DOC SARTINS VALIDATOR 3 VS.VALIDATOR 2

[shanta]

I JUST GOT A HOLD OF VAL3 THIS AFTERNOON. FIRST OFF WHEN I INSTALLED VAL 3 I WAS ABLE TO PRINT TO MY PRINTER RIGHT AWAY. A DEFINATE IMPROVEMENT OVER MY VAL2.OK HERE ARE SOME OF THE CHANGES MADE TO VAL3:
1) THE CONDITIONS OF EACH RACE NOW SHOW THE APPX. POST TIME FOR THAT RACE
2)THE RACE MENU NOW SHOWS THE FIELD SIZE FOR EACH RACE BEFORE LATE SCRATCHES
3)THERE IS NOW AN EARNINGS REPORT FOR THE HORSES THAT SHOWS LIFETIME STARTS ,WINS, EARNINGS PER START,AND RANK. THEN THERE IS A SEPERATE SET OF THE SAME STATS FOR THE DISTANCE AND SURFACE OF TODAYS RACE.THERE IS A 3RD BREAKDOWN WHICH SHOWS THE STATS FOR THE CURRENT YEAR AND A 4TH SET WHICH SHOWS THE STATS FOR THE PREVIOUS YEAR.
4)THERE IS NOW A JOCKEY REPORT WHICH SHOWS NUMBER OF STARTS FOR THE MEET AS WELL AS WINS,PLACES, SHOWS,WINNING %, AND RANK AMONG THE JOCKS IN TODAYS RACE.
5)THERE IS A SEPERATE TRAINERS STAT WHICH SHOWS THE TRAINERS STARTS, WINS,PLACES, SHOWS, WIN% AND RANK AMONG TRAINERS IN THE RACE FOR THE CURRENT MEET.
THERE IS NOT A JOCKEY/TRAINER COMBO STAT IN THIS PROGRAM.I REPEAT THERE IS NOT A JOCKEY/TRAINER COMBO REPORT IN THIS PROGRAM.
6)ON THE PACELINE SCREEN WHERE YOU CHOOSE YOUR LINES EACH PACELINE AFTER THE SPEED RATING NOW HAS DOCS COMPUTERIZED ESP DESIGNATION FOR THAT PARTICULAR LINE.(EAR,E/P,PRE,SUS,S/P,LATE)
6A)A REAL NICE IMPROVEMENT IN MY OPINION IS NOW EACH PACELINE ON THE BOTTOM OF THE PACELINE SCREEN NOW SHOWS THE "CONDITIONS" OF THE RACE. FOR EXAMPLE A 4,000 CLAIMER RESTRICTED TO HORSES THAT HAVE NOT WON A RACE IN 6 MONTHS NOW SHOWS THAT. BEFORE NO DISTINCTIONS WERE MADE.
7)WORKOUTS AND FREQUENCY OF WORKOUTS ARE NOW ON THE PACELINE SCREEN IN FULL VIEW. WITH VAL2 YOU HAD TO HIT F5 TO SEE THE WORKS AND WITH FIRSTERS YOU HAD TO HOLD THE DUMB KEY DOWN TO SEE THEM . THAT WAS KINDA DUMB. THIS IS MUCH BETTER FOR THOSE WHO LIKE TO SEE WORKS.
8) OK AFTER CHOOSING LINES AND GETTING READY TO HIDE THE 3 SCREEN WHICH WAS DOCS PRESCRIBED SCREEN TO HIDE FROM NOW HAS THE SUPPLEMENTAL RANKINGS TO THE RIGHT OF THE LINE SCORE RANK, THIS HAS BEEN ADDED ON. TO BE HONEST THE FIRST COUPLE OF RACES I HID I MADE A MISTAKE AND HID FROM THE SUP RANK CAUSE IT WAS THE FARTHEST TO THE RIGHT!TAKES A LITTLE GETTING USED TO FOR SURE.
9)THE SAME THING EXISTS NOW ON THE V/DC SCREEN. THE SUPPLEMENTAL RANKINGS ARE NOW TO THE RIGHT OF THE V/DC RANKINGS. AGAIN I MADE THE SAME MISTAKE OF HIDING BASED ON SUPP AND NOT V/DC CAUSE IT WAS FARTHEST TO THE RIGHT SIDE! AGAIN I AM GONNA HAVE TO GET USED TO THIS .
10) THERE IS NOW A SEPERATE SCREEN WHERE YOU CAN ENTER COMMENTS EITHER NEG OR POSITIVE ABOUT A HORSE AND SEE THEM ALL TOGETHER. YOU CAN ALSO ENTER THE WINNERS PRICE ON THIS SCREEN IF YOU CHOOSE TO. MAKES THINGS EASIER WHEN YOU REVISIT RACES.

