BetFair: Trying to boost online horse-race betting

[gm10]

Not only does BetFair let racing fans bet against one another, it allows them to bet in ways they can't with traditional wagering.

"You can keep betting in the middle of a race," says Stephen Burn, head of BetFair's San Francisco office. Betting can continue until the results are posted, so "if there's a photo finish, you can keep betting until a result is announced."



http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/11/30/NSRN1M49PB.DTL#ixzz1fUjLMci0

[andymays]

Betfair UK red-faced after scam

Postby Andymays » Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:55 am
http://www.smh.com.au/business/world-bu ... 1l1h9.html

Excerpt:

CYBER criminals stole the payment card details of almost 2.3 million Betfair customers only months before the betting exchange's controversial £1.39 billion ($A2.22 billion) float.

The company was forced to inform the UK Serious Organised Crime Agency, the Australian Federal Police and German law enforcement authorities, as well as international regulators and Royal Bank of Scotland - the lender responsible for accepting credit and debit card payments made via Betfair.

However, the betting exchange did not inform its 3 million-plus registered customers. Neither did it provide any details of the crime in the prospectus for last October's £13-a-share listing, raising questions over the adequacy of its disclosures.

[andymays]

Charging 10% is way too high.

Burn was interviewed on the Roger Stein show today and did a fairly good job.

The archived show is up right now.

http://www.rogerstein.com/radio/archive2.asp

[gm10]

Charging 10% is way too high.

Burn was interviewed on the Roger Stein show today and did a fairly good job.

The archived show is up right now.

http://www.rogerstein.com/radio/archive2.asp

isn't 10% way better than what you're getting now?

[andymays]

isn't 10% way better than what you're getting now?

What about liquidity? Why are any big bettors going to go for that number or even 6% or 7% for that matter when they could team up with someone in Canada or wherever and get 2%-5%? Remember it's we will only be able to wager on California Races I believe.

I support exchange wagering but it should be priced around 6% or 7% to have any shot at players. I would play at that rate. I don't bet much anymore but if I got back to betting a lot I would go around the law for the better rate than 6% or 7%.

[gm10]

What about liquidity? Why are any big bettors going to go for that number or even 6% or 7% for that matter when they could team up with someone in Canada or wherever and get 2%-5%? Remember it's we will only be able to wager on California Races I believe.

I support exchange wagering but it should be priced around 6% or 7% to have any shot at players. I would play at that rate. I don't bet much anymore but if I got back to betting a lot I would go around the law for the better rate than 6% or 7%.

Can you bet during the race in Canada? I didn't know that was possible.

The 10% is high compared to the rest of the world, but I'm guessing that this is because race track management and legislators are being greedy.

[andymays]

Can you bet during the race in Canada? I didn't know that was possible.

The 10% is high compared to the rest of the world, but I'm guessing that this is because race track management and legislators are being greedy.

It's a new thing so I understand that things might have to be different in California but it always seems like when anyone does anything over here the players get screwed first and foremost.

[gm10]

It's a new thing so I understand that things might have to be different in California but it always seems like when anyone does anything over here the players get screwed first and foremost.

Isn't it still better than to NOT have it? 10% isn't that bad.

[andymays]

Isn't it still better than to NOT have it? 10% isn't that bad.

It's controversial over here and most people don't support it right now. I want it to happen so all I can do is fight for them to lower the commission and see what happens. In the end I think it will happen but there might be more than one company doing it.

[gm10]

It's controversial over here and most people don't support it right now. I want it to happen so all I can do is fight for them to lower the commission and see what happens. In the end I think it will happen but there might be more than one company doing it.

That's the funny thing that I don't get about America. The free market is supposed to be good for everything (even healthcare) but when it comes to betting they really take the communist approach. Very centralized, heavily regulated, pre-fixed margins, no real competition.

[Robert Goren]

Can you bet during the race in Canada? I didn't know that was possible.

The 10% is high compared to the rest of the world, but I'm guessing that this is because race track management and legislators are being greedy.Take one look at how the takeout in American race track pools is divided and you will be guessing again about who is being greedy.

[andymays]

That's the funny thing that I don't get about America. The free market is supposed to be good for everything (even healthcare) but when it comes to betting they really take the communist approach. Very centralized, heavily regulated, pre-fixed margins, no real competition.

It's a mess out here.

[Mike_412]

Thanks for the links guys. I'm going to listen to that interview now. I hope for all California players that it gets up and running in May and is a success. It was signed into law in Jersey last January and still nothing over here which shouldn't surprise me. Probably has something to do with who's actually running the Meadowlands and Monmouth. Who knows.

While 10% is better than what we have now, I'd hope that you can qualify for a lower rate depending on one's volume.

[andymays]

Thanks for the links guys. I'm going to listen to that interview now. I hope for all California players that it gets up and running in May and is a success. It was signed into law in Jersey last January and still nothing over here which shouldn't surprise me. Probably has something to do with who's actually running the Meadowlands and Monmouth. Who knows.

While 10% is better than what we have now, I'd hope that you can qualify for a lower rate depending on one's volume.

He indicated that there would probably be some form of rebates.

[takeout]

[snip]
There is also a movement afoot to introduce exchange wagering in the United States to increase handle. That is peer-to-peer wagering and allows for betting on horses to lose. One problem I have with exchange wagering is this is akin to legal Wall Street insider trading.
[snip]
http://www.lvrj.com/sports/tracks-wagerers-realize-benefits-of-lower-takeout-134891648.html

Comment: I have that same problem and predict that it will be crooked as a snake as soon as it is implemented.

[HUSKER55]

I was wondering, if everyone were to use offsite betting parlors that eliminate the track, how would the tracks and horsemen get their money to operate

[Robert Goren]

I was wondering, if everyone were to use offsite betting parlors that eliminate the track, how would the tracks and horsemen get their money to operateThe same place as they do now, the slot machines

[Seabiscuit@AR]

The horsemen could do what 99.9% of bettors do - go and get a real job. Training horses should be as much a hobby activity as betting on them

[johnhannibalsmith]

The horsemen could do what 99.9% of bettors do - go and get a real job. Training horses should be as much a hobby activity as betting on them

Yeah, friggin slackers... getting up at 4am and doing physical work all morning, then back to work in the afternoons, seven days a week, 365 days a year...

Lottsa good jobs out there that allow you time like that to pursue your hobby... I think you got this one pegged.

[Robert Fischer]

[snip]
There is also a movement afoot to introduce exchange wagering in the United States to increase handle. That is peer-to-peer wagering and allows for betting on horses to lose. One problem I have with exchange wagering is this is akin to legal Wall Street insider trading.
[snip]
http://www.lvrj.com/sports/tracks-wagerers-realize-benefits-of-lower-takeout-134891648.html

Comment: I have that same problem and predict that it will be crooked as a snake as soon as it is implemented.

Are these concerns related to the bet-against(lay) aspect ?

[takeout]

It seems like it would be way too easy for insiders to screw with – either way or both ways.

[Robert Goren]

This would be paradise for a horse-doping trainer. Just withhold the dope and lay the bets on every third or fourth horse's races . It would be like stealing candy from a baby.

[Canarsie]

I really don't see how they are going to implement in race wagering here. Most feeds are on different delays heck even TVG shows races that aren't live and doesn't show a "disclaimer" more often than not.

My ADW feed is on more of a delay than the ESPN horse racing video site by at least 5-10 seconds. :bang:

All a sharpie would have to do is employ a person at the track with a good set of binoculars and the ability to see how the race is playing out. Even if it's two seconds when a horse "checks" the odds are it's going to lose and you can lay better odds.

When I spoke to Burn he said that's what they have in the United Kingdom that's probably what he's talking about. Over there you have the ability to watch any track you want on a sub channel of Betfair. No communications company here offers that yet.

[gm10]

This would be paradise for a horse-doping trainer. Just withhold the dope and lay the bets on every third or fourth horse's races . It would be like stealing candy from a baby.

American trainers have been doing this for years. Usually at small venues like Mountaineer, but I've seen larceny Aqueduct as well when someone was making money out of it on Betfair.

There is absolutely no way of stopping them right now, either. At least when it's run in California, Betfair can work with the racing authorities like they do in Britain.

[FenceBored]

American trainers have been doing this for years. Usually at small venues like Mountaineer, but I've seen larceny Aqueduct as well when someone was making money out of it on Betfair.

There is absolutely no way of stopping them right now, either. At least when it's run in California, Betfair can work with the racing authorities like they do in Britain.

The California authorities are too busy micromanaging the relationships between non-California corporations and people those corporations' don't employ to pay attention to overseeing the actual racing product.

[Native Texan III]

I really don't see how they are going to implement in race wagering here. Most feeds are on different delays heck even TVG shows races that aren't live and doesn't show a "disclaimer" more often than not.

My ADW feed is on more of a delay than the ESPN horse racing video site by at least 5-10 seconds. :bang:

All a sharpie would have to do is employ a person at the track with a good set of binoculars and the ability to see how the race is playing out. Even if it's two seconds when a horse "checks" the odds are it's going to lose and you can lay better odds.

When I spoke to Burn he said that's what they have in the United Kingdom that's probably what he's talking about. Over there you have the ability to watch any track you want on a sub channel of Betfair. No communications company here offers that yet.

In UK, the actual tracks supply a room at the track with a "live" picture for a few hundred people to bet against those with slow feeds - a conspiracy to defraud. Betfair also have an extra tax of 60% that larger winners have to pay or they are banned. Only long term losers will pay 10% on their occasional wins.

As folks here are brainwashed to back winners, where is the lay money coming from if IR or normal betting is limited to one State, that is unless they want to invite the Mafia back in to smooth things out?

[andymays]

TVG Betfair to Demonstrate Exchange-Bet Model | BloodHorse.com
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/66473/tvg-betfair-to-demonstrate-exchange-bet-model

Excerpt:

A test model of the first exchange wagering system proposed for the United States will be demonstrated at the University of Arizona Symposium on Racing & Gaming in Tucson beginning Dec. 6.

The system, developed by TVG Betfair, is a “first stage application,” the company said Dec. 5. The racing network TVG is based in California and owned by Great Britain-based Betfair, which operates the largest exchange wagering platform in the world.

With exchange wagering, two or more individuals place directly opposing wagers on the outcome of various sporting events. Given the federal ban on sports betting in the U.S., with the exception of four states, most exchange wagering would occur on horse races.

[Robert Fischer]

or they just play the pick 6/4/3/db w/out said fav