Lebron James

[tucker6]

Is he the most narcissistic superstar of any team sport in recent decades? Maybe Terrell Owens, but he wasn't the face of the sport. He comes across as manipulative, and pulls power plays against coaches and teammates where ever he goes. Spends lots of time instigating buzz about his future, and then goes into a frenzy to deny said rumors.

He seems the most unhappy superstar I've ever seen in a team sport.

[mountainman]

Originally Posted by tucker6

Is he the most narcissistic superstar of any team sport in recent decades? Maybe Terrell Owens, but he wasn't the face of the sport. He comes across as manipulative, and pulls power plays against coaches and teammates where ever he goes. Spends lots of time instigating buzz about his future, and then goes into a frenzy to deny said rumors.

He seems the most unhappy superstar I've ever seen in a team sport.

Bravo. And now that it's apparent he won't come near Jordan's legacy or leave half the footprint, James seems less worried about his public image than indulging his gargantuan ego.

[thaskalos]

A very forgettable "superstar"...IMO.

[azeri98]

Originally Posted by tucker6

Is he the most narcissistic superstar of any team sport in recent decades? Maybe Terrell Owens, but he wasn't the face of the sport. He comes across as manipulative, and pulls power plays against coaches and teammates where ever he goes. Spends lots of time instigating buzz about his future, and then goes into a frenzy to deny said rumors.

He seems the most unhappy superstar I've ever seen in a team sport.

Yes 100%

[cj]

I made a negative tweet about him and it has drawn over 400 likes and 400 retweets. I didn't even hashtag his name or include his Twitter handle, just said Lebron. People have caught on to his tired act.

[barahona44]

Didn't know you had to be loveable to be a great player.He just about single handedly brought the Cavs to the NBA Finals last year after Irving and Love missed the entire post season.

[ronsmac]

Originally Posted by barahona44

Didn't know you had to be loveable to be a great player.He just about single handedly brought the Cavs to the NBA Finals last year after Irving and Love missed the entire post season.

Love and Irving didn't miss the entire post season, but you make a good point.

[barahona44]

Originally Posted by ronsmac

Love and Irving didn't miss the entire post season, but you make a good point.

Thanks for the catch , Love was hurt in the 1st round against the Celtics, and Irving got hurt in the first Warriors game.I can't remember what I had for supper last night, don't expect me to remember what happened a year ago.

[cj]

Originally Posted by barahona44

Didn't know you had to be loveable to be a great player.He just about single handedly brought the Cavs to the NBA Finals last year after Irving and Love missed the entire post season.

You certainly don't need to be lovable to be great. Nobody loved Kobe outside of Lakers fans until he was past his prime. But Lebron's time is running out and he is acting like a total d-bag. I think he is starting to realize he is a lot closer to Hakeem than he is Michael at this point and he may never win again.

[tucker6]

Originally Posted by cj

You certainly don't need to be lovable to be great. Nobody loved Kobe outside of Lakers fans until he was past his prime. But Lebron's time is running out and he is acting like a total d-bag. I think he is starting to realize he is a lot closer to Hakeem than he is Michael at this point and he never win again.

When he left Cleveland, the way he left was always going to come back to bite him IF he didn't live up to the boasting. Well, the chickens are coming home. The coupe de grace will be when Cleveland fans ask that he be traded. Too much to ask? You know the day is coming when a billboard or plane banner has it, and that will be the day when Lebron unravels.

[Valuist]

I think it really bothers him he's no longer considered the top player in the NBA. The ego is just too big.

[Robert Fischer]

Among NBA All-Time Superstars, LeBron was very very good, even great depending on your perspective.


Game is changing.

Teams are playing more advanced offenses and defenses. Screening and using more territory on offense. Teams like the Warriors and Spurs are dominating with this style. Intelligence and efficiency of both gameplay and roster-use, matter to a greater degree than any time in recent NBA history.

Superstars like Curry are doing it by maxing out the potential of the system which they play in, not solely by individual dominance.

Not only is LeBron from the former style, he is aging. All the HGH in the world can't stop that.

[lansdale]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

Among NBA All-Time Superstars, LeBron was very very good, even great depending on your perspective.


Game is changing.

Teams are playing more advanced offenses and defenses. Screening and using more territory on offense. Teams like the Warriors and Spurs are dominating with this style. Intelligence and efficiency of both gameplay and roster-use, matter to a greater degree than any time in recent NBA history.

Superstars like Curry are doing it by maxing out the potential of the system which they play in, not solely by individual dominance.

Not only is LeBron from the former style, he is aging. All the HGH in the world can't stop that.

[QUOTE=Robert Fischer]Among NBA All-Time Superstars, LeBron was very very good, even great depending on your perspective.