I HAVE NOT DONE ANY COMPARISON YET OF DIFFERENCES IN THE V/DC RANKINGS BETWEEN VAL 3 AND VAL 2. I DO HAVE 35 CARDS STORED WHERE I HAVE LINES PICKED IN VAL2. I AM GONNA ENTER THE SAME LINES FOR THE HORSES INTO VAL3, HIDE THE SAME WAY I ALWAYS DO AND SEE IF THERE ARE ANY DIFFERENCES IN THE V/DC READOUTS. THIS WILL TAKE A FEW DAYS BUT I WILL POST WHAT IF ANY DIFFERENCES THAT I SEE .

THESE ARE MY OBSERVATIONS OF THE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN VAL2 AND VAL3.
RICHIE:)

[modred]

Thanks for the info Richie


Where can Val 3 be found for purchase?

[shanta]

THE PHONE NUMBER IS 1-909-845-5745. THE LADY IS THERE MONDAYS AND FRIDAYS ONLY FROM NOON TO 4 P.M PACIFIC TIME.ERIC I JUST WANT TO LET YOU KNOW THAT FOR THE LAST MONTH AT LEAST THE PHONE IS ALWAYS BUSY. DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEM IS OUT THERE.I DO NOT WANT TO LIST THE ADDRESS CAUSE I AM NOT SURE WHATS UP OUT THERE AND DONT WANT TO SEE YA POSSIBLY GET BEAT OK?THEY ARE GOING TO BE FOLDING UP THERE TENT IN MARCH 2004. HOPE THIS HELPS!

RICHIE

[howardjim]

Gentlemen:
I am impressed! After ridiculous attempts at reasoned
conversation on YouBet and limited success on talkaboutgambling.com,I've hit the mother lode thanks to an un-
solicited e-mail from Eric Swearingen.
I was with the Sartin group from '91 on and have been
starved for some relevant input.
My perspective may differ from most though it has proven worthy for my "fit" and paceline approach.I emphasize both those caveats because this is ultimately a private pursuit with myriad approaches and specific comments on the validity of
various factors can be unintentionally misleading.
For what it's worth(hopefully some feedback),I know these things to be true,again for "me":
I follow most of Doc Sartin's dictates with a few except-
ions.Obvious contenders sometimes require old,6th plus,lines.Two
immediate examples are stretches,sprinting well,with older routes
and similar scenarios with turf and/or dirt.There are others though they flow with a look at a horse's history.Unfortunately,I
have not been able to stick to a low/high odds bet nor limit races
to two wagers.
My basic approach is to cull 4-5 contenders by the time-
honored and aforementioned Total Energy and Primary Factors.
The 5th horse may be a tandem contender,4th tie or a close call
I'm willing to bet.I tried for years to pin down various circuits to no avail or hit/miss success---the factors that dominate at certain
times are too time consuming and dependent on the track lines
feeding into that circuit.A broad E/L Difference range by distance
has become my only qualifier unless a Need to Lead type has poor
relative corrolaries.With few exceptions,LRL and PIM noteably,a
range of 15-20-25 points at various dirt distances covers almost
80% of the winners.The range sounds broad,by intent,as my bets
are 5/1 minimum,8/1+ usually and 20/1+ at a quarter unit.I pass
many races and adjust my odds and tier(V/DC) requirements by field size.
Finally,in this long-winded post,HAW,AQUinner,LAD,SUF
and PHA.Winter poses paceline challenges at all but LAD but the
mutuels are there.Some circuits penalize various feed track lines--
I believe the program will work anywhere if you take the time to
monitor the outcome.
Thanks,
Mark

