Tiger Woods Today

[Dave Schwartz]

I was watching a few minutes of golf today and TW crossed my mind. Is it not simply amazing that his success has just evaporated so much?

http://www.horsestreet.com/BBSImages/TigerWoods.jpg

Those stats are really pitiful for a former great.

I understand that American fans can be pretty fickle but do so many people still hold negative feelings for this guy? Personally, I find myself rooting for him to make a comeback.

What are your thoughts?

Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[cj]

Tiger's biggest weapon was his mental toughness and feeling of being invincible. All that was shattered on that November evening a few years ago. Now nobody is intimidated by him, on the course or off.

[Greyfox]

Ben Hogan once said "Golf is 90 % mental."

Of course the way I play, you can declare me insane.
But cj is right.
Tiger keeps looking for the answer in swing changes.
It's the mind that needs fixing.

[PhantomOnTour]

Amazing that it was his ex wife who showed the rest of the PGA Tour how to not be intimidated by Tiger.
She stood up to him and now everyone stands up to him.

[Dave Schwartz]

Now nobody is intimidated by him, on the course or off.

Makes perfect sense.

[ElKabong]

wouldn't count the guy out....he keeps hanging around in these "non majors" lately, the type of tournaments that hold little interest to him now or in the past 12 yrs.....after the Masters & Open we'll have a better handle on how far he's come back

what's nice to see is how the younger pups can't wait to play him head up....i think he was surprised by that....he was used to his faux intimidation bullshit working

[cj]

wouldn't count the guy out....he keeps hanging around in these "non majors" lately, the type of tournaments that hold little interest to him now or in the past 12 yrs.....after the Masters & Open we'll have a better handle on how far he's come back

what's nice to see is how the younger pups can't wait to play him head up....i think he was surprised by that....he was used to his faux intimidation bullshit working

The younger pups are also just as good at hitting the ball, and many outdrive him...with a 3 wood.

[Valuist]

Ben Hogan once said "Golf is 90 % mental."



And the other 50% is physical.

[bigmack]

Match play can bring out a competitive fire in my game that I'd prefer not to be there. My best rounds have been when I was mentally 'quite' and played each hole, & each stroke individually. I've seen tons of hack players and pro's alike melt with an over-competitiveness in the nuanced game o' golfaroonie.

Woods' storke is not what it once was. Mental might be an issue but I don't think he has the physical flexibility he once had.

[rastajenk]

He's not putting like he did when he was on top. That's where the extra strokes are.

[Golf and Horses]

Maybe Tiger has finally found his stroke? Nice closing round 62 Sunday. How about that McIlroy kid? I wouldn't mind seeing Rory, Tiger, Phil, and Lee Westwood duking it out Sunday at the Masters.

[redshift1]

Maybe Tiger has finally found his stroke? Nice closing round 62 Sunday. How about that McIlroy kid? I wouldn't mind seeing Rory, Tiger, Phil, and Lee Westwood duking it out Sunday at the Masters.

No pressure on Woods in the last round. Makes a big difference.

[Golf and Horses]

No pressure on Woods in the last round. Makes a big difference.
That's very true, however, I believe Woods wants to feel the pressure again. Should he get back to old form we will be treated to some very good final rounds this year as I stated in my previous post.

[cj]

That's very true, however, I believe Woods wants to feel the pressure again. Should he get back to old form we will be treated to some very good final rounds this year as I stated in my previous post.

He has faced it a few times already this year and come up woefully short.

[DJofSD]

Gee whiz. Finishing T2 with a final round of 62 seems pretty good to me.

[cj]

Gee whiz. Finishing T2 with a final round of 62 seems pretty good to me.

Nobody is saying it wasn't a great round. However, shooting a 62 while starting early and not really contending is a lot different than doing it while in one of the final groups and battling for the win. It is certainly a good sign, but he has shot good rounds before in this "comeback".

[Canarsie]

Tiger's biggest weapon was his mental toughness and feeling of being invincible. All that was shattered on that November evening a few years ago. Now nobody is intimidated by him, on the course or off.

Especially the sportswriters and media who would have never asked him questions 5 years ago that they do today with no hesitation.

It's a completely different era toda. FDR was able to hide the fact he was in a wheelchair and Kennedy his affairs. With a minimum of one camera and video recorder in many's possession most times scruntiny is and will stay at an all time high. Tiger doesn't handle that well especially in the long term.

Also these young guns are in a different era as far as intimidation goes. They grew up in a youtube era and it hardly affects them. McElroy was shown on tv yesterday doing this. How many times has Tiger declined interviews even directly after a tournament he lost.

http://msn.foxsports.com/tennis/gallery/tennis-caroline-wozniacki-rory-mcilroy-maria-sharapova-roger-federer-andy-roddick-exhibition-030512#photo-title=Your%20turn,%20honey&photo=30756444

He doesn't mind the media attention that's a huge positive in any pro sport.

[DJofSD]

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/john-hawkins/counting-down-tigers-top-rounds/

[Golf and Horses]

He has faced it a few times already this year and come up woefully short.
Yes...he has come up short a few times. Phil stepped on him pretty good at Pebble on Sunday. Phil made every putt he looked at and Tiger missed a ridiculous amount of short putts...and who can forget his beat down at the hands of the great Robert Rock? All I'm saying is I hope he gets back to form for the simple reason that I would love to see some battles between him, Rory, Phil,et al. Especially at the majors. Let's see if that final round is the kickstart for him.

[delayjf]

The younger pups are also just as good at hitting the ball, and many outdrive him...with a 3 wood.

CJ, is the above true? I watched a little this weekend and saw him drive the ball 320 yards.

I always felt his big edge was his length - that edge no longer exists.

I also think the years he has spent swinging a club has caught up with him. The nagging injuries have changed his swing for the worst, limited his practice time which has affected his consistancy, which has affected his mental toughness.

[cj]

CJ, is the above true? I watched a little this weekend and saw him drive the ball 320 yards.

I always felt his big edge was his length - that edge no longer exists.

I also think the years he has spent swinging a club has caught up with him. The nagging injuries have changed his swing for the worst, limited his practice time which has affected his consistancy, which has affected his mental toughness.

There are plenty of guys that outhit him now. More importantly, they are the good players, not just a few bombers that aren't great golfers. He has gotten some of his length back lately, but still, it isn't the weapon for him that it was.

[Marshall Bennett]

There are plenty of guys that outhit him now. More importantly, they are the good players, not just a few bombers that aren't great golfers. He has gotten some of his length back lately, but still, it isn't the weapon for him that it was.
His long drives was really a small part of his success. It was much more what he did following his drives. He was lethal with his putter and it is that more than anything that has hurt him in the past few years.

[cj]

His long drives was really a small part of his success. It was much more what he did following his drives. He was lethal with his putter and it is that more than anything that has hurt him in the past few years.

They didn't change the layout of Augusta and add rough because Tiger was a great putter.

[Marshall Bennett]

They didn't change the layout of Augusta and add rough because Tiger was a great putter.
Ask any of the greats that went into a drought what the culprit was and most will say it was their putter.
Getting on the green on a par 5 in 2 is good, 3 putting makes you no better than the guy behind you. That's not rocket science.

[Golf and Horses]

They didn't change the layout of Augusta and add rough because Tiger was a great putter.


They didn't exactly change the layout...they moved some tee boxes and as you said added rough...the basic layout remained unchanged. They did that because Woods was bombing drives around doglegs and hitting into par 5's with short irons, however I gotta agree with Marshall...his putting has been his biggest obstacle...the latest swing change took awhile to get together, but once he starts putting well...it should be fun to watch all these guys go at it.

[cj]

Ask any of the greats that went into a drought what the culprit was and most will say it was their putter.
Getting on the green on a par 5 in 2 is good, 3 putting makes you no better than the guy behind you. That's not rocket science.

That is all true. It also doesn't have a thing to do with what I posted about Augusta. Tiger certainly had a big distance advantage over his competition.