Hi Robert,

I think being surpassed by Curry, as the best player in the game, as Valuist has said, along with the ascent of the Warriors are the factors that provoked this recent outburst. But LBJ is hardly unique in acting out - let's remember MJ is notorious for having physically and verbally abusing players who he felt weren't peforming to his satisfaction - Steve Kerr was famously one of his victims. And Bird also habitually ragged on the scrubs - in one well-known story, the Celt team bus was passed a billboard for a portable outdoor furniture company called Rent-a-Bench, and he yelled out, "Let's call this place and get a new bench." Players who are in a powerful position are prone to act out in this way - doesn't excuse it.

Re the game changing - I don't think (except for the rules changes of a decade back) that it as changed that much. What I think has happened is that Curry and Draymond Green are 'next level' players - those with a combination of talents such as we've never seen in the NBA before. Your key insight, that GSW has stretched the area of the floor that the defense needs to cover to ca. 165 ft. is exactly what is new, and why they are so difficult to beat. But the ability to control that percentage of the floor is mostly a function of Curry's superhuman level of 3-pt. shooting - .45 accuracy up to ca. 30 ft. with a lightning release - and partly a due to Green's extraordinary passing from a very high post - he can thread the needle past a defender to a cutter 25 ft. away like Joe Montana. It's not rocket science to figure this stuff out - there are other intelligent teams in the league - Memphis and Atlanta come to mind - but they don't have the players to do this.

Re the Spurs - their play is completely traditional, nothing new there, especially this year. Throw it in to the post, pass, cut, hit the open man - this current team plays like the '64 Celts or '69 Knicks, with some 3-pt. shooting added. Yes, that takes intelligence, but high-level hoops always has. But again, intelligence is not enough - the Spurs also have more talented players.

LBJ has to accept that, even for the greatest players, championships are largely the luck of the draw - they can't create them by themselves. cj mentioned Olajuwon, who was certainly a great player, but it's unlikely that he would have won anything if MJ's father wasn't murdered, resulting in his two-year hiatus. Does that make Akeem less great. Not in my book.

Cheers,

lansdale

[ronsmac]

[QUOTE=lansdale]

Originally Posted by Robert Fischer

Among NBA All-Time Superstars, LeBron was very very good, even great depending on your perspective.

Hi Robert,

I think being surpassed by Curry, as the best player in the game, as Valuist has said, along with the ascent of the Warriors are the factors that provoked this recent outburst. But LBJ is hardly unique in acting out - let's remember MJ is notorious for having physically and verbally abusing players who he felt weren't peforming to his satisfaction - Steve Kerr was famously one of his victims. And Bird also habitually ragged on the scrubs - in one well-known story, the Celt team bus was passed a billboard for a portable outdoor furniture company called Rent-a-Bench, and he yelled out, "Let's call this place and get a new bench." Players who are in a powerful position are prone to act out in this way - doesn't excuse it.

Re the game changing - I don't think (except for the rules changes of a decade back) that it as changed that much. What I think has happened is that Curry and Draymond Green are 'next level' players - those with a combination of talents such as we've never seen in the NBA before. Your key insight, that GSW has stretched the area of the floor that the defense needs to cover to ca. 165 ft. is exactly what is new, and why they are so difficult to beat. But the ability to control that percentage of the floor is mostly a function of Curry's superhuman level of 3-pt. shooting - .45 accuracy up to ca. 30 ft. with a lightning release - and partly a due to Green's extraordinary passing from a very high post - he can thread the needle past a defender to a cutter 25 ft. away like Joe Montana. It's not rocket science to figure this stuff out - there are other intelligent teams in the league - Memphis and Atlanta come to mind - but they don't have the players to do this.

Re the Spurs - their play is completely traditional, nothing new there, especially this year. Throw it in to the post, pass, cut, hit the open man - this current team plays like the '64 Celts or '69 Knicks, with some 3-pt. shooting added. Yes, that takes intelligence, but high-level hoops always has. But again, intelligence is not enough - the Spurs also have more talented players.

LBJ has to accept that, even for the greatest players, championships are largely the luck of the draw - they can't create them by themselves. cj mentioned Olajuwon, who was certainly a great player, but it's unlikely that he would have won anything if MJ's father wasn't murdered, resulting in his two-year hiatus. Does that make Akeem less great. Not in my book.

Cheers,

lansdale

It's unfortunate the Rockets never played the Bulls in the finals. I think they would've won.

[lansdale]

[QUOTE=ronsmac]

Originally Posted by lansdale

It's unfortunate the Rockets never played the Bulls in the finals. I think they would've won.

Olajuwon was great, but the 93-94 Rockets was the worst team ever to win an NBA championship - the 94-95 edition with Drexler was somewhat better, but the team they beat in the Finals was an inexperienced Shaq/Penny Magic. I don't think it's much of a reach to think that the Bulls with prime (31/32) Jordan would have won both of these championships. But we'll never know.