Walter Payton

[andymays]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Book-Walter-Payton-abused-painkillers-discusse?urn=nfl-wp8200

Excerpt:

The burden of loneliness and his marriage weren't Payton's only problems. As a player he had numbed his maladies with pills and liquids, usually supplied by the Bears. Payton popped Darvon robotically during his playing days—says Holmes, "I'd see him walk out of the locker room with jars of painkillers, and he'd eat them like they were a snack"—and also lathered his body with dimethyl sulfoxide, a topical analgesic commonly used to treat horses. Now that he was retired, the self-medicating only intensified. Payton habitually ingested a cocktail of Tylenol and Vicodin. In a particularly embarrassing episode, in 1988, Payton visited a handful of dental offices, complaining of severe tooth pain. He received several prescriptions for morphine and hit up a handful of drugstores to have them filled. When one of the pharmacists noticed the activity, he contacted the police, who arrived at Payton's house and discussed the situation.

[OTM Al]

And your point is?

This guy was one of the best ever and played on a terrible team for almost all of his career. I can't imagine the beating he took weekly and still came back the next week. Of course they pumped him full of pills. They pump them all full of pills and shoot them up with god knows what. NFL players are meat that gets cut the second something goes wrong. All for your entertainment.

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone else's words.

[Valuist]

I agree with Al. Pound for pound, as good as anyone who has ever played the game.

I have to believe a very high percentage of former NFL players are taking a large number of painkillers. This shouldn't surprise anyone.

[bigmack]

I LOVED Walter Payton. I had heard rumors back when I was in Palatine and he was in Wheeling. Wheeling can decimate the strongest of wills.

As mentioned, I LOVED Walter Payton but I'm not surprised to hear of this.
____________________

You're asking what Andy's point is? Andy posts stories that he thinks people would have interest in.

[firstoffclaim]

Great football player, not much of a human being

[andymays]

And your point is?

This guy was one of the best ever and played on a terrible team for almost all of his career. I can't imagine the beating he took weekly and still came back the next week. Of course they pumped him full of pills. They pump them all full of pills and shoot them up with god knows what. NFL players are meat that gets cut the second something goes wrong. All for your entertainment.

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone else's words.

Hey Al, I thought the article was interesting. Especially the part that says "and also lathered his body with dimethyl sulfoxide, a topical analgesic commonly used to treat horses."

I don't know what your problem is but I'm finding out that you're a real effin jerk.

All for my entertainment?

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone elses words?

Walter Payton was one of my all time favorites and still is. The article doesn't take anything away from my opinion of him. If you'd ever played a sport at a higher level you would know that most people in professional sports do what they have to do to get through a game. Especially in Football.

Like I said you're a real effin jerk.

[ElKabong]

Andy,

Thank you for posting this. Unfortunately pain meds are far too easily attainable for athletes, and not just the pros.

[bigmack]

Great football player, not much of a human being
What made him less of human being than you?

[Striker]

Nice post Andy. Was the best rb that I ever saw play. I got to meet him several times as I played sports against his son in high school and he was always in attendance. He was very down to earth and would give autographs and talk to whomever would come up to him.

[thaskalos]

Great football player, not much of a human being
Shouldn't a post such as this be followed by some sort of an explanation...or are we supposed to beg?

[PaceAdvantage]

Shouldn't a post such as this be followed by some sort of an explanation...or are we supposed to beg?He's most likely referring to his drug use and extra-marital affairs.

[OTM Al]

Hey Al, I thought the article was interesting. Especially the part that says "and also lathered his body with dimethyl sulfoxide, a topical analgesic commonly used to treat horses."

I don't know what your problem is but I'm finding out that you're a real effin jerk.

All for my entertainment?

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone elses words?

Walter Payton was one of my all time favorites and still is. The article doesn't take anything away from my opinion of him. If you'd ever played a sport at a higher level you would know that most people in professional sports do what they have to do to get through a game. Especially in Football.

Like I said you're a real effin jerk.

