Honor A.P.

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by dryrunguy

DISCLAIMER: I KNOW FULL WELL I AM NOT A NICKS EXPERT. But any time you're talking anything A.P. Indy, there's at least one major given you should be able to take for granted--and that's the nick with mares descending from Mr. Prospector.

So I did a little research tonight using the top 25 2020 sires in the U.S. at the moment (according to Blood Horse). Perhaps I can do the same with prominent sires in Europe, Australia, etc., another time.

For reference, here is Honor A. P.'s pedigree: https://www.pedigreequery.com/honor+a+p. As you'll see, he only goes back to Mr. Prospector once, on the sire's side, in 5 generations.

I'll break them down into four categories based on Honor A. P.'s pedigree: 1) 3X5 linebreeding with mares descending from Mr. Prospector; 2) 4X5 linebreeding with Mr. Prospector mares; 3) Mares from largely outcross sires (where Mr. Prospector is at least 4 generations out would would be a 5X5 linebred to Mr. Prospector or where Mr. Prospector is not represented at all in the past 5 generation; and 4) Linebreeding to A. P. Indy., which for some reason unbeknownst to me beyond an undescended testicle, people seem to be reluctant to try. The number before the sire corresponds to their current 2020 sire ranking at Blood Horse.

3X5 Linebreeding with mares sired by grandsons of Mr. Prospector:

4. Speightstown mares
5. Curlin mares
12. City Zip mares
22. English Channel mares
24. Lookin at Lucky mares

4X5 linebreeding with mares sire by great-grandsons of Mr. Prospector:

7. Munnings mares
8. The Factor mares
16. Street Sense mares
19. Quality Road mares
20. Twirling Candy mares
21. More Than Ready mares

Largely outcross opportunities:

1. Into Mischief mares (which would also line up to Storm Cat, which many people are also reluctant to do--I gather for soundness reasons)
2. Uncle Mo mares
6. Midnight Lute mares
9. Candy Ride mares
10. Hard Spun mares
13. Goldencents mares
14. Mucho Macho Man mares
17. Kitten's Joy mares
23. Medaglia D'oro mares
25. I'll Have Another mares

Linebreed to A. P. Indy himself:

3. Tapit (3X3)
11. Constitution fillies (3x4--I nearly left him off the list because his oldest progeny are only 3 years old, but some of his fillies will be hitting the breeding shed in 2021)
15. Bernardini (3X3)
18. Malibu Moon (2X3--too tight)

ANOTHER DISCLAIMER: Again, I apologize that this is largely U.S.-centric. But I wanted to start with a small, manageable pool of stallions.

that is a heck of a post.

[dryrunguy]

Originally Posted by GMB@BP

that is a heck of a post.

That's good, right?

Another thought occurred to me while I was in a Microsoft Teams meeting this afternoon.

Gone West mares... 3X5 to Mr. Prospector and 4X5X6 to Secretariat. Just a thought.

[Immortal6]

Let’s say I’ve got a will take charge mare looking to breed her, what sires would she cross well with?

[GMB@BP]

Originally Posted by dryrunguy

That's good, right?

Another thought occurred to me while I was in a Microsoft Teams meeting this afternoon.

Gone West mares... 3X5 to Mr. Prospector and 4X5X6 to Secretariat. Just a thought.

its good, seems like well researched and thought out.

[dryrunguy]

Originally Posted by Immortal6

Let’s say I’ve got a will take charge mare looking to breed her, what sires would she cross well with?

That's where we need a real nicks expert. Will Take Charge's oldest progeny are just now 4 years old, so there's no way to tell yet what sires his mares click with, if any (or who his sons might click with). It would also depend on who is the sire of this hypothetical mare's first dam.

[dryrunguy]

Originally Posted by Immortal6

Let’s say I’ve got a will take charge mare looking to breed her, what sires would she cross well with?

Without a real mare and a real brood mare sire, it's hard to say.

But since I am on vacation (use or lose leave--and nowhere to go) and have more free time than usual, I did some digging on True Nicks (which has its proponents and its detractors).

I used pedigree query to find a random Will Take Charge 4-year-old filly named Becca Takes Charge (https://www.pedigreequery.com/becca+takes+charge). She's out of an Any Given Saturday mare.

I then ran her through True Nicks using a wide variety of sire candidates, going alphabetically and skipping some sires here and there because I was just messing around.

By the time I got through the sires starting with G, she got A++ hits with American Pharoah, Artie Schiller, Bernardini, Candy Ride, Cloud Computing, Clubhouse Ride, Coal Front, Danzing Candy, Desert Code, English Channel, Fast Anna, Fort Larned, and Gun Runner. She also had A+ hits with Blame, Bluegrass Cat, and Goldencents.

Then out of nowhere, I noticed the Candy Ride/Danzing Candy thing and decided to check Twirling Candy. Another A++.

Then I decided to pull the pedigrees for four other Will Take Charge mares from different brood mare sire lines (Langfuhr, Sky Mesa, Hold That Tiger, and Johannesburg). Candy Ride, Twirling Candy, and Danzing Candy hit A++ with all five Will Take Charge fillies, regardless of brood mare line. I thought that was curious.

I'm sure there are other sire lines that would yield similar high ratings. I might do more digging tonight. Because genetics fascinate me, and I LOVE rabbit holes.

Another thing struck me that I thought was curious... True Nicks was not at all encouraging about the prospect of the first Will Take Charge mare (Becca Takes Charge) clicking well with anything Uncle Mo or More Than Ready. Perhaps that was just isolated to her because of her brood mare line. But I was seeing B, C, and D ratings for pretty much every stallion that went back to Uncle Mo or More Than Ready. Don't ask me why.