Short term you are right. Long term i would bet on jersey.

I think the language of the 3rd circuit opinion will hold sway at the end of the day

Allan

This is the long-term battleground. The owners will learn in time that they own no such thing, aside from the team names, something from which they will also be stripped of ownership in due time. Owners are anachronisms, and as cities and states continue to get squeezed economically it's only a matter of time until the teams become the property of their host geographical areas. The other possibility is that the players take control and cut the cities in for a much bigger piece of the pie.

Bookmark the post. Give it 20 years. ;)

I am from NJ. And let me tell that there is no need for a sign to tell me I've crossed the state line. I can tell by just stepping out of my car and walking into a store or fast food joint if I hear the ever present nasal whiny griping about...hell NJ people get pissed off at sunshine because they thing it's going to increase their taxes
These people bitch about everything.
They bitch about their cell phone not working then complain about the cell phone tower proposal.
After 9/11 they complained about their tv reception. The temporary solution would be to have the NYC tv stations which broadcast from atop WTC 2 to be tranmitted from the Armstrong Tower in Alpine. OH NO!!! We can't have that!! The transmission of tv signals will harm our kids, they said.
It took 4 or 5 statewide referendums just to get a Sunday racing bill passed.
Number one reason people voted against it.....They thought it would raise their taxes.
DO you know why all of the off track wagering facility licenses are not in use? Because the towns where these things are proposed keep them out. Why? They voters don't know. All they know it represents a change and they are opposed to it.
They complain about the taxes the traffic, the tolls, the government, the governor, etc. Ask them why they live there and they tell they would not live anywhere else.
Logic? Please find it for me.

I understand Robert Goren is also an attorney.
Either that or he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Thespaah, New Jersey is so beautiful it's called the "Garden State"......just get rid of it's residents, and problem solved.:)

Here's the rub. Nevada sanctions the activity. NJ Will not. There is no state oversight other than current statutes that protect consumers of any other product.
Remember the statute in question is a federal law. NJ Has no obligation to assist the federal government in enforcing federal law.
The federal law definition of the entities to which the law applies are "the term “governmental entity” means a State, a political subdivision of a State, or an entity or organization,in section 4(5) of the Indian Gaming Regulatory Act (25 U.S.C. 2703 (5)), that has governmental authority within the territorial boundaries of the United States, including on lands described in section 4(4) of such Act (25 U.S.C. 2703 (4)),"
It shall be unlawful for—
(1) a governmental entity to sponsor, operate, advertise, promote, license, or authorize by law or compact, or
(2) a person to sponsor, operate, advertise, or promote, pursuant to the law or compact of a governmental entity,

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/28/3704

In numerous places within the Code, the term "government" or government entity is mentioned as the focus of the law.
Since NJ is not sponsoring nor promoting( by definition of the new State Statute) the federal law does not apply.
See the definition of the term "loophole"....
Unless the federal government writes legislation to cover ALL entities, public and private, any injunction sought to stay the NJ law would be moot because the state of NJ is technically not in violation of the federal law. Their hands are clean. And because the law does not apply to the racetracks and casinos, again any action is moot because of the wording of the law.
Now, I can see the pro sports leagues perhaps asking their legal teams to start working to find case law and perhaps file suits in civil court, but they may be concerned about other issues.
Of course I could be wrong on this stuff as I am not an attorney.
I read the text of the law on the above provided link. This is to my understanding.

:lol:

glad they didn't open this weekend, i would have been 0/3

I am not a lawyer nor did I stay in a Holiday Inn Express. What I did do was pay attention to the teacher in high school American History class. I understand your frustration. But the answer is to repel the federal law.

No they don't. They have several legal options.

of course they do, that's how lawyer's stay in business

If sports wagering somehow makes it, New Jersey will find out real quick that sports wagering has been oversold and will under produce and never live up to the promises made just like what happened in Atlantic City.

Sports gambling is huge but not the way it will set up in NJ. If sports gambling was set up the way horses can played, money would be pouring in but not by just going to a track or casino.

AC has nothing to do with SW being successful at this juncture the economy and neighboring states put a limit on the number of casinos in AC that would have been successful, AC decided to overkill the landscape combined with political fraud and the inability to do a Las Vegas style mall where people could walk, shop, eat and gamble. No one wanted to see AC go through what it is going through but the poor planning and management of the city itself is also partially to blame. SW will do very well in NJ, hopefully after you win a few times on your bets you too will comment in a more positive way on its merits.

How do you know what William Hill will offer? Link?

Depends on what you mean. If other states don't offer SW in the near future after NJ legalizing, SW will indeed be huge for AC and NJ. It rounds out the gambling experience, and literally tens of thousands of people will come and stay in AC who wouldn't otherwise. Hotels will be sold out several weekends per year [super bowl, NCAA tourney], and considerably fuller every NFL and NCAA football weekend. It's a big deal.

Of course the online piece is the true home run, and what real gamblers want - so they can sit at home and have everything catered to them. But that won't help a destination with hotels, restaurants, etc as much. SW matters to AC because of the ancillary revenue streams, and thus if the purpose is really to help AC and NJ racing then there will be no hurry to get the online component rushed through.

Sports betting in nj will bury the local books ....

