Question for the liberals on this board

[Valuist]

If you could go back in time to the 2008 Democratic primary election, would you still vote the same way? Did your party elect its best candidate? And would the country be better off if Hillary Clinton won that primary, and the Presidential election?

I saw a Mostpost the other day and he admitted he felt Clinton was the better candidate. Curious to see how many other Dems felt that way. As a conservative, I have to agree with Mostpost this time. Seemed like a shocking upset when Obama beat her.

[NJ Stinks]

First, I'm not a registered Democrat so I could not vote in the NJ primary. But to answer your question, I don't think Obama was the best candidate at that time.

But I'm still glad he won the election. This country cannot afford Republicans passing out unpaid for monetary gifts to it's biggest contributors in the form of tax cuts. And even though the Bush tax cuts are still being handed out like candy, at least Obama claims to want to do something about it.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...country cannot afford Republicans passing out unpaid for monetary gifts to it's biggest contributors ...

No, no, no... we're much better off doling out other people's loot to buddies and money men that front fly-by-night alternative energy scams.

[thaskalos]

It would have made no difference, IMO.

Some situations are so messed up, no one could make a positive impression stepping into them...no matter who they are.

That was the situation in 2008, and the same can be said for the situation right now.

And if Romney should win the election this November...we will be vilifying him come 2016 -- just as we are defaming Obama.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by NJ Stinks
...country cannot afford Republicans passing out unpaid for monetary gifts to it's biggest contributors ...

Like stealing GM from the bond holders, in violation of the bankruptcy laws??
Like rewarding Solyndra for its contributions when any IDIOT knew the company was failing with NO HOPE of ever making a profit?

Man, how you possibly ignore so much obvious stuff?
The right here almost always acknowledge when our guys screw up, but I have NEVER seen a one of you libs dare to question the party line. Lemmings, the lot of you.

[DJofSD]

Like stealing GM from the bond holders, in violation of the bankruptcy laws??
Like rewarding Solyndra for its contributions when any IDIOT knew the company was failing with NO HOPE of ever making a profit?


:ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

WH memos say they knew it was a bad investment.

IMO, any time there is an expenditure of monies by any form of government, it should never be called an investment. That is totally false and misleads people that should know better but don't -- the average American and all so called journalist. Dumber than dirt.

[Tom]

Everything Obama has doled out had been a reward or a payback - period.

That is why he has fixed NOTHING.

[Wagergirl]

It would have made no difference, IMO.

Some situations are so messed up, no one could make a positive impression stepping into them...no matter who they are.

That was the situation in 2008, and the same can be said for the situation right now.

And if Romney should win the election this November...we will be vilifying him come 2016 -- just as we are defaming Obama.

I agree, it seems to be the way that we handle these things, and then 30 years from now, while defaming that president they will find something good to say about Obama

[dartman51]

I agree, it seems to be the way that we handle these things, and then 30 years from now, while defaming that president they will find something good to say about Obama

Why wait 30 years? I can think of a couple of good things to say about him now. He seems to be a good husband and father. And he has nice teeth. :ThmbUp:

[cosmo96]

I like Hillary, but Obama was the best choice. Hillary is doing a great job as Secretary of State. Hillary may still run in 2016.

[Valuist]

I like Hillary, but Obama was the best choice. Hillary is doing a great job as Secretary of State. Hillary may still run in 2016.

And on the other side, I would expect to see Ryan run in 2016.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by Wagergirl
I agree, it seems to be the way that we handle these things, and then 30 years from now, while defaming that president they will find something good to say about Obama

I'll be 91 and it sure as Hell won't be ME!!!! ;)

[PaceAdvantage]

And even though the Bush tax cuts are still being handed out like candy, at least Obama claims to want to do something about it.
How can you even type this with a straight face? Are you telling me Obama has had no opportunity in the last four years to repeal the Bush tax cuts? He didn't have a Dem majority in the House AND Senate for the first two years of his presidency?

Really?

[horses4courses]

[/B]

I'll be 91 and it sure as Hell won't be ME!!!! ;)

All the same, chances are you'll be senile and have no idea what you're saying.
Oh, wait....my bad

[NJ Stinks]

How can you even type this with a straight face? Are you telling me Obama has had no opportunity in the last four years to repeal the Bush tax cuts? He didn't have a Dem majority in the House AND Senate for the first two years of his presidency?

Really?

I did say "claim".

2010 - Obama did not think it would be prudent to raise taxes on anybody - the recession was too fresh

2011 - Obama wanted to give a 2% SS tax break to employees. He also wanted to go back to Clinton tax rates for anybody over $200G's. Repubs said no to the SS cuts unless all kept Bush tax cuts. Obama agreed to this compromise because he didn't have the 60 votes in the Senate to get the SS cut passed without Republican support.

2012 - was basically 2011 repeated except I think extending unemployment benfits was something else the dems got for extending the Bush tax cuts to anybody making over $200G's.

Anyway, I've responded to this question before. So this time I didn't bother looking it up. But I'm confident it's an in the ballpark answer. :)


(Somehow fonts changed. :confused: )

[Tom]

All the same, chances are you'll be senile and have no idea what you're saying.
Oh, wait....my bad

You wanna go to the moon?

Bang....zoom!

[Tom]

So you favor doubling the lowest tax bracket?
Because Bush halved it.

And what do you mean being handed out like candy?
That is just not true......they are the official tax rates, end of story.

No one is handing out anything, and if they were, it would be DEMOCRATS, Einststein!

[mostpost]

You wanna go to the moon?

Bang....zoom!

One of the great cartoons of all time. Was it in Playboy originally?

[horses4courses]

You wanna go to the moon?

Bang....zoom!


bcYppAs6ZdI

[Actor]

My wife says the did not vote for Obama, she voted against Sarah Palin. :bang:

[PaceAdvantage]

My wife says the did not vote for Obama, she voted against Sarah Palin. :bang:Considering Sarah Palin wasn't running for President, that doesn't quite seem like a sound move.

I know, I know...everyone was saying ol' Johnny M would be six feet under before his term was up...but that doesn't seem to be the case, now does it? Plus if I'm not mistaken, his MOTHER is still alive (and we all knew this before the elections in 2008), so longevity seems to run in his family...

[Actor]

Considering Sarah Palin wasn't running for President, that doesn't quite seem like a sound move.