[DJofSD]

There are plenty of guys that outhit him now. More importantly, they are the good players, not just a few bombers that aren't great golfers. He has gotten some of his length back lately, but still, it isn't the weapon for him that it was.
Tiger was ranked #1 in driving distance last weekend.

[TJDave]

Nobody is saying it wasn't a great round. However, shooting a 62 while starting early and not really contending is a lot different than doing it while in one of the final groups and battling for the win. It is certainly a good sign, but he has shot good rounds before in this "comeback".

I've never seen Tiger rally like that. He's the best at protecting a lead but this is uncommon behavior. If this were a horse race, as his trainer I couldn't wait to run him back. I say he's poised to win the Masters and if I can get a price I'll bet him.

[pktruckdriver]

"A lion will not cheat on his wife, but a Tiger Wood!"

[DJofSD]

Ya, ya, we've been all over that already. Sorry, but I'm not interested in that subject any more.

[cj]

...if I can get a price I'll bet him.

Highly doubtful. He'll be the favorite.

[Canarsie]

Highly doubtful. He'll be the favorite.

Big spread between the UK and Vegas. No surprise he's favored here.

http://www.oddschecker.com/golf/us-masters

http://www.vegasinsider.com/golf/odds/futures/

[Beachbabe]

Is anyone tired of the fawning adulation of Woods by the gallery; especially here at Doral. Sheesh, they climax every time he hits the ball, and if I hear "get in the hole !" one more time, even when he drives the ball, I think I'll scream.

[headhawg]

Is anyone tired of the fawning adulation of Woods by the gallery; especially here at Doral. Sheesh, they climax every time he hits the ball, and if I hear "get in the hole !" one more time, even when he drives the ball, I think I'll scream.The gallery is full of his ex-lovers...

[Golf and Horses]

Is anyone tired of the fawning adulation of Woods by the gallery; especially here at Doral. Sheesh, they climax every time he hits the ball, and if I hear "get in the hole !" one more time, even when he drives the ball, I think I'll scream.
"Get in the hole" and "You da man" are hardly exclusive to Woods followers... but I agree they are old and tiresome.

[Beachbabe]

Tiger withdraws after a few holes with some kind of injury or discomfort with his left foot or leg.

[Jay Trotter]

Did anyone catch the "OJ Simpson" type car chase as Tiger left the golf course. It seemed the injured Tiger was driving. Maybe his caddie had a 4 iron to his head -- it was hard to see.

I find it disgusting that they following him on the course when he is so far back from the leaders and then they actually have live video of him carting off to the clubhouse; and finally on to the highway!

Mean while, McIlroy is making a charge.......Go Rory!:jump:

[098poi]

I know the highway stuff was kind of dumb but I think they were just trying to get their money's worth out of the blimp.

[Beachbabe]

Tightness in his Achilles.

:( :sleeping: :liar:

[PhantomOnTour]

The man is suffering from nagging injuries which are common to steroid users...not the type of injury, but the fact that he can't seem to shake 'em.

IMO that man is histoire !
Done dada
Finito
Caput

No more majors.

[DJofSD]

Did anyone catch the "OJ Simpson" type car chase as Tiger left the golf course. It seemed the injured Tiger was driving. Maybe his caddie had a 4 iron to his head -- it was hard to see.


That was exactly the thought I had when I saw that extended video coverage from the blimp.

Tiger's old caddie but not his current one.

[Marshall Bennett]

The man is suffering from nagging injuries which are common to steroid users..
So you're basically tossing in half of all professional sports figures as well. Nagging injuries are as common as a runny nose.

[PhantomOnTour]

What % of pro athletes do you think use PEDs?

Do you think Tiger used them?
I do

[Jay Trotter]

What % of pro athletes do you think use PEDs?

Do you think Tiger used them?
I do
I never really gave it much thought but it's beginning to appear as very likely, especially in light of his "lack of morals" with regard to his marriage. It wouldn't be a large leap to PEDs!

I was a big Tiger fan but I'm finding myself more and more conflicted. I don't know if it's his "attitude" on the course which is fairly negative and apparent; or if it's the continued media fawning (which isn't his fault).

I enjoy a good sport story (e. the Lin basketball story) but continually highlighting someone who isn't performing really is a turn off. Jack was one of my guys growing up and I thought Tiger's chase to break his records was great and something I cheered for. Now, I'm beginning to think that Tiger isn't "Jack-worthy"!

[PhantomOnTour]

I have no proof that Tiger used roids.
Only the eye test, the injury bug, and the declining performance.

I'm like most people...i loved watching the guy, and i don't even like golf (haven't played a round in 20yrs).
He was golf's meal ticket for years; the game is more popular because of him.
The man just wasn't living right, in a number of ways, and it has caught up with him

[Marshall Bennett]

They're so many that don't live right, and who really is to judge? There's a whole lot about many we simply don't know about. I don't know, but I've always liked Tiger first as a golfer. He added a lot of excitement to what can be a dull sport for many. I truly believe the competition has caught up to Tiger more than his game declining. He's still very good.
I hope he wins the Masters, will dent a lot of folk's chins.

[DJofSD]

TW diagnosis: mild strain. Expected to return to play later this week.

[Greyfox]

If I didn't golf every time I had an ache or a pain somewhere, I'd never be golfing. So he quit with 6 holes to go and it's a mild sprain. That's a head-scratcher to me. :rolleyes:

[ten2oneormore]

There is little doubt in my mind Tiger used some kind of HGH,steroid or some super drug.His doctors also treated Marion Jones,Bill Romanowski, and Tim Montgomery.

[Marshall Bennett]

There is little doubt in my mind Tiger used some kind of HGH,steroid or some super drug.His doctors also treated Marion Jones,Bill Romanowski, and Tim Montgomery.
I've always found it tough to make accusations when there's not even a milligram of proof. Obviously you don't like him and need an excuse for his success. Your condition is common with many, I've always had my doubts about the Williams sisters in tennis.
I remember a few years back during an interview, Fred Couples was asked about drugs in relationship with golf. Can't quote him exactly, but basically he said he'd never in his years on the PGA heard of anyone using drugs. The mental conditioning required to compete simply won't allow it. Whether he was full of shit or not I don't know, but he made sense. Perhaps he wasn't even considering steroids, HGH, or whatever.
Tiger simply doesn't strike me as an abuser of drugs of any sort. I could be dead wrong, but without some form of proof to sway my opinion, I'll stand by that.

[ten2oneormore]

I like him.I root for him and feel like he got a raw deal for the whole cheating thing.I mean its wrong but there have been literally thousands of athletes/public figures who have done the same and received far less backlash.

I think you are being naive though with the whole no proof argument.His doctors patients are the whose who of the whole BALCO mess and other HGH/Steroid investigations.Meanwhile while under the care of these doctors he bulks up 20-30 lbs .Even Mr Balco himself Victor Conte said something along the lines of I wonder why his libido is so strong , could it be the same reason he gained all that muscle.

I agree that he doesn't strike me as a drug abuser but as with all the designer steroid people.They thought they were getting an edge and couldn't be caught because tests couldn't detect the drug.I'm sure they were given the whole no side effects,can't be detected ,miracle drug sales pitch that turned out to be a bunch of BS.Also he has been building his squeaky clean image from day 1, so that too could be a bunch of BS.Seeing someone in interviews and commercials hardly give an accurate representation of their true personality.

[Jay Trotter]

I like him.I root for him and feel like he got a raw deal for the whole cheating thing.I mean its wrong but there have been literally thousands of athletes/public figures who have done the same and received far less backlash.
Whoa cowboy....."he got a raw deal"! Yikes, there is "cheating" and then there is "cheating". He took it to a whole other level. If he's allowed to see his kids at all he probably got off light on that front.

[Red Knave]

If I didn't golf every time I had an ache or a pain somewhere, I'd never be golfing.
I'm going to guess that you're not 36 either.

I tell my golfing partners that I'm the same age as Tiger but I have an extra 26 years experience.

