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View Full Version : I thought the point of all weather track was to you know, run on through all weather


toussaud
11-20-2011, 06:34 PM
about to cancel at hollywood park.

meanwhile, golden gate with similar conditions going strong

:cool:

outofthebox
11-20-2011, 06:37 PM
maybe it's the old drainage excuse..this sucks

davew
11-20-2011, 06:40 PM
wow, listening to conso pay-outs and refunds on DD, P3, P4, P6
and place pick all - gonna be some upset betters

outofthebox
11-20-2011, 06:42 PM
wow, listening to conso pay-outs and refunds on DD, P3, P4, P6
and place pick all - gonna be some upset bettersand some happy people that maybe missed in the first two legs of the pick 6.

PICSIX
11-20-2011, 06:44 PM
and some happy people that maybe missed in the first two legs of the pick 6.

I get a do-over!!!! :jump: :jump: :jump: :lol: :lol: :lol:

andymays
11-20-2011, 06:44 PM
I know it's probably the same old spot at about where the 7 furlong race would start. I believe it's the part where the water runs off the backstretch??????

andymays
11-20-2011, 06:48 PM
The Jocks were split on the decision. Hollywood to date was ahead of last year in handle as well. Oh well.

statepierback
11-20-2011, 06:49 PM
Good day to dig up some trash. Today its worth something for those lucky enough to know where to look. Better than burning those trash cans. :cool:

outofthebox
11-20-2011, 06:50 PM
I know it's probably the same old spot at about where the 7 furlong race would start. I believe it's the part where the water runs off the backstretch??????I'm not sure about that. The remaining races would not start from the chute. But who knows. Haven't been there in years. I remember the old backside swimming pool once drained on to the main track at the half mile pole, and they put all the races on the grass that day..

andymays
11-20-2011, 06:51 PM
I'm not sure about that. The remaining races would not start from the chute. But who knows. Haven't been there in years. I remember the old backside swimming pool once drained on to the main track at the half mile pole, and they put all the races on the grass that day..

The info I got is from a very reliable source.

outofthebox
11-20-2011, 07:00 PM
The info I got is from a very reliable source.Trust you on that.

andymays
11-20-2011, 07:07 PM
Trust you on that.

It's the Richard Shapiro synthetic mandate Curse. Hollywood Park is also the historic site of the keying of Jerry Jam's car.

Richard Shapiro keying Jerry Jamgotchian's car - YouTube

I think there are about 10 parts to this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6CtHcx0jys

Seabiscuit@AR
11-20-2011, 11:24 PM
From what I have seen of All Weather tracks outside the USA they are excellent when it comes to running in bad weather. This is their major strength. If they have to cancel meetings at Hollywood Park it would have to a problem specific to the Hollywood Park track rather than the all weather surface itself

dansan
11-20-2011, 11:44 PM
Ive seen that track with a ft of water in the past they never cancel before poly

BlueShoe
11-21-2011, 09:05 AM
wow, listening to conso pay-outs and refunds on DD, P3, P4, P6
and place pick all - gonna be some upset betters
There sure were at Los Al. Did not hear even one sympathetic comment agreeing with the cancelation. An amusing aspect of the scrub was that after everyone settled in they were bored. There was one race left from Hawthorne, and then just the last three from Golden Gate. None of the night harness or quarters had started yet. Down to one track and waiting half an hour between wagers not something that simulcast patrons are accustomed to. Many left, but for we diehards that liked something in the 9th at GG and stuck around, time seemed to drag. How did we ever manage back in the day before simulcasting and we went to the track and could only play that track? :D

toussaud
11-21-2011, 10:39 AM
yesterday was a day in stooper infamy at hollywood park lol

cj
11-21-2011, 10:59 AM
There was a pretty blatant screwing of the horseplayers at Hollywood yesterday as well that has nothing to do with the canceled races.

CincyHorseplayer
11-21-2011, 02:20 PM
I love when it rains about 4 inches in 24 hours and they call the track "Fast".Like it's impervious to precipitation.Funny stuff.Heady stuff.Magic dirt:rolleyes:

Midnight Cruiser
11-21-2011, 05:13 PM
what was that cj?

andymays
11-21-2011, 05:15 PM
what was that cj?

A first time gelding was announced minutes before the race went off and it won at a huge price. The race was a spread race for most and in a spread race where you're using a bunch of horses a lot of people throw in first time geldings.

If a first time gelding is not announced at least 30 minutes prior to the first race of the day then that gelding should be scratched. The $1000 fine doesn't protect the bettors.


I'm pretty sure that's what he was referring to.

Midnight Cruiser
11-21-2011, 05:23 PM
Es Luna? Only reason it paid under 100 is because Toby T had it listed on his sheets as working well...

andymays
11-21-2011, 06:40 PM
Es Luna? Only reason it paid under 100 is because Toby T had it listed on his sheets as working well...

That's the one. Working well after being gelded is a pretty good clue. Most experienced handicappers would have used it with others in the race based on that information.