I know, I know...everyone was saying ol' Johnny M would be six feet under before his term was up...but that doesn't seem to be the case, now does it? Plus if I'm not mistaken, his MOTHER is still alive (and we all knew this before the elections in 2008), so longevity seems to run in his family...No one can predict the future. That's the whole idea of having a Vice President. What if some nut succeeded in shooting him? They nearly got Roosevelt in '32, Truman in '50, Reagan in '81 and of course Kennedy in '63. We're overdue for an assassination attempt.

That's your cue Tom. :lol:

[Actor]

Considering Sarah Palin wasn't running for President, that doesn't quite seem like a sound move.

I know, I know...everyone was saying ol' Johnny M would be six feet under before his term was up...but that doesn't seem to be the case, now does it? Plus if I'm not mistaken, his MOTHER is still alive (and we all knew this before the elections in 2008), so longevity seems to run in his family...You're handicapping. This is not a $2 bet at the track. :lol:

[Actor]

So you favor doubling the lowest tax bracket?
Because Bush halved it.

And what do you mean being handed out like candy?
That is just not true......they are the official tax rates, end of story.

No one is handing out anything, and if they were, it would be DEMOCRATS, Einststein!Einststein ??

[fast4522]

No one can predict the future. That's the whole idea of having a Vice President. What if some nut succeeded in shooting him? They nearly got Roosevelt in '32, Truman in '50, Reagan in '81 and of course Kennedy in '63. We're overdue for an assassination attempt.

That's your cue Tom. :lol:

The US Secret Service does a excellent job in protecting the President. All across our country Americans perform an extraordinary service and duty in protecting America at all levels, be it FBI, police, fire personnel, or the many positions unmentioned. The fact that they are Americans thinking as Americans makes the huge difference in excellence in job execution. We have no shortage of whack jobs due to liberal policy that has been the core of many of America's ills. I reject the notion that we are overdue for an assassination attempt, I think continuous improvement and the American spirit by those who serve, works for all who call America home. However continuous stupidity at the highest levels undermines our personnel and our economy, everyone deserves better than the leadership we have now.

[Tom]

Yes, Eintstein...search for it here. Hint: include 46 in your search terms.


Obama has assination insurance - Joe Biden.

[rastajenk]

I think that's certainly why he didn't pick Hillary as his Veepster.

[Actor]

Yes, Eintstein...search for it here. Hint: include 46 in your search terms.Einststein or Eintstein ? You changed the spelling.


Obama has assination insurance - Joe Biden.assination ?

[Tom]

No, I did NOT change the spelling.
Try searching instead of playing English teacher.

[BlueShoe]

Hillary may still run in 2016.
But only if she runs against Romney. If Obama wins there may not be a 2016 election. An unchecked Obama, with re election fears behind him, will have four years in which to continue unabatted his destruction of the Republic in order to fulfill his dream of a Marxist society. Do you really think this megalomaniac will just relinquish all power and quietly go back to Chicago and become a community organizer again? With a nation in total shambles and near anarchy by 2016 can you think or say President-For-Life Obama? Would he dare attempt such a thing? Not as far fetched as it might seem, although he would face major obstacles, such as a military that would mutiny and launch a counter coup, but this man has such ego that he just might try such a thing.

[lsbets]

Einststein or Eintstein ? You changed the spelling.


assination ?

Eintstein is an old joke, gotta be about 5 years or so now. Refers to a former poster who liked to tell everyone he was the smartest guy here, and he did so in a post where he mispelled Einstein.

[NJ Stinks]

But only if she runs against Romney. If Obama wins there may not be a 2016 election. An unchecked Obama, with re election fears behind him, will have four years in which to continue unabatted his destruction of the Republic in order to fulfill his dream of a Marxist society. Do you really think this megalomaniac will just relinquish all power and quietly go back to Chicago and become a community organizer again? With a nation in total shambles and near anarchy by 2016 can you think or say President-For-Life Obama? Would he dare attempt such a thing? Not as far fetched as it might seem, although he would face major obstacles, such as a military that would mutiny and launch a counter coup, but this man has such ego that he just might try such a thing.

This is a remarkable post by any standard.

[Rookies]

This is a remarkable post by any standard.

Remarkably INSANE, even by the standards of some here.

This is what happens, when you've spent every waking moment and all the sleeping ones 24-7-365 looking for Reds under the bed for your ENTIRE life.

You become certifiable.

[BlueShoe]

This is a remarkable post by any standard.
What, no tin foil hat joke? :D Was expecting you, Mosty or one of the other lefties to come back quickly, and was not disappointed. Back on topic, those of us on the Right have such fear and loathing of Obama that the idea of him attempting to seize dictatorial power during some crisis of his own manufacturing is not that all far fetched. I have openly stated in the past that if Barack Obama is re elected in 2012 it will mean the end of the American Republic as we know it, and my position remains the same.

[TJDave]

This is a remarkable post by any standard.

Considering this is an anonymous message board, not so much. ;)

[horses4courses]

those of us on the Right have such fear and loathing of Obama that the idea of him attempting to seize dictatorial power during some crisis of his own manufacturing is not that all far fetched. I have openly stated in the past that if Barack Obama is re elected in 2012 it will mean the end of the American Republic as we know it, and my position remains the same.

Be afraid, be very afraid.......... :rolleyes:


http://i43.tinypic.com/11i2scp.jpg

[PaceAdvantage]

But only if she runs against Romney. If Obama wins there may not be a 2016 election. An unchecked Obama, with re election fears behind him, will have four years in which to continue unabatted his destruction of the Republic in order to fulfill his dream of a Marxist society. Do you really think this megalomaniac will just relinquish all power and quietly go back to Chicago and become a community organizer again? With a nation in total shambles and near anarchy by 2016 can you think or say President-For-Life Obama? Would he dare attempt such a thing? Not as far fetched as it might seem, although he would face major obstacles, such as a military that would mutiny and launch a counter coup, but this man has such ego that he just might try such a thing.I must step in here. They were saying the same thing about Bush in 2004. And lo and behold, off he went when his eight years were up.

Plus, the US didn't turn into a theocracy, like we were also "warned" by the far-whacked-left would happen under a prolonged Bush presidency.

Like those before you during the Bush years, you simply sound silly when writing such things.