[ten2oneormore]

Whoa cowboy....."he got a raw deal"! Yikes, there is "cheating" and then there is "cheating". He took it to a whole other level. If he's allowed to see his kids at all he probably got off light on that front.




Top of my head

Michael Jordan
Kobe Bryant
Tony Parker
Shaquille Oneill
Magic Johnson
John F Kennedy
Bill Clinton
John Edwards
David Letterman


the list goes on forever.They are just the guys off the top of my head that are/were held in high regard as far as their reputations and most remain intact.

[DJofSD]

Tiger Woods ‏ @TigerWoods

Going to answer some questions tomorrow for #TW13launch. Use @EASPORTS_Tiger and I'll get to as many as I can.

While you never can be sure that it really is Tiger behind the keyboard, you can still have a little fun.

[Canarsie]

I've always found it tough to make accusations when there's not even a milligram of proof. Obviously you don't like him and need an excuse for his success.


I don't care for him but as you stated there is no proof just a very weak link to the doctor from Canada. He deserves the benefit of the doubt imo. With everything else that has come out a leak would have made the front page. Someone arrested for blackmail would have also been a possibility.

[Beachbabe]

Today, he's thrown his club twice that I saw. Once on the tee, after a bad drive, and on the 14th after a shot he didn't like....taking a chunk of fairway.

Class act !!!! :blush:

[Greyfox]

Today, he's thrown his club twice that I saw. Once on the tee, after a bad drive, and on the 14th after a shot he didn't like....taking a chunk of fairway.

Class act !!!! :blush:

A great role model for Junior Golfers eh?
I thought when he went through his speech of repentence last year that he promised a "softer" milder Tiger. (I didn't believe it at the time and as we can see a tiger can't change his stripes.)

[PhantomOnTour]

I have no proof that Tiger used roids.Only the eye test, the injury bug, and the declining performance.I'm like most people...i loved watching the guy, and i don't even like golf (haven't played a round in 20yrs).
He was golf's meal ticket for years; the game is more popular because of him.
The man just wasn't living right, in a number of ways, and it has caught up with him
Hate to bring this up again, but do you think the throwing of clubs and foul language are forms of roid rage?
I am fully convinced that the man dabbled in the stuff at the very least.

[DJofSD]

I'm not sure I saw a club being thrown. I saw clubs being dropped at the end of a swing out of frustration but actually tossing a club, did not see that.

[rastajenk]

I think that piece of sod on 14 was his divot.

Thank goodness he's not like all the other soulless faceless Bubba "Webb" Watleys out there right now.

[Jay Trotter]

There wasn't a real club toss.....rather a loose grip off a bad tee shot that slipped out of his hands -- that's not really an anger thing.

However, he did take a pretty good divot with a strike of anger on the other shot.

The intensity is a double edged sword, one part makes him "great" and one part makes him looks fairly "bad"! All in all though, if you don't have that intensity, whether you let it show or not, you probably aren't going to play at his level.

[cj]

There wasn't a real club toss.....rather a loose grip off a bad tee shot that slipped out of his hands -- that's not really an anger thing.

However, he did take a pretty good divot with a strike of anger on the other shot.

The intensity is a double edged sword, one part makes him "great" and one part makes him looks fairly "bad"! All in all though, if you don't have that intensity, whether you let it show or not, you probably aren't going to play at his level.

Come on! I've played golf for 20 years now and never once has the the club slipped out of my hands before, during, or after a swing. It is better than his routine dropping of the F bomb though.

[Jay Trotter]

Come on! I've played golf for 20 years now and never once has the the club slipped out of my hands before, during, or after a swing. It is better than his routine dropping of the F bomb though.
I've had the Driver come out my hands the odd time -- and not in anger. Sometimes when you make a poor swing you'll slide through with only one hand on the grip and it can get away on you if you're gripping loosely as you should.

Now that piece of shit "putter" I threw into the pine trees after yanking a 3 foot putt, that was for real. That was about 30 years ago though -- I've matured!

[DJofSD]

Wow.

[cj]

There is a newer thread.

[Track Phantom]

Interesting to see Tiger win yesterday. I run a Masters Pool and I have always liked fading Tiger because so many people jump on him. Now I'm concerned because he appears to be in good form and hungry for a major.

Does anyone think he will sh^t the bed in the Masters or is he likely to play well there again? I'm very much torn.

[Dave Schwartz]

I actually find myself rooting for Tiger. He's fallen so far and everyone deserves another chance. (Even the superstars.)

However, I don't think he goes from a small win like this to his previous Masters form in a week.

I'd have to lay against him unless I could get a very good price.

[DJofSD]

Tiger at Augusta? Like a hand in a glove.

[DJofSD]

I actually find myself rooting for Tiger. He's fallen so far and everyone deserves another chance. (Even the superstars.)

However, I don't think he goes from a small win like this to his previous Masters form in a week.

I'd have to lay against him unless I could get a very good price.
I would not call this win a small one. The pin placement on Sunday was a challenge.

Some one posted on Twitter, Tiger's the favorite at 4 to 1 to win -- where, I'm not sure if that's a betting line from LV or Ladbroke.

[judd]

the week before he withdrew because he said was an injury,, com-on
he quit cause he was 7 shots or more behind,- he looked fine this weekend didnt he ?

[DJofSD]

the week before he withdrew because he said was an injury,, com-on
he quit cause he was 7 shots or more behind,- he looked fine this weekend didnt he ?
Not sure what it means but check out the color of the shoes on Sunday. Tiger switched to white shoes at the turn during the tourney where he WD. I thought I heard one TV talking head he thought TW was walking gingerly. I did not see it.

I think Tiger is now older and a lot wiser -- at least as far as understanding he can not play through the pain any longer, and, it is not a wise thing to do. So, yes, he withdrew but not b/c he could not win but b/c he knew he had more to lose by making his achilles problem worse.

[judd]

Not sure what it means but check out the color of the shoes on Sunday. Tiger switched to white shoes at the turn during the tourney where he WD. I thought I heard one TV talking head he thought TW was walking gingerly. I did not see it.

I think Tiger is now older and a lot wiser -- at least as far as understanding he can not play through the pain any longer, and, it is not a wise thing to do. So, yes, he withdrew but not b/c he could not win but b/c he knew he had more to lose by making his achilles problem worse.

WHITE SHOES WITH BLACK PANTS

[Dave Schwartz]

Look out, Tiger! The fashion police are coming next!

:lol:

[Beachbabe]

WHITE SHOES WITH BLACK PANTS


It's his contribution to racial harmony.

[cj]

I actually find myself rooting for Tiger. He's fallen so far and everyone deserves another chance. (Even the superstars.)

However, I don't think he goes from a small win like this to his previous Masters form in a week.

I'd have to lay against him unless I could get a very good price.
I want to root for him, but the cursing and club kicking today is pathetic.

[Dave Schwartz]

More of that, huh?

[098poi]

I am rooting for Tiger but clearly the wheels have come off. I would be very pleased to see Sergio win. A lot of holes left though.

[cj]

More of that, huh?

In the short time I watched, I heard two very clear G.d Da..ts, and saw one club toss followed by a kick of the same club.

[swami13]

In the short time I watched, I heard two very clear G.d Da..ts, and saw one club toss followed by a kick of the same club.

There was another time when he was dying to say GD and he saw the camera was on him and he held off.

I watch a lot of the PGA Tour, and I noticed Tiger glancing real quick at the camera today three or four times, he never used to do that, he's turned into a head case.

Why he has to re-invent his swing every few years is beyond me, if he simplified to see the ball, hit the ball, he would be much better off.

I love the Couples, Dufner pairing tomorrow. Pulling for Lefty though.

[DJofSD]

Read "The Big Miss."

It's not the "big swing" causing Tiger problems, it's the flat stick.

[swami13]

Read "The Big Miss."

It's not the "big swing" causing Tiger problems, it's the flat stick.

your right, the putts I saw on 8 and 9 today my wife could have made,

maybe ;)

[Beachbabe]

your right, the putts I saw on 8 and 9 today my wife could have made,

maybe ;)



But you couldn't have.......right ?? ;)

[swami13]

But you couldn't have.......right ?? ;)

hole 8, maybe

hole 9, woulda been a gimme :cool:

[cj]

Read "The Big Miss."

It's not the "big swing" causing Tiger problems, it's the flat stick.

The big swing looked pretty shaky today too.

[Dave Schwartz]

In the short time I watched, I heard two very clear G.d Da..ts, and saw one club toss followed by a kick of the same club.

As sad as it is, this may be a reminder to all of us that it is very easy to be "gentlemanly" when life is going well for us and a might more difficult to maintain when life is handing us lemons non-stop.

TW is not a hero of mine. I actually don't have ANY of those - we humans are just not up to that task.

After watching him suffer through all of this (albeit from a distance) I just wish he'd pull his life together.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz

[thaskalos]

As sad as it is, this may be a reminder to all of us that it is very easy to be "gentlemanly" when life is going well for us and a might more difficult to maintain when life is handing us lemons non-stop.

TW is not a hero of mine. I actually don't have ANY of those - we humans are just not up to that task.

After watching him suffer through all of this (albeit from a distance) I just wish he'd pull his life together.


Regards,
Dave Schwartz
I don't know if Tiger's case is a suitable example of a "life handing us lemons non-stop".

Some people have suffered greatly through no fault of their own...

[Dave Schwartz]

LOL - Tiger certainly planted some of those same lemon trees.

[098poi]

I'm watching "Morning Drive" on the Golf Channel and Holly Sonders could be my "Master", WOW!

[DJofSD]

This season Holly has been Martin Hall's foil. I like her more in this new role.

[Greyfox]

I've been associated the last few years with Junior Golfers.
Naturally, like any young athletes they have role models.
Tiger is certainly a "star" to many of them.
Unfortunately, as a Role Model he is giving implicit permission to young people to hack the course after a poor swing, to curse at errant shots, to scowl, and to in general, give a mask-like stone appearance in competition.
He does not seem to enjoy playing golf.
He does not seem to respect the game's traditions of camaraderie and good fellowship.
In short, the last few years he's been an extremely poor Role Model for young people to emulate, and that's from a man who has set up a Foundation for the development of youth.

I cannot pull for this man to win. (Besides, as I've said elsewhere, I think his problems are between the ears - not the swing.)

[Jay Trotter]

I've been associated the last few years with Junior Golfers.
Naturally, like any young athletes they have role models.
Tiger is certainly a "star" to many of them.
Unfortunately, as a Role Model he is giving implicit permission to young people to hack the course after a poor swing, to curse at errant shots, to scowl, and to in general, give a mask-like stone appearance in competition.
He does not seem to enjoy playing golf.
He does not seem to respect the game's traditions of camaraderie and good fellowship.
In short, the last few years he's been an extremely poor Role Model for young people to emulate, and that's from a man who has set up a Foundation for the development of youth.

I cannot pull for this man to win. (Besides, as I've said elsewhere, I think his problems are between the ears - not the swing.)
Have to agree with you here! His disposition is very poor of late.

[mountainman]

One of the analysts on golf channel made an interesting observation last night. The guy's opinion was that Tiger has a long HISTORY of choking-or at least playing poorly- when forced to play catchup. He thinks Woods needs the reassurance of looking at a leader board and seeing his name on top.

In my opinion, Tiger's problems are more technical than mental. I think he's battled barely submerged swing demons for a long , long time, and they-along with his peculiar obsession with rebuilding his swing- just finally consumed him.

[Dave Schwartz]

In short, the last few years he's been an extremely poor Role Model for young people to emulate, and that's from a man who has set up a Foundation for the development of youth.

Foxie,

I can totally agree with that.

I guess I am HOPING he can improve himself; to get back to his potential as a real role model.

[DJofSD]

One lesson Tiger can teach regardless: winners never quit and quitters never win.

[mountainman]

One lesson Tiger can teach regardless: winners never quit and quitters never win.

But hasn't his perseverance even come into question? Not only because he withdrew from two(?) tournaments when well behind, but because there were comments from fellow players of him tanking once or twice last year when victory was out of reach.

[Striker]

In the short time I watched, I heard two very clear G.d Da..ts, and saw one club toss followed by a kick of the same club.
He is not only embarassing himself but also the game of golf with this crap.

[headhawg]

I guess I am HOPING he can improve himself; to get back to his potential as a real role model.He never was nor never will be a role model. These behaviors aren't really new; they were just ignored because he was once a helluva golfer. I pray that Jack's record remains. I cannot root for this tool under any circumstances.

[Greyfox]

He never was nor never will be a role model. These behaviors aren't really new; they were just ignored because he was once a helluva golfer. I pray that Jack's record remains. I cannot root for this tool under any circumstances.

He's not a role model to you.
But ask young people how they think about him.
Fortunately Ricky Fowler and Rory McIlroy are capturing the attention of Junior golfers more and more. But between 2 to 8 years ago all the teens wanted to play like Tiger.
If you mean that he's never been a "good" role model with respect to behavior, I agree. He's been pouting and scowling for years. Nevertheless, he has been a role model.

[headhawg]

If you mean that he's never been a "good" role model with respect to behavior, I agree. He's been pouting and scowling for years. Nevertheless, he has been a role model.I guess you just have a weird definition of role model. Being a role model includes all behaviors not just playing golf.

[Greyfox]

Tiger's former swing coach Butch Harmon has recently commented to the Wall Street Journal about the changes in his ex- student's swing. As reported by The Golf Channel, he said:

• Woods, Harmon thinks, has “lost his nerve putting. I think his nerves are bad, and he's lost his confidence.”

• Woods needs less instruction, not more. “He's Tiger Woods, for God's sake.”

• Woods “looks like he's playing 'golf-swing' and not golf. In my opinion, he's very robotic.”

More at link: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303425504577355913365616018.html

[Greyfox]

I guess you just have a weird definition of role model. Being a role model includes all behaviors not just playing golf.

Your definition of role model is really weird.
Get a dictionary and check it out.
Role models can be either "good" or "bad."
They are still role models.

[elysiantraveller]

Or is he? Today was certainly a blast from the past. I personally hope he is as golf, to me, is more enjoyable/exciting when he is playing well. Opinions?

[cj]

Or is he? Today was certainly a blast from the past. I personally hope he is as golf, to me, is more enjoyable/exciting when he is playing well. Opinions?

Since he seems to be the only story in golf, I guess it is better when he actually plays well.

[Greyfox]

He won it on #16 making a shot that he likely couldn't make in 49 more tries.
Help arrived when Sabattini felt a little bit of the tight collar down the stretch.
Nevertheless, Tiger put on a brilliant show.

[Jay Trotter]

He's obviously not done and I think he will easily eclipse Sam Sneads all-time tour wins record of 82 (Woods now has 73); but he is likely less than 50% to catch Jack's majors total of 18 (Woods has 14). I personally think Nicklaus is a more deserving champion.

I'm torn on whether or not I want him back on top. I'm ready for the "Next One" to arrive and I'm tired of the media's preoccupation with Tiger, specifically when he isn't in the mix.

[JustRalph]

He plays Muirfield very well. He has won Jack's tournament several times.

Believe it or not I used to be a member of the Dublin Ohio Police Deartment and worked the tournament a few years. My gig was the 9th hole.

It was a good time, usually. The off duty jobs working parties at the homes around the course were very lucrative and you got to hang out with many a famous golf pro. This was before Tiger was playing. Never got to meet him.

Btw, he looked a little thin to me. But he looked like he was much more comfortable. That could be bad news for the others.

[redshift1]

Go back about about 12 months, Rory McIlroy was being touted as the greatest golfer ever and Woods was ready for The Nationwide Tour.

June 14th-17th, U.S. Open.



.

[Marshall Bennett]

The PGA needs a Tiger that plays well. It's been somewhat boring of late.
Whether ya like him or not, he makes the game interesting.

[elysiantraveller]

I agree CJ.

The preoccupation when he is bad is annoying but none of these youngers have really shown any ability to be consistent. I would have no problem with Rory becoming "the guy" and everyone taking stabs at beating him but we really haven't seen that. Phil is always going to be "the other guy."

Good Tiger is still better than all of these so I just kinda hope he gets good again.

[DJofSD]

The PGA needs a Tiger that plays well. It's been somewhat boring of late.
Whether ya like him or not, he makes the game interesting.
Somewhat boring?

No offense but you come off as some one that does not play and is only interested when Tiger is in the mix.

I enjoy good golf, and, some of the personalities make it more interesting. Yes, it is more fun when Tiger wins but during his absence it has been fun to watch the Zack's, Rory's, Rickies', DJ's and even the Jason's. If anything it has shown us what an exceptional athlete Tiger really is.

[Canarsie]

Somewhat boring?

No offense but you come off as some one that does not play and is only interested when Tiger is in the mix.

I enjoy good golf, and, some of the personalities make it more interesting. Yes, it is more fun when Tiger wins but during his absence it has been fun to watch the Zack's, Rory's, Rickies', DJ's and even the Jason's. If anything it has shown us what an exceptional athlete Tiger really is.

I'm no fan of Tiger but the ratings meter goes through the roof when he's in contention or when he wins. Like it or not he is the game of golf.

As you stated I also like the other personalities but that makes both of us in the extreme minority.

[Marshall Bennett]

Somewhat boring?

No offense but you come off as some one that does not play and is only interested when Tiger is in the mix.

I both play (quite often) and watch whether Tiger plays or not.
Yes, compared to play with Tiger, I've found it a bit boring. Perhaps I like many have been spoiled to the excitement he brings.

[DJofSD]

I both play (quite often) and watch whether Tiger plays or not.
Yes, compared to play with Tiger, I've found it a bit boring. Perhaps I like many have been spoiled to the excitement he brings.
Great! so I guess in the spirit of Harvey Penick, you are my friend.

Some times what they select to show on TV is on the boring side. Just to keep in interesting I wish they'd be able to show some of the other players when they're in trouble. It's not that I relish in their difficulties, I just find it fun to see what they're looking at, how they go about deciding what to do and then seeing if they can pull it off. It doesn't have to be a hero's shot but something more than just chipping or pitching into the fairway.

[cj]

Great! so I guess in the spirit of Harvey Penick, you are my friend.

Some times what they select to show on TV is on the boring side. Just to keep in interesting I wish they'd be able to show some of the other players when they're in trouble. It's not that I relish in their difficulties, I just find it fun to see what they're looking at, how they go about deciding what to do and then seeing if they can pull it off. It doesn't have to be a hero's shot but something more than just chipping or pitching into the fairway.

I love golf too, play a lot when I can, but with all the NFL like parity it can get boring. People want to see superstars, not 50 guys where any can win on any given week. None of the young guys have stepped up consistently or the Tiger mania would have slowed considerably.

[DJofSD]

CJ, I understand.

Who'll be the 1st 3x winner this year?

[DJofSD]

PGA tour, Memorial Shots of the Week (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxMuASfZ2ew&feature=youtu.be) -- 5 players highlighted and just the last one is TW.

[Marshall Bennett]

I don't think it's only Tiger either. Couples was in the hunt at Augusta and they followed him intensely. Same was true with Watson a couple years back when he nearly won a major. Obviously Tiger with all his success is going to draw attention.
Yeah, I'd say without any of these guys the tour gets boring. The competition is intense these days. There are some really good golfers, any of which can win that I don't even really know much about.

[DJofSD]

BTW, TW's niece has debuted today as a pro. Shot a 75.

Talk about your expectations. What do you think she's up against? If it is like Arney's grand kid, it's a lot.

[horses4courses]

I'm no huge fan of Tiger, but watching him in the first two rounds of the 2012 US Open, he has showed me he still has enough game to win more majors.
It may not be this one, but it will happen..... :ThmbUp:

[Beachbabe]

Tiger was so "magnanimous" with his praise during the day two news conference after his round. When asked what he thought of amateur Beau Hoestler, at 17 yrs old, taking the lead at -2 for a short time; instead of praising the kid, etc., he said, "Well, it's early; there's still a lot of golf to play."

What an a-hole !!! :mad: :ThmbDown:

[newtothegame]

Tiger was so "magnanimous" with his praise during the day two news conference after his round. When asked what he thought of amateur Beau Hoestler, at 17 yrs old, taking the lead at -2 for a short time; instead of praising the kid, etc., he said, "Well, it's early; there's still a lot of golf to play."

What an a-hole !!! :mad: :ThmbDown:
Sorry Beach, I have to disagree. I think he gave an honest assessment of his opinion. Would it have been better if he went out there and said this kid would be the next great phenom?
Maybe he could of sounded a bit more tactful, I don't know as i didn't hear the interview. But I just don't see a lot wrong with what he said...And, he's right, there is a lot of golf left and for an amatuer...well he will be lucky to be in sight of a leaderboard come Sunday with the pressure.

[098poi]

I happen to catch that and Tiger said there was still a lot of golf to play and then said something about how he had done the same thing when he was young. He really could easily have heaped praise on the young man and said how exciting the game of golf is when something like this happens but he didn't. I think he missed a great opportunity to boost his image as a person and a player. It did come off as kind of shallow. I am still rooting for Tiger but someone needs to knock him in the head once in a while.

[Beachbabe]

Sorry Beach, I have to disagree. I think he gave an honest assessment of his opinion. Would it have been better if he went out there and said this kid would be the next great phenom?
Maybe he could of sounded a bit more tactful, I don't know as i didn't hear the interview. But I just don't see a lot wrong with what he said...And, he's right, there is a lot of golf left and for an amatuer...well he will be lucky to be in sight of a leaderboard come Sunday with the pressure.

You're right; he gave an honest assessment of his opinion.......and his opinion is, "it's all about me."
Look, he didn't have to fawn over the kid or praise him as the next phenom, but jeeze, it was a feel-good story. Everybody was rooting for Hoestler (not that they thought he could/would win the tourney). Woods could have levelled some praise on the rookie.
It would warm the cockles of my heart if Woods goes out & shoots an 80 tomorrow.

[Beachbabe]

Edited to add two more a-holes in the world of golf:

Sergio Garcia who smashed a microphone with his club after an errant drive.....and David Feherty who thought that was no big deal & then proceeded to excuse Woods' comments on the amateur (Hossler) and playing with Phil & Bubba (comment which I didn't hear). Feherty said that why should Tiger give a "rat's behind" about either of those two things. All he wants to do is win a tournament.
Granted...winning the tourney is of upmost importance ....but isn't there something to congeniality; good sportsmanship; a little humility ?

[newtothegame]

You're right; he gave an honest assessment of his opinion.......and his opinion is, "it's all about me."
Look, he didn't have to fawn over the kid or praise him as the next phenom, but jeeze, it was a feel-good story. Everybody was rooting for Hoestler (not that they thought he could/would win the tourney). Woods could have levelled some praise on the rookie.
It would warm the cockles of my heart if Woods goes out & shoots an 80 tomorrow.
Babe, I agree that maybe he could of said something different. I just have never liked reporters, who as soon as you step off of a tough stage (in this case a very demanding gold course in the U.S open) to start asking questions. Sure they are super stars and should be more polite I guess. But, woods gave his honest assessment, which was not at all critical of the young man, and he catches grief for it?
I would bet if you ask woods how he feels about his own game, he would probably say there's a lot of golf left to play.....

[DJofSD]

TW gave an honest opinion. I expect if he was talking to Beau alone the statement would be the same. Tiger is not this kids mom.

On the other hand, when Tiger was asked about Furek, he kind of had to scramble a little bit and what he said was good enough.

[Greyfox]

Tiger will likely win this weekend.
But there is nothing gracious about him and it is no surprise that he didn't offer high praise to the kid (eventhough his Foundation supports kids) or anyone else.
I noted that he still spits at the side of the green and can be pouty.
He'll never hold a candle to Jack when it comes to class.

