Moss Interview - Very interesting

[CyberBet]

Marshall Bennett made a point I was going to make. PETA is out of their mind IMO. They cannot take the whips away from the jockey or we will end up seeing multiple horses and jockeys killed on a daily basis!
Taking the whip from a jockey is akin to taking the steering wheel out of your car before you go to the store.

I can see where a lighter more forgiving whip would have merit. Also there need not be this great reach forward to strike down hard. Most horses will take off if you just give them a tap. After all it is their flight reflex that causes this sudden burst of speed and that can be accomplished rather easily with the flick of the wrist not the shoulder.

[JustRalph]

wow! I agree with getting rid of the drugs, but some of the leaps you guys take are astounding.

There is no way in hell the owners of this filly did anything wrong. The fact that she was a filly doesn't make a dimes worth of difference. You cannot foresee what happen to Eight Belles. You can't see the future and anybody going after the owners or the Trainer/Jock is nuts. If it was Monba who ran last, would all the whining that is going on be any different........... I think so. There would be outcry, but not like there is for the filly.

Nobody could have foreseen this. You don't think that if these things could be predicted it wouldn't have been figured out by now? The amount of money at risk alone, would change the game if these kind of things could be predicted. They can't. So they still happen and in this case in the rarest of forms. On the gallop out! Come on???? I have watched the overhead 50 times. She plants her feet to slow down and both give way.......... it is a freak accident. That is all............she obviously had some weakness that was undetectable. Humans have weaknesses too. I worked in an emergency room for two years. Bones break in weird ways sometimes. You can't foresee it.

As Doctor Bramlage stated, the numbers on breakdowns haven't changed for 30 years. That kind of throws a monkey wrench into the theory on breeding, doesn't it? If we are breeding a less sound horse, why haven't the numbers skyrocketed year after year?

[GameTheory]

I caught Michael Savage on the radio for about 5 seconds last night. He seemed to have been convinced somehow that she had broken both legs DURING the race and that the jockey was whipping the horse AFTER that point. Is this what is being reported? (If so, a good example of why it is a bad idea to trust anything you hear in the media about issues you aren't real familiar with.)

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by OTM Al

These horses are all inbred and always have been. Perhaps you aren't aware of the history of the breed but all are descended through all of 3 sires, the Godolphin Barb, the Darley Arabian and the Byerly Turk. ALL of them. The Darley is responsible for about 75% of all current TBreds and an even great portion trace their lineage through Eclipse, one of his descendants. The problem is not the inbreeding, it is the breeding of genetically defective horses that seemed ok because they were pumped full of drugs during their racing days.

OTM, I belive you are correct in tracing the lineage of all T-breds.......But, correct breeding vs. in breeding are two different circumstances.....

After all, it is very legal and safe to marry past your 3d cousin.....food for thought, anyway...

Good breeding takes this into account, but, I think there are too many 1st and 2d horse cousins, that are getting married......and that, will surely magnify the flaws.....



humbly,

[OTM Al]

That's pretty rare though I have seen it. I keep breeding records in my db as some day (of course I've been saying this for some time) I want to have a look at dam sire success rates. What you see much more frequently is the same sort of crosses over and over...and way too many Mr. Prospectors

[ryesteve]

Originally Posted by GameTheory

I caught Michael Savage on the radio for about 5 seconds last night. He seemed to have been convinced somehow that she had broken both legs DURING the race and that the jockey was whipping the horse AFTER that point.

Good to know that he's consistently moronic, regardless of the subject matter...

[OTM Al]

Very good points Ralph, but I would counter by saying that we should be seeing less because of technology. Bone scans are now common and catch horses that still have weak spots. Horses are raced far less. Tracks, even the dirt ones are safer. These things should be reducing numbers of breakdowns, but they are staying the same. That means the effects of these things are being countered

[JustRalph]

Originally Posted by OTM Al

Very good points Ralph, but I would counter by saying that we should be seeing less because of technology. Bone scans are now common and catch horses that still have weak spots. Horses are raced far less. Tracks, even the dirt ones are safer. These things should be reducing numbers of breakdowns, but they are staying the same. That means the effects of these things are being countered

good points ..........

[OTM Al]

Yes, unfortunately.....

I've felt for some time also they should allow new blood back into the line by breeding some Arabians back in. Its not like they aren't all part Arabian already anyway. Speedball male with a solid Arabian dam might give you something that could race well even in the first generation, but surely by the second. Seem to recall TBreds being bred to other groups. I seem to have heard even Secretariat covered a couple standard breds once upon a time. Don't see why such a concept couldn't be easily used to get strength and endurance back in the breed.

[LottaKash]

Originally Posted by OTM Al

Yes, unfortunately.....

I've felt for some time also they should allow new blood back into the line by breeding some Arabians back in. Its not like they aren't all part Arabian already anyway. Speedball male with a solid Arabian dam might give you something that could race well even in the first generation, but surely by the second. Seem to recall TBreds being bred to other groups. I seem to have heard even Secretariat covered a couple standard breds once upon a time. Don't see why such a concept couldn't be easily used to get strength and endurance back in the breed.

HaHa.......I think you have to go and and talk to the SHEIKS about that.........

[OTM Al]

I am going to assume you are joking, but just in case you aren't.... There are Grade 1 events run for Arabians at Delaware Park during the summer. Without their Arabian races some of Delaware's cards so far would have about 2 races on them. Plenty of good ones here and around the world.

[misscashalot]

Originally Posted by jonnielu

.... and put an end .......... racing and girls racing against boys.

Just on this one point of yours. In Europe girls successfully race against the boys every day, and without incident.

[46zilzal]

Originally Posted by misscashalot

Just on this one point of yours. In Europe girls successfully race against the boys every day, and without incident.

MOST of the time in North America as well.

[Indulto]

Originally Posted by 46zilzal

MOST of the time in North America as well.

46,
I'm not sure that's true in recent years. I'm thinking of Danzon who has failed to return to form after almost beating males in a turf stakes race, and Rags to Riches who was injured and defeated following her Belmont victory. Was Azeri as strong after facing males?

I'm not convinced racing females against males is necessarily bad, but if it were my filly or mare, I'd think about waiting for her final race to try unless she had absolutely nothing left to prove in her own division. And I'd sure think twice about risking her future foals if the experiment were to take place on dirt.

Maybe Eight Belles would have survived with more time to develop. It's a tough call and obviously her connections knew she was exceptional.

OA,
What other potential negatives would there be in re-introducing Arabian blood besides the lower price their foals would initially bring.

[chickenhead]

I think whats being missed by pointing to Rags to Riches, Eight Belles, etc, are how many of the colts get injured on the triple crown trail, and/or are never the same again (or never seem the same again). It's not a small number.