[PaceAdvantage]

Remarkably INSANE, even by the standards of some here.

This is what happens, when you've spent every waking moment and all the sleeping ones 24-7-365 looking for Reds under the bed for your ENTIRE life.

You become certifiable.I have to check back and see if you and NJ Stinks had similar to say about Bush throwing out the Constitution and keeping himself in office forever...and turning the US into a theocracy...

[horses4courses]

I have to check back and see if you and NJ Stinks had similar to say about Bush throwing out the Constitution and keeping himself in office forever...and turning the US into a theocracy...

I would have said that Bush couldn't wait to get out of Washington.
His VP, on the other hand.....well, there's another story.

[NJ Stinks]

I have to check back and see if you and NJ Stinks had similar to say about Bush throwing out the Constitution and keeping himself in office forever...and turning the US into a theocracy...

I'm clean, PA. :)

[PaceAdvantage]

I'm clean, PA. :)What I meant to say was, I have to check back and see if you were calling the people "insane" who were posting similarly outrageous theories about Bush and his desire to stay in office and where he wanted to lead the country...not that you WERE saying these things about Bush...

My bad.

[mostpost]

But only if she runs against Romney. If Obama wins there may not be a 2016 election. An unchecked Obama, with re election fears behind him, will have four years in which to continue unabatted his destruction of the Republic in order to fulfill his dream of a Marxist society. Do you really think this megalomaniac will just relinquish all power and quietly go back to Chicago and become a community organizer again? With a nation in total shambles and near anarchy by 2016 can you think or say President-For-Life Obama? Would he dare attempt such a thing? Not as far fetched as it might seem, although he would face major obstacles, such as a military that would mutiny and launch a counter coup, but this man has such ego that he just might try such a thing.

The ravings of a mad man. I mean you. The only place such a thing would be considered possible is in a diseased mind. Unfortunately there are a lot of diseased minds on your side of the fence.

It's all a part of one of Karl Rove's cardinal dictums. "Accuse your opponent of what you are doing yourself."

[mostpost]

What, no tin foil hat joke? :D Was expecting you, Mosty or one of the other lefties to come back quickly, and was not disappointed. Back on topic, ]those of us on the Right have such fear and loathing of Obama [/COLOR]that the idea of him attempting to seize dictatorial power during some crisis of his own manufacturing is not that all far fetched. I have openly stated in the past that if Barack Obama is re elected in 2012 it will mean the end of the American Republic as we know it, and my position remains the same.

And therein lies the source of your problem. Your fear is irrational. Your loathing is based on the fact that Obama is different from you. You rationalize that it is because (you think) he is a Socialist or Communist or Klingon or something.

Don't feel bad. It's not your fault. It has been scientifically proven that the part of the human brain which initiates fear, is much larger in Conservatives. You fear anything that is not like you.

[PaceAdvantage]

The ravings of a mad man. I mean you. The only place such a thing would be considered possible is in a diseased mind. Unfortunately there are a lot of diseased minds on your side of the fence.

It's all a part of one of Karl Rove's cardinal dictums. "Accuse your opponent of what you are doing yourself."Would you spare us. The same things were said about Bush in 2004. They were saying he has and will continue to stomp all over the Constitution...that he will see to it that he is President forever (or as long as he lives)...that he will turn the US into a theocracy...

It's the same shit every four years, depending on which side of the fence you like to squat.

[lsbets]

You fear anything that is not like you.

What a disgusting, vile man you are.

Any proof to back that up?

[mostpost]

I must step in here. They were saying the same thing about Bush in 2004. And lo and behold, off he went when his eight years were up.

Plus, the US didn't turn into a theocracy, like we were also "warned" by the far-whacked-left would happen under a prolonged Bush presidency.

Like those before you during the Bush years, you simply sound silly when writing such things.

Bush would not have done that. He was not enough of an idealogue. He also was not smart enough. I don't have the same confidence about some of the young conservative Republican leaders of today. Guys like Eric Cantor, Rand Paul and Paul Ryan are far too in love with their ideas. They show me no sign that they are concerned with the effect those ideas would have on real people.

I hear that Ryan is a nice guy. I do not buy it. He's charismatic. He makes you think he is a nice guy if you let him. Ryan clearly does not like people.
A clip has been running today of an interview he had with Chris Wallace of Fox News. Apparently it is (was?) Paul Ryan's birthday.
Fox News presented him with a cake. (It had a $ sign on it, and Wallace suggested Ryan cut the cake and eat some of it as it would symbolize cutting the federal budget.

Ryan looked like he really regretted not bringing his poison tester along. Any normal person would have grabbed a piece of the cake and enjoyed it. Ryan said, "Oh, I don't eat sweets." Implying strongly that anyone who did eat sweets was somehow inferior.

[newtothegame]

Bush would not have done that. He was not enough of an idealogue. He also was not smart enough. I don't have the same confidence about some of the young conservative Republican leaders of today. Guys like Eric Cantor, Rand Paul and Paul Ryan are far too in love with their ideas. They show me no sign that they are concerned with the effect those ideas would have on real people.

I hear that Ryan is a nice guy. I do not buy it. He's charismatic. He makes you think he is a nice guy if you let him. Ryan clearly does not like people.
A clip has been running today of an interview he had with Chris Wallace of Fox News. Apparently it is (was?) Paul Ryan's birthday.
Fox News presented him with a cake. (It had a $ sign on it, and Wallace suggested Ryan cut the cake and eat some of it as it would symbolize cutting the federal budget.

Ryan looked like he really regretted not bringing his poison tester along. Any normal person would have grabbed a piece of the cake and enjoyed it. Ryan said, "Oh, I don't eat sweets." Implying strongly that anyone who did eat sweets was somehow inferior.

You really sick lol. Now, please explain how "Oh, I don't eat sweets" translates to implication that those who do are inferior? lmao too funny!! :lol:

[PaceAdvantage]

Bush would not have done that. He was not enough of an idealogue. He also was not smart enough. I don't have the same confidence about some of the young conservative Republican leaders of today. Guys like Eric Cantor, Rand Paul and Paul Ryan are far too in love with their ideas. They show me no sign that they are concerned with the effect those ideas would have on real people.