[mountainman]

Let's turn things the OTHER way and try to imagine how tiresome it must get for other players-especially when they've just done something noteworthy in their OWN right- to be bombarded with questions abt tiger.
Big tiger fan here, but he should reciprocate with patient, congenial responses when asked about other players. He owes his peers that much.

[Dave Schwartz]

I would offer that to see it from TW's perspective one must consider 2 years of horrible play (by his former standard) and the pressure put on him as a result.

As for the lack of humility, etc. --- He also has had to endure almost every tournament that has contained commentary about how badly he has played or, at the least, how he was never a factor. IOW, the media beats him up whenever he leaves his game in the locker room (again).

I am certainly not exonerating the guy. He has been a jerk for a long time. I am simply saying that in the same situation, many of us might act in a similar fashion (even though we would hope/expect that to not be the case).


Dave

[Canarsie]

Let's turn things the OTHER way and try to imagine how tiresome it must get for other players-especially when they've just done something noteworthy in their OWN right- to be bombarded with questions abt tiger.
Big tiger fan here, but he should reciprocate with patient, congenial responses when asked about other players. He owes his peers that much.

I'm not a Tiger fan but don't think its such a big deal even though he should. This is the way he was brought up he's certainly not changing now its not in his MO.

As far as the other golfers my hunch is that they are thrilled he's doing well. It brings in more casual fans to watch which equates to higher purses and just as important endorsements. If one was to beat Tiger in a playoff he would probably pick up five new sponsors at bare minimum.

[newtothegame]

I would offer that to see it from TW's perspective one must consider 2 years of horrible play (by his former standard) and the pressure put on him as a result.

As for the lack of humility, etc. --- He also has had to endure almost every tournament that has contained commentary about how badly he has played or, at the least, how he was never a factor. IOW, the media beats him up whenever he leaves his game in the locker room (again).

I am certainly not exonerating the guy. He has been a jerk for a long time. I am simply saying that in the same situation, many of us might act in a similar fashion (even though we would hope/expect that to not be the case).


Dave
I agree completely Dave,
The scutiny placed on this guy has been unreal over the last few years. From the messy relatrionship, the women, the gold club incident outside his Florida home, to his mental capability in Golf. He finally seems to be putting it together again and somehow he is held to a higher standard then what the average response would be from most people? As I mentioned earlier, I don't think he said anything wrong. Yes, he could of handled it differently but, that would be to place higher expectations on him then the average person and I am just not willing to do that.
These guys are out there on what may be the toughest course they will face all year long. The mental aspect and focus needed would and has humbled many very good golfers.
After coming off the course, have a mic stuck in your face, and asked about a high school kid that Tiger most likely isnt even aware of......???
I just see a no win for Tiger in his response.......
Where are all the other interviews, of the golfers, that were asked about this young kids game? Was Furyk asked about him? How about any of the other leaders? Were they asked.....?
Sometimes that media spotlight can be very bright and that in itself can be very daunting.
Anyway, I do agree it could of been handled differently by Tiger. I am just not willing to hold him to a higher standard then I would anyone else.

[Dave Schwartz]

Anyway, I do agree it could of been handled differently by Tiger. I am just not willing to hold him to a higher standard then I would anyone else.

I agree with you agreeing. <G>

The only thing I would say is that I have no problem to him being held to a higher standard. After all he is TIGER WOODS.

But I would not hold him to a higher standard that I might not be able to live up to myself.

[Greyfox]

Anyway, I do agree it could of been handled differently by Tiger. I am just not willing to hold him to a higher standard then I would anyone else.

Yes. Tiger is human and human's are prone to make mistakes.

That said Tiger was marketed for hundreds of millions of dollars $$$$$$$ as a PARAGON OF VIRTUE.
He would not have been given those advertising endorsements without attached high expectations 1. as a player 2. as a person.
He failed himself, his family, the public and the sponsors.
The criticisms were harsh and deservedly so considering that he was being sold to the public as something that he was not.
In view of the monies that he has earned, he had to be held to a higher standard than anyone else.
While he still sits down to crap like the rest of us, he is NOT just another regular guy who mucked up.

[ArlJim78]

I agree with Greyfox, tiger lacks class. not in terms of holding him to a higher standard either, simply comparing him to other golfers.

[delayjf]

done the same thing when he was young

So Tiger was leading in a PGA event when he was 17 - that's new to me. Anyone know when and where?

[Greyfox]

Sunday Tiger looked beaten right from the "get go."
He arrived 15 or 20 minutes late for his practice time, something he never does.
His body posture on the first few holes did not exude the normal self-confidence that he shows.
Being 5 strokes off the pace at the start of Sunday's round, maybe he knew that Saturday's play put him out of it.
At any rate, to my eyes. he looked beaten before he arrived at the first tee.

[GaryG]

The final round was a lot more enjoyable to watch with TW already in the toilet. The focus was on the tournament and not just on him. Tiger is lurking ....he is charging... :lol:

[DJofSD]

Prior to the tournament, it was reported that Tiger had asked Sean to not be on course or at the practice areas prior to play.

At some point during play it was confirmed -- it might have been during the GC's "Live at the US Open" or "Golf Central." As I recall the confirmation was after a conversation with Sean where he said this move was a good thing and he, Sean, was not offended by it. It was just another confirmation the reps were there and Tiger was confident.

I wonder if Tiger will rethink this strategy.

Also, I think Johnny was spot on in his observations about Tiger's lack of distance control and inability to adjust to changes to the conditions of the greens.

[Greyfox]

Also, I think Johnny was spot on in his observations about Tiger's lack of distance control and inability to adjust to changes to the conditions of the greens.

Johnny Miller saved the day from what would have been an utter bore to watch as they never had Simpson on their cameras until close to the end.
Miller knows that course as well as he knows the back of his hand.
He frequently predicted what was going to happen in different situations and was "spot on" virtually every time.
He's one of the best announcers in the game, even if it is at the expense of his popularity with players. He's a pretty honest guy and calls it the way he sees it.

[kingfin66]

There was one shot on Saturday that stands out with regard to Johnny's ability to analyze. A golfer, I don't remember which one, had a side-hill shot with the ball well above his feet. He was standing far away from the ball. Johnny pointed out that he was too far away from the ball to effectively make that shot, and that if anything, he should move much closer to the ball. He suggested that the result was not going to be good. Sure enough, the golfer totally chunked it (about 15 yards) and was still in the rough.

[DJofSD]

There was one shot on Saturday that stands out with regard to Johnny's ability to analyze. A golfer, I don't remember which one, had a side-hill shot with the ball well above his feet. He was standing far away from the ball. Johnny pointed out that he was too far away from the ball to effectively make that shot, and that if anything, he should move much closer to the ball. He suggested that the result was not going to be good. Sure enough, the golfer totally chunked it (about 15 yards) and was still in the rough.That was a member of the club, and, I saw that too.

He was in the rough with a hybrid. Unfortunately, between the ball being well above his feet and his flat swing with a longer club, he got very little ball and hooked it into the rough on the other side. And to make it worse, he repeated the mistake.

[Greyfox]

That was a member of the club, and, I saw that too.

.

The only member of the club that I remember was Mike Allen, the Senior.
I didn't see the shot, but it was probably him.
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/golf/pga/players/Michael+Allen/1274/scorecard/2012/24

[DJofSD]

Yes, it was him, about 1 hour 10 minutes into Saturday's broadcast.

I made one mistake about what happened. He did flub the shot but not to the opposite rough. He advanced the ball but still in the same right side rough.

[Bettowin]

So Tiger was leading in a PGA event when he was 17 - that's new to me. Anyone know when and where?


He didn't make a cut until he was 19 (7 tournaments prior to being 19) so if he led it was because he birdied and early hole and nobody else had started or something to that effect.

[rastajenk]

The final round was a lot more enjoyable to watch with TW already in the toilet. The focus was on the tournament and not just on him. Tiger is lurking ....he is charging... :lol:I thought it was an absolute snoozer on Sunday. I swept the back porch, hoed the garden, and was still looking for something to do to occupy time until the last groups were on the final holes. And by then the winner was chillin' in the house.

A late run by Woods would have been welcome relief. Of course, the way he crashed on Saturday, his run would have been over by about 7:00. So it still would have been a snoozer.

[Jay Trotter]

I thought it was an absolute snoozer on Sunday. I swept the back porch, hoed the garden, and was still looking for something to do to occupy time until the last groups were on the final holes. And by then the winner was chillin' in the house.

A late run by Woods would have been welcome relief. Of course, the way he crashed on Saturday, his run would have been over by about 7:00. So it still would have been a snoozer.I don't know about this......if you had actually sat down and watched the whole thing, shot for shot, it was very entertaining. The course itself was probably the star of the day. I thoroughly enjoyed the entire tournament.

I would equate it to World Series baseball. I am not a baseball fan in any way, shape or form; but I can tune in to the World Series where every pitch and play is bursting with drama and one little mistake can cost the game. It's a heightened sense of importance with each play that takes it to another level. That's the way the U.S. Open plays out.

[rastajenk]

I hear ya. But I didn't feel it this year.

[PhantomOnTour]

IMO the golf on Sunday was putrid.
My kingdom for a fairway or green in regulation!

These guys were all over the place....Furyk threw the title away

[DJofSD]

IMO the golf on Sunday was putrid.
My kingdom for a fairway or green in regulation!

These guys were all over the place....Furyk threw the title away
Were you aware of the nature of the course before watching?

[rastajenk]

I was, and I'm with POT on this one. I watched a lot of Th-Fri-Sat action; I wanted to get into an exciting Sunday finish. I like watching good players struggle with difficult courses that can produce unexpected results. By Sunday, though, the results were thoroughly predictably....bad. It was tedious.

In the 2002 Kentucky Derby, War Emblem led Perfect Drift and Proud Citizen all the way around, and nothing else did anything to alter the outcome. Few can claim it was an exciting Derby. All big events can throw a clunker sometimes...in my humble yet peerless opinion :p , this Open was one.

[Greyfox]

I thought it was an absolute snoozer on Sunday. I swept the back porch, hoed the garden, and was still looking for something to do to occupy time until the last groups were on the final holes. And by then the winner was chillin' in the house.

A late run by Woods would have been welcome relief. Of course, the way he crashed on Saturday, his run would have been over by about 7:00. So it still would have been a snoozer.

To a point I agree with you.
As I said above Johnny Miller saved the show from being a disaster.
One of the problems that put a damper on the experience for me was the time frame.
It was Father's Day.
Our evening was warm and sunny a good time to barbeque.
With the family over, I did not want to spend the evening watching golf.
I would have enjoyed it more had the whole presentation ended 2 hours earlier.

[DJofSD]

What, no DVR?

Geeze, the golf world seems to be divided about west coast tournaments. Some really liked being able to watch real time in prime time. Then others complain about it running late, needing to go to work the next morning, and now, don't interfer with my family BBQ. Really?

[Canarsie]

To a point I agree with you.
As I said above Johnny Miller saved the show from being a disaster.
One of the problems that put a damper on the experience for me was the time frame.
It was Father's Day.
Our evening was warm and sunny a good time to barbeque.
With the family over, I did not want to spend the evening watching golf.
I would have enjoyed it more had the whole presentation ended 2 hours earlier.


Ratings were exceptional my hunch is they would love for it to be on the west coast every year. Having said that I agree 100% that being with family is far more important.

U.S. Open Prime Time TV Ratings on NBC Rise 29% as Simpson Wins

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2012/06/18/bloomberg_articlesM5TMK01A74E901-M5TNJ.DTL

[Jay Trotter]

I was, and I'm with POT on this one. I watched a lot of Th-Fri-Sat action; I wanted to get into an exciting Sunday finish. I like watching good players struggle with difficult courses that can produce unexpected results. By Sunday, though, the results were thoroughly predictably....bad. It was tedious.

In the 2002 Kentucky Derby, War Emblem led Perfect Drift and Proud Citizen all the way around, and nothing else did anything to alter the outcome. Few can claim it was an exciting Derby. All big events can throw a clunker sometimes...in my humble yet peerless opinion :p , this Open was one.
Actually, some "good" players did step up and post outstanding efforts including Webb Simpson's 68, Michael Thompson's 67, and amateur Jordon Speith's 70. Unfortunately, these players weren't the big name players we expected to light it up. The fact that Furyk, McDowell, etc. blew up shouldn't take away from the ones who withstood the pressure.

Part of the problem might be the way the media focuses their coverage leading up to the final putt. A good example would be the fine coverage Beau Hossler received with a host of neat storylines while Jordon Speith was all but ignored. For the most part the same thing happened to Webb Simpson. He was ignored to a great extent and somehow emerged on top when the dust settled.

The TV coverage needs to make each player's story part of the telecast -- give us a reason to root for them. Often they treat the non-Tiger Woods, non-Phil Michelson's as if they're the Washington Generals or the guy in Pro Wrestling who always loses. If we knew the backstories and the battles some of these guys endured just to get to the tournament we might look at their efforts a bit differently.

That's my take but if someone indicates they were "not entertained" sufficiently, then who is anyone else to say they are wrong!

[Greyfox]

What, no DVR?

Geeze, the golf world seems to be divided about west coast tournaments. Some really liked being able to watch real time in prime time. Then others complain about it running late, needing to go to work the next morning, and now, don't interfer with my family BBQ. Really?

Of course I used the DVR to watch the end of it.
But some of my family watched the end and I had to ask them not to tell me the outcome.
I played it back later that evening as it would be impossible to avoid the radio/tv/newspaper reporting of it.
Would you like to watch the DVR for the Kentucky Derby or watch it live?
Don't tell me that it doesn't matter. To me it does.

[delayjf]

my hunch is they would love for it to be on the west coast every year.

If I was the golf god it would be at Pebble beach every year, The British Open would be a St Andrews every year, and they could play the PGA at a different location every year.

[PhantomOnTour]

Were you aware of the nature of the course before watching?
Yes...why can't guys hit the fairway off the tee?

[Greyfox]

Yes...why can't guys hit the fairway off the tee?

Those fairways are quite a bit narrower than what 95% of us are used to.
To get an idea hold your hand out at arms length and close the two middle fingers.
The space remaining between the forefinger and little finger will give you an idea of the width of an average fairway as it tapers away in 3 dimension.
Then hold your hand out again, this time closing your ring finger and the little finger.
Looking between the forefinger and the long finger will give you an idea as to the sight that the pros are facing.
Of course at the U.S. open 1 foot off the fairway and you're in deep rough.

[PhantomOnTour]

Those fairways are quite a bit narrower than what 95% of us are used to.
To get an idea hold your hand out at arms length and close the two middle fingers.
The space remaining between the forefinger and little finger will give you an idea of the width of an average fairway as it tapers away in 3 dimension.
Then hold your hand out again, this time closing your ring finger and the little finger.
Looking between the forefinger and the long finger will give you an idea as to the sight that the pros are facing.
Of course at the U.S. open 1 foot off the fairway and you're in deep rough.
I know the rough in the US Open is deep...there's no first cut.
All the reason more to make sure you hit the fairway and these guys couldn't do it.
I chalk it up to nothing more than pressure.
The best golfers in the world can hit it straight and land in the fairway, unless they have to ask their knees to please not knock.

[Greyfox]

I know the rough in the US Open is deep...there's no first cut.
All the reason more to make sure you hit the fairway and these guys couldn't do it.
I chalk it up to nothing more than pressure.
The best golfers in the world can hit it straight and land in the fairway, unless they have to ask their knees to please not knock.

Oh. Don't get me wrong. I thought Furyk....probably "choked."
Having said that most pros do not hit straight shots on drives.
They say it's one of the hardest things to do.

[PhantomOnTour]

"Hitting it straight" was not the best term i could have used.
What i meant is...the best golfers in the world should be able to hit the fairway...by draw, fade or whatever.
This tourney seemed like it was won only because someone had to win it.
IMO it just wasn't good golf.

