Cuomo and NY racing

[OTM Al]

Knew from the beginning he would be no friend of racing in NY. His plan marches on. The comments are astounding. Evidently there is a lack of oversight in gaming of all types in NY, despite the fact that it all has gov't oversight committees. And apparently VLTs have been propping up the racing industry...even though they just started after a 10 year delay caused by.....wait for it....New York State.

http://www.newsday.com/opinion/regulate-gambling-properly-in-new-york-state-1.3500251

The conspiracy theorists are claiming that he's sold out to Genting who will in turn help finance his 2016 presidential run. For once I think I agree with them...broken clocks are right twice a day you know.

[Tom]

The rotten nut falls not far from the corrupt Tree.
He is a Cuomo.
Heaven forbid NYS try oversight on, uh, the STATE GOVERNMENT!
What a cesspool - and this is just another turd floating by.

[mannyberrios]

Wow!

[JustRalph]

I have many in laws in NY and never understood their fascination with living in NY.

Al, Tom........get out now!! :lol:

[Tom]

It's my 58th favorite state, Ralph!

[Indulto]

Knew from the beginning he would be no friend of racing in NY. His plan marches on. The comments are astounding. Evidently there is a lack of oversight in gaming of all types in NY, despite the fact that it all has gov't oversight committees. And apparently VLTs have been propping up the racing industry...even though they just started after a 10 year delay caused by.....wait for it....New York State.

http://www.newsday.com/opinion/regulate-gambling-properly-in-new-york-state-1.3500251

The conspiracy theorists are claiming that he's sold out to Genting who will in turn help finance his 2016 presidential run. For once I think I agree with them...broken clocks are right twice a day you know.There is a difference in being no friend of NYRA and no friend of New York racing.

How can you be certain New York racing wouldn't be better off if AQU went away. How does one economically justify rwo racetracks less than 10 miles apart? I haven't been to AQU since True Knight beat Forego in the Suburban, but from what I keep reading here, the experience of attending there is approaching that of a NYCOTB parlor.

Cuomo has to juggle the needs of more than just horseplayers and horse owners. Would you rather his predecessor stayed in office?

[alhattab]

There is a difference in being no friend of NYRA and no friend of New York racing.

How can you be certain New York racing wouldn't be better off if AQU went away. How does one economically justify rwo racetracks less than 10 miles apart? I haven't been to AQU since True Knight beat Forego in the Suburban, but from what I keep reading here, the experience of attending there is approaching that of a NYCOTB parlor.

Cuomo has to juggle the needs of more than just horseplayers and horse owners. Would you rather his predecessor stayed in office?

Taken purely at face value, his comments toward the end make complete sense to me. Why shouldn't they be asking the question over the value of the industry vis-a-vis the degree of subisidy? You always have to wonder if you can take at face value, but I'd like to understand better what is so offsensive about the words he said. Nobody wants to see NY racing go away I get that, but there's nothing wrong with laying the numbers on the table and having a reasoned, fact-based discussion on the topic.

[pandy]

I don't know much about Andrew Cuomo but his father made a show of it like he cared for racing but was anti racing, anti sports (lost the Jets and Giants under his watch), anti business and pro taxes. Mario Cuomo was one of the most ineffective elected officials in the history of this country. His method of governing was so simplistic that it rendered him incompetent. His strategy was always the same, we have to raise taxes. Tens of millions in revenue left the state under his watch.

[JustRalph]

Tens of millions in revenue left the state under his watch.

and it's happening again under his son.

[mannyberrios]

I don't know much about Andrew Cuomo but his father made a show of it like he cared for racing but was anti racing, anti sports (lost the Jets and Giants under his watch), anti business and pro taxes. Mario Cuomo was one of the most ineffective elected officials in the history of this country. His method of governing was so simplistic that it rendered him incompetent. His strategy was always the same, we have to raise taxes. Tens of millions in revenue left the state under his watch.
How true, how true

[pandy]

Actually when you add up the revenue lost from the Jets/Giants crossing the river and extrapolate it over the years, plus all of the other businesses that fled the state under Mario's watch, it probably cost the state of New York hundreds of millions.

[Indulto]

Taken purely at face value, his comments toward the end make complete sense to me. Why shouldn't they be asking the question over the value of the industry vis-a-vis the degree of subisidy? You always have to wonder if you can take at face value, but I'd like to understand better what is so offsensive about the words he said. Nobody wants to see NY racing go away I get that, but there's nothing wrong with laying the numbers on the table and having a reasoned, fact-based discussion on the topic.Hopefully, the NY politicians will actually do that, but the sins-of-the-father attitude in this thread is probably ingrained in the legislature there as well.

[Dave Schwartz]

It's my 58th favorite state, Ralph!

Tom, I wonder how many people got this.

[FenceBored]

Tom, I wonder how many people got this.

Elvis Costello's segment in Americathon, right?

[OTM Al]

Taken purely at face value, his comments toward the end make complete sense to me. Why shouldn't they be asking the question over the value of the industry vis-a-vis the degree of subisidy? You always have to wonder if you can take at face value, but I'd like to understand better what is so offsensive about the words he said. Nobody wants to see NY racing go away I get that, but there's nothing wrong with laying the numbers on the table and having a reasoned, fact-based discussion on the topic.


If you take what politician say at face value, then I feel sorry for you. That stuff is usually cover for what they really mean and what is really meant here is the Cuomo administration is doing everything it can to renege on previous agreements the State itself made. This subsidy hasn't even been in place for 2 months and they want to redo the agreement. This isn't about education or whatever else they are claiming. It's about a money grab.

[JustRalph]

If you take what politician say at face value, then I feel sorry for you. That stuff is usually cover for what they really mean and what is really meant here is the Cuomo administration is doing everything it can to renege on previous agreements the State itself made. This subsidy hasn't even been in place for 2 months and they want to redo the agreement. This isn't about education or whatever else they are claiming. It's about a money grab.

Exactly right, from my seat in left field.

I rarely comment on NY racing issues because we have some certified up close and personal accounts from people on the front lines. I can bitch about field sizes and the usual bullshit at the tracks if I want etc. But if you can't see that what Al is saying is dead on, you better be checking your crooked politician meter in for service.

[OTM Al]

The real joke of the statement (or one of many really) is Gov. Cuomo says that we have gambiling in NY State. You might say that's right, but isn't true according to the law. According to the law, gambling is illegal. Horse racing has an exemption as it does in many jurisdictions, so just consider that a different beast. The VLTs are considered, and are in fact, lotteries. Lotteries are not considered gambling. Ponder on that with great confusion, but that is the way it is. VLTs and electronic table games are not real slots (like in Vegas) or real table games with cards, dice etc. In my book this makes them an even bigger rip off than the ones in Vegas, but that's a different argument.

[alhattab]

If you take what politician say at face value, then I feel sorry for you. That stuff is usually cover for what they really mean and what is really meant here is the Cuomo administration is doing everything it can to renege on previous agreements the State itself made. This subsidy hasn't even been in place for 2 months and they want to redo the agreement. This isn't about education or whatever else they are claiming. It's about a money grab.

I hear you. The shame of it is that you can never take these guys at their word despite the fact they are supposed to be serving us. To me the question of subsidizing horse racing to the presumed detriment of other social programs or state pet projects was inevitable. I can't believe it has taken this long in NY (the slots funds diversion has been going on for years at the harness tracks) or elsewhere (i.e., PA and especially Delaware). I'm not arguing for another use of the funds. I'm just asking for a reasoned discussion over the options. I share your skepticsm over how those funds would be used and the money probably would be used to serve the purpose of many government programs, particularly those associated with the left, which is to increase government power. We've already had the question answered in NJ, and racing lost. Racing lost despite some seemingly persuasive economic analyses done about the benefits the racing industry brings the state that have been discussed elsewhere in this forum. It is frustrating that the argument is never fact-based. I've never seen an analysis for NY (or any other state for that matter) that supported why the quantitative and qualitative (i.e., quality of life, open space, etc) returns on investment for each dollar of subsidy money provided racing should be preferred over other potential uses for those funds. Prisons and livestock/vegetable farms provide jobs and open space, too. Money going to education could reduce class sizes, hire better teachers, etc. Why should racing get the money? At least they tried to explain why in NJ. They still lost (although I believe the money went to fund the AC redevelopment authority). What are the NY horsemen doing to prove their cause is worthy?

[aaron]

The real joke of the statement (or one of many really) is Gov. Cuomo says that we have gambiling in NY State. You might say that's right, but isn't true according to the law. According to the law, gambling is illegal. Horse racing has an exemption as it does in many jurisdictions, so just consider that a different beast. The VLTs are considered, and are in fact, lotteries. Lotteries are not considered gambling. Ponder on that with great confusion, but that is the way it is. VLTs and electronic table games are not real slots (like in Vegas) or real table games with cards, dice etc. In my book this makes them an even bigger rip off than the ones in Vegas, but that's a different argument.
I agree with everything you have stated. Anyone who expects the NY politicians to do the right thing will be greatly disappointed in time. It took them 10 years to get slots at Aqueduct and in that time they turned down Steve Wynn and had MGM withdraw because of their ineptitude. If you are going to have gambling legalize it and do it right.
At this point,the long range outcome will be how badly will they screw racing.

[alhattab]

Looks like another state governor has finally woken up. Maybe Cuomo, Christie and Corbett conspired to end this stupid charade. I don't know how the PA budget process works. Let's see what the legislature does...

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/67349/pa-horsemen-blast-plan-to-raid-slots-fund?source=rss

[thespaah]

I don't know much about Andrew Cuomo but his father made a show of it like he cared for racing but was anti racing, anti sports (lost the Jets and Giants under his watch), anti business and pro taxes. Mario Cuomo was one of the most ineffective elected officials in the history of this country. His method of governing was so simplistic that it rendered him incompetent. His strategy was always the same, we have to raise taxes. Tens of millions in revenue left the state under his watch.
Yet those dunderheads elected Cuomo 4 times.
One thing Cuomo was good at was growing the NY welfare state. He guaranteed himself the heavily democrat downstate vote.
Cuomo literally chased longtime businesses out of NY with confiscatory taxation.
Now, NY State wants to study casinos on non-Indian lands.
This should have been done 30 years ago when those grand resorts in the Catskills began to crumble.
I used to see billboards all over the place that said "Casinos mean jobs"...Nobody listened.
I think casinos in NY could work if there is a gaming commission with the legal authority as strong as that in Nevada.