When people got money they will go to the track and bet with cash up

When the players are broke they will bet with the book.....a doomsday scenario for the rotten scummy books

For the record I hate bookmakers the scumbags for years sat on there fat ass and and answered the phone....now they got internet sites that do it for them

Now things are changing

Why hate the books? They provide a valuable service. Try walking in and getting an unsecured, no-interest line of credit from a banker.

Atlantic City did not become a rich, booming resort, but the casinos did just fine for 30 years---until casinos were opened in all surrounding states. Unless every surrounding state does the same with sports betting, NJ can only benefit from the additional gambling dollars.

I don't believe NJ will win the federal legal challenge, but if it did the casinos and state would definitely benefit.

I agree on that....

Can't tell you how many books I've stiffed over my lifetime....

My favorite was stiff the book for 1700 and then have somebody else who bets with him put in my plays and get paid from him :lol:

Everything I have read says it will be only offered at casinos and tracks. Have you read anywhere that it will be offered online or by phone?

It may only bury the books if people can bet the way they currently bet with the books.

Only at Monmouth Park to start no other venues as of yet. No phone or internet for quite a while.

Nfl have filed for injuctive relief becuase they think that nj is still in violation of paspa due to its repealing sports betting laws for only racetracksand casinos.

Not sure ifthey have a leg to stand on with this tact since the third circuit hasalready ruled that it is up to the state to determine their own laws regarding sportsbetting

Allan

Aucually the lawsuit they just filed for injuctive relief states that they are asking for relief due to jersey still being in violation of PASPA despite of the laws on jersey books that deregulate sports betting,

Not sure how that will fly in court but we shall see tomorrow.

Allan

good one

Has anybody put up a line yet if you will be able to place a legal sports wager in New Jersey on Sunday, Oct. 26.

The line is even money that you do an about face once SW is up and running.

I sure hope we all live that long!!
Lawyers = delays and more delays.

Should be a nice day Sunday at MP enjoy!

What is different now from the ruling of March 2013?
Same Judge.

Shipp granted the leagues’ request for an injunction because he felt the leagues had “demonstrated irreparable injury” would befall them as a result of increased legal sports betting. Shipp’s decision was also based on his belief that “no hardship will befall” New Jersey by not having legal sports betting.

Shipp acknowledged that some of the legal questions raised by this case were “novel” but ultimately decided that the dreaded “judicial activism” was “generally unwarranted no matter how unwise a court considers a policy decision of the legislative branch.” As a result, Shipp suggested the only remedy for New Jersey was to convince Congress to revise or abolish PASPA. There are currently two federal bills seeking to alter the sports betting landscape, both of which were filed by New Jersey pols, neither of which is likely to make any headway anytime soon.

What I have said all along. NJ will no doubt appeal. Maybe the supreme court will side with NJ but I have my doubts. The Roberts court has done crazier things. That is about NJ's only hope.
No chance that a bill pass the house with current make up. As a person involved on the periphery of trying legalize online poker, I have a feel where the votes are. They are not there in house, not even close. In the senate there might be 51 votes but not 60. There are at least 5 "openly opposed to gambling" democratic senators. Their votes would have to offset by republicans. I am not sure that would happen. It would take some horsetrading to get to 60 and these days republicans are scared to horsetrade. Even then you would still have get all of the "libertarian" republican senators. I don't think that is a given. Nobody knows if Obama would veto it.

What has changed is what the 3rd circuit stated what jersey has to do in order to have sports betting at its racetracks and casinos,that is change their sports betting laws, they did.

If the injuction was a slam dunk, shipp would have not have postponed action on the injunction today.

He is bound by the 3rd circuit opinion, in other words he can't say their opinion is doo-doo.

What he can say is that even though jersey repealed its sports betting laws they are still somehow authorizing it by law and grant the request for injunction.



Very thin legal ice.

i have been handicapping pro football nonstop now for the past 2 days, does this mean that i can't make a bet this weekend?

This. What Robert and Sandy are missing is that Shipp's 2013 ruling is not the last word on the matter any longer. He may still opt to rule in the leagues' favor, but he'll be doing so in contravention of the appeals court language, and that opens up another can of worms.

If the injunction is granted it begins to look like SHIPP is the proponent (rather than a critic) of judicial activism, methinks.

According to mike francesa on wfan the producer called up Monmouth and thst said for the first month it will be $100 max and tickets will be handwritten

I didn't hear this my friend told me today

Seems weird.....

Can you imagine just repeating the Vikings 70 times for 100 lololo

Yes, and the games will not be televised. The bettors will receive scores via teletype:

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l1...psb20c5a5f.jpg

"But the Third Circuit also found that even if the state could not sponsor or license sports betting by law, New Jersey was free to repeal any of its own prohibitions on sports betting, as long as it was privately regulated."

Thus you have the ability to circumvent PASPA and move forward. MP and the other racetracks as well as any casino are able to take bets. Sunday will be a soft opening where tickets will be written up by hand and a maximum dollar limit will be in place as well as only NFL games will be able to be bet on. Once William Hill is given the green light everything will be included betting wise.

Sunday is not here yet, the state is still involved if they make any money on sports wagering, which then make SW in violation of the federal ban.
I personally wish we all could bet anywhere we wanted to. Living in Nevada we also can't open up accounts anywhere but Nevada.
I am rooting that New Jersey can break through, but living in a highly regulated state I know that the road to getting this done will not be easy.
Even if Jersey starts up on Sunday that does not mean that the battle will be over. PASPA has to be repelled at the federal level to finally have clear sailing.