[DJofSD]

First, the fairways are narrow to begin with, and, they become even narrower where a ball typically would land at about 270 yards from the tee box.

Next, none of those fairways are level. The course is built on the side of a sand dune. The end result is a course that not only is canted but there's a bend or out and out dogleg. The insult on top of injury is the slope of the fairway is away from the bend making it even harder to keep the ball in play -- dogleg right will have a slope from high side on the right to low on the left.

So you might have been disappointed the fairways hit was low. But remember, where the ball first lands is not how that stat is measured, it is where the ball stops. And on that course, sure, the ball might hit the fairway but quiet often it rolls into the rough.

[DJofSD]

"Hitting it straight" was not the best term i could have used.
What i meant is...the best golfers in the world should be able to hit the fairway...by draw, fade or whatever.
This tourney seemed like it was won only because someone had to win it.
IMO it just wasn't good golf.
Well, there's good golf and then there's exciting golf.

Sounds like you wanted the latter.

[melman]

DJ--I liked this year's setup just fine. The best players on a very tough course. However in review take a look at the final numbers. Holes 1 thrue 6 is where "the course" did all it's damage. I believe the field was a combined 1,200 OVER PAR for those holes. I think the USGA went overboard on the set up of those holes. The Masters remains my favorite. When great players hit great shots they can get rewarded with birdies or an eagle. I can see it both ways and enjoy it both ways. But I also think it would be more interesting for the casual viewer to see some below par scores.

[DJofSD]

TW T1 w/ Van Pelt thru 12 at Congo.

Could be thrilling.

[DJofSD]

TW wins #74. 1st in 2012 w/ 3 wins.

[Greyfox]

At hole #16 Van Pelt had him and came short in the grass with his second shot.
Then he buggered up a chip out and gave Tiger a chance to stay alive.
When a lot of these guys smell Tiger breath, they choke.
I'm sure Tiger knows that.

[horses4courses]

When a lot of these guys smell Tiger breath, they choke.


Must be something he ate........ :rolleyes:

[cj]

TW wins #74. 1st in 2012 w/ 3 wins.

Good for him, but we all know nobody will consider Tiger "back" until he wins a major. He has said so himself.

[mountainman]

I suspect the Greenbriar made tiger an offer he couldn't refuse. And if so, it's probably good business. I'm sure the return in public interest alone-not to mention prestige and revenue-are more than worth whatever they shelled out.

[DJofSD]

TW, starting on the back nine, double bogey on hole 17. Puts him +1.

Lots of golf yet to be played.

[redshift1]

Not a constant fan of women's golf but fun to watch how the 16 year-old Thompson fares against the international contingent. Rare to see an american in contention but Thompson is near the top very early in the Women's Open.

[letswastemoney]

I suspect the Greenbriar made tiger an offer he couldn't refuse. And if so, it's probably good business. I'm sure the return in public interest alone-not to mention prestige and revenue-are more than worth whatever they shelled out.
It's 2 weeks before the British Open. Tiger always plays 2 weeks before a major. I doubt there was any type of offer.

[mountainman]

It's 2 weeks before the British Open. Tiger always plays 2 weeks before a major. I doubt there was any type of offer.

Think they just sat back and hoped he'd notice them? Somehow, I doubt it.

[Greyfox]

Not a constant fan of women's golf but fun to watch how the 16 year-old Thompson fares against the international contingent. Rare to see an american in contention but Thompson is near the top very early in the Women's Open.

The average golfer can probably learn more from the ladies tour than the mens.

[rastajenk]

Woods and Sam Snead apparently had a good working friendship since Tiger was a kid, so his appearance at Greenbriar is acknowledgement of that. I also believe it's part of the long redemption process, making himself more available. Plus, Sam is next on the list of immortals for Woods to pass on the all-time wins list.

There may have been some other incentives, but so what? It's an old style course that can give up some birdies; I think it will become a pretty popular stop on the tour fairly quickly.

[mountainman]

Woods and Sam Snead apparently had a good working friendship since Tiger was a kid, so his appearance at Greenbriar is acknowledgement of that. I also believe it's part of the long redemption process, making himself more available. Plus, Sam is next on the list of immortals for Woods to pass on the all-time wins list.

There may have been some other incentives, but so what? It's an old style course that can give up some birdies; I think it will become a pretty popular stop on the tour fairly quickly.

Sill suspect they paid him a hefty appearance fee. But then, I always look at things through rose colored glasses. Call me a romantic.

[Canarsie]

Well, there’s been chatter that the event pays guys like Tiger and Phil appearance fees, which has not been denied or confirmed, but is implied in CBSSports.com’s Steve Elling’s report.

http://www.weiunderpar.com/post/tiger-woods-goes-all-commitment-happy-adds-greenbrier-to-schedule

[mountainman]

Well, there’s been chatter that the event pays guys like Tiger and Phil appearance fees, which has not been denied or confirmed, but is implied in CBSSports.com’s Steve Elling’s report.

http://www.weiunderpar.com/post/tiger-woods-goes-all-commitment-happy-adds-greenbrier-to-schedule

My guess is tiger 150-250k..phil 100 -150

[DJofSD]

Big oops -- pulled an Ian Poulter mistake but in reverse. Ian dropped the ball on his marker which was on the green, moving it.

At one point, it looked like a penalty on the 11th hole might cost Mickelson a spot on the weekend. When he went to mark his ball on the green, he dropped his ball marker on the ball, causing it to move.

Mickelson moved his ball back to its original position, but the result was a one-stroke penalty.

The rule Mickelson violated was Rule 20-1/15, which says any accidental movement of the ball or the ball-marker which occurs before or after this specific act, such as dropping the ball or ball-marker, regardless of the height from which it was dropped, is not considered to be directly attributable and would result in the player incurring a penalty stroke.

Very likely going to miss yet another cut. Full story here. (http://tourreport.pgatour.com/2012/07/06/mickelson-likely-to-miss-cut-again/)

[rastajenk]

My guess is tiger 150-250k..phil 100 -150Whatever it may have been, it looks like they're going to get only two days' worth of celebritiness. Not the ROI they were shooting for, one can assume. :p

[Canarsie]

My guess is tiger 150-250k..phil 100 -150

I like you so please sit down before you read this. :eek:

http://www.cbssports.com/golf/blog/eye-on-golf/19516902/mickelson-has-another-short-week-at-greenbrier-as-lengthy-skid-continues

[letswastemoney]

Think they just sat back and hoped he'd notice them? Somehow, I doubt it.
Yes, I do. The pattern for Tiger is to play 2 weeks before a major, then take the week before major off. It has nothing to do with money.

Tiger needs to prep for the British Open. Why wouldn't he play in these events without being paid? He's not going to get any better practicing at home.

[Greyfox]

In the Ladies golf Lexi Thompson has been all over the county with her score going up and down like a yoyo. Yet she's still in contention. An unbelievable round.

[Beachbabe]

Tiger misses the cut, unless he aces the last hole

[bigmack]

Another serial adulterer gets encouragement from drone like fans while his kids suffer from yet another shattered marriage as a result of infidelity.

GO TIGER.

[mountainman]

Yes, I do. The pattern for Tiger is to play 2 weeks before a major, then take the week before major off. It has nothing to do with money.

Tiger needs to prep for the British Open. Why wouldn't he play in these events without being paid? He's not going to get any better practicing at home.
C'mon. The tourney doesn't even DENY that they paid tiger and phil.

[mountainman]

I like you so please sit down before you read this. :eek:

http://www.cbssports.com/golf/blog/eye-on-golf/19516902/mickelson-has-another-short-week-at-greenbrier-as-lengthy-skid-continues

tx for validating my cynicism. not at all surprised.

[redshift1]

In the Ladies golf Lexi Thompson has been all over the county with her score going up and down like a yoyo. Yet she's still in contention. An unbelievable round.


Same thing today 3 birdies so far and 1 double bogie.