Reid doesnt want to vote on Obama's plan????

[newtothegame]

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2012/12/05/surprise_mcconnell_offers_vote_on_obamageithner_fi scal_cliff_plan_reid_objects



["The president's plan] was so ridiculous, as I’ve said, it wouldn’t even pass the House under Nancy Pelosi. And that’s why even the most liberal members of Congress, the President’s most ardent supporters, haven’t come forward to support it. So, for the White House to demand a response shows they’re just playing games at this point. And if you don’t believe me, ask yourself how many Democrats would vote for this bill. Not many. But I didn’t think we should have to speculate. I still think we should give Democrats a chance to demonstrate for themselves how serious the President’s plan was, and how serious they are. That’s why I just asked consent to offer an amendment to the Russia Trade Bill that gave them that opportunity. As I noted, I’d be happy to have this vote here, or as an amendment to the next bill, or as a standalone — it will not slow down what I hope is swift passage of PNTR for Russia. If the President’s proposal was made in good faith, Democrats should be eager to vote for it. So I’m surprised the Majority Leader just declined the chance for them to support it with their votes. I guess we’re left to conclude that it couldn’t even pass by a bare majority of votes, and that they’d rather take the country off the cliff than actually work out a good-faith agreement that reflects tough choices on both sides. "

[Ocala Mike]

All the bs aside, Obama's got the better cards in this poker game. Let's see how he plays them.

[newtothegame]

All the bs aside, Obama's got the better cards in this poker game. Let's see how he plays them.
What BS? Are you saying the plan that was presented to McConnel was NOT a real plan?

[Ocala Mike]

BS as in the posturing of both sides without any meaningful negotiations. Face it, both sides are going to "cave" somewhat in the end; the R's on rates and the D's on entitlements/spending. All I'm saying is that right now the advantage is with BO. If the R's play it right, though, the advantage could be theirs in a couple of months on the debt ceiling thing.

[dartman51]

All the bs aside, Obama's got the better cards in this poker game. Let's see how he plays them.


You are right in the fact that Obama holds the best hand. What I'm trying to understand, is why he isn't playing the cards that he was dealt. He is out again, today, on the campaign trail, his second such trip since the election, trying to sell his plan to the American people. Why?? :confused: Doesn't he realize that "the American people" already bought into his plan. That's why he got re-elected. If he was a real LEADER, he would have the leaders of both parties, in a room, and tell them, "we are not leaving here till we have a deal." But, then, he's doing what he does best, campaign. Blame the Republicans for all the worlds ills. :ThmbUp:

[OntheRail]

I think Obama is waiting to see what goes down on Dec. 21st.... I mean why deal with it if the World"s gonna end in two weeks. If the Sun rises on the 22nd they will roll up their sleeves and head out for Christmas break. :lol:

[cj's dad]

I think Obama is waiting to see what goes down on Dec. 21st.... I mean why deal with it if the World"s gonna end in two weeks. If the Sun rises on the 22nd they will roll up their sleeves and head out for Christmas break. :lol:

And 20 days in Hawaii.Maybe he can dig up his BC then

[newtothegame]

BS as in the posturing of both sides without any meaningful negotiations. Face it, both sides are going to "cave" somewhat in the end; the R's on rates and the D's on entitlements/spending. All I'm saying is that right now the advantage is with BO. If the R's play it right, though, the advantage could be theirs in a couple of months on the debt ceiling thing.
So, you think Geitner's proposal to McConnel (on behalf of the admin) was just "posturing"?
I am glad McConnel said lets put it to a vote right now.....shows this WH does not really care or is not interested in actually solving the problem if you ask me.
By the way, did you see Deans comments? you know the illustrious Dean who all Dems and libs love.......he said that it was going to be EVERYONE who has their taxes raised as this is what is really needed and the 'fiscal cliff" should be gone over as its the only way forward......
And here I thought the dems were looking out for the middle class .....:lol:

