DRF Disaster

[menifee]

You want a recipe for disaster - mix private equity with a company that dominates its industry (i.e., DRF). What is the result, it appears to be an ownership group that raises prices, leverages the assets and cuts costs.

What is the result:

1. A website that crashes every weekend (Formulator) when its customers need it the most.

2. Blogs - whereby the major writers for the paper don't update their blogs for weeks at a time. Randy Moss has not updated his blog for nearly a year. If you don't want to do a blog, that is fine. But don't promote something and then not give any content when the user accesses it. Oh wait, that is the formulator web model.

3. Poor customer service.

I have never seen a more poorly run private organization than DRF. The paper has a great history, but I hope someone with serious capital would enter this industry and give them a run for their money.

[redshift1]

Yes, they are unreliable enough to be annoying plus there are better handicappers and race analysis commentary here at Pace.

[DJofSD]

In what way does DRF dominate the industry?

[trackrat59]

From my perspective the only valuable assets DRF has are:

1. Formulator
2. Mike Welsch

Formulator breaks down every now and again and last I knew Mike Welsch, thank God, was still around and kicking. ;)

[Tom]

Several features in the Simulcast Daily have not been updated for ages, too.

But they still appear in the advertisements.

[jelly]

If what you say is true that the DRF dominates its industry,It is the Industries choosing.
The Industry could easily give out the PPs for free and attract more players to the game but they choose not to. :bang:

[captainhot]

Steven Crist (on big race days) and Dan Ilman both have worthwhile blogs. I have been checking Moss's blog about once a month just to see if he has put up anything since last summer, he hasn't----pretty embarrassing.

[the little guy]

If what you say is true that the DRF dominates its industry,It is the Industries choosing.
The Industry could easily give out the PPs for free and attract more players to the game but they choose not to. :bang:


That's not true.

[takeout]

That's not true.
Which part?

[Stillriledup]

Which part?

I'm not sure what Andy means when he says its not true, but i'll tell you what IS true. The truth of the matter is that the DRF has to pay handicappers and figure makers money and that forces the paper to keep raising the price of their PPs. Many people don't want to pay for Beyer figs or Brad Free's picks, many people just want the PPs with no fluff. DRF customers don't want to pay Brad Free or Dave Litfin's salary, they would rather have a cheaper PP option.

[proximity]

. Many people don't want to pay for Beyer figs .


those people can buy a $3.50 equibase program with 15 tracks when they enter the track or otb.

the beyer figures offer more value than any other widely available figures.

i do agree with the original poster that moss needs to get on the ball.

[affirmedny]

Steven Crist (on big race days) and Dan Ilman both have worthwhile blogs. I have been checking Moss's blog about once a month just to see if he has put up anything since last summer, he hasn't----pretty embarrassing.

Not any more embarrassing than Pricci having Bill Christine on his front page 2 months after he quit for not getting paid.

[TravisVOX]

Equibase controls the data in horse racing. If you want to distribute racing information that is official, you have to go through them.

[cj]

Not any more embarrassing than Pricci having Bill Christine on his front page 2 months after he quit for not getting paid.

I don't really think you can compare DRF to a blog.

[Cratos]

You want a recipe for disaster - mix private equity with a company that dominates its industry (i.e., DRF). What is the result, it appears to be an ownership group that raises prices, leverages the assets and cuts costs.

What is the result:

1. A website that crashes every weekend (Formulator) when its customers need it the most.

2. Blogs - whereby the major writers for the paper don't update their blogs for weeks at a time. Randy Moss has not updated his blog for nearly a year. If you don't want to do a blog, that is fine. But don't promote something and then not give any content when the user accesses it. Oh wait, that is the formulator web model.

3. Poor customer service.

I have never seen a more poorly run private organization than DRF. The paper has a great history, but I hope someone with serious capital would enter this industry and give them a run for their money.

DRF was a disaster in the sixties when it had a true monopoly because the industry it supports is a disaster in terms of organization and management.

I believe that the supplier of racing data should be focused on the quality and timeliness of the data to the bettor and not the predictability of the data outcomes. Bettors should be encouraged to wager along their own risk curves.

Incidentally, the true captain of the data supply ship is Equibase.

[macguy]

That's not true.

Hastings Park was giving out free PPs at the start of the season. They weren't DRF PPs, but they were pretty good as far as something for free goes, they were way beyond the 2-3 race lines found in most programs.

It can be done, though at Hastings, it didn't last long.

[the little guy]

I didn't say it " couldn't be done. "

I thought the word " easily " was not a correct way to word it.

[proximity]

3. Poor customer service.

I have never seen a more poorly run private organization than DRF. The paper has a great history, but I hope someone with serious capital would enter this industry and give them a run for their money.

if brisnet would hire a speed figure consultant and create some affordable monthly/annual unlimited plans, they could be the one.

as for drf, they need to improve their i.t. and get some brisnet style pp generator software. why with formulator do i have to waste tons of ink printing fractional times, worthless drf speed ratings and variants, moss race flow......???

also since mr moss isn't making separate pace variants for 90+% of the tracks why are there still no pace figures for presque isle downs and no half mile pace figures for 4 1/2 furlong races anywhere? all he has to do is make a speed chart for these situations since he's not making variants. you don't need 15 years of data to do this. :rolleyes:

[affirmedny]

I don't really think you can compare DRF to a blog.

that's a legitimate point.

[GatetoWire]

also since mr moss isn't making separate pace variants for 90+% of the tracks why are there still no pace figures for presque isle downs and no half mile pace figures for 4 1/2 furlong races anywhere? all he has to do is make a speed chart for these situations since he's not making variants. you don't need 15 years of data to do this. :rolleyes:


It would seem that one of the reasons that Presque Isle is not included is because of the lack of interest. I don't follow that track at all and was shocked just now at the low handle.
$100k on most days and $500k on nights without competition according to DRF Charts.

Can the handle really be this low? No wonder that they don't produce pace figs for this place.

[proximity]

It would seem that one of the reasons that Presque Isle is not included is because of the lack of interest. I don't follow that track at all and was shocked just now at the low handle.
$100k on most days and $500k on nights without competition according to DRF Charts.

Can the handle really be this low? No wonder that they don't produce pace figs for this place.


they make beyers for presque isle and that takes actual work beyond just making a speed chart (getting the variant) and lack of interest doesn't stop moss from making numbers for fp and asd. and even if players aren't interested in presque isle, they do have very good purses and fast horses will evetually ship from there to tracks all over the mid-atlantic.

[ElKabong]

Steven Crist (on big race days) and Dan Ilman both have worthwhile blogs. I have been checking Moss's blog about once a month just to see if he has put up anything since last summer, he hasn't----pretty embarrassing.

re:randy moss...i've seen him hosting segments on the nfl network (yes, the racing r.moss), he may be drifting to that line of work for better pay / future

[proximity]

re:randy moss...i've seen him hosting segments on the nfl network (yes, the racing r.moss), he may be drifting to that line of work for better pay / future

maybe some saints fans will let him know that there's now enough data to make numbers for 1m 70y races at fair grounds too.

[MickJ26]

Apparently I'm in the minority here. I love the DRF. I enjoy the articles, I enjoy the features, I get tons of valuable information. Their website is fantastic. I like comparing my picks to theirs. Hammersley gave me a cold pick four at Hollywood a couple of years ago that I cashed for $800. Not bad for a dollar. Just not crazy about their constant price hikes, though.

[takeout]

Hastings Park was giving out free PPs at the start of the season.How long did they do that?

[PaceAdvantage]

I have never seen a more poorly run private organization than DRF.You need to get out more then.The paper has a great history, but I hope someone with serious capital would enter this industry and give them a run for their money.I think that's been tried more than once...and if someone thought they could make some money doing so, it will be tried again...the fact that it hasn't tells you something.

[Canarsie]

Trackmaster just put out an app for the Droid where you can buy past perfromances for a track for 99 cents. I haven't bought one yet but will certainly try it soon.

For the life of me I can't understand the DRF and their logic. They want to move people off the newspaper edition but price their online product at a ridiculous price in my opinion. If the charged you the same amount for the number of tracks in that days print edition and you could choose your tracks business would boom. Plus the middleman is cut out completely.

I subscribe to the DRF Quick Sheets and think it's the best $100 investment I can make in racing. I save all of them and can go back and see the morning line and other good stuff. That's an unlimited annual price why they can't make the PP's more affordable is beyond my comprehension.

I used to be an unlimited Trackmaster harness subscriber but canceled it after having it quite some time. They actually contacted me and asked why I canceled. I told them "your basic edition is worthless to me, and when you had two price hikes in one year for the platinum it was the beginning of the end". The guy was nice enough to reply and thank me for my suggestions and then told me the USTA bumped them up in price and that's why they did it. You wonder why harness racing is dying look no further than the idiots who are running the insane asylum.

Before someone intercedes and defends them I still have the email there is no defense.

[cj]

You need to get out more then.I think that's been tried more than once...and if someone thought they could make some money doing so, it will be tried again...the fact that it hasn't tells you something.

I think it is because the market is so small rather than being afraid the product is so good.

[macguy]

How long did they do that?

They did it for about the first 3 weeks of the season this year. They then replaced them with a kind of "Tip sheet, analysis" type thing that I had no interest in.

The free PPs were nice while they lasted, though.

[takeout]

Thanks. Any idea why they didn't do it for the whole meet?

[toussaud]

You need to get out more then.I think that's been tried more than once...and if someone thought they could make some money doing so, it will be tried again...the fact that it hasn't tells you something.
DRF hasn't been under their current ownership for all that long correct me if i am wrong. There were sold when I first started following horse racing for something like 60-100 million dollars

[takeout]

http://www1.drf.com/about/about_history.html

[snip]
Previous Ownership

• 1894-1922 Frank Brunell

• 1922-1988 Triangle Publications, Inc.

• 1988-1991 News America

• 1991-1998 K-III/Primedia, Inc.

• 1998-2004 Alpine Capital Group

• 2004-2007 The Wicks Group of Companies, L.L.C.
[snip]

Looks like ’88 is when the merry go round started. Squeeze it and then sell. Does the Wicks Group still own it?

[macguy]

Thanks. Any idea why they didn't do it for the whole meet?


No idea. They switched to a "picks/analysis" sheet instead of the free PPs, my guess is it was cheaper to give out the picks sheet instead of the PPs.

[takeout]

That’s too bad. At least they were on the right track originally.

[takeout]

DRF hasn't been under their current ownership for all that long correct me if i am wrong. There were sold when I first started following horse racing for something like 60-100 million dollars
I looked right over it before. Looks like it’s Arlington Capital Partners now:

[snip]
Ownership Profile

DRF is owned by Arlington Capital Partners (www.arlingtoncap.com), a Washington, DC-based private equity fund with over $1 billion of committed capital focused on middle market buyout investment opportunities in growth industries including: media and information services, healthcare services, aerospace/defense, business services and outsourcing, and education.

The firm’s professionals have a unique combination of operating and private equity experience that enables Arlington to be a value-added investor. Arlington invests in companies in partnership with high quality management teams that are motivated to establish and/or advance their company’s position as leading competitors in their field.
[snip]

Comment: Five owners in the last 23 years. That’s one juicy lemon.

[jelly]

Equibase is the only thing keeping the DRF in business.It also keeps the game from growing by not giving away the pps and creating more players and more handle.

[proximity]

Apparently I'm in the minority here. I love the DRF. I enjoy the articles, I enjoy the features, I get tons of valuable information. Their website is fantastic. I like comparing my picks to theirs. Hammersley gave me a cold pick four at Hollywood a couple of years ago that I cashed for $800. Not bad for a dollar. Just not crazy about their constant price hikes, though.

i do like the drf and although i've been critical of mr moss on this thread, he does seem like a good guy and overall i'm a fan of his pace figures project. if he's following the sport as closely as you'd think someone who is the pace ambassador of the horseplayer's bible should be though then i agree with menifee that there should be more than one blog update in 13 months.

and i'd love to ask crist and beyer if they've ever heard of cj milkowski.

[takeout]

Equibase is the only thing keeping the DRF in business.It also keeps the game from growing by not giving away the pps and creating more players and more handle.Agree.

[KingChas]

and i'd love to ask crist and beyer if they've ever heard of cj milkowski.

I think maybe they just might read us.................. :cool:

http://www1.drf.com/racing_links/links_handisvcs.html

[the little guy]

Equibase is the only thing keeping the DRF in business.It also keeps the game from growing by not giving away the pps and creating more players and more handle.

The first sentence is not true, but please elaborate on why you say it, as I would love to learn from you.

On the second part, please give us your plan for exactly how this will be implemented, and how this will happen.

[TommyCh]

Fully agree. They price it as if they're a monopoly. Their handicappers are mediocre, at best, especially Watchmaker. They all have a tendency to play it safe and pick the buzz horses. Although Illman gives great analysis on individual horses; that's not the same as handicapping.

[Irish Boy]

I don't envy the DRF's position. Newspapers and magazines are taking it on the chin. For newspapers, the major sources of revenue are advertisements and classifieds. Neither of those things will be particularly lucrative for a specialty newspaper.

I'd imagine that within a decade, the DRF will be an online-only production. They'd probably do it now except that old people are 1.) a major demographic and 2.) afraid of the internets. In that world, opinion will matter far less because the writers won't have a monopoly on space; the internet is infinite.

I haven't had any problems with the DRF, but then again, I don't really use any of the bells and whistles either. I read Crist's blog and I buy PDF forms. I'd love it if the forms were a little less expensive, but then again, I buy them one at a time so I hurt myself too. I've got 99 problems but the DRF aint one.

[TommyCh]

I don't envy the DRF's position. Newspapers and magazines are taking it on the chin. For newspapers, the major sources of revenue are advertisements and classifieds. Neither of those things will be particularly lucrative for a specialty newspaper.

I'd imagine that within a decade, the DRF will be an online-only production. They'd probably do it now except that old people are 1.) a major demographic and 2.) afraid of the internets. In that world, opinion will matter far less because the writers won't have a monopoly on space; the internet is infinite.

They'll be totally online before ten years. I believe some smaller OTBs or racebooks that are not easy distribution for DRF simply print out PDFs for customers. At some point, the printing and distribution costs erased from the bottom line will look awfully good to them.

[Irish Boy]

They'll be totally online before ten years. I believe some smaller OTBs or racebooks that are not easy distribution for DRF simply print out PDFs for customers. At some point, the printing and distribution costs erased from the bottom line will look awfully good to them.
I was playing it safe. Like I said, I think they'd like to do it tomorrow, but they likely have a huge clientele of patrons that know the internet is where young people watch pornographic films and not much else.

[jelly]

The first sentence is not true, but please elaborate on why you say it, as I would love to learn from you.

On the second part, please give us your plan for exactly how this will be implemented, and how this will happen.



Just an opinion.I think the DRF believes their future is in the ADW business.


If you get me the Company specs I would happily give you my honest opinion on how this could happen.



Little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?

[Irish Boy]

Just an opinion.I think the DRF believes their future is in the ADW business.
I think you are right. I'm not so sure that's actually true, but I agree.

[proximity]

Little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?

one area on this thread where i was probably wrong was in saying that brisnet should get unlimited plans. the reality is that it should all be pay as you go even if a card has already been clicked on.

[proximity]

one area on this thread where i was probably wrong was in saying that brisnet should get unlimited plans. the reality is that it should all be pay as you go even if a card has already been clicked on.

of course even then the track would just have one person print out the pps and then make copies for the employees and horsemen.

nyra $1249
jelly $1249
proximity $1249:mad:

[the little guy]

Just an opinion.I think the DRF believes their future is in the ADW business.


If you get me the Company specs I would happily give you my honest opinion on how this could happen.



Little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?


But you stated them as facts. Maybe an " I think " before them might have made that easier to understand.

On your failure to answer the second part, unless you can explain how someone should do something you say they should do, your " opinion " really isn't very helpful. Now you want the Company specs? I'm sorry, I just assumed you knew how to do this, otherwise you wouldn't have suggested as much. I guess you didn't.

I do, however, appreciate your honesty in explaining that part.

[jelly]

You said you wanted to know exactly how to implement this,how can one do this without the specs?


Remember these words?
"The promotion and betterment of racing is behind the decision to start Equibase" It's not working.

I THINK it's more about jobs for a few dozen friends.


Must have been a tough question.
I'll ask again little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?

[duncan04]

Must have been a tough question.
I'll ask again little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?


Why does it matter?

[jelly]

Just curious,do you think it's an inappropriate question?

[the little guy]

You said you wanted to know exactly how to implement this,how can one do this without the specs?


Remember these words?
"The promotion and betterment of racing is behind the decision to start Equibase" It's not working.

I THINK it's more about jobs for a few dozen friends.


Must have been a tough question.
I'll ask again little Guy,do you pay for your Past Performances?


You seem to be confused, and in your haste to try to appear clever, are asking a rhetorical question as though anyone with a clue doesn't see that it is both irrelevant and a deflection.

I never stated some opinion here. I am all for investigating anything that might make this industry better and stronger. However, you make very flippant comments, with some confusing certainty, and thus I fairly asked you how these things ( that in your words are " easy " ) can be done. I don't see how this is unfair ( it's not ). Your reaction is to not answer and ask me a superfluous ( and rhetorical ) question.

You post as though you have all the answers, yet when asked, you have none. A question is not an answer.

[duncan04]

Just curious,do you think it's an inappropriate question?


No just don't understand why it matters? Are you trying to make a point? Just asking

[jelly]

I applaud you for not having to pay for your pps,I want this for everyone.
I believe this will help grow this game.I believe the cost of pps is keeping this game from becoming mainstream.That and the high takeout of course.



I'm not being a wise a$$
I'd like to know your ideas that might make the industry better and stronger?





"The promotion and betterment of racing is behind the decision to start Equibase"

[duncan04]

I applaud you for not having to pay for your pps,I want this for everyone.
I believe this will help grow this game.I believe the cost of pps is keeping this game from becoming mainstream.That and the high takeout of course.



I'm not being a wise a$$
I'd like to know your ideas that might make the industry better and stronger?





"The promotion and betterment of racing is behind the decision to start Equibase"

Did I miss him answering this question or something?

[takeout]

He answered it loud and clear for me by ignoring it.

[eastie]

I'd say that he's paid for more racing forms than you have hair on your head. A $2 bet will get you free PP's on xpressbet, so it's not like it's some special privilege afforded just to him. Plus I threw that 11 guy in that he gave out Monday in the last for the pick 4 for the Saratoga bankroll....:)

[proximity]

A $2 bet will get you free PP's on xpressbet, so it's not like it's some special privilege afforded just to him......:)

we're talking about drf formulator here, not equibase or trackmaster programs.

[PaceAdvantage]

He answered it loud and clear for me by ignoring it.Do you honestly think a guy who works as a NYRA analyst is paying for his PPs?

It would be like someone working in an office and having to pay for the copier paper they use, or their pens, or the computer they work on...give your head a shake man...it was a dumb question to begin with.