Why? I have no idea what your intent is when you post something like this, a regular habit of yours. I don't know if you are mocking him, pointing out something interesting, or makng some social comment on drug use. If you would have written YOUR opinion like you just did, then it would have been quite clear wouldn't it?

And BTW, I don't think much of you either.

[andymays]

Why? I have no idea what your intent is when you post something like this, a regular habit of yours. I don't know if you are mocking him, pointing out something interesting, or makng some social comment on drug use. If you would have written YOUR opinion like you just did, then it would have been quite clear wouldn't it?

And BTW, I don't think much of you either.

Who cares if you don't know my intent. Why should I explain anything to a guy who loves to cheap shot people? The article speaks for itself and I didn't offer an opinion.

Like I said you're just an effin jerk who throws out crap like that all the time. Why don't you quit following me around and worry about yourself?

[OTM Al]

Who cares if you don't know my intent. Why should I explain anything to a guy who loves to cheap shot people? The article speaks for itself and I didn't offer an opinion.

Like I said you're just an effin jerk who throws out crap like that all the time. Why don't you quit following me around and worry about yourself?

Follow you around? Really? I wouldn't follow you around if you espoused the beliefs I hold most dear.

Who cares if I don't know your intent? I do, that's who. Maybe this one bothered me more than your regular multi-sucessive-post lead-ins. I used to love football and the reason was Walter Payton. I grew up watching this guy every Sunday because every Sunday he was there giving it his all. The entire Bears offense followed the formula handoff to Payton, handoff to Payton, incomplete pass, punt. I'm sure Valuist can back me up on that one. But he transcended the game and his play was beautiful to watch. I quit caring about the game after there was no more Walter Payton.

But then how dare I question the great "andymays". For he is our savior and knows all that is good for us. So not only are we not allowed to question your opinions, but we aren't even allowed to know what they are? It's simply good enough for us all to think you have one?

All you make clear to me is that story about you over at Paulick had a lot more truth in it than falsehood. Follow you around? Start your own message board. I guarantee I won't sign up. Follow YOU around? Don't flatter yourself.

[Valuist]

I LOVED Walter Payton. I had heard rumors back when I was in Palatine and he was in Wheeling. Wheeling can decimate the strongest of wills.

As mentioned, I LOVED Walter Payton but I'm not surprised to hear of this.
____________________

You're asking what Andy's point is? Andy posts stories that he thinks people would have interest in.

He lived in Wheeling? I live there now. I had never heard that. I know he lived in Arlington Heights and then South Barrington.

Payton was the best back I've seen play and I've seen Simpson, Sanders, Smith, Peterson and Dickerson (Jim Brown was before my time).

[andymays]

Follow you around? Really? I wouldn't follow you around if you espoused the beliefs I hold most dear.

Who cares if I don't know your intent? I do, that's who. Maybe this one bothered me more than your regular multi-sucessive-post lead-ins. I used to love football and the reason was Walter Payton. I grew up watching this guy every Sunday because every Sunday he was there giving it his all. The entire Bears offense followed the formula handoff to Payton, handoff to Payton, incomplete pass, punt. I'm sure Valuist can back me up on that one. But he transcended the game and his play was beautiful to watch. I quit caring about the game after there was no more Walter Payton.

But then how dare I question the great "andymays". For he is our savior and knows all that is good for us. So not only are we not allowed to question your opinions, but we aren't even allowed to know what they are? It's simply good enough for us all to think you have one?

All you make clear to me is that story about you over at Paulick had a lot more truth in it than falsehood. Follow you around? Start your own message board. I guarantee I won't sign up. Follow YOU around? Don't flatter yourself.

It sounds like you're obsessed with me Al. You pull this crap every few months. If you'd like I can send you a pair of my dirty socks to put under your pillow.

Get lost.

[OTM Al]

No.

If you can't handle a question or a criticisim, it isn't me that has the problem. There's only one person on this board that has the right to tell me or anyone else to leave, and that is not you.