[mostpost]

http://townhall.com/tipsheet/guybenson/2012/12/05/surprise_mcconnell_offers_vote_on_obamageithner_fi scal_cliff_plan_reid_objects



["The president's plan] was so ridiculous, as I’ve said, it wouldn’t even pass the House under Nancy Pelosi. And that’s why even the most liberal members of Congress, the President’s most ardent supporters, haven’t come forward to support it. So, for the White House to demand a response shows they’re just playing games at this point. And if you don’t believe me, ask yourself how many Democrats would vote for this bill. Not many. But I didn’t think we should have to speculate. I still think we should give Democrats a chance to demonstrate for themselves how serious the President’s plan was, and how serious they are. That’s why I just asked consent to offer an amendment to the Russia Trade Bill that gave them that opportunity. As I noted, I’d be happy to have this vote here, or as an amendment to the next bill, or as a standalone — it will not slow down what I hope is swift passage of PNTR for Russia. If the President’s proposal was made in good faith, Democrats should be eager to vote for it. So I’m surprised the Majority Leader just declined the chance for them to support it with their votes. I guess we’re left to conclude that it couldn’t even pass by a bare majority of votes, and that they’d rather take the country off the cliff than actually work out a good-faith agreement that reflects tough choices on both sides. "

Gullible, aren't you? What McConnell tried to do means absolutely nothing. He offered an amendment to the Russian Trade Bill. This is a bill that has strong bipartisan support. If the bill passes the amendment passes and the Obama plan is adopted and becomes law. Since they have already invoked cloture the bill only needs fifty one votes to pass. What they don't tell you as that since there is now an amendment to the bill it must go back to the House. The House will either reject the bill outright or will remove the amendment. We are right back where we started and we have wasted several days in getting a trade bill most everyone supports passed.

Guy Benson also trots out the old canard that Obama's budget was defeated 99-0. That never happened. The vote was on whether to take a vote. Since there had been no discussion, no debate on the bill, and no opportunities to make amendments; the vote was 99-0

Just another example of Republican leadership pulling the wool over the eyes of their gullible followers. :(

[newtothegame]

Gullible, aren't you? What McConnell tried to do means absolutely nothing. He offered an amendment to the Russian Trade Bill. This is a bill that has strong bipartisan support. If the bill passes the amendment passes and the Obama plan is adopted and becomes law. Since they have already invoked cloture the bill only needs fifty one votes to pass. What they don't tell you as that since there is now an amendment to the bill it must go back to the House. The House will either reject the bill outright or will remove the amendment. We are right back where we started and we have wasted several days in getting a trade bill most everyone supports passed.

Guy Benson also trots out the old canard that Obama's budget was defeated 99-0. That never happened. The vote was on whether to take a vote. Since there had been no discussion, no debate on the bill, and no opportunities to make amendments; the vote was 99-0

Just another example of Republican leadership pulling the wool over the eyes of their gullible followers. :(
You obviously dont read well...notice it also said "Or stand alone"......but its ok, im used to stupidity from you. You can also see the clip to see his own words if you like. Funny how reid wanted no part of it and now even the WH is saying it wouldnt get past the DEMOCRATICALLY CONTROLLED SENATE!
But, please spin away......By the way since you didnt addresss it in this post, maybe you would like to spin why Dean said EVERYONE needs to have there taxes raised now and its best to go over the "fiscal cliff". This was the plan all along as we told you all (and the rest of America) that raising taxes ONLY on the RICH meant NOTHING! What a few days further down the path to nowhere?? lmao.
Now, YOU on the left gt to own raising taxes on everyone!!!!

[newtothegame]

Just to make sure you can read it, here is the actual quote from the story on McConnel
"That’s why I just asked consent to offer an amendment to the Russia Trade Bill that gave them that opportunity. As I noted, I’d be happy to have this vote here, or as an amendment to the next bill, or as a standalone"
Bolding by myself to help ya out
Seeing it only needs 51 as you mentioned, why not vote on it??? After all it was the WH and what they want, I am sure the dems would support it right?

[mostpost]

You obviously dont read well...notice it also said "Or stand alone"......but its ok, im used to stupidity from you. You can also see the clip to see his own words if you like. Funny how reid wanted no part of it and now even the WH is saying it wouldnt get past the DEMOCRATICALLY CONTROLLED SENATE!
But, please spin away......By the way since you didnt addresss it in this post, maybe you would like to spin why Dean said EVERYONE needs to have there taxes raised now and its best to go over the "fiscal cliff". This was the plan all along as we told you all (and the rest of America) that raising taxes ONLY on the RICH meant NOTHING! What a few days further down the path to nowhere?? lmao.
Now, YOU on the left gt to own raising taxes on everyone!!!!
Try to understand. The vote is meaningless. It is grandstanding by McConnell. He says he is willing to have a stand alone vote, but if it came to that he would back down. Do you seriously think that McConnell would allow passage of a bill he has previously opposed so vigorously?

As to the assertion that the proposal-it is not actually a bill yet-would not pass the Democratically controlled Senate, that could very well be true. The proposal undoubtedly contains measures that are meant as bargaining chips. Things that will be given up in exchange for the other side giving up some favorite of theirs. Also, numbers will be adjusted. I doubt if there is ever a bill of any importance which its sponsers expect to be passed as originally written.

[mostpost]

So, you think Geitner's proposal to McConnel (on behalf of the admin) was just "posturing"?
I am glad McConnel said lets put it to a vote right now.....shows this WH does not really care or is not interested in actually solving the problem if you ask me.
By the way, did you see Deans comments? you know the illustrious Dean who all Dems and libs love.......he said that it was going to be EVERYONE who has their taxes raised as this is what is really needed and the 'fiscal cliff" should be gone over as its the only way forward......
And here I thought the dems were looking out for the middle class .....:lol:
Dean did not say it was going to be everyone. He said he thought it should be everyone. There is a big difference.
In any case, I agree with Dean. We are in this mess because Republicans thought you can run a country of 300M without collecting sufficient tax revenues. For thirty years we have kicked the can down the road and ignored the problem. Reducing the top tax rate to 50% was probably not a bad idea, Reducing it to 28% was ridiculous. Combining that with large increases in defense spending was disastrous.

BUT, this is not a good time to raise taxes on the middle class. The middle class needs that money to dig us out of the recessions. A few years down the road we should phase in a return to the Clinton era tax rates. In addition to that we should add a couple of brackets at the top-45% for $500,000 to $1,000,000 and 50% over $1,000,000.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Dean did not say it was going to be everyone. He said he thought it should be everyone. ...
In any case, I agree with Dean....

...So if a person is earning $25,000 a year and if that is not enough to provide the items above (And it is not!!!!) then even one dollar of taxes is unfair...

Which is it? You agree with Dean that everyone should have taxes raised or you think that under no circumstances whatsoever should people at or below your personal benchmark pay any taxes at all?

[newtothegame]

In true lib fashion, he just says whatever fits the agenda at the moment. No different then the election.

[mostpost]

Well, well, well. Will you look at what just happened in the Senate.
http://news.yahoo.com/debt-ceiling-debate-twist-sen-mitch-mcconnell-filibusters-233346015.html
Harry Reid said, "OK Mitch, well have a vote on the President's proposal. Let's see if it can pass. Let's see if Democrats will support it."

What did Mitch say? Now remember Mitch is the one who brought it up in the first place. He's the one who criticized the Democrats when the refused to bring it up for a vote.

He said, "I OBJECT" and proceeded to filibuster the vote. Just as I predicted.
There will be no vote in the Senate because Mitch McConnell does not want a vote. The whole thing was a charade, a parlor trick to make the Democrats look bad. Pathetic.
Pathetic that you all fell for it. :rolleyes:

[mostpost]

Which is it? You agree with Dean that everyone should have taxes raised or you think that under no circumstances whatsoever should people at or below your personal benchmark pay any taxes at all?

You raise a valid point because I did indeed say both of those things. I do think we should return to the Clinton era tax rates, which does include a 15% tax on the lowest bracket. But it also includes credits and exemptions which result in basically a 0 tax liability.

In a perfect world the lowest earners would pay little or no taxes. In this world they pay some.

Another way to solve the problem would be to have jobs for these people. Jobs which pay enough to provide for their needs.

[newtothegame]

Well, well, well. Will you look at what just happened in the Senate.
http://news.yahoo.com/debt-ceiling-debate-twist-sen-mitch-mcconnell-filibusters-233346015.html
Harry Reid said, "OK Mitch, well have a vote on the President's proposal. Let's see if it can pass. Let's see if Democrats will support it."

What did Mitch say? Now remember Mitch is the one who brought it up in the first place. He's the one who criticized the Democrats when the refused to bring it up for a vote.

He said, "I OBJECT" and proceeded to filibuster the vote. Just as I predicted.
There will be no vote in the Senate because Mitch McConnell does not want a vote. The whole thing was a charade, a parlor trick to make the Democrats look bad. Pathetic.
Pathetic that you all fell for it. :rolleyes:
Funny how you try and twist the story now. Point is, you come on here and talk about how people (me in particuliar), are gullible yet, you couldn't even read that McConnel proposed the vote in SEVERAL ways (not just as a rider as you had suggested).
Then, you get called on making contradictory statements not but days apart on tax stands and in typical fashion of what happened in the past election, you say whatever feels best at the moment.
Then you wonder why you get called a "tool"......:lol:
Party line says no taxes, mosty says "no taxes". Party line says tax everyone, mosty says tax everyone.......
I really could care less if McConnel votes or doesnt...this was not about McConnel. The Idea was that the DEMS would not even support their own presidents suggestions. The WH even came out and said that it would not pass the Senate (which is democratically controlled.
Now, reid tries to turn the tables and say's ok, lets vote on it......ITS A FREAKING GAME. Bottom line is YOU and I both know that taxing ONLY the rich does absolutely NOTHING except make for a feel good story so the dems can raise a glass and say "we got them suckers". But, several days later, while the deficit continues to climb and our debt CONTINUES to spiral out of control....WHAT?
At the end of the day, things will have to be cut or EVERYONE will see a tax increase (and possibly both). Go sell your snake oil to those who buy it!

[RaceBookJoe]

Funny how you try and twist the story now. Point is, you come on here and talk about how people (me in particuliar), are gullible yet, you couldn't even read that McConnel proposed the vote in SEVERAL ways (not just as a rider as you had suggested).
Then, you get called on making contradictory statements not but days apart on tax stands and in typical fashion of what happened in the past election, you say whatever feels best at the moment.
Then you wonder why you get called a "tool"......:lol:
Party line says no taxes, mosty says "no taxes". Party line says tax everyone, mosty says tax everyone.......
I really could care less if McConnel votes or doesnt...this was not about McConnel. The Idea was that the DEMS would not even support their own presidents suggestions. The WH even came out and said that it would not pass the Senate (which is democratically controlled.
Now, reid tries to turn the tables and say's ok, lets vote on it......ITS A FREAKING GAME. Bottom line is YOU and I both know that taxing ONLY the rich does absolutely NOTHING except make for a feel good story so the dems can raise a glass and say "we got them suckers". But, several days later, while the deficit continues to climb and our debt CONTINUES to spiral out of control....WHAT?
At the end of the day, things will have to be cut or EVERYONE will see a tax increase (and possibly both). Go sell your snake oil to those who buy it!

But you nailed it..THAT's the game. You tax the rich, and then they can come back and say, "well, what do you know..that didnt work, i guess we have to raise everyone's taxes" Here is a decent video also :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulkyG5F9LSI&feature=youtu.be

[mostpost]

Funny how you try and twist the story now. Point is, you come on here and talk about how people (me in particuliar), are gullible yet, you couldn't even read that McConnel proposed the vote in SEVERAL ways (not just as a rider as you had suggested).
Whether as a rider to another bill or as a stand alone bill, McConnel wanted a vote on the bill. Until the Democrats said let's have a vote. Then he cried and filibustered.
Then, you get called on making contradictory statements not but days apart on tax stands and in typical fashion of what happened in the past election, you say whatever feels best at the moment.
You think they are contradictory because you don't get nuance. You don't get that I was answering two different questions in two different threads.
Then you wonder why you get called a "tool"......:lol:
Party line says no taxes, mosty says "no taxes". Party line says tax everyone, mosty says tax everyone.......
I support higher tax rates on the wealthy. I never said any different. I think higher rates on the middle class are necessary although this may not be the best time to initiate them. I don't think those who earn under $25,000 a year should be required to pay taxes depending on their circumstances. It really does not matter if we raise the rate on those people. I hear constantly from you and others how they don't pay and taxes. So if they pay 15% of nothing or if they pay 10% of nothing what is the difference.
I really could care less if McConnel votes or doesnt...this was not about McConnel. The Idea was that the DEMS would not even support their own presidents suggestions. The WH even came out and said that it would not pass the Senate (which is democratically controlled.
The Yahoo story, which I posted, explains why the bill would not pass the Senate. The reason is significant and it was ignored by the Townhall story which would like you to believe that the Democrats oppose all of the Obama plan. A proposed change in the way the debt ceiling limit is raised is the issue.
It's not a matter of Democrat v Republican but of Executive v Legislative.

Now, reid tries to turn the tables and say's ok, lets vote on it......ITS A FREAKING GAME. Bottom line is YOU and I both know that taxing ONLY the rich does absolutely NOTHING except make for a feel good story so the dems can raise a glass and say "we got them suckers". But, several days later, while the deficit continues to climb and our debt CONTINUES to spiral out of control....WHAT?
At the end of the day, things will have to be cut or EVERYONE will see a tax increase (and possibly both). Go sell your snake oil to those who buy it!
Right, just raising taxes on the rich does not solve the debt problem. Neither does lowering them and leaving them the same leaves the problem the same.
The problem was caused by Republican policies from 1981 to 2008 and by the money Democrats have had to spend to try and fix those problems.

[Striker]

So, you think Geitner's proposal to McConnel (on behalf of the admin) was just "posturing"?
I am glad McConnel said lets put it to a vote right now.....shows this WH does not really care or is not interested in actually solving the problem if you ask me.
By the way, did you see Deans comments? you know the illustrious Dean who all Dems and libs love.......he said that it was going to be EVERYONE who has their taxes raised as this is what is really needed and the 'fiscal cliff" should be gone over as its the only way forward......
And here I thought the dems were looking out for the middle class .....:lol:
So now this shows that the repubs(or at least the ones in the senate) are not serious in solving this same problem, not that the dems are serious either, but what just transpired with this was absurd. You can't spin this story any other way besides the fact that Mitchy M got caught with his hand the cookie jar.

[newtothegame]

So now this shows that the repubs(or at least the ones in the senate) are not serious in solving this same problem, not that the dems are serious either, but what just transpired with this was absurd. You can't spin this story any other way besides the fact that Mitchy M got caught with his hand the cookie jar.
Did you notice I said "Its a freaking game".....
I know BOTH parties are in it for themselves. If you have followed any of my post, you would know that I am all for kicking ALL of them out of congress and starting from scratch.
I just find it hillarious that TOOLS, like the one above will follow the party line NO MATTER what is said from day to day.
One day its TAX the rich. Next day its tax everyone....Tomorrow it very well might be tax everyone BESIDES me.....its how libs work!

[dartman51]

Doing ANYTHING with taxes, won't mean anything to the economy. You can change it up, down, sideways, backwards or forwards, it won't matter. If the spending is not curtailed, the deficit WILL NOT be reduced. I keep hearing the Dems want to go back to CLINTON ERA taxes, but NOT ONE will agree to go back to CLINTON ERA spending. So you gain nothing, just a lot of chatter for the politicians, to make themselves feel good. :ThmbUp: