Pay Raises, they get pay raises?

[pktruckdriver]

NYRA chief defends execs' raises despite red ink

ALBANY, N.Y. (AP) - The head of the New York Racing Association says executive compensation has increased 3 percent this year despite more red ink projected for the state franchise that operates the Aqueduct, Belmont and Saratoga racetracks.

NYRA chief executive and President Charles Hayward told a news conference in Albany Monday that the raises were justified because the executives haven't had raises in three years, while their health insurance payments have increased.

Last Tuesday, the head of the state's Financial Oversight Board told Hayward there are "significant and unacceptable gaps" in the board's ability to obtain and analyze information about the racing organization's proposed budget.

Hayward says NYRA provided its executive compensation plans to the board on Thursday. He says NYRA is projected to lose $11.6 million this year.







Yes I copied this directly, but losing money deserves pay raise's, I still do not see how they lose money, especially all the money they get from me, how bout you?




totally unreal, think they will hire me, I can lose money too

[PaceAdvantage]

Yes I copied this directly, but losing money deserves pay raise's, I still do not see how they lose money, especially all the money they get from me, how bout you?




totally unreal, think they will hire me, I can lose money tooVery naive response. Maybe you think NYRA should cut back their pay or give them ZERO pay increases for three-five years so that NYRA can lose all of their executives and have to waste time and money hiring headhunters or trying to recruit replacement executives who will work for less pay and zero salary increases over the next three-five years?

And what half-decent executive is going to want to work for a company that doesn't give out any raises over a 3-5 year period, or has to pay them below fair market value?

Just because a company is losing money, this doesn't necessarily mean it's the fault of the executives. How about market forces? How about the general health of the economy? How about the general health of the industry itself?

Examples abound in this nation of industries and corporations that are currently losing money. Do you think all those executives in all those other industries aren't getting paid?

If an executive isn't performing up to snuff, they get fired.

You must think they all sit around a big table at NYRA smoking big fat stogies lit with the $20 bills you hand them through the windows, all the while pointing at you and laughing their asses off....am I warm?

[Tom]

Warmer..... :D
As long as they pay the tickets...who cares?

[Robert Goren]

Very naive response. Maybe you think NYRA should cut back their pay or give them ZERO pay increases for three-five years so that NYRA can lose all of their executives and have to waste time and money hiring headhunters or trying to recruit replacement executives who will work for less pay and zero salary increases over the next three-five years?

And what half-decent executive is going to want to work for a company that doesn't give out any raises over a 3-5 year period, or has to pay them below fair market value?

Just because a company is losing money, this doesn't necessarily mean it's the fault of the executives. How about market forces? How about the general health of the economy? How about the general health of the industry itself?

Examples abound in this nation of industries and corporations that are currently losing money. Do you think all those executives in all those other industries aren't getting paid?

If an executive isn't performing up to snuff, they get fired.

You must think they all sit around a big table at NYRA smoking big fat stogies lit with the $20 bills you hand them through the windows, all the while pointing at you and laughing their asses off....am I warm?Not as general rule in horse racing. I think most bettors believe there is no mismanaged business than horse racing. I tend to agree with them. There is attitude that price doesn't matter in horse racing. I know of no other business where that attitude prevails.

[pktruckdriver]

If an executive isn't performing up to snuff, they get fired.

You must think they all sit around a big table at NYRA smoking big fat stogies lit with the $20 bills you hand them through the windows, all the while pointing at you and laughing their asses off....am I warm?


Yes that is what I think, kick'em to the curb, they can not account for the money and can not answer the public as to why they are losing money, but instead continue to borrow money to operate, can not someone follow the damn money, if I had moeny given to me to do this and I did that I would be held accountable for it, wouldn't I , yet these people are not, BS

[pktruckdriver]

Warmer..... :D
As long as they pay the tickets...who cares?


