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06-24-2016, 11:01 PM
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#1
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Another problem with "jackpot" bets
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06-24-2016, 11:09 PM
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 12,402
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PTP with a round-tripper there. To the point, well-articulated, and well-written. That should be linked to the front of Paulick's since that's about the only way anyone gets any real news out of the industry.
__________________
"You make me feel like I am fun again."
-Robert James Smith, 1989
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06-24-2016, 11:32 PM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 31
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I feel bad for the bettors, just shows that Churchill doesn't care. Why spend your money there?
They made damn sure to wait out the rain at last years Arlington Million. Just imagine if they cancelled 3 grade ones...
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06-25-2016, 05:58 AM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 647
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This is really a gut twister...They would have to called security if i was lucky enough to be live. It's just sickening the things CDI gets away with annually. Hope Paulick Report picks up with this article...
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06-25-2016, 09:09 AM
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#5
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Just another Facist
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Now in Houston
Posts: 52,773
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Bravo PTP for writing about it
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06-25-2016, 09:35 AM
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Home
Posts: 342
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I wonder if a crafty lawyer could find grounds for a lawsuit.
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06-25-2016, 10:07 AM
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Tampa
Posts: 98
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Isn't this the pool that was seeded with half of Derby day carryover?
Comes across like "It's our money and we'll decide how this goes."
Now the real question...
Does this keep you away on mandatory payout day?
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06-25-2016, 10:24 AM
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#8
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NoPoints4ME
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 9,854
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hard2Like
Isn't this the pool that was seeded with half of Derby day carryover?
Comes across like "It's our money and we'll decide how this goes."
Now the real question...
Does this keep you away on mandatory payout day?
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Keeps me away everyday. When I boycott, I boycott.
Golden Gate and Churchill Downs are the worst tracks in America. They can keep their jackpots.
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06-25-2016, 12:35 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,128
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My sentiments, exactly. Since the Hana referendum I have bet the Oak, Derby only for, what 3-4 years now? That outta count for something. Others should do the same. Very bad public relation building up when these things occur. Act now.....
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Originally Posted by EMD4ME
Keeps me away everyday. When I boycott, I boycott.
Golden Gate and Churchill Downs are the worst tracks in America. They can keep their jackpots.
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06-27-2016, 10:29 AM
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#10
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$2 Showbettor
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: The Villages
Posts: 2,578
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fox
I wonder if a crafty lawyer could find grounds for a lawsuit.
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Not going to happen. There's an ordinance on the books in Kentucky that one is not allowed to sue for gaming winnings.
Buying a ticket is like going on a TV game show. Before the show you sign a waiver indicating that you will accept what the show gives you, regardless of what happens on the show. So if you win a car and $1M cookie jar on the show, in reality they can give you anything they want.
Same with a racing bet, the track gives you want they want and you have no legal say in the matter.
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06-27-2016, 01:48 PM
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#11
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@TimeformUSfigs
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Moore, OK
Posts: 46,828
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Redboard
Not going to happen. There's an ordinance on the books in Kentucky that one is not allowed to sue for gaming winnings.
Buying a ticket is like going on a TV game show. Before the show you sign a waiver indicating that you will accept what the show gives you, regardless of what happens on the show. So if you win a car and $1M cookie jar on the show, in reality they can give you anything they want.
Same with a racing bet, the track gives you want they want and you have no legal say in the matter.
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People fight and beat ordinances often if they are deemed illegal or one party acts improperly. I doubt there would be much chance on this one, probably none at all, but if Churchill pushed it too far they could get themselves in trouble.
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06-27-2016, 02:20 PM
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Redboard
Not going to happen. There's an ordinance on the books in Kentucky that one is not allowed to sue for gaming winnings.
Buying a ticket is like going on a TV game show. Before the show you sign a waiver indicating that you will accept what the show gives you, regardless of what happens on the show. So if you win a car and $1M cookie jar on the show, in reality they can give you anything they want.
Same with a racing bet, the track gives you want they want and you have no legal say in the matter.
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Don't be this categorical. There's no way that statute applies to fraud claims, for instance.
There's a legal strategy that could scare the crap out of Churchill in this situation. You file, allege fraud, and get discovery. And then you go through all their e-mails and see if someone, somewhere, discussed the possibility of the jackpot carrying over as a benefit of canceling the race. If you find it, you've got them.
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06-28-2016, 12:14 PM
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#13
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$2 Showbettor
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: The Villages
Posts: 2,578
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dilanesp
Don't be this categorical. There's no way that statute applies to fraud claims, for instance.
There's a legal strategy that could scare the crap out of Churchill in this situation. You file, allege fraud, and get discovery. And then you go through all their e-mails and see if someone, somewhere, discussed the possibility of the jackpot carrying over as a benefit of canceling the race. If you find it, you've got them.
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Good luck with that. You may be able to get your client's $2 bet back, but as far as recovering "lost winnings," there is no legal entity.
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06-28-2016, 02:04 PM
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 8,798
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Redboard
Good luck with that. You may be able to get your client's $2 bet back, but as far as recovering "lost winnings," there is no legal entity.
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That's not always true in a fraud case. There is extensive debate in the caselaw as to when you can receive "benefit of the bargain" damages (essentially, what you expected to make) on a fraud claim instead of "out of pocket" damages. The cases consider factors such as whether limiting the damages will allow the tortfeasor to get away with the fraud. Those arguments could very well militate against Churchill in this situation.
Plus, there's emotional distress and punitives.
There's another thing-- if Churchill knows such an e-mail exists, they may decide to settle because they don't want that discovery to come out because it will make the track look terrible and cost it credibility (and could even result in discipline from the state commission).
This is the sort of thing that could be worth a roll of the dice.
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06-28-2016, 04:36 PM
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#15
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NoPoints4ME
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 9,854
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dilanesp
Don't be this categorical. There's no way that statute applies to fraud claims, for instance.
There's a legal strategy that could scare the crap out of Churchill in this situation. You file, allege fraud, and get discovery. And then you go through all their e-mails and see if someone, somewhere, discussed the possibility of the jackpot carrying over as a benefit of canceling the race. If you find it, you've got them.
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I like your thinking with this. 
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