[modred]

Thanks for the info Richie

And happy to see that you made it to the PA Board Mark.... happy reading .. a lot of stuff here and really great people too.

[shanta]

WELCOME TO P.A.! I AGREE SO MUCH WITH WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT "FEEDER TRACKS" AFFECTING THE EARLY /LATE GRAPH READOUTS! I WAGER AT A LOT OF THE TRACKS YOU MENTIONED IN YOUR POST. I ALSO KNOW A FEW PEOPLE (SUCCESSFUL!) WHO WAGER WITH THE "VALUE" STARTEGY THAT YOU OUTLINED. WHAT I TRY TO DO WITH THE E/L GRAPH IS LOOK FOR XTREMES(EARLY OR LATE) . I DO NOT LIKE TO WAGER ON THESE TYPES!(UNLESS THE WHOLE RACE IS XTERMES). ALSO LOVE WHEN CHALK SHOWS UP LIKE THIS ON THE GRAPH! I CANT TOSS FAST ENOUGH! AGAIN WELCOME!
RICHIE

[shanta]

I HAVE WORKED 10 CARDS COMPARING V/DC ON THE 2 PROGRAMS. THE V/DC WERE THE SAME IN ALL BUT 2 RACES THAT I HAVE DONE SO FAR. BOTH THE RACES WERE 5 FURLONG DIRT RACES. IN BOTH THE RACES (USING THE SAME LINES) VAL2 HAD THE WINNER 1 TIER BETTER.

WHAT I ALSO HAVE NOTICED ARE THESE 2 THINGS:
1) THE BALANCE NUMBERS ON THE 6 SCREEN ARE OCCASIONALY DIFFERENT WITH THE 2 PROGRAMS USING THE SAME LINES.THIS HAS THROWN ME OFF A LITTLE CAUSE I KNOW MY BALANCE PARAMETERS FROM VAL 2 AND VAL 3'S ARE A LITTLE DIFFERENT.
2) ON THE 6 SCREEN THE SCBL(SECOND CALL BEATEN LENGHTS)ARE SOMETIMES VERY DIFFERENT WHEN USING THE SAME LINES. AND I DO MEAN VERY DIFFERENT SOMETIMES! THE E/L GRAPH "STICKS" ARE THE SAME, LINES USED ARE THE SAME BUT THIS READOUT SOMETIMES IS "VERY" DIFFERENT. I DON'T USE IT BUT IF YOU DO JUST PUTTING IT OUT THERE FOR YOU TO KNOW.

THE ADDITION OF THE SUP READOUTS ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF BOTH THE "HIDE SCREEN"(3 SCREEN) AND THE VALIDATOR SCREEN REALLY TAKES GETTING USED TO. I MADE ANOTHER MISTAKE YESTERDAY WAGERING IN JERSEY CAUSE I BET OFF THE WRONG READOUTS! I WOULD MOVE IT TO THE LEFT OF V/DC AND ALSO TO THE LEFT OF LINE SCORE ON THE "HIDE SCREEN" BUT THATS JUST MY 2 CENTS WORTH.

HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!!! RICHIE :)

[howardjim]

Richie:
Many thanks for your Validator comparisons.It was my impression from Follow-Up's after VAL2 was issued that the only
salient improvement was an instant paceline ranking available
from the pp's.As this is easily accomplished manually and the V/DC
tinkering seemed minor,I stayed with VAL1.Your comparisons point to a similar conclusion with the latest,and presumably last
incarnation.
My approaches center on probable contenders from which
I'm getting specific odds,limiting a desire to fine-point tiers.That said,the Validator program and the methodology in general have
afforded me an appreciation of how imprecise the art of picking
winners is in fact,and by necessity,as the logical favorites are
often grossly overbet.
The demise of PIRCO was unfortunate though inevitable.I
would hate to lose the program as well and regroup from sources
that focus on peripheral data I prefer to disregard.Several calls
to Trackmaster about original pacelines not converted,Colonial
outer-turf was one,were met with "contact 3rd party vendor"
replies.
I'm not sure how many of us depend upon the program.I am
willing and anxious to promote any efforts feasible to bridge the gap of no Trackmaster/Sartin interaction,should that void begin to
create additional problems.
Thanks again for your contributions.
Mark

[Binder]

Rich
Thank you for the info and revue and news of Val3
Having been studying the Sartin programs with you
since PL4 I look foward to benifiting from your help and time
once again

Bill

[sq764]

Through 3 races at sam Houston, have hit 2 horses VDC 1 - $11.00 in the first and $28 in the 3rd. Also, had the exacta in the 3rd VDC1 over VDC 2 (9-5) paid $241.. (Also the other VDC 2 horse #2 finished 3rd for a $940 tri, but I didn't play it).


Back to the track :-)

[KIANTI]

THIS IS RICHIE(SHANTA). I AM AT MY BUDDIES IN JERSEY SO I AM USING THIS SCREEN NAME.VERY NICE RESULT AT HOUSTON LAST NIGHT FOR THE EARLY RACES!!!!!! I THINK YOU ARE VERY SMART IN PLAYING HOUSTON ON A CONSISTENT BASIS WHICH I READ FROM AN EARLIER POST OF YOURS.YOU ARE GONNA HAVE TOUGH NIGHTS WHEN THE CHALK WINS LIKE CRAZY OR HORSES WIN THAT YOU JUST DO NOT GET. BUT BY PLAYING CONSISTENT AT HOUSTON YOUR GOOD NIGHTS ARE SOMETIMES UNREAL AND MORE THAN MAKE UP FOR THE BAD ONES.YOU HAVE PUT A LOT OF TIME IN LEARNING THE PROGRAM AND IT SEEMS TO BE PAYING OFF FOR YOU!!!!! :eek:


RICHIE:)

[shanta]

JUST WANTED TO PUT THIS BABY TO BED. I HAVE DONE NUMEROUS CARDS ON VAL 3 NOW AND AFTER COMPARING RESULTS WITH VAL 2 I HONESTLY SEE 1 MAJOR DIFFERENCE WHEN IT COMES TO MY (RICHIES) USE OF THE 2 PROGRAMS.
THE PLACING OF THE SUPPLEMENTAL READOUTS TO THE RIGHT OF BOTH THE V/DC READOUTS ON THE 7 SCREEN AND ALSO TO THE RIGHT OF THE PRIMARY LINE SCORE AN THE "HIDE SCREEN " HAVE COST ME TO HIDE WRONG AND ALSO IN 3 RACES TO BET OFF THE WRONG READOUTS. I DO NOT KNOW WHY THE SUP READOUTS WERE ADDED. MY RECORDS WHEN LOOKING BACK DO NOT SHOW THIS "CORROLARY" AS BEING ANYTHING SPECIAL TO FOCUS ON. TOTAL ENERGY, PRIMARY LINE SCORE, SPEED RATING AND OF COURSE V/DC RANKINGS ALL OUTPERFORMED THE SUP LINE SCORE. AGAIN THIS IS FROM MY TRACKS , MY LINES SELECTED, MY HIDING OF HORSES ETC,ETC.

THE PRINTING ASPECT AND THE "CLASS" BREAKDOWNS ARE BOTH POSITIVE CHANGES FROM VAL2 BUT I DO NOT USE EITHER OF THOSE 2 THINGS WHEN I WAGER.