And Yes Tom , I guess it was this attitude that got us into this mess, but I can't argue with you on this one, they DO PAY THEIR TICKETS, oh well

[GatetoWire]

According to this story on DRF.com
http://www.drf.com/news/nyra-discloses-salary-information

Hayward made $469,000 in 2010. That is pretty low given executive compensation around the country.
If NYRA upped the comp maybe they could get some better execs to run the place.

I bet the casino execs make triple what Hayward takes home.

In fact 5 execs at Churchill make way more than Hayward

http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/officerProfile?symbol=CHDN.O&officerId=827703

[pktruckdriver]

Better yet get me a job here, nobody works harder and longer hours than I do most of the time, and I am pretty sure I could show profits, heck there are and have been so many reports and commissions of committee's to look into this and recommendations made and yet they too go away, isn't it time NYRA becomes respectable and also a money making corp that it should be, am I the only one wishing this, or the only one to speak up, no that is not true, many have tried and they finally quit trying when nothing was ever done, like trying to become a big winner :bang:, but danged if I won't stop :bang:.

send me an email for a job
pktruckdriver@msn.com

going for a walk to cool down, sorry

[pktruckdriver]

According to this story on DRF.com
http://www.drf.com/news/nyra-discloses-salary-information

Hayward made $469,000 in 2010. That is pretty low given executive compensation around the country.
If NYRA upped the comp maybe they could get some better execs to run the place.

I bet the casino execs make triple what Hayward takes home.

In fact 5 execs at Churchill make way more than Hayward

http://www.reuters.com/finance/stocks/officerProfile?symbol=CHDN.O&officerId=827703

But here is another quote
As other track operators such as the New York Racing Association and Magna Entertainment dealt with bankruptcy proceedings in the last few years, Churchill Downs made money and increased revenue, including at its namesake track, which will host the 136th Kentucky Derby on Saturday.

whole story here http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2010/04/20100426/SBJ-In-Depth/Can-This-Man-Save-Horse-Racing.aspx

[PaceAdvantage]

Yes that is what I think, kick'em to the curb, they can not account for the money and can not answer the public as to why they are losing money, but instead continue to borrow money to operate, can not someone follow the damn money, if I had moeny given to me to do this and I did that I would be held accountable for it, wouldn't I , yet these people are not, BSCan you please cite specifics of just what it is you are talking about? Because I am having a hard time understanding you...what money were they given that they did this with when they should have done that?

:confused:

[PaceAdvantage]

And Yes Tom , I guess it was this attitude that got us into this mess, but I can't argue with you on this one, they DO PAY THEIR TICKETS, oh wellWhat mess, exactly? Again, be specific.

[PaceAdvantage]

Not as general rule in horse racing. I think most bettors believe there is no mismanaged business than horse racing. I tend to agree with them. There is attitude that price doesn't matter in horse racing. I know of no other business where that attitude prevails.What kind of control do the NYRA execs currently in place have over price (I assume you mean takeout)?

I hope you are familiar enough with NY racing and those who actually call the shots on price before writing stuff like this...but it sounds like you are not.

[pktruckdriver]

This the local newspaper here in Saratoga, and there are so many more

And how many years back do we go, tell me Bossman , you seem to take this personally, why, because you live in NY, so do I, this organization needs to be cleaned out and completely re-organized, then pay your guys what they are worth when they do what they are suppose to do, make money and not hide from anyone

http://saratogian.com/articles/2011/06/21/news/doc4e013dfda2483170276965.txt



http://leftatthegate.blogspot.com/2011/06/oversight-chairman-insulting-verb-nyra.html


http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/NYRA-leaves-in-the-blanks-1321064.php

these are not my words but someones else's, about how Grand Belmont use to be...

You’re so right. What was once the sport of kings has been sucked dry by leeching politicians. After so many years of mismanagement, why did disgraced former governor Eliot Spitzer decide to give NYRA a 25 year extension on its franchise to run thoroughbred racing in NY instead of allowing it to be run by a profit-making corporation? In private hands, racing in NY would be forced to run its operation efficiently, serve the needs of its customers, and ultimately live or die based on how well it competes in the free market.
The government see all forms of gambling as cash cows for their endless need for revenue. Now they are hoping that we’ll all run to the slot machines to fatten their coffers. Wouldn’t it be great if no one showed up?


