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[elysiantraveller]

Originally Posted by classhandicapper

First, if your adversary tells you it's not going to put NATO troops and missiles in former Soviet countries, but they keep moving in that direction, you feel your national security is threatened, so you warn them repeatedly about it for years, your promise to not invade Ukraine if nukes are removed becomes problematical.

One of these is written down. One isn't. Something you continually ignore because it does fit your priors.

That's what happened.

I'll ask again for you to direct me where it was written down. Fuck... Trump signed something Kim... it didn't say anything of import but even they signed something.

If don't care if you think Russia is an evil empire, they clearly have legitimate national security concerns.

So do their neighbors. Something you conveniently ignore.

What we did was essentially put a rabid dog in the corner, tease it, and now we are getting upset because it bit.

Also, I didn't say it's all NATO and US's fault.

But you just did...

I said we have degrees of evil here where both sides want control of Ukraine for strategic reasons, oil and gas, extremely strategic natural resources, and in our case a lot of political corruption in Ukraine benefitting certain politicians in the US.

How does Ukraine wanting to join the EU suddenly become us taking over strategic natural resources?

Please explain.

Russia wants all that stuff too and was looking for reasons to invade and install their puppet.

Goddammit you're close...

So we can cut it off there... the reason Russia invaded Ukraine is because the Ukraine wants to integrate into the western economy. The key word in that sentence is wants.

Russia, a historically backward and paranoid power, sees its historical possession slipping away. That is unacceptable to them.

Anything else is just rehashing Kremlin talking points.