Tom
11-21-2011, 09:20 PM
Hollywood is a joke of a track.

A first time gelding was announced minutes before the race went off and it won at a huge price.

andymays
11-21-2011, 09:23 PM
Hollywood is a joke of a track.

That's not Hollywood Parks fault it's the fault of the CHRB.

Tom
11-21-2011, 09:38 PM
The CHRB wipes their noses?
The track has a responsibility.

cj
11-21-2011, 10:35 PM
A first time gelding was announced minutes before the race went off and it won at a huge price. The race was a spread race for most and in a spread race where you're using a bunch of horses a lot of people throw in first time geldings.

If a first time gelding is not announced at least 30 minutes prior to the first race of the day then that gelding should be scratched. The $1000 fine doesn't protect the bettors.


I'm pretty sure that's what he was referring to.
Exactly. I'm sure the connections scored out for much more than the lousy grand fine.

andymays
11-22-2011, 09:53 AM
The CHRB wipes their noses?
The track has a responsibility.

It's not up to the track. They have to follow the CHRB rules. I just found out that they're going to address the issue once again because of this incident. It is a perfect example of not protecting the bettors. Does anyone know how the first time gelding thing is handled in other jurisdictions?

toussaud
11-22-2011, 09:59 AM
A first time gelding was announced minutes before the race went off and it won at a huge price. The race was a spread race for most and in a spread race where you're using a bunch of horses a lot of people throw in first time geldings.

If a first time gelding is not announced at least 30 minutes prior to the first race of the day then that gelding should be scratched. The $1000 fine doesn't protect the bettors.


I'm pretty sure that's what he was referring to. wow that's messed up.

cj
11-22-2011, 11:08 AM
It's not up to the track. They have to follow the CHRB rules. I just found out that they're going to address the issue once again because of this incident. It is a perfect example of not protecting the bettors. Does anyone know how the first time gelding thing is handled in other jurisdictions?

You are telling me the stewards couldn't have scratched the horse? I find that hard to believe.

andymays
11-22-2011, 11:14 AM
You are telling me the stewards couldn't have scratched the horse? I find that hard to believe.

The rule right now is the rule they have to follow. Apparently the only consequence is the fine. I don't believe there was even a fine until this year but I could be wrong.

It could also be the case that the Trainer did report it but someone in the Racing Office neglected to notify the public in a timely manner.

I doubt that most other jurisdictions even have a fine but I'd like to know if someone out there is familiar with the rules in say Florida, Kentucky, and NY.

cj
11-22-2011, 11:34 AM
The rule right now is the rule they have to follow. Apparently the only consequence is the fine. I don't believe there was even a fine until this year but I could be wrong.

It could also be the case that the Trainer did report it but someone in the Racing Office neglected to notify the public in a timely manner.

I doubt that most other jurisdictions even have a fine but I'd like to know if someone out there is familiar with the rules in say Florida, Kentucky, and NY.

I would bet the stewards have some discretion in these matters when protecting the public is involved. They chose not to exercise it.

andymays
11-22-2011, 11:39 AM
I would bet the stewards have some discretion in these matters when protecting the public is involved. They chose not to exercise it.

I just sent an email to ask. Mike M. always gets back to me.

andymays
11-22-2011, 03:33 PM
I just sent an email to ask. Mike M. always gets back to me.
Andy:

This matter is covered by CHRB Rule 1865, which says in part: (1) If the true sex of a horse is not correctly identified in the official program for the race in which the horse is entered, the trainer of the horse shall be subject to a minimum fine of $1,000.

So you can see, the rule dictates a specific penalty and does not allow for scratching the horse. That said, if there was something special about a case, a suggestion of fraud, for example, I’m confident the stewards have authority to take action under some other section of the rules, but for ordinary cases, the penalty is a $1,000 fine.

Mike

cj
11-22-2011, 03:42 PM
Andy:

This matter is covered by CHRB Rule 1865, which says in part: (1) If the true sex of a horse is not correctly identified in the official program for the race in which the horse is entered, the trainer of the horse shall be subject to a minimum fine of $1,000.

So you can see, the rule dictates a specific penalty and does not allow for scratching the horse. That said, if there was something special about a case, a suggestion of fraud, for example, I’m confident the stewards have authority to take action under some other section of the rules, but for ordinary cases, the penalty is a $1,000 fine.

Mike

That tells me they could have scratched the horse if they wanted to do so. There is no doubt they could have found a reason. They just didn't care enough about the bettor.

andymays
11-22-2011, 03:59 PM
That tells me they could have scratched the horse if they wanted to do so. There is no doubt they could have found a reason. They just didn't care enough about the bettor.

I'm still waiting for someone to let me know how other states handle this situation.

I did learn that when this rule was gone over before it was suggested that the Vets who did the pre race inspections should make note if it's a horse or gelding but the Vets didn't want the burden. I'm pretty sure this rule will be changed at the next meeting. It should be.