I hear that Ryan is a nice guy. I do not buy it. He's charismatic. He makes you think he is a nice guy if you let him. Ryan clearly does not like people.
A clip has been running today of an interview he had with Chris Wallace of Fox News. Apparently it is (was?) Paul Ryan's birthday.
Fox News presented him with a cake. (It had a $ sign on it, and Wallace suggested Ryan cut the cake and eat some of it as it would symbolize cutting the federal budget.

Ryan looked like he really regretted not bringing his poison tester along. Any normal person would have grabbed a piece of the cake and enjoyed it. Ryan said, "Oh, I don't eat sweets." Implying strongly that anyone who did eat sweets was somehow inferior.Oy vey...are you serious? I mean really...you sound absolutely silly...you sound EXACTLY like those you criticize on the right for sounding when they talk about Obama.

I'm sorry Ryan is no Sarah Palin...we didn't make it so easy for you this time, which is why you're sounding so ridiculous.

I hope you guys run with this sort of thing nationwide. It's going to make people take a step back and really consider the lack of intellect and convictions on the part of Dems needed to try and solve the problems of today concerning the US economy.

I mean really...if THIS is going to be your focus, you're doomed.

[mostpost]

What a disgusting, vile man you are.

Any proof to back that up?

What a disgusting, vile man you are.

Any proof that I am wrong? My proof is the consistently despicable things Blue Shoe posts here about Obama.

[lsbets]

Bush would not have done that. He was not enough of an idealogue. He also was not smart enough. I don't have the same confidence about some of the young conservative Republican leaders of today. Guys like Eric Cantor, Rand Paul and Paul Ryan are far too in love with their ideas. They show me no sign that they are concerned with the effect those ideas would have on real people.

I hear that Ryan is a nice guy. I do not buy it. He's charismatic. He makes you think he is a nice guy if you let him. Ryan clearly does not like people.
A clip has been running today of an interview he had with Chris Wallace of Fox News. Apparently it is (was?) Paul Ryan's birthday.
Fox News presented him with a cake. (It had a $ sign on it, and Wallace suggested Ryan cut the cake and eat some of it as it would symbolize cutting the federal budget.

Ryan looked like he really regretted not bringing his poison tester along. Any normal person would have grabbed a piece of the cake and enjoyed it. Ryan said, "Oh, I don't eat sweets." Implying strongly that anyone who did eat sweets was somehow inferior.

This is a joke, right? No sane person could write this without joking.

[PaceAdvantage]

What a disgusting, vile man you are.

Any proof that I am wrong? My proof is the consistently despicable things Blue Shoe posts here about Obama.One could easily say the same thing about you...proof being what you just wrote about Ryan.

You must fear anything that is not like you...especially hard working, successful folk.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...Implying strongly that anyone who did eat sweets was somehow inferior.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101229043821/headhuntershorrorhouse/images/3/3d/Exploding_head.gif

[mostpost]

Oy vey...are you serious? I mean really...you sound absolutely silly...you sound EXACTLY like those you criticize on the right for sounding when they talk about Obama.

I'm sorry Ryan is no Sarah Palin...we didn't make it so easy for you this time, which is why you're sounding so ridiculous.

I hope you guys run with this sort of thing nationwide. It's going to make people take a step back and really consider the lack of intellect and convictions on the part of Dems needed to try and solve the problems of today concerning the US economy.

I mean really...if THIS is going to be your focus, you're doomed.
Ryan is smart. I did not say he wasn't smart. I said he has no feelings to go along with his intelligence. And being smart is not enough if your ideas are wrong. Ryan's ideas are wrong. He is smart enough to convince some people they are right. He's not smart enough to make them work if enacted. No one is.

BTW What I said is right. Paul Ryan=Cold fish.

[mostpost]

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20101229043821/headhuntershorrorhouse/images/3/3d/Exploding_head.gif
You need to do something about those migraines.

[lsbets]

What a disgusting, vile man you are.

Any proof that I am wrong? My proof is the consistently despicable things Blue Shoe posts here about Obama.

So you say someone who doesn't like Obama is racist (your actual words were because he's different, which is liberal code) because he says nasty things about Obama. You offer no proof of anything other than he doesn't like Obama, and say it is up to me to prove that he is not racist.

Do you realize you sound like a totally unhinged lunatic?

Does saying that make me an anti-postite because you worked for the USPS? Do I now how to prove that I don't hate all postmen just because I recognize that you are an unhinged compulsive liar?

[PaceAdvantage]

Ryan is smart. I did not say he wasn't smart. I said he has no feelings to go along with his intelligence. And being smart is not enough if your ideas are wrong. Ryan's ideas are wrong. He is smart enough to convince some people they are right. He's not smart enough to make them work if enacted. No one is.

BTW What I said is right. Paul Ryan=Cold fish.He has no feelings? How in the world would you know that? Have you spent any time with the man?

What do you think his wife and children would say? Do you think they think their Dad/Husband has no feelings?

What planet are you living on?

If this is all you've got, like I said before, you're doomed.

[mostpost]

One could easily say the same thing about you...proof being what you just wrote about Ryan.
If you want to equate what I said about Ryan with what Blue Shoe has said about Obama, I can't stop you. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

You must fear anything that is not like you...especially hard working, successful folk.

You should have come over and said Hello. Ask the guys who were at the Arlington Park outing. I'm a friendly guy. I mean you spent all those years watching me work at the Post Office and you never said Hi. I have to say I am hurt.

I worked during my life. I worked in the family grocery during High School and early college. I worked at Motorola during late college. I was out of work on only two occasions for a total of only about three or four weeks, during my post college working life.

Despite having three major operations I retired form the PO with more than a year and a half of sick leave accumulated. I rarely turned down overtime if it was offered. Of course, I did not work as a stock trader. I did not own a business. I just worked. Therefore I was not successful. By your terms.
lsbets acronym would be appropriate here.

[mostpost]

So you say someone who doesn't like Obama is racist (your actual words were because he's different, which is liberal code) because he says nasty things about Obama. You offer no proof of anything other than he doesn't like Obama, and say it is up to me to prove that he is not racist.

Do you realize you sound like a totally unhinged lunatic?

Does saying that make me an anti-postite because you worked for the USPS? Do I now how to prove that I don't hate all postmen just because I recognize that you are an unhinged compulsive liar?
Do you realize you sound like a totally unhinged lunatic?

