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Old 12-31-2017, 11:24 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by jay68802 View Post
Since we are going to give theories about this subject, here is mine.

Horse racing is afraid of technology. Track managers and horsemen think accurate information will ruin the sport. Since speed figures have become available the payouts have dropped, and lower payouts is why they lost attendance and are unable to attract new customers. If they allow accurate information to be widely available their sport will continue to decline.
That's what handicappers should worry about. Trainers and owners only care that they win the race. It's a big leap to think that they want to screw up the timing to screw up speed figures to make gamblers happy.
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Old 12-31-2017, 11:32 PM   #47
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Racing secretaries are spineless when dealing with the horsemen.
They write races to suit the demands of the trainers. The horsemen want small fields.
That is purely my opinion.
Pure silliness. Trainers want races to go. You really think they somehow are manipulating the field sizes to be small? I'd love to hear how you figure they're pulling that off.
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Old 01-01-2018, 05:11 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by Fager Fan View Post
That's what handicappers should worry about. Trainers and owners only care that they win the race.

You are right they want to win races. Some of them don't care how they do it, either. Danny Robertson, a clocker, was bribed by trainers to report slower work out times on their horses. Why? They wanted higher win mutual on their bet.


It's a big leap to think that they want to screw up the timing to screw up speed figures to make gamblers happy.
Then why not have accurate timing and distances? Why should it be off in some cases and just plain false in others. Whats the reason?
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Old 01-01-2018, 09:11 AM   #49
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Then why not have accurate timing and distances? Why should it be off in some cases and just plain false in others. Whats the reason?
I long ago learned to not take work times as gospel. I know of too many instances of inaccuracies, and not usually for nefarious purposes. And yes, there are known times where clockers weren't on thee up and up, including wanting to keep info to themselves for betting purposes.

I have no idea what the problems are with timing at GP. I assume someone has asked, so what was the answer? CJ could certainly call and ask. But I'm sure they're not deliberately messing up the times to mess up speed figures to supposedly raise prices on horses and make handicappers happy. Clearly they're not happy, right?

Though it's a good point that the wealth of info at handicappers' fingertips have driven down prices.
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Old 01-01-2018, 09:59 AM   #50
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https://twitter.com/racetrackandy/st...60670277025792





Let's Take Action

https://www.classaction.org/free-case-evaluation

If you've been harmed by a company's negligence or misconduct, you may have the right to sue for your losses. At ClassAction.org, we help people take action.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:16 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by Fager Fan View Post
Pure silliness. Trainers want races to go. You really think they somehow are manipulating the field sizes to be small? I'd love to hear how you figure they're pulling that off.
trainer enters multiple horses to get the race to go(fill) then scratch the one's he/she never planned on running in the first place. Happens all the time

Last edited by Afleet; 01-01-2018 at 11:17 AM.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:23 AM   #52
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Sure, get rich scheme for the lawyer.

It's too bad you don't put your collective power to better use. You're going to end hard-pressed to prove damages on this one. Why not go after drugs? It's far more easily proven how someone is damaged.

It's hard to take you seriously when you throw out class action suit both over this and also when it never happens.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:26 AM   #53
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Sure, get rich scheme for the lawyer.

It's too bad you don't put your collective power to better use. You're going to end hard-pressed to prove damages on this one. Why not go after drugs? It's far more easily proven how someone is damaged.

It's hard to take you seriously when you throw out class action suit both over this and also when it never happens.
What's your solution to the chronic timing problems and having false times show up in the PP's we pay for?
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:33 AM   #54
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What's your solution to the chronic timing problems and having false times show up in the PP's we pay for?
Really?

Don't bet Gulfstream if it's a real issue for you.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:36 AM   #55
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What's your solution to the chronic timing problems and having false times show up in the PP's we pay for?
here is a very simple solution, stop buying the racing form and get off your ass and go to the track and time your own horses.

these fake times are nothing new in this game, especially in Florida
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:39 AM   #56
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trainer enters multiple horses to get the race to go(fill) then scratch the one's he/she never planned on running in the first place. Happens all the time
That's the opposite from manipulating for the purpose of having a small field, as you admit it's done to try to get a small field larger for the purpose of having it go.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:43 AM   #57
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Really?

Don't bet Gulfstream if it's a real issue for you.
Poor timing happens everywhere but Gulfstream is the worst.

And in other words you don't have a solution. It goes directly to the integrity of the game and making sure the PP's people pay for and use have the most accurate data possible.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:44 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by lamboguy View Post
here is a very simple solution, stop buying the racing form and get off your ass and go to the track and time your own horses.

these fake times are nothing new in this game, especially in Florida
Get off my ass and go to Gulfstream instead of expecting accurate data in the past performances I buy? I live in San Diego for one...........
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Old 01-01-2018, 05:42 PM   #59
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It could certainly be argued that Speed Figures have ruined the game for numerous horseplayers.
It's awfully hard to find value any more.

Trip handicapping is also of little benefit, as everyone has access to replays and very little is missed.
Now, one of the few things left - pace figures - are also losing value.

What's left for the hobbyist to do?
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Old 01-01-2018, 05:54 PM   #60
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Not to be misunderstood. I don't mean figures themselves have ruined things.

I meant to say the widespread AVAILABILITY of good figures at little to no cost has taken away their advantage and it's only getting worse.

That City of Light horse last week is good example. Horse should have been 15-1 or more based on old handicapping. Instead he wins at 7-1.

Last edited by Denny; 01-01-2018 at 05:56 PM. Reason: Typo
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