[andymays]

No.

If you can't handle a question or a criticisim, it isn't me that has the problem. There's only one person on this board that has the right to tell me or anyone else to leave, and that is not you.

You clearly took the thread offstride in post number 2 with an attack on me for no apparent reason. Any reasonable person following the thread will conclude that you have a problems between the ears.

You took a thread about a great football player and turned it into an attack on me.

As far as handling anything I think I've handled you pretty well in this thread and others. :lol:

How bad do you want to look today? :confused:

[OTM Al]

You actually consider that an attack on you? Really? What was I supposed to say "Gee Andy, what a nice job posting the article that I could have read elsewhere."? You posted a piece on a person who was beloved by many people that said some pretty awful things and left it there with NO COMMENT. You don't think that might generate a little controversy?

So I see this and what am I supposed to think as to your intentions? Maybe I think you think it's funny that a black man went from the heights of his profession to the bottom of a bottle of pills. Maybe I think you are commenting on the NFL and how it buries its problems while printing money on the backs of its players. First one would generate a real insult from me. Second would get my agreement. But you said NOTHING.

I asked you two questions:
What is your point?
Why don't you tell us what you think instead of just posting someone else's words?

It's actually pretty much just one question in the end. And you couldn't answer it without childish name calling. In "handling" me well, you've once again proved that what was written about you is pretty close to the fact. Say what you want in defense of you awe inspiring intellect. I won't be the one looking like a fool. Done.

[andymays]

You actually consider that an attack on you? Really? What was I supposed to say "Gee Andy, what a nice job posting the article that I could have read elsewhere."? You posted a piece on a person who was beloved by many people that said some pretty awful things and left it there with NO COMMENT. You don't think that might generate a little controversy?

So I see this and what am I supposed to think as to your intentions? Maybe I think you think it's funny that a black man went from the heights of his profession to the bottom of a bottle of pills. Maybe I think you are commenting on the NFL and how it buries its problems while printing money on the backs of its players. First one would generate a real insult from me. Second would get my agreement. But you said NOTHING.

I asked you two questions:
What is your point?
Why don't you tell us what you think instead of just posting someone else's words?

It's actually pretty much just one question in the end. And you couldn't answer it without childish name calling. In "handling" me well, you've once again proved that what was written about you is pretty close to the fact. Say what you want in defense of you awe inspiring intellect. I won't be the one looking like a fool. Done.

:rolleyes: You're embarrassing yourself. :eek:

I'm off to lunch now Al. You have about an hour and a half to think of your next brilliant post.

Keep Trying. :D

[JeremyJet]

He lived in Wheeling? I live there now. I had never heard that. I know he lived in Arlington Heights and then South Barrington.

Payton was the best back I've seen play and I've seen Simpson, Sanders, Smith, Peterson and Dickerson (Jim Brown was before my time).

We used to live a block from Walter's house in Arlington Heights. His house was located on Pinetree Drive.

I also live in Wheeling now, Valuist. Right by Nino's at the corner of Buffalo Grove Rd & Dundee.

[JeremyJet]

My two favorite RB's were/are Walter Payton and Earl Campbell ... in that order.

[ArlJim78]

Payton is my co favorite of alltime, along with Barry Sanders.

I also live in Arlington Heights but had no idea Payton used to live here.

[newtothegame]

You actually consider that an attack on you? Really? What was I supposed to say "Gee Andy, what a nice job posting the article that I could have read elsewhere."? You posted a piece on a person who was beloved by many people that said some pretty awful things and left it there with NO COMMENT. You don't think that might generate a little controversy?

So I see this and what am I supposed to think as to your intentions? Maybe I think you think it's funny that a black man went from the heights of his profession to the bottom of a bottle of pills. Maybe I think you are commenting on the NFL and how it buries its problems while printing money on the backs of its players. First one would generate a real insult from me. Second would get my agreement. But you said NOTHING.

I asked you two questions:
What is your point?
Why don't you tell us what you think instead of just posting someone else's words?

It's actually pretty much just one question in the end. And you couldn't answer it without childish name calling. In "handling" me well, you've once again proved that what was written about you is pretty close to the fact. Say what you want in defense of you awe inspiring intellect. I won't be the one looking like a fool. Done.
At some pint, they always resort to this.......sad!!!

[newtothegame]

As to Walter, a great RB. had all kinds of heart on the field. Played on a mediocre team. Took unbelievable punishment. The guy could flat out play!
Can not contribute to him as a person....I didnt know him.
I personally think Barry sanders was better and played on a worse team!

[Striker]

Payton is my co favorite of alltime, along with Barry Sanders.

I also live in Arlington Heights but had no idea Payton used to live here.
I know he used to train vigorously on a very steep hill in the off season. I always thought it was in Arlington Heights.

[Hanover1]

Horses at the top of the game live similar lives in many instances. Not the carousing of course...but if given the chance......just sayin.

[maddog42]

Payton is my co favorite of alltime, along with Barry Sanders.

I also live in Arlington Heights but had no idea Payton used to live here.

Being an okie, (sooner) I saw a little more of Sanders, and I give him the nod.
Lest I get attacked for no reason , here are my top 3:
1 Barry Sanders
2 Walter Payton
3 Earl Campbell
It is funny, that with all the great backs that OU has had, 2 of my top 3 are from OSU and Texas.
Little known fact. After his recruiting visit to OU, Earl got off the plane and said he loved OU and was probably going there. He did of course change his mind, and committed to Texas. Am I the only one on this board that thinks Earl was top 3 all time?
As for being critical of Payton, who knows what demons he battled? Walk a mile in that guys shoes.

RIP.

[Valuist]

As to Walter, a great RB. had all kinds of heart on the field. Played on a mediocre team. Took unbelievable punishment. The guy could flat out play!
Can not contribute to him as a person....I didnt know him.
I personally think Barry sanders was better and played on a worse team!

Sanders was more elusive. But Payton was much stronger. And a better receiver. And a better blocker. Oh yeah he was the emergency QB and punter as well.

[PaceAdvantage]

All you make clear to me is that story about you over at Paulick had a lot more truth in it than falsehood.Now my curiosity has been piqued...link?

And andymays, please don't start telling people where they may and may not post. This isn't a private thread. Anybody is free to comment, and your personal insults were 100x more an ATTACK than anything Al wrote to you earlier in this thread.

[Dahoss2002]

Being an okie, (sooner) I saw a little more of Sanders, and I give him the nod.
Lest I get attacked for no reason , here are my top 3:
1 Barry Sanders
2 Walter Payton
3 Earl Campbell
It is funny, that with all the great backs that OU has had, 2 of my top 3 are from OSU and Texas.
Little known fact. After his recruiting visit to OU, Earl got off the plane and said he loved OU and was probably going there. He did of course change his mind, and committed to Texas. Am I the only one on this board that thinks Earl was top 3 all time?
As for being critical of Payton, who knows what demons he battled? Walk a mile in that guys shoes.

RIP.
Earl makes my top 3. The Tyler Rose. He has some real health issues as well. Playing in the NFL can take alot out of a man. Bum was never shy calling his number.

[bks]

He's most likely referring to his drug use and extra-marital affairs.

Playing in the NFL, as a rule, reduces life expectancy significantly. SIGNIFICANTLY. Like 10-15 years or more on average.

I wonder exactly what the objection to "taking drugs" is. I'm not directing this at you, PA, but to anyone who looks down at players for their drug use. Do you know what happens to the bodies of football players, particularly ones with careers as long as Payton's? I trust you don't or you wouldn't begrudge them any painkilling medications they take, nor would you judge them for becoming addicted if they do.

And something for those who object to PED usage on the basis that they pose health risks to players: while it's true that some of them do, particularly when taken unsupervised by a doctor, football itself is inarguably far more likely to negatively impact a player's life span than is any steroid they take.

[Valuist]

Playing in the NFL, as a rule, reduces life expectancy significantly. SIGNIFICANTLY. Like 10-15 years or more on average.

I wonder exactly what the objection to "taking drugs" is. I'm not directing this at you, PA, but to anyone who looks down at players for their drug use. Do you know what happens to the bodies of football players, particularly ones with careers as long as Payton's? I trust you don't or you wouldn't begrudge them any painkilling medications they take, nor would you judge them for becoming addicted if they do.

And something for those who object to PED usage on the basis that they pose health risks to players: while it's true that some of them do, particularly when taken unsupervised by a doctor, football itself is inarguably far more likely to negatively impact a player's life span than is any steroid they take.

For life expectancy, I've heard for NFL players it is right around 54-55 years of age so its at least 15 years less than the average male.

You are 100% correct re: the painkillers. Anyone judging former players for getting addicted to painkillers is clueless.

[sandpit]

I remember hearing Steve Largent say he knew it was time to retire when he woke up one Monday and it took him an hour to put on his shirt.

[Cardus]

Hey Al, I thought the article was interesting. Especially the part that says "and also lathered his body with dimethyl sulfoxide, a topical analgesic commonly used to treat horses."


All for my entertainment?

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone elses words?
I don't know what your problem is but I'm finding out that you're a real effin jerk.

Walter Payton was one of my all time favorites and still is. The article doesn't take anything away from my opinion of him. If you'd ever played a sport at a higher level you would know that most people in professional sports do what they have to do to get through a game. Especially in Football.

Like I said you're a real effin jerk.

If this is a joke, fine.

If you are serious, though, you're a real effin jerk.

Go start a thread with a poll attached to it.

[Rookies]

The 2 combatants here can do whatever they wish. I've met one of them at Saratoga twice and consider him to be an upstanding person. Enough said.

As for the topic of the thread itself, I too grew up with Sweetness and consider him, like others to easily be in the Top 5 Running Backs of all time. I'd could rate the same 1-2-3 Brown-Sanders-Payton and throw in Emmett Snmith and Thurman Thomas as well as some of those named already (Campbell, Sayers, Peterson,etc) in the Top 10.

In fact, I liked Payton so much for his work ethic, attitude and COMMUNITY SERVICE, that he ranks with me near the top of the heap for all time NFL greats- all positions!

To me, this was a clear hatchet job which deliberately set out out to take advantage of a long ago deceased superstar. Those incidents of negativity are designed to overshadow the great things accomplished in Payton's life.

That he had drug problems, no doubt in strong part, designed by NFL Management who pushed their players to do whatever it took to get on the field in the early eras. I am drawn to another HOFer Joe D. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_DeLamielleure) to get the low down on the scummy way that a mega billion dollar enterprise has treated its former stars.

It is disgraceful. Joe D got a pension of $11k for many, many years and the fact that both the NFL and his own Players Union conspired for years to **** players like him is beyond reprehensible.

I will never forgive Ditka/McMahon for not ensuring that Payton did not get into the end zone during that Super Bowl annihilation of the Patsies. If the Bears had to carry him over the goal line, they should have to commemorate his years of sacrifice and excellent, hard work!

It is, at least, one of Ditkas biggest regrets that they did not. Ditka shares with many of us, that he would piss on this writer if he found him one day and had the opportunity.

I can only hope that somebody else getes the brain wave to do exposes on scum writers- like this guy!

[PhantomOnTour]

Looking back, ain't it safe to say that Ditka wasn't much of a head coach?

[Robert Fischer]

those guys get trapped with those drugs that make them feel normal for a while.

some of these guys need programs where they can get clean, and get on a calisthenics regiment and go on with their life feeling half decent. Some need multiple surgeries and/or realistically need a "pain management" regiment after a football career.

they are horses out there. the pros are not as "bad" as the college scene where you're REALLY a piece of meat out there... but in the Pros you get a taste of some money and a lavish lifestyle. You buy into the glory of victory with the team...

http://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/lufkindailynews.com/content/tncms/assets/editorial/5/48/f53/548f5312-3c44-11df-8381-001cc4c03286.image.jpg

[OTM Al]

I will never forgive Ditka/McMahon for not ensuring that Payton did not get into the end zone during that Super Bowl annihilation of the Patsies. If the Bears had to carry him over the goal line, they should have to commemorate his years of sacrifice and excellent, hard work!

It is, at least, one of Ditkas biggest regrets that they did not. Ditka shares with many of us, that he would piss on this writer if he found him one day and had the opportunity.


I don't think they even realized it at the time, and don't imagine Walter Payton would have said a word during the game, but they should have. The game was over for long enough time to get over the initial mindset. What was that 46 points they scored, pretty much at will?

[highnote]

At some pint, they always resort to this.......sad!!!


You mean "after a few pints, they always resort to this." :D

[PaceAdvantage]

I find it interesting that when the not-so-pretty underbelly is exposed on a guy like Tiger Woods, a significant portion of his fan base turns against him and basically revels in his subsequent mediocrity on the "playing field."

But when the same thing happens to Walter Payton, his fans seem to be taking it as a personal shot against THEM!

Is it because Payton has passed on that there seems to be a lot more forgiveness in the hearts of his fans?

[Dahoss2002]

I find it interesting that when the not-so-pretty underbelly is exposed on a guy like Tiger Woods, a significant portion of his fan base turns against him and basically revels in his subsequent mediocrity on the "playing field."

But when the same thing happens to Walter Payton, his fans seem to be taking it as a personal shot against THEM!

Is it because Payton has passed on that there seems to be a lot more forgiveness in the hearts of his fans?
Probably that and also the perception of their personalities. Payton, with no SEC offers played at Jackson St.,made it big in the NFL, and always seemed to be pretty humble. Tiger gets the "spoiled brat" rap. Alot of folks rejoice in his problems. Just the sad side of human nature maybe.

[thaskalos]

I find it interesting that when the not-so-pretty underbelly is exposed on a guy like Tiger Woods, a significant portion of his fan base turns against him and basically revels in his subsequent mediocrity on the "playing field."

But when the same thing happens to Walter Payton, his fans seem to be taking it as a personal shot against THEM!

Is it because Payton has passed on that there seems to be a lot more forgiveness in the hearts of his fans?
No PA...Payton's illness and untimely death have little to do with the way his fans have reacted to this new "biography".

Walter Payton retired in 1987, and he didn't reveal his illness until 1999. Why wait for 12 years after his death (and 24 years after his retirement) to write a book such as this?

Payton was a throwback; a true gridiron warrior who showed amazing courage and class, both on the football field...and while fighting against the dreaded disease which claimed his life.

He deserved better than to have his biography written by a spineless sports reporter like Jeff Pearlman.

[toetoe]

And your point is?

This guy was one of the best ever and played on a terrible team for almost all of his career. I can't imagine the beating he took weekly and still came back the next week. Of course they pumped him full of pills. They pump them all full of pills and shoot them up with god knows what. NFL players are meat that gets cut the second something goes wrong. All for your entertainment.

Why don't you tell us what you actually think rather than just posting someone else's words.


Al, I'm not sure what you yourself are saying. Surely you're not saying that his behavior should be condoned because he was a great player. :confused:

[toetoe]

I don't know what your problem is but I'm finding out that you're a real effin jerk ...

Like I said you're a real effin jerk.



I defend your right to your opinion, but your description of Al --- Off The Mark Al in this case --- is dead wrong. :)

[toetoe]

You actually consider that an attack on you? Really? What was I supposed to say "Gee Andy, what a nice job posting the article that I could have read elsewhere."?





I guess you might address the story itself. Debunk it, flesh it out, go off on a tangent.

Maybe you two fellas have a history of which I know nothing ... ? If so, the subject might not even matter.

Respectfully,

Lou Groza