[Tom]

I pay for my PPs twice.
Once when I download then and then again when I use them!:mad:

[eastie]

I pay for my PPs twice.
Once when I download then and then again when I use them!:mad:


one of Tom's more truthful and humorous posts for sure

[the little guy]

Do you honestly think a guy who works as a NYRA analyst is paying for his PPs?

It would be like someone working in an office and having to pay for the copier paper they use, or their pens, or the computer they work on...give your head a shake man...it was a dumb question to begin with.


It wasn't a question....it was a deflection. That poster makes one outlandish statement after another, and then when finally questioned on anything, he responds with a question. He did it to Duncan as well. The only surprising thing is that ANYONE fell for it.

[usedtolovetvg]

Canadian harness tracks give you the PPs for free. They are just the basic ones, 6 lines. I prefer the 12 liners but the free ones are ok for the newbies.

[classhandicapper]

In an effort to prove the contrary nature that helps me as a gambler I'm going to take the other side. I think the DRF has made so many improvements over time it's making it progressively more difficult to beat the game. :lol:

When I use Formulator I can do trainer inquiries, watch replays, look up charts to see race development and field strength, find out how horses are coming out of a race (speed figures and key race type analysis), get access to Moss pace figures, look at lifetime PPs to find races on slop, turf etc... that used to not be in the PPs because they only gave you 10 running lines, look up offspring information etc... It's really endless.

15-35 years ago I had a pile of DRFs in my basement covering a couple of years. I had to calculate all my figures and trainer stats manually, look it all up by going through dozens and dozens of back DRFs and notebooks, go to the track to watch races and replays or record races on my VCR etc..

Hours and hours of work are now all just a click away and centrally located.

I agree that's it's not cheap (the paper copy is even worse) and occasionally the response time is not quite what I would like it to be. But overall I think they've done an admirable job of providing more and improved information in an environment where the customer base in shrinking for everyone and where they have other competitors with market share.

If the sport itself gets its act together and starts growing, I am sure the DRF will have the capital and resources to improve their product and services further.

Note: At times I have received my PPs for free because I provided some input and tested software and products for the DRF, but I am a paying customer now.

[Robert Fischer]

in a perfect world, (in addition to the regularly scheduled claiming cards)the major racing circuits would run about 4-5 maiden-alw-stks races broadcast "free" on a state owned channel on every basic cable package in America, in prime time, a couple nights a week. This premium racing would have a seasoned professional sports announcer along with a handicapper (Serling, Crist, Ilman,Welsch,etc...) and most important they would consistently promote the ADW that these Major circuits have created for this purpose along with a toll free Call In number to wager.
The prime time racing could open the option for sponsor ads on owner's silks and track's safety rails, as well as plenty of quick spots for alcohol and cars, etc...

this impossible utopian scenario would see a large increase in pool size and increases across the board. PPs for the Prime Time Racing would obviously be free to account holders.

[takeout]

I still can’t find a thing wrong with post #6. I agree totally.

[the little guy]

I still can’t find a thing wrong with post #6. I agree totally.


I can 100% guarantee there is something wrong with it.

[takeout]

I'm ready to be enlightened.

[GaryG]

The Saturday slowdown has apparently started....formulator is barely working.

[Rapid Grey]

The Saturday slowdown has apparently started....formulator is barely working.

Yep, I can't even login.

[GaryG]

Working now...

[thespaah]

You want a recipe for disaster - mix private equity with a company that dominates its industry (i.e., DRF). What is the result, it appears to be an ownership group that raises prices, leverages the assets and cuts costs.

What is the result:

1. A website that crashes every weekend (Formulator) when its customers need it the most.

2. Blogs - whereby the major writers for the paper don't update their blogs for weeks at a time. Randy Moss has not updated his blog for nearly a year. If you don't want to do a blog, that is fine. But don't promote something and then not give any content when the user accesses it. Oh wait, that is the formulator web model.

3. Poor customer service.

I have never seen a more poorly run private organization than DRF. The paper has a great history, but I hope someone with serious capital would enter this industry and give them a run for their money.
DRF is going the same way most print periodicals are going. Away.

[thespaah]

I looked right over it before. Looks like it’s Arlington Capital Partners now:

[snip]
Ownership Profile

DRF is owned by Arlington Capital Partners (www.arlingtoncap.com), a Washington, DC-based private equity fund with over $1 billion of committed capital focused on middle market buyout investment opportunities in growth industries including: media and information services, healthcare services, aerospace/defense, business services and outsourcing, and education.

The firm’s professionals have a unique combination of operating and private equity experience that enables Arlington to be a value-added investor. Arlington invests in companies in partnership with high quality management teams that are motivated to establish and/or advance their company’s position as leading competitors in their field.
[snip]

Comment: Five owners in the last 23 years. That’s one juicy lemon.
That tells me the Arlington Group isn't one bit interested in the value or quality of the publication to the horseplayer. To them ,the DRF is an asset. And as soon as that asset becomes a liability where the tax write off is no longer viable, the company will slash costs and if that doesn't work, sell or close the paper. JMHO.

[thaskalos]

In an effort to prove the contrary nature that helps me as a gambler I'm going to take the other side. I think the DRF has made so many improvements over time it's making it progressively more difficult to beat the game. :lol:

When I use Formulator I can do trainer inquiries, watch replays, look up charts to see race development and field strength, find out how horses are coming out of a race (speed figures and key race type analysis), get access to Moss pace figures, look at lifetime PPs to find races on slop, turf etc... that used to not be in the PPs because they only gave you 10 running lines, look up offspring information etc... It's really endless.

15-35 years ago I had a pile of DRFs in my basement covering a couple of years. I had to calculate all my figures and trainer stats manually, look it all up by going through dozens and dozens of back DRFs and notebooks, go to the track to watch races and replays or record races on my VCR etc..

Hours and hours of work are now all just a click away and centrally located.

I agree that's it's not cheap (the paper copy is even worse) and occasionally the response time is not quite what I would like it to be. But overall I think they've done an admirable job of providing more and improved information in an environment where the customer base in shrinking for everyone and where they have other competitors with market share.

If the sport itself gets its act together and starts growing, I am sure the DRF will have the capital and resources to improve their product and services further.

Note: At times I have received my PPs for free because I provided some input and tested software and products for the DRF, but I am a paying customer now.
For the quality of their printed product (and for their distribution methods), they should be ashamed of themselves.

Instead of tailoring their product to fit the simulcasting needs of every racing jurisdiction, they choose to include inaccessible racetracks into their printed editions...and then "package" them in such a way where it now becomes necessary to buy as many as THREE different racing forms just for saturday's AM action.

And then they wonder why they are losing ground to the simulcast programs sold at the entrance doors...

And, while their "online" product HAS greatly improved over time...would it kill them to improve their PRINTED product a little as well?

NO pace figures...and NO accurate track variants so the player can construct these pace figures himself.

NO complete trainer stats for the trainers in the race.

NO track bias information.

NO reliable "trouble" lines.

And NO post position numbers for some of the tracks, some of the time...

All this for just $7 an issue...

Nice...:ThmbUp:

[classhandicapper]

For the quality of their printed product (and for their distribution methods), they should be ashamed of themselves.

Instead of tailoring their product to fit the simulcasting needs of every racing jurisdiction, they choose to include inaccessible racetracks into their printed editions...and then "package" them in such a way where it now becomes necessary to buy as many as THREE different racing forms just for saturday's AM action.

And then they wonder why they are losing ground to the simulcast programs sold at the entrance doors...

And, while their "online" product HAS greatly improved over time...would it kill them to improve their PRINTED product a little as well?

NO pace figures...and NO accurate track variants so the player can construct these pace figures himself.

NO complete trainer stats for the trainers in the race.

NO track bias information.

NO reliable "trouble" lines.

And NO post position numbers for some of the tracks, some of the time...

All this for just $7 an issue...

Nice...:ThmbUp:

I know this sounds like a bad excuse (and maybe it is), but I think there are space issues that limit the information available in the print edition PPs and other limitations when it comes to distribution. The more editions they tried to print, the more expensive it would become. Maybe they could do a better job with the track selection in some editions (I don't see most of them). You should make some suggestions directly.

[menifee]

They are down again.

I don't know what's more incredible:

1. In 2011, they can't figure out how to maintain a website and a server; or

2. I keep doing business with them.

[Casino]

Can you imagine what will happen for the Saratoga meet when you cant log on to Formulator holy s$%^!

I still use them,but im planning on a backup just in case,i might just get the paper since i have a annual plan with formulator.
The Spa meet could be interesting for DRF.

[toussaud]

so sick of this damn site i'm trying to look at woodbine enteries to night, i have had to load the page no less than 8 times to get the content to show.

[cj]

Today is brutal. I have no idea what the problem is, but they don't have many PPs posted yet that all the other sites have up. Once they are posted, you have no idea if you can actually access them.

[Rapid Grey]

Cantebury hasn't been able to race in weeks yet the DRF still puts them in the Midwest edition.... :bang:

[cj]

I can't figure out how if they can't work at Canterbury that they keep putting out PPs.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I can't figure out how if they can't work at Canterbury that they keep putting out PPs.

If the fiscal mess gets resolved, they'd like to resume racing ASAP (i.e., not have to wait even a few days to put together entries).

[cj]

If the fiscal mess gets resolved, they'd like to resume racing ASAP (i.e., not have to wait even a few days to put together entries).

I understand why. I just assume someone is doing it for free since racing is shut down.

[johnhannibalsmith]

I understand why. I just assume someone is doing it for free since racing is shut down.

Since they have been taking entries since the impasse began, I'm guessing the salaried employees in the racing office are still being paid by Canterbury (along with the trackman and his staff, cleaning crews, the GM, and anyone else that works essentially outside of mutuels and perhaps concessions).

[David-LV]

Racing will start up again at Canterbury on Thur. July 21, 2011.

________
David-LV

[iwearpurple]

Racing will start up again at Canterbury on Thur. July 21, 2011.

________
David-LV

Where did you get this information from?

[thespaah]

Cantebury hasn't been able to race in weeks yet the DRF still puts them in the Midwest edition.... :bang:
http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=WAVS&type=TV_Shows&movie=Simpsons&quote=32dohs.txt&file=32dohs.wav

[PaceAdvantage]

Racing will start up again at Canterbury on Thur. July 21, 2011.

________
David-LVNot sure if this is definite. Heard there was supposed to be some sort of meeting Monday or Tuesday...something about the Governor or something like that...and that they hope to be back Thursday July 21...sorry to be so vague, but I don't have the info in front of me and I'm going by memory.

[proximity]

another example of the drf's weak i.t. is how they handle the moss pace figures when there is an official time for a fraction but the position/beaten lengths are absent (due to heavy fog for example). in these situations the leader's pace figure will show up as the pace figure for all the horses. of course if you're using the pps you can always look up and see that there is no running position/ beaten lengths for the call in question, but if you're just using the moss pace figures report..... you are screwed.

anyhow, i'm no computer expert, but you'd think that a simple if/then statement could easily handle this.

if beaten lengths=" ", then "-", else "pace figure" ????

[PhantomOnTour]

DRF has their new PP plan for the Saratoga meet for ONLY $1.50 per card.

In years past it was only $1 per card....a 50% increase....for what?
Any new features in the classic DRF pp's?
Sire stats?....no
Class ratings?....no
Pace figs?....no
Track bias info?....no
Post position info?....no

BRIS has all of the above for only $1 per card (and that's not some kinda special deal either).....is it the Beyers that people can't do without???
That's the only thing DRF has that BRIS does not.

Hey, at least they're not rebuilding their website during the opening week of Sar and DelMar like they did last year.
Remember that? Excellent timing there....execution as well...that went smoothly :rolleyes: