Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Go Back   Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board


Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board

Horse Racing Forum - PaceAdvantage.Com - Horse Racing Message Board (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/index.php)
-   General Racing Discussion (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=10)
-   -   Fans advocacy group to support safety? (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=142588)

Gasser57 01-02-2018 03:53 PM

Fans advocacy group to support safety?
 
I was live-streaming todayís first race at Parx, and the caller mentioned a horse (Lust for Money) and jockey went down. It happened off camera, and about 10 minutes later Parx suspended racing for the day because of the cold. I then saw tweets indicating Lust for Money had died (presumably euthanized), but there were no details. Some tweets expressed anger that a horse had to die before racing was cancelled.

As someone whoís fairly new to the sport, it angers me if the horsesí safety takes a backseat to business interests. Not saying this was the case here since I donít know the particulars about what happened today, but it did make me wonder if thereís an advocacy group of fans that works to help ensure the safety of the horses comes first? Iíve read a little about the NTRA, but it looks like itís more of a trade group and this is just one of many things it promotes.

Is there a fan-centered group that advocates solely for safer racing?

Fager Fan 01-02-2018 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasser57 (Post 2256539)
I was live-streaming todayís first race at Parx, and the caller mentioned a horse (Lust for Money) and jockey went down. It happened off camera, and about 10 minutes later Parx suspended racing for the day because of the cold. I then saw tweets indicating Lust for Money had died (presumably euthanized), but there were no details. Some tweets expressed anger that a horse had to die before racing was cancelled.

As someone whoís fairly new to the sport, it angers me if the horsesí safety takes a backseat to business interests. Not saying this was the case here since I donít know the particulars about what happened today, but it did make me wonder if thereís an advocacy group of fans that works to help ensure the safety of the horses comes first? Iíve read a little about the NTRA, but it looks like itís more of a trade group and this is just one of many things it promotes.

Is there a fan-centered group that advocates solely for safer racing?

No, there's not.

thaskalos 01-02-2018 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasser57 (Post 2256539)
I was live-streaming todayís first race at Parx, and the caller mentioned a horse (Lust for Money) and jockey went down. It happened off camera, and about 10 minutes later Parx suspended racing for the day because of the cold. I the saw tweets indicating Lust for Money died (presumably euthanized), but there were no details. Some tweets expressed anger that a horse had to die before racing was cancelled.

As someone whoís fairly new to the sport, it angers me if the horsesí safety takes a backseat to business interests. Not saying this was the case here since I donít know the particulars about what happened today, but it did make me wonder if thereís an advocacy group of fans that works to help ensure the safety of the horses comes first? Iíve read a little about the NTRA, but it looks like itís more of a trade group and this is just one of many things it promotes.

Is there a fan-centered group that advocates solely for safer racing?


If this is true...then you will have a difficult time adjusting to this game. Here...powerful painkillers are administered to these horses in order "keep them racing", when they should really be resting while mending their various injuries. And this happens throughout the year. Consequently...not only are the sport's "business interests" held in higher regard than the "safety of the horses"...they are considered more important than the safety of their riders, as well.

And we horseplayers are most interested in our "business interests" too...while we try to keep these "ugly details" out of our minds as we try to "pick winners". Sadly...you can't be "sensitive" in this business. You either get "disensitized"...or you get OUT.

Tom 01-02-2018 04:38 PM

Quote:

As someone whoís fairly new to the sport, it angers me if the horsesí safety takes a backseat to business interests.
Seriously, I have two words for you:

RUN!
NOW!

Many do not give a crap about horse safety and even more do not give a crap about you as a customer.

You will quickly learn that most, if not all tracks, either do not care or do not possess the mental abilities to effect any meaningful changes


PaceAdvantage 01-02-2018 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasser57 (Post 2256539)
As someone whoís fairly new to the sport, it angers me if the horsesí safety takes a backseat to business interests.

I feel comfortable saying a horse's safety does NOT take a backseat to business interests. Now, obviously, this isn't always the case. But where else in the world is it the case?

Even PETA has been shown to kill a whole shitload of animals it had in its care at some of its shelters.

And yes, there are some trainers who are out there for the buck and will do anything to get it, including putting animals at risk.

But, for the most part, I would say that the horses in this game are cared for as best as possible, under the current guidelines in place.

Yes, you can complain about LEGAL medications such as bute (painkillers) and lasix (anti-bleeders). But they are legal for use and those using them are operating under the laws that are in place.

But just like any other industry, there are those individuals who seek to push the envelope and beyond. This isn't a perfect world.

But to postulate that horse's safety (and by extension, jockey safety) takes a backseat to business interests is unfair in my opinion.

chiguy 01-02-2018 05:13 PM

Perfectly stated PA. I know a few horsemen and I can tell you that they care for their horses like they do family members. There will always be bad apples that put $ before all else but that exists in every walk of life.

Tom 01-02-2018 05:58 PM

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/s...d.php?t=142208

But the game still allows this crap to occur.
The game needs to be purged of the slimeballs who pretend to be trainers.
And it ain't happening fast enough.

Mulerider 01-02-2018 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage (Post 2256567)
But just like any other industry, there are those individuals who seek to push the envelope and beyond. This isn't a perfect world.

Is it safe to assume that those individuals gravitate to the tracks at which it is easier to push the envelope? I mention this because I'd handicapped Parx's Monday card for a tournament. Two horses on the card were coming back after two days' rest. One was a granddaughter of Holy Bull, and was making her fourth lifetime start, all at Parx. Prior to her race on Friday (in which she ran hard but wide) she'd been laid off for two months. Surely her trainer knows horses better than I, but I was vaguely relieved when the card was cancelled, despite having spent a couple of hours handicapping it.

Gasser57 01-02-2018 06:50 PM

So it sounds like opinions are mixed regarding whether the horses' well-being (and by extension, the jockeys') are subordinate to business interests.

Tom - thanks for posting the Penn thread. After reading that it sounds like the best thing to do about tracks that show a flagrant disregard for safety is boycott them. I certainly won't give Penn any more business, and will do some research to try and figure out which tracks care more about the horses and jockeys and just play them. Mulerider's post about Parx carding two horses in a race that only had two days off suggests along with today's event mentioned in my OP that I don't need to give them any business either.

Fager Fan 01-02-2018 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PaceAdvantage (Post 2256567)
I feel comfortable saying a horse's safety does NOT take a backseat to business interests. Now, obviously, this isn't always the case. But where else in the world is it the case?

Even PETA has been shown to kill a whole shitload of animals it had in its care at some of its shelters.

And yes, there are some trainers who are out there for the buck and will do anything to get it, including putting animals at risk.

But, for the most part, I would say that the horses in this game are cared for as best as possible, under the current guidelines in place.

Yes, you can complain about LEGAL medications such as bute (painkillers) and lasix (anti-bleeders). But they are legal for use and those using them are operating under the laws that are in place.

But just like any other industry, there are those individuals who seek to push the envelope and beyond. This isn't a perfect world.

But to postulate that horse's safety (and by extension, jockey safety) takes a backseat to business interests is unfair in my opinion.

Thank you.

There are many in the business who take great care of the horses.

There's a sickening story with photos making its round on FB about the ass**** who left a dog chained to the front porch in this weather and it was found frozen to death. Do we condemn all dog owners?

thaskalos 01-02-2018 08:19 PM

There was trainer testimony in Pennsylvania that as many as 95% of the trainers at Penn National "cheat" by illegally administering medication to their horses on race day. Isn't this "placing business-interests ahead of the interests of the horse"? Is Penn National that much different than Parx...or Charlestown...or Evangeline...or Delta Downs, etc...in this regard?

Or do we deny the cheating allegations...even when the trainers themselves admit to them?

Tom 01-02-2018 08:31 PM

Quote:

Or do we deny the cheating allegations...even when the trainers themselves admit to them?
A conundrum.
You know trainers never tell the truth! :cool:

thaskalos 01-02-2018 08:32 PM

There was also a report circulating a few years ago...on a massive study that was conducted on the fractured limbs of horses who had suffered fatal breakdowns while racing or working out. It reported that, in about 75% of the cases, the fatal break of the limb occurred precisely on the same spot where there was evidence of prior trauma...suggesting that the horse was brought back to racing before its prior serious injury had properly healed. Isn't this also an indication of placing "business" ahead of "safety"?

Of course, these reports seldom enjoy wide publicity...because they interfere with the "business interests" of the sport. How many horses die at the track every year...and how little mention do these unfortunate horses garner?

Just because we play this game doesn't mean that we must also keep our heads buried in the sand.

Fager Fan 01-03-2018 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaskalos (Post 2256655)
There was also a report circulating a few years ago...on a massive study that was conducted on the fractured limbs of horses who had suffered fatal breakdowns while racing or working out. It reported that, in about 75% of the cases, the fatal break of the limb occurred precisely on the same spot where there was evidence of prior trauma...suggesting that the horse was brought back to racing before its prior serious injury had properly healed. Isn't this also an indication of placing "business" ahead of "safety"?

Of course, these reports seldom enjoy wide publicity...because they interfere with the "business interests" of the sport. How many horses die at the track every year...and how little mention do these unfortunate horses garner?

Just because we play this game doesn't mean that we must also keep our heads buried in the sand.

Those reports see wide circulation. Everyone in racing has read them and knows this to be the case. It isn't indication of being brought back to racing prior to proper healing of a previous serious injury. Instead, it's the beginning stages of the future fracture.

The problem is detection. If the horse is showing no signs of lameness, then it can get past the trainer, the trainer's vet, and the state vet. This isn't to say that there aren't trainers who will overlook or cover up signs of lameness, but most are conscientious.

Fager Fan 01-03-2018 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thaskalos (Post 2256647)
There was trainer testimony in Pennsylvania that as many as 95% of the trainers at Penn National "cheat" by illegally administering medication to their horses on race day. Isn't this "placing business-interests ahead of the interests of the horse"? Is Penn National that much different than Parx...or Charlestown...or Evangeline...or Delta Downs, etc...in this regard?

Or do we deny the cheating allegations...even when the trainers themselves admit to them?

Cheaters saying everyone else is doing it isn't entirely believable, is it?


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:59 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2018 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved -- Best Viewed in a modern browser @ 1280x720 Resolution Or Higher

» Advertisement
» Current Polls
What is your most successful handicapping trait/tool?
Patience - 14.18%
40 Votes
Experience - 17.02%
48 Votes
Number crunching - 6.38%
18 Votes
Sheets / Thorograph / TimeformUS / DRF / Equibase, etc. - 11.70%
33 Votes
Software - 15.96%
45 Votes
Very specific races/angles - 10.64%
30 Votes
Jockey/Trainer angles - 6.03%
17 Votes
Other - 18.09%
51 Votes
Total Votes: 282
This poll is closed.
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:59 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright 1999 - 2018 -- PaceAdvantage.Com -- All Rights Reserved -- Best Viewed in a modern browser @ 1280x720 Resolution Or Higher
We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program
designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.