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Old 04-15-2021, 01:28 PM   #1
cutchemist42
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Canterbury introducing 10% takeout on p5/p6

I applaud the move!!
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Old 04-15-2021, 06:30 PM   #2
thaskalos
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I have mixed feelings whenever I see Canterbury implementing innovative wagering strategies. On the one hand, I am hoping that the customer betting reaction will be appetizing enough to have other tracks considering similar innovative maneuvers. But when the bettor reaction ISN'T what Canterbury expects it to be...then the other tracks take this as a clear indication that the mutuel takeout isn't a prime consideration for the bettors...and this hurts the horseplayer's cause going forward.

Wagering innovations are wasted when they use tracks like Canterbury as laboratories...IMO.
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Old 04-15-2021, 07:55 PM   #3
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Exotic bets should have exotic takeouts, no need for 10% here.

Call me when a track goes to 5% WPS.
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Old 04-15-2021, 08:38 PM   #4
Boomer
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I tried playing Canterbury a couple of years ago when they lowered the takeout. I felt as a bettor obliged to do just that.


But the live feed was so dark and annoying I couldn't take it. If they fix that I will give it a shot.
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Old 04-15-2021, 10:47 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Onesome View Post
Exotic bets should have exotic takeouts, no need for 10% here.

Call me when a track goes to 5% WPS.
Yep, tracks need to stop catering to the carnival bets and start catering to the wps players. I know that CBY tried a few years ago but I want to see a track that doesn’t start its card with quarter horses do it
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Old 04-16-2021, 12:47 AM   #6
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Racing has no problem being the ugly stepchild of the gambling world. They embrace it. So as horseplayers we have little choice but to gravitate to the few bones they give us. Mandatory payouts jackpot pick 6's, pick 5/pick 4 carryovers etc. This is a little different. This is a track offering a 10% takeout on a 50 cent pick 5 and a 10% takeout on a $1 Traditional pick 6. With so many horseplayers objecting to the transition to the jackpot pick 6, a $1 pick six with a 10% takeout is really a great alternative. Not sure if they will have carryovers if nobody hits or they will pay off for 5 of 6 the main prize. Whatever the case as horseplayers (collectively) either you are on board with promotions like this and reward the tracks for trying or you ignore them only to watch them not offered int he future. For me it is a . I will definitely will be playing Canterbury Park when they open.
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Old 04-16-2021, 02:33 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Boomer View Post
I tried playing Canterbury a couple of years ago when they lowered the takeout. I felt as a bettor obliged to do just that.


But the live feed was so dark and annoying I couldn't take it. If they fix that I will give it a shot.
I'm pretty sure they have a nice HD feed now, timed a lot of races from there unfortunately but nice picture at least.
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:35 AM   #8
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Back in 2011 when the low takeout P5 was put in California one of the selling points was that it would get gamblers on the east coast involved in the card AND that it would raise handle on the vertical wagers within the sequence. What's remarkable to me is that innovative tracks/jurisdictions have figured out that breaking even, or close to it is worth it because of the money they make on the vertical wagers within the sequence. And California never got their shit together and expanded with more low take wagers.

Racing has to lower take and breakage on high churn wagers like WPS and Exactas to get some churn going. There is less churn than ever in the history of horse racing because of the low take horizontals.
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Old 04-16-2021, 10:02 AM   #9
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IMO, the problem with this idea as a national strategy is that it can become a lot like lowering state taxes. A lower state tax may cause some people and businesses to relocate from CA to TX or from NY to FL (which is good for FL and TX) but it doesn't necessarily increase national pie. It's coming out of someone else's pocket (NY and CA).

To increase the size of the racing pie we need a change of perception about whether you can actually win (think poker) and/or make the pleasure of the track experience and playing worth the small losses and thought of as entertainment like attending sports, concerts etc.. That way you attract brand new players into the game or those that are already playing increase their handle by more than churn and that more than compensates the track for the lower tax rate (or "take" in this case).

Personally, I think it would be more beneficial LONG TERM to lower the take on WPS or even EXs and DBLs because there's less volatility in the results and you might generate a lot more consistent winners at 10% than 16% or higher, but people love trying to make life changing scores (lotteries and lotto) and tracks are probably more focused on short term bottom line issues.
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Old 04-16-2021, 01:56 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by The_Turf_Monster View Post
Yep, tracks need to stop catering to the carnival bets and start catering to the wps players. I know that CBY tried a few years ago but I want to see a track that doesn’t start its card with quarter horses do it
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Old 04-16-2021, 01:57 PM   #11
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Exotic bets should have exotic takeouts, no need for 10% here.

Call me when a track goes to 5% WPS.
Absolutely!!!
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Old 04-17-2021, 03:15 PM   #12
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I live in Minnesota and 2020 was the first year since 1988 I did not make a bet on their races.

We can't bet Minnesota tracks from home because it's against the law.

I wrote my state senator, and explained how much taxes were paid to the state on bets made at the state's tracks. He wrote me back stating that there is way too much on his plate.
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Old 05-20-2021, 08:44 PM   #13
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I'm reupping this just to remind people of this wager.

If you prefer some wagering formats to others, it's important to reward tracks which offer player-friendly wagering formats. If this fails, I'm sure they'll go back to the jackpot style Pick Six everyone here hates.
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Old 05-20-2021, 09:03 PM   #14
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Unless there was some sort of glitch in reporting figures, Canterbury handled over $650,000 in Wednesday's pick five. Not too many years ago that would have been the total daily handle on a slow day.
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Old 05-21-2021, 12:38 AM   #15
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Unless there was some sort of glitch in reporting figures, Canterbury handled over $650,000 in Wednesday's pick five. Not too many years ago that would have been the total daily handle on a slow day.

They had a carryover of about 90k into yesterday, that's what propelled the wager total. Still it's a pretty nice showing that their pick 5 totals made it into 6 figures each day of the meet so far.
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