Actually it is conservative code. Obama's not like us. He's not an American.
Obama's not like us. He was born in Kenya.
Obama's not like us. He's a secret Muslim.
Obama's not like us. He's a communist.

[PaceAdvantage]

You should have come over and said Hello. Ask the guys who were at the Arlington Park outing. I'm a friendly guy. I mean you spent all those years watching me work at the Post Office and you never said Hi. I have to say I am hurt.

I worked during my life. I worked in the family grocery during High School and early college. I worked at Motorola during late college. I was out of work on only two occasions for a total of only about three or four weeks, during my post college working life.

Despite having three major operations I retired form the PO with more than a year and a half of sick leave accumulated. I rarely turned down overtime if it was offered. Of course, I did not work as a stock trader. I did not own a business. I just worked. Therefore I was not successful. By your terms.
lsbets acronym would be appropriate here.I never judged you or said anything derogatory about your former employment. In fact, I have stepped in to defend you more than once against the attacks on your former career.

I also never said you weren't successful.

What I said is that you fear folks who are different from you. And since you seem to have a lot of fear and loathing for people who work hard and are successful, I must conclude they are different from you as well using nothing but pure logic.

Now, it's quite possible that you fear people who are different from you in other ways. You may have worked hard and been successful, but still fear those who work hard and are successful, for whatever bizarre reason you can conjure up in your head.

[mostpost]

He has no feelings? How in the world would you know that? Have you spent any time with the man?

What do you think his wife and children would say? Do you think they think their Dad/Husband has no feelings?

What planet are you living on?

If this is all you've got, like I said before, you're doomed.

No feelings for those who are not part of his circle. It should have been obvious that was what I meant.

Do you deliberately misinterpret things so you can win arguments (at least in your mind), or do you really not understand?

[PaceAdvantage]

Do you realize you sound like a totally unhinged lunatic?

Actually it is conservative code. Obama's not like us. He's not an American.
Obama's not like us. He was born in Kenya.
Obama's not like us. He's a secret Muslim.
Obama's not like us. He's a communist.There's a lot of interesting circumstantial and non-circumstantial evidence out there that points to him not being born in the USA.

This odd book jacket (from 1991) being one of them:

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/05/17/The-Vetting-Barack-Obama-Literary-Agent-1991-Born-in-Kenya-Raised-Indonesia-Hawaii

I don't know...maybe they faked that book jacket to make Obama look bad?

Plus he won't release his school records, which would undoubtedly shed some light on his "status" when he applied to those schools.

You have to admit these things are at the very least, "interesting." Or is your intellectual curiosity that muted?

[mostpost]

I never judged you or said anything derogatory about your former employment. In fact, I have stepped in to defend you more than once against the attacks on your former career.

I also never said you weren't successful.

What I said is that you fear folks who are different from you. And since you seem to have a lot of fear and loathing for people who work hard and are successful, I must conclude they are different from you as well using nothing but pure logic.

Now, it's quite possible that you fear people who are different from you in other ways. You may have worked hard and been successful, but still fear those who work hard and are successful, for whatever bizarre reason you can conjure up in your head.

I have to sleep on that one. WOW!! Too bizarre.

[PaceAdvantage]

No feelings for those who are not part of his circle. It should have been obvious that was what I meant.

Do you deliberately misinterpret things so you can win arguments (at least in your mind), or do you really not understand?I'm not a mind reader, believe it or not. When you say a man has no feelings, how am I supposed to know how to qualify those remarks?

Who is not part of his circle? Or do you just mean old folks and poor folks?

[hcap]

But only if she runs against Romney. If Obama wins there may not be a 2016 election. An unchecked Obama, with re election fears behind him, will have four years in which to continue unabatted his destruction of the Republic in order to fulfill his dream of a Marxist society. Do you really think this megalomaniac will just relinquish all power and quietly go back to Chicago and become a community organizer again? With a nation in total shambles and near anarchy by 2016 can you think or say President-For-Life Obama? Would he dare attempt such a thing? Not as far fetched as it might seem, although he would face major obstacles, such as a military that would mutiny and launch a counter coup, but this man has such ego that he just might try such a thing.Yes it is as far fetched as it might seem. Rightie paranoia.

If Bush did not appropriate the republic, odds are Obama won't either.

[rastajenk]

Yeah, at least Bush was liked by the military...not that they would go along with something like that, but it seems more likely than backing Obama in some kind of dictatorial take-over.

There were some who said the same thing about Clinton toward the end of his terms.

Fortunately, we still have a measure of federalism. If The O directed Ohio to suspend elections, he would receive a resounding "**** You!" from the people, the administration, the courts. It would take a societal breakdown so complete as to be unimaginable, and that ain't happening within four years.

Obama's a bad dude, a real cancer on the body politic; but that's why there are term limits. We will survive this somehow.

[Tom]

Yes it is as far fetched as it might seem. Rightie paranoia.

If Bush did not appropriate the republic, odds are Obama won't either.

The worry I have is that unlike Bush, this guys has already put us so far in the hole we may never get out of it. He has NO PLAN to payback anything, just spend more and more. What happens when our electric grid fails and we cannot afford to fix it? He is going to gut defense spending....always a good move. He stole GM from it's rightful investors, he has poured billions into payback for cronies......what the HELL else is left for him to ruin?

[Rookies]

I have to check back and see if you and NJ Stinks had similar to say about Bush throwing out the Constitution and keeping himself in office forever...and turning the US into a theocracy...

Look hard... look very hard.

I thought Bush was a doofus and not the brightest tool in the shed, but I would never think of claiming that Bush, with the post 9-11 winds in his ideological sails, would think of becoming America's first dictator by power.

Not ever.

That thinking is akin to the lunatic Apocalypse truthers, who get it in their heads that they need to fortify their home to the nth. to prepare for the onslaught of whatever... the state...the police... the army...

It's the stuff of unhinged lunacy. We had one of those whackos north of TO. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/07/17/barrie-bombs-in-home.html?cmp=rss

Scary crazy!

[PaceAdvantage]

Look hard... look very hard.

I thought Bush was a doofus and not the brightest tool in the shed, but I would never think of claiming that Bush, with the post 9-11 winds in his ideological sails, would think of becoming America's first dictator by power.

Not ever.

That thinking is akin to the lunatic Apocalypse truthers, who get it in their heads that they need to fortify their home to the nth. to prepare for the onslaught of whatever... the state...the police... the army...

It's the stuff of unhinged lunacy. We had one of those whackos north of TO. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/07/17/barrie-bombs-in-home.html?cmp=rss

Scary crazy!Again, my mistake in the wording. By "similar to say," I of course meant that you would be calling "crazy" those people claiming Bush was a threat to become a dictator for life and/or change the US into a theocracy. I didn't mean to imply that YOU were actually claiming this about Bush.

[Valuist]

Rookies-

You really seem obsessed with US politics. I'm sure you get a completely unbiased view, especially living in another country :rolleyes: .

Everyone I talk to in Europe shares your views, most likely shaped by a liberal biased media.

[Rookies]

Again, my mistake in the wording. By "similar to say," I of course meant that you would be calling "crazy" those people claiming Bush was a threat to become a dictator for life and/or change the US into a theocracy. I didn't mean to imply that YOU were actually claiming this about Bush.

Ok, fair enough change. But now that you're changing the channel and watering down the insanity wine, are you suggesting that those on the Left HERE didn't decry those who suggested that Bush would take power after his 4/8 years as an unelected tyrant? Is that what you're implying, PA?

Sure, there was no shortage of criticism of Bush. Could be wrong, but I don't recall ANYONE on the Left saying that HERE. Sure, you can find lunatics on the Net to back almost any statement you come up with.

The difference to me PA, is that members of this Forum here and NOW, are quoting this insanity! That's the point, rather than some nebulous, shadow figures from the Net.

Yes, I understand too, that not everyone knows who certain individuals are here in the flesh, as espoused by their Forum personality- but some do- in person. Just as many will/are meeting in a few days at the Spa.

Most people here are 'real', some less real than others imho.:rolleyes:

[Rookies]

Rookies-

You really seem obsessed with US politics. I'm sure you get a completely unbiased view, especially living in another country :rolleyes: .

Everyone I talk to in Europe shares your views, most likely shaped by a liberal biased media.

To reiterate:

1) The rest of my immediate nuclear family are dual U.S. & Canadian citizens;

2) I have been exposed to American media for 50 years- daily;

3) I've been coming to the States with frequency for almost 40 years;

4) My views of the politics of the U.S. are far more conservative than a majority of the citizens of my country, who do have biased/ignorant views, because their physical contact with Americans is extremely limited.

That is, they equate the country with politicians and make the mistake that everyone is in synche with those running it;

5) NO country does everything perfectly and only a fool/ dupe subscribes to the 'Love it or Leave it' philosophy. Most on this Forum, regardless of their place on the spectrum don't; they want 'Change'- some left, some right. Nothing wrong with that and it's a hallmark of freedom that few in the world enjoy.

[Actor]

Eintstein is an old joke, gotta be about 5 years or so now. Refers to a former poster who liked to tell everyone he was the smartest guy here, and he did so in a post where he mispelled Einstein.Five years? The oldest hit I get on the word is from May 2008 where Tom uses it. No hit that explains what's going on.

[FantasticDan]

There's a lot of interesting circumstantial and non-circumstantial evidence out there that points to him not being born in the USA.Yeah, I've always enjoyed your, "I'm not a birther, but..." posts :rolleyes: :lol:

[BlueShoe]

Wow, isn't this fun?:ThmbUp: Have not gotten this kind of rise from the lefties in a PA thread in a long time. How predictable they are, bait a trap for them and they all come charging in. :D Amazing though, how many psycoanalysts we have on this forum that are on the left side of the political ideology aisle. As usual with leftists, they declare any person crazy that differs in opinions from their own, or one who expresses great concern over the future of the Republic or who fears that a totalitarian government is a very real possibility in the not too distant future. In the meantime, am quite content to maintain my position as a far right wing loon and happy to continue crossing swords with the far left wing loons here on this forum and in any other place in which they are encountered.

[johnhannibalsmith]

Five years? The oldest hit I get on the word is from May 2008 where Tom uses it. No hit that explains what's going on.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=523706&postcount=1

Easy enough.

[PaceAdvantage]

Yeah, I've always enjoyed your, "I'm not a birther, but..." posts :rolleyes: :lol:If you haven't figured it out by now, I'm an equal opportunity kind of guy. I'm doing that with religion on the religious threads by reading Hitchens. And I can assure you I am not an atheist.

Again, I must ask...is intellectual curiosity that dead around here? You act as if conspiracies and crazy shit never happens. That there is NO WAY Obama could have been born outside of the USA, with all the circumstantial and non-circumstantial evidence that keeps rearing its ugly head.

I also toyed around with the 9/11 conspiracies a while back, if you remember.

Don't act as if I only post about stuff I actually believe, because the evidence here proves otherwise.

[PaceAdvantage]

Sure, there was no shortage of criticism of Bush. Could be wrong, but I don't recall ANYONE on the Left saying that HERE. Sure, you can find lunatics on the Net to back almost any statement you come up with.

The difference to me PA, is that members of this Forum here and NOW, are quoting this insanity! That's the point, rather than some nebulous, shadow figures from the Net.I found one from back then in seconds...I could work to find more if you'd like:

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=323779&postcount=66

They plan on steering this country away from the feudalistic theocracy it is headed for under the neocon leadership.

[FantasticDan]

If you haven't figured it out by now, I'm an equal opportunity kind of guy.Sure you are.. here, let me go back and find some of your "questioning" and "intellectual curiosity" threads about GWB and his presidency..

:sleeping:

No wait.. I'm sure there are some.. just give a minute..

:sleeping:

Hmm.. guess I'll look later when I have some more time..

[PaceAdvantage]

Sure you are.. here, let me go back and find some of your "questioning" and "intellectual curiosity" threads about GWB and his presidency..

:sleeping:

No wait.. I'm sure there are some.. just give a minute..

:sleeping:

Hmm.. guess I'll look later when I have some more time..I guess you missed this part of my reply:

Don't act as if I only post about stuff I actually believe, because the evidence here proves otherwise.You also seemed to miss that I toyed with the 9/11 conspiracies. Bush and/or Cheney being DIRECTLY responsible for 9/11 was one of those theories. Does that count in your search?

[Tom]

2) I have been exposed to American media for 50 years- daily;

I certainly hope you can find a cure for that.
Heck, if your socialized plans doesn't cover it, I'll kick in a few bucks to help out.

[mostpost]

You really sick lol. Now, please explain how "Oh, I don't eat sweets" translates to implication that those who do are inferior? lmao too funny!! :lol:

Ah! But it's true. So many of those "I don't eat sweets" people look down on those who do. You can hear it in their voice; in their attitude of 'you sweet eaters are weak and can't control your appetites'.

Being that a number of regulars on OT, including Wisconsin and ArlJim78 have seen me at Arlington and being that there is a picture of me in the gallery, I can't pretend that I do not eat sweets. What about you?

Maybe my opinion is colored by my experiences, but I get the same vibe from a lot of the "I don't eat sweets" crowd. And they always say it in the same tone the rest of us would say, "someone defecated in the punch bowl."
"Don't eat sweets?" Get some help man. :faint:

[PaceAdvantage]

Ah! But it's true. So many of those "I don't eat sweets" people look down on those who do. You can hear it in their voice; in their attitude of 'you sweet eaters are weak and can't control your appetites'.

Being that a number of regulars on OT, including Wisconsin and ArlJim78 have seen me at Arlington and being that there is a picture of me in the gallery, I can't pretend that I do not eat sweets. What about you?

Maybe my opinion is colored by my experiences, but I get the same vibe from a lot of the "I don't eat sweets" crowd. And they always say it in the same tone the rest of us would say, "someone defecated in the punch bowl."
"Don't eat sweets?" Get some help man. :faint:Doesn't Mrs. Obama lecture us on the dangers of eating sweets? I would think, given her penchant to promote healthy eating, that sweets would be a bit of a no no...do you hold the same opinion of her as you do Mr. Ryan in that regard?

[FantasticDan]

Doesn't Mrs. Obama lecture us on the dangers of eating sweets? I would think, given her penchant to promote healthy eating, that sweets would be a bit of a no no...do you hold the same opinion of her as you do Mr. Ryan in that regard?Mrs. Obama has promoted healthier eating habits, but she's also said that occasionally indulging in sweets and treats in moderation is a good thing too, which it is.

In other words, she wouldn't react to a cake as if it's a pile of dog poop.. :lol:

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/chris-wallace-terrifies-rep-paul-ryan-with-a-birthday-cake/

[Tom]

Mrs. POS was on Leno last night, and chastised Olympic heroine Gabby for treating herself to an Egg McMuffin after winning gold.

I would think the closest ties Mrs. POS has to the Olympics would be someone having to high-hurdle her ass!

My doctor told me at my physical last month that Egg McMuffins are actually a good breakfast choice nutritionally, if you have to eat on the road.

That's a few extra grand in Mickey Dee's pocket so far this year!

[FantasticDan]

Mrs. POS was on Leno last night, and chastised Olympic heroine Gabby for treating herself to an Egg McMuffin after winning gold.
http://www.upi.com/blog/2012/08/14/Michelle-Obama-Gabby-Douglas-visit-The-Tonight-Show/6041344963983/

Seated next to Obama, whose campaign "Let's Move" promotes healthy eating, Douglas admitted to sneaking in a little celebratory fast food after her gold medal.

"I splurged on an egg mcmuffin at McDonalds," Douglas said.

"You're setting me back, Gabby," the first lady joked.
Wow, that's some serious chastising.. :lol:

[Mike at A+]

Reasoning of the typical 0bama voter: He's black, he's cool, he did drugs, we love him and he's gonna give us money that other people worked for.

Reasoning of the typical Romney voter: He's smart, he's honest, he loves America, he's successful, and he wants me to be successful.

[TJDave]

Reasoning of the typical 0bama voter: He's black, he's cool, he did drugs, we love him and he's gonna give us money that other people worked for.

Reasoning of the typical Romney voter: He's smart, he's honest, he loves America, he's successful, and he wants me to be successful.

Let's pretend you're right.

Which are there more of?

[Rookies]

I found one from back then in seconds...I could work to find more if you'd like:

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=323779&postcount=66

Before my time here, I believe & I don't recognize that poster here. That's a bit of a Bud Lite reckoning of the scales v.s. those of Blue Shoe, imho; nor does it suggest that Bush will take over as titular head.

[FantasticDan]

Reasoning of the typical 0bama voter: He's black, he's cool, he did drugs, we love him and he's gonna give us money that other people worked for.

Reasoning of the typical Romney voter: He's smart, he's honest, he loves America, he's successful, and he wants me to be successful. :lol: So the black man is a thug (who typical supporters love, cuz they are too), and the white man is a patriotic angel.

Right?

[Rookies]

:lol: So the black man is a thug (who typical supporters love, cuz they are too), and the white man is a patriotic angel.

Right?

I thought the only reason to vote for Romney was the less than subtle, Beaver Cleaver- Wonder Bread family photos that some publish here...:lol:

[newtothegame]

Ah! But it's true. So many of those "I don't eat sweets" people look down on those who do. You can hear it in their voice; in their attitude of 'you sweet eaters are weak and can't control your appetites'.

Being that a number of regulars on OT, including Wisconsin and ArlJim78 have seen me at Arlington and being that there is a picture of me in the gallery, I can't pretend that I do not eat sweets. What about you?

Maybe my opinion is colored by my experiences, but I get the same vibe from a lot of the "I don't eat sweets" crowd. And they always say it in the same tone the rest of us would say, "someone defecated in the punch bowl."
"Don't eat sweets?" Get some help man. :faint:
Just because you impose YOUR thoughts and what you THINK they may or may not be thinking does NOT make you right. Too prtend that somehow you knew what Ryan was thinking is absurd to say the least.
It's this administration who is promoting the healthy food choices for us, yet do other things. Yet, not once have I heard you question MO for her "thoughts".....lol :lol:

[Actor]

I reject the notion that we are overdue for an assassination attempt, As well you should. It's an example of the Monte Carlo Fallacy. I thought handicappers would realize that. I was trying for humor. I guess I failed. :bang:

[rastajenk]

Ryan does p90X. But I seriously doubt he looks down on, or thinks less of, those millions that don't. So he's a fitness freak; how can you project anything negative onto that?

[horses4courses]

Ryan does p90X. But I seriously doubt he looks down on, or thinks less of, those millions that don't. So he's a fitness freak; how can you project anything negative onto that?

He's popping 'roids?

[rastajenk]

Well he ain't smokin' choom.

[Striker]

he's honest
Good one. :lol:

[Tom]

Wow, that's some serious chastising..

Some serious ASS, too.

[PaceAdvantage]

:lol: So the black man is a thug (who typical supporters love, cuz they are too), and the white man is a patriotic angel.

Right?Your interpretation...not surprisingly.

[PaceAdvantage]

I thought the only reason to vote for Romney was the less than subtle, Beaver Cleaver- Wonder Bread family photos that some publish here...:lol:And I thought it was the hair.

Romney/Ryan. The best HAIR COMBO of any Presidential ticket EVER....sometimes it's the simple things that win people over... :lol:

[FantasticDan]

Your interpretation...not surprisingly.Oh, please enlighten us with yours, which I'm sure will detail how an incredibly overt racist comment and perception, is actually not! :eek:

[lsbets]

And I thought it was the hair.

Romney/Ryan. The best HAIR COMBO of any Presidential ticket EVER....sometimes it's the simple things that win people over... :lol:

Oh come on PA, everyone knows John Edwards had the best hair of all time, and paired with Kerry, their hair was light years better than Bush and Cheney (granted Cheney couldn't really add anything to the hair cause, so Bush fought that battle alone).

[FantasticDan]

Oh come on PA, everyone knows John Edwards had the best hair of all time, and paired with Kerry, their hair was light years better than Bush and Cheney (granted Cheney couldn't really add anything to the hair cause, so Bush fought that battle alone).Yep, close call, but gotta give the nod to Kerry/Edwards..

http://bitsblog.theconservativereader.com/files/2007/09/kerry-edwards.jpg

http://timeswampland.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/600_hfs_romneyryan_2_0811.jpg

[PaceAdvantage]

Oh come on...who would want the Edwards hairstyle over Romney/Ryan? Not me...(quite frankly at this point though, I'd take any of them over what I have left... :lol: )

But seriously, how can anyone deny the hair power of these two? :D

[hcap]

Yeah PA, tough to beat

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/hendrikhertzberg/ryan-munster-465.jpg

[rastajenk]

Damn, that took longer than I expected. Four days...way over the over.

[Tom]

hcap, Eddie, unlike most democrats, was gainfully employed and paid his own way, so no disgrace being compared to him.

Couldn't you find a nice anchor that has similar hair?

[BlueShoe]

Any proof that I am wrong? My proof is the consistently despicable things Blue Shoe posts here about Obama.
Not going to let up Mosty. My proof is the destruction that his administration has unleashed on the nation. So much damage has been done that it could not have been done by chance or plain incompetence, but only by carefully planned design. Many of us on the Right, including myself, view Obama as the second coming of Vladimir Lenin, and insist that he is a hard line Marxist, and there is much proof that validates that position. In order to create the Marxist society that he yearns for, he and his associates must first destroy and weaken all traditional aspects of American society and render impotent the free enterprise system. In these goals he has achieved great success in his first term, and if given a second term, with re election concerns behind him, many of us greatly fear that he will complete his destruction of the American Republic as we know it.

[horses4courses]

Not going to let up Mosty. My proof is the destruction that his administration has unleashed on the nation. So much damage has been done that it could not have been done by chance or plain incompetence, but only by carefully planned design. Many of us on the Right, including myself, view Obama as the second coming of Vladimir Lenin, and insist that he is a hard line Marxist, and there is much proof that validates that position. In order to create the Marxist society that he yearns for, he and his associates must first destroy and weaken all traditional aspects of American society and render impotent the free enterprise system. In these goals he has achieved great success in his first term, and if given a second term, with re election concerns behind him, many of us greatly fear that he will complete his destruction of the American Republic as we know it.

I doubt that a few years on a shrink's couch would be of any help here.... :eek:

[BlueShoe]

I doubt that a few years on a shrink's couch would be of any help here.... :eek:
Nope, but in the meantime, we are working very hard to find a cure for Liberalism. Perhaps the place to start is to introduce them to a basic course in Ornithology. We will start with the study of the ostrich, and examine its reputed behavior when confronted with danger, and the mythical way it is said to ignore and sidestep such issues.:rolleyes:

[FantasticDan]

Yeah PA, tough to beat

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/hendrikhertzberg/ryan-munster-465.jpg
http://mariopiperni.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Romney_Ryan_Munsters1.jpg

:D

[Tom]

It is funny how all the left has to offer is cartoons and jokes.....no substance.
Must be hard to be a lib and have this under-performing serial failure as your boy.

Raise you one....:lol::lol::lol:

[dartman51]

Not going to let up Mosty. My proof is the destruction that his administration has unleashed on the nation. So much damage has been done that it could not have been done by chance or plain incompetence, but only by carefully planned design. Many of us on the Right, including myself, view Obama as the second coming of Vladimir Lenin, and insist that he is a hard line Marxist, and there is much proof that validates that position. In order to create the Marxist society that he yearns for, he and his associates must first destroy and weaken all traditional aspects of American society and render impotent the free enterprise system. In these goals he has achieved great success in his first term, and if given a second term, with re election concerns behind him, many of us greatly fear that he will complete his destruction of the American Republic as we know it.

You are absolutely correct. Obama's own words, "we tried my plan and it worked."
I don’t know about you but I don’t see the economy as getting any better. So, what exactly worked? The continuation of high unemployment, outrageous gas prices, and record numbers of Americans going on disability, is that what worked? Was the plan to see millions more pushed onto the government dole? Was the plan to see America teetering on the edge of another recession? Tell me Mr. President, what worked? What exactly was your plan in regards to the economy? To maintain the status quo? To focus all of the blame on George W. Bush?
Just more bullshit lies by this President. The worst lying President in American history. He surpassed Nixon some time ago. :ThmbUp:

[PaceAdvantage]

Yeah PA, tough to beat

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/hendrikhertzberg/ryan-munster-465.jpgI fail to see the resemblance, unless everyone with a widow's peak fits the bill...

[rastajenk]

Unitl the mothership sends down a new demeaning depiction, this one will have to do. :rolleyes:

[Tom]

I fail to see the resemblance, unless everyone with a widow's peak fits the bill...


FTFY......

[fast4522]

Desperate folks going all the way back to the Munsters, could you imagine the real photos of the desperate bottom feeders shitting bricks at the thought of their Kenyan getting beat?