A shocking thread...

[mostpost]

..In which I criticize a union. :eek:

Recently, in Chicago, Mayor Emanuel and School Superintendent Brisard (Sp?) have advocated a longer school day for the students. Nothing has been decided systemwide, but teachers in three schools have voted to institute a 90 minute extension to the school day with an emphasis on Math and Science. In exchange they will receive a 2% raise; not nearly as much as the increase in time spent. But that is their choice and I have no quarrel with that.

My problem is with the reaction of the Chicago Teachers Union. One Op Ed piece says the teachers at the three schools stabbed their fellow teachers in the back. Karen Allen, the President of CTU says they should concentrate on improving the teaching they do in the time they now have rather than increasing the time.

I say why not do both? Why not encourage teachers to improve their teaching? Why not encourage principals to monitor their teachers more closely? Why not provide adequate tools to the schools.

As you all know, I am not one who thinks teachers are overpaid. I think most teachers are dedicated and work many hours outside of classroom hours, BUT

If the teachers in a particular school wish to spend more time helping students
they should be encouraged and praised, not vilified.

[skate]

sure, put in more of an effort, fine.

The problem has gotten to the point that the workers can not afford to keep paying for poor results, that simple.

It has gotten to the point that it does not matter if others want "more for less", because finnally "we found a bottom" and they can lend a hand in cleaning up the mess they have made.:)

no more "tears for crap"...yep.

[Tom]

Pay teaches for the number of students that can pass a third party exam.

100% of the student pass, they get 100% of their pay
50% pass, the get half the pay.

Pay for play, mostie.
How about it? :D

[ArlJim78]

what i'd like to know is after adding 90 minutes to their day, how long does that make their day?

[mostpost]

what i'd like to know is after adding 90 minutes to their day, how long does that make their day?
The school day was 8:45AM to 2:45PM. Now it will be 8:15AM to 3:45PM. Of course that is just the time they spend with students. Before and after class there are tests to grade, homework to check and lesson plans to develop.
My friend who teaches in the local Catholic school is at school between six and seven every morning and seldom leaves before five.

[Dave Schwartz]

Pay teaches for the number of students that can pass a third party exam.

100% of the student pass, they get 100% of their pay
50% pass, the get half the pay.


Seems like a good idea on the surface, Tom. However, I can tell you that this approach has absolutely killed education on the west coast.

Since the school districts' primary concern is graduation rate, the instruct the teaches to concentrate on the slowest members of the class. There is no such thing as enrichment or encouragement for the smarter students.

It is why the Asians are so far ahead of us in science and math: they reward success where as we punish failure: two distinctly different goals.

Ironically, at first glance it seems that both groups do it exactly the other way around.


Dave Schwartz

[TJDave]

they reward success where as we punish failure: two distinctly different goals.


In a capitalistic society they are the antithesis of each other. The punishment for failure IS the reward for the successful.

A teacher who teaches this...

Is a success.

[toetoe]

In a capitalistic society they are the antithesis of each other. The punishment for failure IS the reward for the successful.

A teacher who teaches this...

Is a success.



Huh ? (:Scratching head.)

[lsbets]

Kudos to the teachers for wanting to try something. Shame on the union.

But ..... I don't think adding time to the day will do it. Kids are kids. They need to have time to blow off steam, they have limited attention spans. IMO, summer vacation should be shortened. Add an extra week off at Christmas and spring break. Then give three weeks off in June/July, and two weeks off around labor day.

[turninforhome10]

Our whole education system needs overhauled. We need to look to John Dewey and his ideas on education. http://www.wilderdom.com/experiential/JohnDeweyPhilosophyEducation.html
We teach 12 yrs of general ed so we kids who are generally educated morons. Then we send them to 4 more years of gen ed we call it a degree. When are kids supposed to learn skills for the real world, that would would be a Masters degree
I had a professor tell me once that nobody really learns anything useful until their Masters. I think it is sad that teachers have to be more concerned about bumping up standardized test for district funding rather than actually teaching useful info.
No child will be left behind when they are all in the back.

[HUSKER55]

I think there would be more progress if the testing was done by third parties and let the teachers just teach. There is too much bias letting the ones who teach do the grading.


Class room teachers should have no input on grades.

[highnote]

Dave -- totally agree. The whole no child left behind thing is killing education. Teachers are teaching so that kids can pass the mastery tests. Weaker ones are getting much of the teachers' attention. Good ones are being left behind from where they could be.

It's great that weaker ones are getting extra attention, but the achieving kids are not achieving at their full potential. This is going to be a big problem and as you said the Asians are surpassing the U.S.

The Dept. Of Education is another federal agency that should be done away with. Education should be run from the state and local level -- not the federal level. There was no DOE 80 years ago.

Which reminds me -- kids should be required to study morals and ethics. This is a subject that was dropped from the ciriculum many years ago. Maybe if more people were taught morals and ethics the U.S. would not have so many thieves and crooks on Wall Street and in Washington.








Seems like a good idea on the surface, Tom. However, I can tell you that this approach has absolutely killed education on the west coast.

Since the school districts' primary concern is graduation rate, the instruct the teaches to concentrate on the slowest members of the class. There is no such thing as enrichment or encouragement for the smarter students.

It is why the Asians are so far ahead of us in science and math: they reward success where as we punish failure: two distinctly different goals.

Ironically, at first glance it seems that both groups do it exactly the other way around.


Dave Schwartz

[rastajenk]

Class room teachers should have no input on grades.That's a pretty radical notion. Can't say I buy into that one at all.

[Tom]

Third party is always the way to go.
I agree 100% with that idea.
Like an SAT format.

[cj's dad]

Isn't it a shame that all cannot attend private school where you either achieve or are removed. Guess what, most achieve !!

[Tom]

What happens to those who do not?
Oh, Congress, I forgot.