WHEN I AM WAGERING AT THE TRACK I AM USING VAL 2 BECAUSE OF CLARITY(FOR ME!) IN HIDING HORSES AND CLARITY(FOR ME!) SEEING THE RIGHT READOUT (V/DC) FOR WAGERING DECISIONS.
RICHIE

[teko]

I have been trying to purchase val 3. I telephoned and also emailed the Sartin group but have no replys yet. Does any one know where else val 3 can be obtained.

[witchdoctor]

The e-mail was from Aline Best and all orders go to her at:PO Box
601 Beaumont, CA 92223
Ph. 909-845-5745
The E-mail address was greathorses2003@yahoo.com

She answers the phone only on Monday and Friday.

Hope this helps.

[tyler]

Just for everyone's information, there's a new webpage for Sartin fans, SartinAlums@yahoogroups.com, that just got started a few weeks ago. Not many messages yet, but the person who started it understands Sartin's methodology thoroughly and is very accessible.
ty

[Binder]

Hello Tyler

Thank you for the link about the Sartin Group

I just tried to join and my
Membership is Pending
I hope they accept me

[TenZin]

it sounds like the sartin group makes it hard join their group
and get V3 because either they're business idiots or because
they worked out a strategy of making you think they got a
special product --- iows, they're businesses geniuses.

[Secretariat]

Actually I think Doc is terrific. But has anyone actually been refused in joining PIRCO?

[Binder]

I just wanted to say
I have been accepted
Group is very new So not to many messages
Thanks for letting me in Sartin Alum
:)

[Vinnie]

Hey folks, I just wanted to put this out there. Be wary, and exercise caution about ordering any further Sartin related products. I went to the TM web site yesterday and when I checked again today, the Sartin Group url has been removed. I think that Shanta was correct about those folks possibly folding up the tent by March or April of this year.

Regards,

Vinnie

[sq764]

Wonderful.. I finally find a piece of t-bred software that I find useful and legit and it may all go down the tubes..

Oh well.

[Binder]

I sure hope
this only means they just are going to stop selling programs
For me this is not an issue. I will just have to make sure to always have a backup copy of Val 2 or 3 (if I ever get my order)
My worry is' Is trackmaster going to stop making the PP files that Doc said were made just for Sartin clients?
I will be meeting Shanta on Sat. at the track
I know he's tight with some higher ups at Trackmaster
I will ask him if he can find out anymore info

[Vinnie]

Thanks a bunch for the post Binder and SQ!

I don't believe that this means that the folks at TM are going to stop supporting the program. But, I really don't know one way or the other to be honest with you. I hope not. <G>......

I will contact the folks at TM and see if I can get any info. from them.

Stand by Guys!

Vinnie

[Vinnie]

Hey Guys! I have some Very good news to report from the folks at TM. I received an email response from Craig Walker of TrackMaster earlier this evening. He stated "the exe files will still be provided as always". So, hopefully, the users of the Val series of programs should still be good to go for sometime to come. At least I am hoping so anyhow.

Vinnie

[shanta]

Vinnie has it right on the money. I just spoke with the president of trackmaster,David Siegel. He said that the .exe files will be available for the forseeable future and their is nothing to worry about. He told me to "rest easy"! hey Vinnie how have you been? i have been tied up here and have not written you. I am sorry and will change that. Richie

[Binder]

Thanks guys
for doing the leg work.
Long live Validator



:)

[Tom]

You do the Doc proud with your close finish in the Pic 4 contest.
Nice total you brought home.

[Binder]

Thank You Tom

That made me feel very good

I sure hope Doc can see my
efforts. I worked very hard to do the contest by following
Doc 's instructions
I was hard because I had to guess who would be the low price horses and would be hides
I hid those guys and bet the other top V/DC horses
I'm very proud that Val 2 gave me that one hugh hit. It held up
and got me 4th place

I remember what Doc said to me once
and I read it in the followup

"Its not how many races you win - Its how much money you make "

:)