Tom
11-22-2011, 10:22 PM
Simple solution - this ain't rocket since - the moron who drops the entry slip in is responsible to note any medical procedures since the last race. End of story. Nothing is as hard as these people want us to believe. Running fair racing is NOT hard to do, unless you don't care about the fans, which, obvioulsy, the California tracks do not.

andymays
11-23-2011, 09:25 AM
Simple solution - this ain't rocket since - the moron who drops the entry slip in is responsible to note any medical procedures since the last race. End of story. Nothing is as hard as these people want us to believe. Running fair racing is NOT hard to do, unless you don't care about the fans, which, obvioulsy, the California tracks do not.

Give me the rules in Kentucky, Florida, and NY on this subject.

Tom
11-23-2011, 09:55 AM
The rules there are moot.
Hollywood screwed up, not them.

andymays
11-23-2011, 10:26 AM
The rules there are moot.
Hollywood screwed up, not them.

Hollywood has no say about what happened. The Stewards work for the CHRB and the rules that are in place were followed. I'm pretty sure the rule will be changed.

If you don't know the rules in Kentucky, Florida, or NY and you don't know how the rules work out here maybe ...................................

cj
11-23-2011, 10:41 AM
Give me the rules in Kentucky, Florida, and NY on this subject.

You could have called in the time you keep asking here. That is the only way anyone is going to find out.

andymays
11-23-2011, 10:44 AM
You could have called in the time you keep asking here. That is the only way anyone is going to find out.

I have my hands full with the stuff out here. I did talk to Mike Marten of the CHRB yesterday evening.

My point is that if you're going to knock California for what happened then you ought to know how it compares to other jurisdictions.

My other point is that a guy like Mike Marten always answers emails and if he doesn't know the answer he finds out and gets back to the person asking the question. I don't know of any other jurisdiction that does that.

senortout
11-23-2011, 10:53 AM
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/32821/kentucky-requiring-gelding-notification

Believe it says in there (date of ruling, etc)

andymays
11-23-2011, 10:55 AM
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/32821/kentucky-requiring-gelding-notification

Believe it says in there (date of ruling, etc)

Thanks. It sounds like California at least fines the Trainer. I'm for scratching the horse if the first time gelding is not reported at least 30 minutes to the first race of the day.

Tom
11-23-2011, 11:15 AM
What diff does it make what anyone else's rules are?
Wrong is wrong.

senortout
11-23-2011, 11:17 AM
Believe we are overlooking the bigger picture.....First time geldings should be right there in the past performances, just like blinkers added, blinkers removed, lasix added,removed, adjuncts, etc., etc.

But there never has been a big rush to inform the public now has there......say they do announce to the fans over the P.A......what percentage of fans will those announcements get through to.....with more and more fans betting w/ ADW off track? And like me with the sound muted while studying pps?

All that said I would have probably let em beat me anyways, truth be told.

andymays
11-23-2011, 11:21 AM
Believe we are overlooking the bigger picture.....First time geldings should be right there in the past performances, just like blinkers added, blinkers removed, lasix added,removed, adjuncts, etc., etc.

But there never has been a big rush to inform the public now has there......say they do announce to the fans over the P.A......what percentage of fans will those announcements get through to.....with more and more fans betting w/ ADW off track? And like me with the sound muted while studying pps?

All that said I would have probably let em beat me anyways, truth be told.

Agree. :ThmbUp:

andymays
11-23-2011, 11:37 AM
What diff does it make what anyone else's rules are?
Wrong is wrong.

Everyone agrees that it's wrong but what are you doing in your area to make sure they have a fair rule? And why don't you know the rule in your area?

Tom
11-23-2011, 11:42 AM
Because I use HDW and have the gelding info I need.

andymays
11-23-2011, 12:30 PM
Because I use HDW and have the gelding info I need.

How do they get you the information about first time geldings if it isn't available? Isn't that the whole point of the discussion?

Tom
11-23-2011, 01:48 PM
I was being sarcastic. ;)

andymays
11-23-2011, 02:47 PM
I was being sarcastic. ;)

Got it. :D

FenceBored
11-27-2011, 04:05 PM
Roger Stein on gelding-gate:

How about telling people in the winners circle. I think you should have a guy dressed up in a clown's suit just go in the winner's circle, look underneath the horse's two hind legs and hold up a sign "Gelding, ha ha ha". Laugh at everybody. How about doing that?
-- http://www.rogerstein.com/archives/111126.wma about 39:30

andymays
11-27-2011, 04:07 PM
Roger Stein on gelding-gate:

How about telling people in the winners circle. I think you should have a guy dressed up in a clown's suit just go in the winner's circle, look underneath the horse's two hind legs and hold up a sign "Gelding, ha ha ha". Laugh at everybody. How about doing that?
-- http://www.rogerstein.com/archives/111126.wma about 39:30



Exactly. This guy belongs in the Hall of Fame. A better friend of the Horseplayer there will never be. :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp: