Would California agree to slots if the takeout could not exceed 10%

[jelly]

A hypothetical question.

The legislature and the Governor agreed to allow slots at California tracks.

But it comes with a catch ,to draw more customers,the tracks takeout could not exceed 10%

Do they take the deal?

[andymays]

No

[Stillriledup]

I think they would take it. Think of all the tracks around the country (and closeby countries) who don't care one iota about the racing product and just inhale slot monies hand over fist.

Stronach and all these people dont want to own racetracks, they just bought these tracks in CASE the state granted them slots licenses. Stronach is buying up tracks around the country for one purpose, the hope that slots won't be far behind.

[toussaud]

I think they would take it. Think of all the tracks around the country (and closeby countries) who don't care one iota about the racing product and just inhale slot monies hand over fist.

Stronach and all these people dont want to own racetracks, they just bought these tracks in CASE the state granted them slots licenses. Stronach is buying up tracks around the country for one purpose, the hope that slots won't be far behind.
i usually agree with you but right here, not so much. Stronach, for all his faults, really is a horseman. he loves horse racing. he just isn't all that good at running at racetrack lol.

To say that the oly thing he ever careda bout was getting slots, that's just not true. maybe in a place like portland meadows, but not santa anita.

[Stillriledup]

i usually agree with you but right here, not so much. Stronach, for all his faults, really is a horseman. he loves horse racing. he just isn't all that good at running at racetrack lol.

To say that the oly thing he ever careda bout was getting slots, that's just not true. maybe in a place like portland meadows, but not santa anita.

Nobody buys up a bunch of dead beat tracks unless there's an underlying reason. (psst, slots! :D )

[pandy]

Jelly, that's a great idea. If the takeout was 10% on everything, including exactas and trifectas, which are the most popular bets, the handle would be be astronomical. I would say that the handle would increase by 400 to 500%. I have a friend who's a pro bettor who thinks that a major track could do $50,000 million a day if they had a 5% takeout.

[jelly]

No



Woudn't be profitable?

[andymays]

Woudn't be profitable?
No, not under the current conditions.

[jelly]

I think most tracks would accept it.I think Pennsylvania tracks would have accepted it if that was their only alternative.

[andymays]

I think most tracks would accept it.I think Pennsylvania tracks would have accepted it if that was their only alternative.

There are a lot of other things to consider. The Tracks don't make the same amount of money from every dollar wagered and there is a big difference from on track handle and out of State handle.

[Canarsie]

Stronach and all these people dont want to own racetracks, they just bought these tracks in CASE the state granted them slots licenses. Stronach is buying up tracks around the country for one purpose, the hope that slots won't be far behind.


Oh really? Where have you come up with this one? This interview is less than 2 months old.

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2011-06-20/business/bs-bz-hancock-stronach-plans-20110620_1_frank-stronach-tracks-in-west-virginia-slots

He already owned a track and didn't pony up the money. :bang:

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2009-02-27/news/0902260208_1_laurel-park-fees-slot-machine-casinos

[levinmpa]

It's pretty sad that none of these "slots laden" tracks have thrown the horse player a bone in the form takeout relief. The tracks get the revenue from the slots. The owner/trainers benefit from higher purses, but the horse player gets nothing. So much for the 3 sides of the triangle. It's really a shame that places like Philly Park and Delaware have made no attempt to grow the game. They should have lobbied their legislatures for takeout relief, especially since the racing handle is dwarfed by the slots handle. It's a crime that Pennsylvania tracks still take 30%+ on some gimmicks.

[Valuist]

It's pretty sad that none of these "slots laden" tracks have thrown the horse player a bone in the form takeout relief. The tracks get the revenue from the slots. The owner/trainers benefit from higher purses, but the horse player gets nothing. So much for the 3 sides of the triangle. It's really a shame that places like Philly Park and Delaware have made no attempt to grow the game. They should have lobbied their legislatures for takeout relief, especially since the racing handle is dwarfed by the slots handle. It's a crime that Pennsylvania tracks still take 30%+ on some gimmicks.

I agree 100%. Does anyone but locals play those tracks? I've heard about the purses being big at Parx but I never hear or see anyone say they like the card at Parx, or have to bet so and so in a race at Parx.

I have never felt slots are good for racing. Why should they subsidize racing? Cut the takeout and watch the handle skyrocket.

[Charli125]

A hypothetical question.

The legislature and the Governor agreed to allow slots at California tracks.

But it comes with a catch ,to draw more customers,the tracks takeout could not exceed 10%

Do they take the deal?

They should take the deal, but it would require getting the TOC to take a lower percentage of a much larger pie. I doubt they would ever have the foresight to do that despite having the purses artificially increased.

[pondman]

A hypothetical question.

The legislature and the Governor agreed to allow slots at California tracks.

But it comes with a catch ,to draw more customers,the tracks takeout could not exceed 10%

Do they take the deal?

There are already 59 Indian Casinos in the State. Don't think slots will draw anyone to the track. People aren't going to the track in California because it's not fun, and they are broke.

I'm expecting handicappers to move their bets overtime back to wps, and away from exotics, where the takeout is lower than many other States.

[toussaud]

I will get slammed to the grave for this and back but I personally think exotics, or at least, the super duper exotics we have now has hastened the demise of horse racing. Just my personal opinion. SoCal made a deal with the devil when they started promoting that pick 6. it depletes bankrolls faster than anything else, and very rarely do you win anything. we all see the guy who won 3 million or 500k, but we don't see the guy who started the meet with a nice bankroll and by the time the first San Rafeael comes around (late January) he's flat broke. And there are alot more of those.

I take my friends to the track when I do go, they don't give a damna bout making w/p/s wagers, they want to "make the real money", they go with hundreds of dollars and usually by the 8th race they are betting 3 dollar dime super combos lol.


Horse racing is supposed to at it's simplest form, be about, a day at the races, a few drinks,, hopefully some decent food, watching some half decent horse racing, make a few wagers, and hopefully win a few and pay for your day, maybe even pay for a nice dinner afterward or if you had a really good day go shopping. Now it seems to be "let's try to hit it big" event. Tracks promote nothing but carryovers, people want to do nothing but bet the most complex wagers that they can and go broke doing so, have a bad experience, and after enough bad experience (by their own causing mind you) don't come back

[therussmeister]

But perhaps if the tracks just offered basically wps, your friends wouldn't go at all.

[Stillriledup]

I will get slammed to the grave for this and back but I personally think exotics, or at least, the super duper exotics we have now has hastened the demise of horse racing. Just my personal opinion. SoCal made a deal with the devil when they started promoting that pick 6. it depletes bankrolls faster than anything else, and very rarely do you win anything. we all see the guy who won 3 million or 500k, but we don't see the guy who started the meet with a nice bankroll and by the time the first San Rafeael comes around (late January) he's flat broke. And there are alot more of those.

I take my friends to the track when I do go, they don't give a damna bout making w/p/s wagers, they want to "make the real money", they go with hundreds of dollars and usually by the 8th race they are betting 3 dollar dime super combos lol.


Horse racing is supposed to at it's simplest form, be about, a day at the races, a few drinks,, hopefully some decent food, watching some half decent horse racing, make a few wagers, and hopefully win a few and pay for your day, maybe even pay for a nice dinner afterward or if you had a really good day go shopping. Now it seems to be "let's try to hit it big" event. Tracks promote nothing but carryovers, people want to do nothing but bet the most complex wagers that they can and go broke doing so, have a bad experience, and after enough bad experience (by their own causing mind you) don't come back


The biggest pick 6 winners don't usually rebet all that money. Most of those big jackpots go right into someone's actual bank account and not into their betting account to rebet.

I think that the pick 6 isnt really 'the devils bet' its the people who are betting into that pool without a sufficient bankroll that make it LOOK like the devils work. The pick 6 is a bet for the super rich, there's really no reason for anyone other than the super rich to go chasing that rainbow. There's plenty of money to be made in pick 5s, pick 4s supers and Pentafectas.

[toussaud]

The biggest pick 6 winners don't usually rebet all that money. Most of those big jackpots go right into someone's actual bank account and not into their betting account to rebet.

I think that the pick 6 isnt really 'the devils bet' its the people who are betting into that pool without a sufficient bankroll that make it LOOK like the devils work. The pick 6 is a bet for the super rich, there's really no reason for anyone other than the super rich to go chasing that rainbow. There's plenty of money to be made in pick 5s, pick 4s supers and Pentafectas.
i would not call it the devils bet per say but too many people who play it have no business playing a pick 6. either for bankroll or lack of handicapping expertise
But perhaps if the tracks just offered basically wps, your friends wouldn't go at all.

The history of horse racing and attendance does not support this.

I know i'm doing you know what in the wind here, but just how i feel about the subject. In the end when bettors who are new come in and deplete their bank roll in all these exotics it helps no one.

[Phantombridgejumpe]

The racing has improved a lot (which says something about where it was before) - but the facility is now a slots/poker facility with a small amount of space for the horse player (although what they do have is nicer).

The horse quality is better as is the jockey colony, still not NYRA level, but better.

Hard to complain they haven't helped to horsemen some when a $5,000 claiming race has a purse over $20K