The Economist on the Stalemate

[redshift1]

Article on the debt talks stalemate from a reasonably balanced source.







http://www.economist.com/node/18928600?fsrc=scn/tw/te/ar/shameonthem

[bigmack]

The entire article is a travesty of a mockery of a sham of a mockery of a travesty of two mockeries of a sham.

Opens with a dubious line:

There is no good economic reason why this should be happening. America’s net indebtedness is a perfectly affordable 65% of GDP.

[fast4522]

Some threads like the Casey Anthony and others I just stay away from because I find the whole thing "tragic", not the case here. Here I feel it is fitting to cut the bastards legs off, and prey that they succeed in doing so. I remember the movie Malcolm X where in the movie the line "Get Your Hands Out Of My Pockets" comes to mind. I look at Tarp and the other stupid things these people in Washington did and say "Get Your Hands Out Of My Pockets". It is very fitting to comment in this thread with all the stupidity involved with assholes who ship our money outside our Country. Let this President burn in the polls, popularity, and ideology with the blatant stupidity of his party.

[Sugar Ron]

Yeah, that's another good piece.

But hey, hopefully the dumb cons continue to ignore all these warnings and keep following that clueless amateur 'bagger (Cantor) right over the cliff... LMAO

[Tom]

Which cliff is that, Ron, the one that comes off the end of the debt curve Obama has created?

[rastajenk]

If you are playing poker, would you say something like, "Don't call my bluff?" Isn't that an admission that you got nothing? How stupid is that? But hey, The O is the smart one here, right Ron? Some of us are calling your bluff. You got nothing.

[redshift1]

Some threads like the Casey Anthony and others I just stay away from because I find the whole thing "tragic", not the case here. Here I feel it is fitting to cut the bastards legs off, and prey that they succeed in doing so. I remember the movie Malcolm X where in the movie the line "Get Your Hands Out Of My Pockets" comes to mind. I look at Tarp and the other stupid things these people in Washington did and say "Get Your Hands Out Of My Pockets". It is very fitting to comment in this thread with all the stupidity involved with assholes who ship our money outside our Country. Let this President burn in the polls, popularity, and ideology with the blatant stupidity of his party.

The question is who wins in the game of economic brinkmanship? Will the republicans come off as appearing .... more interested in sticking it to Obama than compromising on fiscal issues ..... or will Obama be viewed as the imperious leader of failed policies that are prolonging the recession.

[Tom]

So far, neither Obama nor the dems have presented a budget.
That tells you who is serious about it and who is not.

[GaryG]

"Don't call my bluff" says the POS/POTUS who is holding a busted flush.

[Sugar Ron]

Wish I could've been there yesterday to watch BO 'dress down' the little con boy from VA...

[fast4522]

Dressing down someone who wants to destroy you is not exactly a smooth move in the bigger picture. Someone has to tell the big guy that it is not his agenda any longer. The old codger Harry Reid is calling names now, but by the time he retires and has to go home his Vegans will be throwing bricks at him if he dares the heat. They want class warfare for the people, watch the people.

[Tom]

"Don't call my bluff" says the POS/POTUS who is holding a busted flush.

The fool has no clue what he says! :lol:

[dartman51]

The fool has no clue what he says! :lol:

He didn't have his teleprompter. He was :confused: . He gets that way when he is winging it. :ThmbUp:

[Tom]

The Fool N Chief will hold a Press Snivel today.

"Bwaaaa. The big bad wepubwicans cawwed my bwuff! Bwaaaa. They made me eat peas. Bwwaaaa bwaaaaa. I'm the pwesident...I should get my waaaay. Bwaaaaaaaa bwaaaaaa bwaaaaaaa.

Even Joe Biden is waughing at me now!

[Tom]

Since the pwesident's first reaction to a austerity is to screw the seniors out their SS check, I thought it would a good idea to actually look at some real government spending programs and see if the resident libs can find a few in there that are not as important as SS and might be better targets for Barry to look at halting.

Check out the main list and label each item as either more important than SS or less important, then tally up your cost savings.

http://www.mostafasafavi.com/blog/have-you-seen-the-pork-that-has-been-identified-in-the-stimulus-bill

Here's a quick billion of wasted money.

$ 600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees. $ 400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent STD’s.

[mostpost]

Since the pwesident's first reaction to a austerity is to screw the seniors out their SS check, I thought it would a good idea to actually look at some real government spending programs and see if the resident libs can find a few in there that are not as important as SS and might be better targets for Barry to look at halting.

Check out the main list and label each item as either more important than SS or less important, then tally up your cost savings.

http://www.mostafasafavi.com/blog/have-you-seen-the-pork-that-has-been-identified-in-the-stimulus-bill

Here's a quick billion of wasted money.
The President never threatened to withhold SS checks. He said it may not be possible to send them out if they are not funded. Republicans are fighting to cut SS and Medicare benefits.
As to your list.


• $ 2 billion earmark to re-start FutureGen, a near-zero emissions coal power plant in Illinois that the Department of Energy defunded last year because it said the project was inefficient.
A zero emissions coal power plant would be beneficial in that it would save money on pollution clean up. Of course it would need to be efficient. Perhaps the reason for the restart is that the efficiency has improved.

• A $ 246 million tax break for Hollywood movie producers to buy motion picture film.
I would consider this pork too

• $ 650 million for the digital television converter box coupon program.
A necessary expense considering the mandated change from analog to digital. It's called progress.

• $ 88 million for the Coast Guard to design a new polar icebreaker (arctic ship).
Is your argument that we don't need this since Global Warming is melting all the ice in the arctic regions anyway?

• $ 448 million for constructing the Department of Homeland Security headquarters.
Is this the same Department of Homeland Security that George W, Bush told us was so necessary? Where do you propose these people work?

• $ 248 million for furniture at the new Homeland Security headquarters.
Do you expect them to sit on the floor?
• $ 600 million to buy hybrid vehicles for federal employees.
For federal employees or for those employees to use as part of there jobs. There is a big difference. Fuel savings will mitigate a lot of those costs.

• $ 400 million for the Centers for Disease Control to screen and prevent STD’s.
Just what we want is more people running around and spreading STD's


• $ 1.4 billion for rural waste disposal programs.
Tell them damm rurals to stop defecating.

• $ 125 million for the Washington sewer system.
Same for them Washingtonians.

• $ 150 million for Smithsonian museum facilities.
30 Million people visit the Smithsonian each year. That is $5 per visitor.

• $ 1 billion for the 2010 Census, which has a projected cost overrun of $ 3 billion.
The census is mandated by the United States Constitution.

• $ 75 million for “smoking cessation activities.”
The fewer people who smoke, the better off we all are.

• $ 200 million for public computer centers at community colleges.
A good idea but it probably could wait for more prosperous times.

• $ 75 million for salaries of employees at the FBI.
Are you proposing we don't pay FBI agents?

• $ 25 million for tribal alcohol and substance abuse reduction.
The less Alcohol and substance abuse there is, the more likely that native Americans will have jobs and contribute to society.

• $ 500 million for flood reduction projects on the Mississippi River.
Let 'em drown. :rolleyes:

• $ 10 million to inspect canals in urban areas.
Canals include locks; locks can become damaged.

• $ 6 billion to turn federal buildings into “green” buildings.
Future savings offset current costs.

• $ 500 million for state and local fire stations.
Let 'em burn

• $ 650 million for wildland fire management on forest service lands.
Let them burn too.

• $ 1.2 billion for “youth activities,” including youth summer job programs.
Youth summer job programs produce workers. Workers spend money.



• $ 88 million for renovating the headquarters of the Public Health Service.
Could probably wait.
• $ 412 million for CDC buildings and property.
Ditto

• $ 500 million for building and repairing National Institutes of Health facilities in Bethesda, Maryland.
Are the present facilities in such bad shape?

• $ 160 million for “paid volunteers” at the Corporation for National and Community Service.
Isn't "paid volunteers" an oxymoron?

• $ 5.5 million for “energy efficiency initiatives” at the Department of Veterans Affairs National Cemetery Administration.
Again, future savings offsets current expenditures.

• $ 850 million for Amtrak.
We need to rethink Amtrak, its routes, schedules and dependency on freight line tracks-not defund it.

• $ 100 million for reducing the hazard of lead-based paint.
Nothing like a country of brain damaged kids.

• $ 75 million to construct a “security training” facility for State Department Security officers when they can be trained at existing facilities of other agencies.
Do we know there is time and space available at these other agencies? Are those facilities relevant to the needs of the State Department?

• $ 110 million to the Farm Service Agency to upgrade computer systems.
Just give 'em a quill and a bottle of ink.

• $ 200 million in funding for the lease of alternative energy vehicles for use on military installations
For, I believe the fourth time, future savings offset current costs.

So looking at your list, Tom, I found one example of Pork (Hollywood producers); A few things that should perhaps be postponed; and a few things that one would need more information about, but mostly necessary and beneficial expenses.

[rastajenk]

That list is most(post)ly the Government taking care of its own. So Obamarama is basically saying, Granny may have to go without so the bureaurcrats can continue to spend. Is that really the message you want to get behind so enthusiastically, Mr Post? Surely the President can prioritize better than that, if he really wanted to. It's pretty obvious he doesn't.

[redshift1]

Documents obtained from the Nixon/Bush1 presidential libraries.

Republicans highlighted in this article but probably standard MOP for both party strategists


http://gawker.com/5814150/roger-ailes-secret-nixon+era-blueprint-for-fox-news

[Tom]

Congrats, mostie - obviously, you have put far more thought into the budget than Obama has. Did you tally up your savings?

[fast4522]

With so much disbelief as to who, what, or when, so I will impart the next play, Obama is next under the bus. He is playing poker with 9 high and the whole house knows it.

[Tom]

This whole lie about default and the end of the world happening on August 2 is nonsense. We have the cash flow to pay the interest and all our important obligations. It is just another chapter in the Obama legacy of fear politics.

Hey Barry, listen to the little girl...this is August 3rd, you friggin lying moron.

83chZPsYLbo&feature=related

[dartman51]

With so much disbelief as to who, what, or when, so I will impart the next play, Obama is next under the bus. He is playing poker with 9 high and the whole house knows it.


OH YEAH???????........Well DON'T CALL HIS BLUFF!!!!! ;)

[Tom]

On the weekends, I miss the daily talks he gives to calm reassure, and unite the country in times of trouble.

[highnote]

“I could end the deficit in 5 minutes. You just pass a law that says that anytime there is a deficit of more than 3% of GDP all sitting members of congress are ineligible for reelection.”
—
Warren Buffett giving us a quick lesson on incentive in this interview on CNBC.

[Tom]

Speaking of that, has anyone yet suggested that congress and the president all deny tier salaries and perks and pay for own health care?

[ElKabong]

Congrats, mostie - obviously, you have put far more thought into the budget than Obama has. Did you tally up your savings?

Why is it every time I copy and paste mosty's Long Winded posts into a search, it shows a match? The dude simply googles shit and pastes it as a reply. No original thought in his head....Not one

.

[mostpost]

Why is it every time I copy and paste mosty's Long Winded posts into a search, it shows a match? The dude simply googles shit and pastes it as a reply. No original thought in his head....Not one

.
Maybe that's because when you google something it searches for each word in the phrase. Or maybe it is because I use facts to back up my opinion, unlike you.

When I read something posted by the cons on this board my first and immediate reaction is "That's not right." There's something amiss about the facts. That is not how I recall that situation. I don't trust the source. That interpretation is wrong.
But before I post my reply, I google the item. I find sources that are not right wing blogs. (not easy to do.) I try to find original sources. (Police reports rather than newspapers stories- Actual court decisions as opposed to a TV report) I prefer mainstream media to right or left wing blogs, but I definitely prefer left over right.

ORIGINAL THOUGHT? I have never seen you post any thing that I hadn't already heard on Limbaugh or Hannity or read at Breitbart or Drudge. Never seen you express an opinion that wasn't expressed on Fox or at the Heritage Foundation.

The fact is there are no original thoughts, merely variations. You don't even have variations

[Tom]

Clearly, it is getting harder and harder for some to maintain their delusions.

[highnote]

So looking at your list, Tom, I found one example of Pork (Hollywood producers); A few things that should perhaps be postponed; and a few things that one would need more information about, but mostly necessary and beneficial expenses.

Hollywood films are the #2 export of the U.S. after defense.

So the tax break for buying film might be more of an incentive than pork.

Connecticut gives a big tax break to producers of movies and TV shows. There is a lot of production going on in the state which has benefitted small business -- who end up generating more revenue and therefore more taxes.

I'm all for lower taxes -- most people are. So I don't see a tax break for film companies as pork. I see it as good economic policy.

It doesn't cost anything to give a tax break and it generates tax revenue at the end of the process.

[Tom]

I saw next to nothing on the list that the feds should be spending money on.

So Jon, could one rightly make the comparison that the Hollywood start of these film and their huge salaries as just as evil as CEOs?

[highnote]

I saw next to nothing on the list that the feds should be spending money on.

So Jon, could one rightly make the comparison that the Hollywood start of these film and their huge salaries as just as evil as CEOs?


A tax breaks is not spending. Buying new computers is spending. NOT taking in a tax is NOT spending. There is a big difference.

If the US GOV were to GIVE money to Hollywood Studios to buy film then you could make the argument that the US GOV could have some say on how much people's salaries are in that industry.

"TAX BREAKS" is NOT spending. I would argue there shouldn't be a tax on buying film in the first place.

WASTE is the money that has been spent on the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and that huge embassy the US GOV built in Baghdad.

The US GOV could have built a giant wall around the entire continental US to keep people out and developed the most advanced methods in the world to stop terrorism and spend money on small groups of elite black ops to take out key targets in Afghanistan and Iraq -- or better yet -- on drones or robots to take out key targets because at the end of the day the enemies the US GOV fought are still alive. Maybe some of the leaders are dead, but the people from where those leaders emerged still exist. And you can't wipe out whole societies -- that is genocide. So you can never kill everyone who might be an enemy -- on practical grounds and on moral grounds.

So what have these wars really accomplished? They may have changed the complexion, but have they really changed the fundamentals?

[Tom]

But tax credits are negative income.
And I'm sorry I misspelled your name....JOHN! :blush:

[highnote]

But tax credits are negative income.
And I'm sorry I misspelled your name....JOHN! :blush:

I suppose that is one way of looking at it.

I have never heard of negative income. I have heard of spending more than you make and that is a loss.

I don't think of taxes as income. I think of taxes as donations -- or shakedowns.

See, here's the thing... when you or I go out and provide a service or a product we expect to get paid a fair wage. That is income for us. The US GOV expects to collect a tax before the work is done. When they collect tax on the purchase of film, just exactly what have they done that they deserve to get paid for? If the tax collected on the sale of film could be earmarked for a specific project or service or product, I'd say great. That needs to be paid for. But that's not the way it works. They take in as much as they can and then they find ways to spend the money. Wouldn't it be great if we could get our clients to pay us and then we figure out how much service to provide them!

Jon is close enough and a heluva lot closer than asshole -- which is how a lot of people spell it.