,class and recency like any other handicapping angle. Normally, the very best numbers will have the lowest odds! you’re looking to gain value when using these numbers. If you can project a longshot today that is going forward that can compete with these favorites then that is what you’re looking for. anyone can pick the fastest horses with these numbers. Practice,practice,practice! After the days races are over. Look back at each race and see if there any things that can help in reading those patterns. You will see it clearly then. A lot of times you will say oh if I would’ve saw that before, then maybe you could’ve had that winner! But we all say that. Good luck!

[PalaceOfFortLarned]

Merely information, and has to be treated as such.

As a long time Sheets (Ragozin) player on big weekends and events, they aren't going to guide you to winning multiple races or dominating the win pool.

Where I find them most helpful on big days is separating the pretenders and contenders. With the Sheets or Thoros in hand, I rarely find myself surprised by any kind of winner.

[Saratoga]

Originally Posted by PalaceOfFortLarned

Merely information, and has to be treated as such.

As a long time Sheets (Ragozin) player on big weekends and events, they aren't going to guide you to winning multiple races or dominating the win pool.

Where I find them most helpful on big days is separating the pretenders and contenders. With the Sheets or Thoros in hand, I rarely find myself surprised by any kind of winner.

That's hard to believe.....

Surprises , like a 32-1 shot , happens almost every day.......

And your saying , O he has a shot" ???

If you can, how about an example....

[hracingplyr]

I use them sometimes on big days. Had a very good day yesterday with them. My buddy and I went partners on this weekends sheets. If anyone wants todays drop me a line at robertj1949@gmail.com cost 15.00.

[king kong]

Yes, the track

[Profesor]

Originally Posted by topgun

Hello,

I have bought these figs for the last month and I am not having any success. If there are winners using these number please PM me with how to win with these numbers, and by the way they are not cheap.

Topgun

In my opinion you’re wasting your money buying Thotograph sheets they are a joke compared to the Ragozins,The best trainers in the country use Ragozin to asses their horses including Cox,Brown,Asmussen,and Pletcher,I’ve been using the Ragozin Sheets for over 30 years they are well worth the cost if you know how to interpret the #s,they will put you on a lot of mid priced and some long shots horses that win or run in the money, they also will keep you off a lot of bad favorites,the learning curve is long though and they’re only a very good tool no magic winning formula ,and they are expensive,but they are expensive for a reason.

[AndyC]

Originally Posted by Profesor

In my opinion you’re wasting your money buying Thotograph sheets they are a joke compared to the Ragozins,The best trainers in the country use Ragozin to asses their horses including Cox,Brown,Asmussen,and Pletcher,I’ve been using the Ragozin Sheets for over 30 years they are well worth the cost if you know how to interpret the #s,they will put you on a lot of mid priced and some long shots horses that win or run in the money, they also will keep you off a lot of bad favorites,the learning curve is long though and they’re only a very good tool no magic winning formula ,and they are expensive,but they are expensive for a reason.

If you have been using Ragozin sheets for over 30 years how do you know how good the Thorograph sheets are?

[P.Rosa]

At the end of each year Thoro-Graph gives away a week their sheets.
So if you want to know if Thoro-Graph is right for you, try it out at the end of December.

[Profesor]

I’ve used Thorograph for a whole Spring Summer Belmont meet because of the cheaper price Jerry Brown worked for Ragozin so I figured maybe they are not that much different, well I found out they are much different, I’ve never seen so many pair ups seems like horses run the same # every race hard to read which way a horse is going that way, plus I compared #s w/ my friends who used Rags and the Rags had the right # most of the time,Jerry Brown uses a different methodology Rag is way more accurate by far IMO

[TrifectaBox]

TG has a redboard room where you can see their product after a racing card for FREE



So you dont even have to buy it to make a judgement about its value.



Rags does not do that .



I'm not a user of either , though I'm familiar with both for a very long time.


The many 'pair ups' and flatness of some of the TG sheets is an old story. That said, their numbers move around quite a bit with developing horses, so in some ways thats a false criticism


Who is to say which is right or not? Jerry often highlights some numbers from the competition , which he says are ridiculous on the face of it .



Since Rags wont display their product , even after the fact, I have no way to make that judgement for myself.

[Poindexter]

Based on the comments even the so called best whichever they may be have a huge learning curve to them. Sounds like handicapping. So op tries out a product for a month and find it expensive and not very helpful. Isn’t this game tough enough already without putting yourself in the hole before you even start? Am I to believe that whales and sharps who bet maybe 35 percent of each pool, maybe more and are highly rebated have no access to the sheets and Tg. If you use these products and you have found away to make them pay for themselves each year then of course continue. But if not put your energy into product you can get for free. Speed figures is just one aspect of handicapping.You don’t need the sheets or tg to beat this game. Unfortunately you do need rebates to beat this game.

By the way previous poster says you can access the sheets for free after the races. Master them before you invest in them.

[lamboguy]

i won in Nevada in the 1990's betting house quinella's using Ragozin sheets. Jonathan Hardoon was the sheet reader at that time. i am not sure if I could have had the same great results betting parimutuelly though.

i did see Len Freedman, one of the original partners in the Sheets, win consistently through the windows in the late 90's and early 2000. a matter of fact, he not only bet with them but claimed horses successfully using those numbers.

Thoroughgraph is very similar to Ragozin.