NYRA, I love NY racing always have, I do good ,except at Saratoga picking winners, but the people running it, not the Trainers and Jockeys and backstretch staff, no the Exec's and other who take all the money those people make for them and do what with it, tell me please, where does it go, you can't tell me that can you Bossman, why? please tell me where all that money goes and how they can be broke, please tell me

[Cardus]

Albany -- the state capitol -- has been monumentally injurious to racing in New York. I am not the most qualified to say this -- I am comfortable enough, though, based upon personal experience -- to say that I trust the NYRA CEO far, far more than people in Albany. That's fair comment.

[Cardus]

Prior NYRA administrations might have deserved censure, but I am willing to give the current group along, long leash to fix things, as it has for sure.

[Tom]

Here's a tip - never read horse racing article on non-racing newspapers.
The writers are ignorant SOBs with personal agendas and political ties to write the lies they do. You will never read the truth in a newspaper. Especially one in NY.

[OTM Al]

Here's a tip - never read horse racing article on non-racing newspapers.
The writers are ignorant SOBs with personal agendas and political ties to write the lies they do. You will never read the truth in a newspaper. Especially one in NY.

These stories coming out don't tell half the story and not a single one asks why these politicians are going at NYRA again. Can guess that several would love to take the franchise away. That way it can be bid again (and again and again) with all the kickbacks involved plus manuevering to take away more of the slots revenue. Sound familiar? No proof of this of course, but would you doubt it?

Th State Budget Director has some nerve to be at this as well. How far in the red is his budget? Think it's a tad worse. I love how he is bringing up exec salaries again too. Let's see, the numbers were released in 2010 and they are talking about a 5% raise. That's pretty tough math to figure out what they would be now. And as has been stated, these salaries are lower than other places, which means they go even less far because this is New York and stuff just happens to cost more, a lot more in some cases, so the disparity is even bigger than it looks like on paper.

And no one bothers to understand why they would be operating at a loss this year. Might be because since they now have a new revenue stream coming, they have started doing a lot of the capital improvements that they had to put off for years. Good business really, but nothing like a little sensationalism.

Finally, the call center thing is a farce, but since it is now law, guess they can drop a couple million more having to build and hire. In the long run that may work out for the best, but then again, the State approved that move through the R&W Board in the first place, so they only have themselves to point at.

New York politicians are the problem. I trust Cuomo far less than Spitzer when it comes to racing in NY. He will do damage if given the chance.

[dansan]

wish I had a job with health insurance

[PaceAdvantage]

This the local newspaper here in Saratoga, and there are so many more

And how many years back do we go, tell me Bossman , you seem to take this personally, why, because you live in NY, so do I, this organization needs to be cleaned out and completely re-organized, then pay your guys what they are worth when they do what they are suppose to do, make money and not hide from anyone

http://saratogian.com/articles/2011/06/21/news/doc4e013dfda2483170276965.txt



http://leftatthegate.blogspot.com/2011/06/oversight-chairman-insulting-verb-nyra.html


http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/NYRA-leaves-in-the-blanks-1321064.php

these are not my words but someones else's, about how Grand Belmont use to be...

You’re so right. What was once the sport of kings has been sucked dry by leeching politicians. After so many years of mismanagement, why did disgraced former governor Eliot Spitzer decide to give NYRA a 25 year extension on its franchise to run thoroughbred racing in NY instead of allowing it to be run by a profit-making corporation? In private hands, racing in NY would be forced to run its operation efficiently, serve the needs of its customers, and ultimately live or die based on how well it competes in the free market.
The government see all forms of gambling as cash cows for their endless need for revenue. Now they are hoping that we’ll all run to the slot machines to fatten their coffers. Wouldn’t it be great if no one showed up?


NYRA, I love NY racing always have, I do good ,except at Saratoga picking winners, but the people running it, not the Trainers and Jockeys and backstretch staff, no the Exec's and other who take all the money those people make for them and do what with it, tell me please, where does it go, you can't tell me that can you Bossman, why? please tell me where all that money goes and how they can be broke, please tell meWhy do we need to go back any years? Your thread was started about these current execs and their salaries. This has nothing to do with past years.

And you never answered my questions. Yet you ask me more?

The answers to all your questions are not secret...not hidden...NYRA is required to disclose much of what you are asking...why don't you look it up?

I'm not out here looking to lynch NYRA management like you apparently are, so I don't know the answer to your question. I honestly don't know why you are so angry with NYRA management. Are they not putting on a quality racing show? Are people not betting into their product?

It seems to me you're angry at them from a class warfare type of angle...you seem to think they are making too much money...how much money are they making compared to the suits in Southern California? That's a comparable racing venue, is it not?

How much worse is SoCal doing than NYRA? Many would say MUCH worse. How much should those guys be making?

NYRA has streamlined itself since the days of the Federal Indictment. Many of the old guard is gone.

Exactly how do you expect NYRA to continue improving its situation? With underpaid and/or under qualified people at the helm?

Racing will never be in private hands in the state of New York as long as the politicians can see a way for them to get an ever increasing slice of the pie by requiring the state to be racing's overlord.

[takeout]

I don’t get it. Why is Hayward yanking these guys around?
And, why are they putting up with it?
I can’t figure out who’s the boss of whom here.

[offtrack]

It must indeed be time for racing at Saratoga.

The tradition of henchmen sounding off just prior to the upstate meet has begun. The politicos think there is power/votes in berating NYRA in public.
Happens every year around this time.

I've come to view the chest thumping and posing over who really runs racing as great entertainment.

The 3% pay raises were applied in DECEMBER, as NYC OTB closed up.

I have found C Haywood to be a right guy, he visits Saratoga simulcast in the off season on occasion. Always takes questions from fans.

[overthehill]

It seems strange to me to see so many of you sticking up for these guys, when i see such a decline in the quality of racing in new york over the years. i never thought i would ever see so many $10k claiming races at Belmont. While I agree that the political hacks are no knights in shining armor. I believe that NY racing fans have always suffered from lack of disclosure by the powers that be and i always think its suspicious when a public entity goes to court to try to prevent the release of documents.

[PaceAdvantage]

It seems strange to me to see so many of you sticking up for these guys, when i see such a decline in the quality of racing in new york over the years.Why would you find it strange?

And NYRA isn't exactly a public entity as you simply describe it...never has been....

[Robert Goren]

What kind of control do the NYRA execs currently in place have over price (I assume you mean takeout)?

I hope you are familiar enough with NY racing and those who actually call the shots on price before writing stuff like this...but it sounds like you are not.Are they actively lobbying for lower takeouts? If they are, I haven't heard about. Everybody and their dog need to be working for lower takeouts everywhere. In the long run, it is racing's only hope.

[point given]

Seems to me that the new guard (last 5 years) is being lumped in with the bad practices of the old guard which I think is wrong. Hayward is a standup guy and he has done a good job. It is a difficult time for racing and NYRA is addressing the issues headon. A big portion of the debt as he stated was the large one they had to write off from NYCOTB. The raises I think are mistimed though as they would have better been served when the company shows a profit. Been through similar downturns

[Bruddah]

The truth is, the execs at NYRA don't turn a paper clip to earn their salaries. The suits don't make or break racing in the state. It's all political and the everyday folks doing the work get laid off, when there are needs for budget cuts. If you don't think so, go back and read and read some more.

PA supports the NYRA simply because it's the NYRA and his father will be retiring from that organization in the not to distant future. I can understand and sympathize with his support but let's put the bias in the open when debating.

[OTM Al]

The truth is, the execs at NYRA don't turn a paper clip to earn their salaries. The suits don't make or break racing in the state. It's all political and the everyday folks doing the work get laid off, when there are needs for budget cuts. If you don't think so, go back and read and read some more.

PA supports the NYRA simply because it's the NYRA and his father will be retiring from that organization in the not to distant future. I can understand and sympathize with his support but let's put the bias in the open when debating.

This may be the most uninformed and ridiculous statement I have ever read on this board. Congrats.

[Bruddah]

This may be the most uninformed and ridiculous statement I have ever read on this board. Congrats.

How so, oh wise one?

[Tom]

NYRA is far below past years in terms of quality.
That is because the entire industry is far below where it was in past years.
NYRA puts on show year round. Who has a better product? No one comes close.

[OTM Al]

How so, oh wise one?

I don't see a point in discussing it with you. It's very clear that you are clueless when it comes to the workings of upper management in any large business concern to be able to make such a statement. Guess you just figure all the stuff that goes on, most of which I'm sure you are completely unaware of, happens by magic. Say that you don't like the product. That's a personal preference that everyone has the right to, but don't make ignorant statements you can't back up and know nothing about.

[the little guy]

I don't see a point in discussing it with you. It's very clear that you are clueless when it comes to the workings of upper management in any large business concern to be able to make such a statement. Guess you just figure all the stuff that goes on, most of which I'm sure you are completely unaware of, happens by magic. Say that you don't like the product. That's a personal preference that everyone has the right to, but don't make ignorant statements you can't back up and know nothing about.


I'm just trying to figure out who PA's Dad is.

[lamboguy]

Are they actively lobbying for lower takeouts? If they are, I haven't heard about. Everybody and their dog need to be working for lower takeouts everywhere. In the long run, it is racing's only hope.i think its the state of new york that regulates the takeout for the tracks.

i said this before, the smartest thing NYRA did was cut half the breakage by paying to the dime. it makes their takeout in essence less than california even though the rate in cally is lower. if they didn't pay the dime the handle would be down more at this point. barry swartz deserved a double raise for figuring out that one ahead of time. that one move kept them in action and maybe things straighten out and horseracing returns.

[the little guy]

i think its the state of new york that regulates the takeout for the tracks.

i said this before, the smartest thing NYRA did was cut half the breakage by paying to the dime. it makes their takeout in essence less than california even though the rate in cally is lower. if they didn't pay the dime the handle would be down more at this point. barry swartz deserved a double raise for figuring out that one ahead of time. that one move kept them in action and maybe things straighten out and horseracing returns.


Steve Crist was responsible for the dime breakage......not Barry.

[Robert Fischer]

http://kosherspaghetti.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/schwartz.jpg

[lamboguy]

Steve Crist was responsible for the dime breakage......not Barry.
when did steve christ work for NYRA?

[pktruckdriver]

Wow, another can of worms for fodder, yes I do stir it up once in awhile, but i still feel I am right here, to a degree.

And yes the racing has been slowly declining in the City, and will see how the Spa does this year, but that is like Tom says almost everywhere, unless you're in La. , but those are full fields but of what caliber of horse.

I would like to know why NYRA will not disclose its books completely, that to me means there is something to hide, am I wrong there, of course not.

Show me where and how they are losing money, quit stating I do not answer your questions, as I do, but you do not provide me with this info, can you?

Let me see a breakdown of all the losing of the monies taken in by NYRA, let me see where all the monies taken in are paid out and to who, is this too much to ask, should be simple enough , money in and money out , please enlighten me as to how this works and show me why we are losing all this money.

Now for Mr. Hayward, been there since when 2004, too long not to have turned this around, so no pity thrown his way, he's had over 7 years to fix things, and nothing yet, just indictments and scandals abound, come on am I the only seeing this , this way?

Please let me state this does not affect , what use to be and still is some of the best racing in the counrty, as stated earlier I love NYRA racing and do good with capping it, except The Spa, and want it to continue, but I feel major change is necessary, how long do you need to turn things around, to me 7 years is too long to not have done it by now, heck no, no raises.

You want to pay more for Executive salaries then hire better people and pay them more to do the job at hand, make NYRA the best it can be, quit being afraid to stand up to these people and state the facts as they are, they are losing money and do not show any potential of ever making any, since we can not see the books and verify anything, so how would we ever know.

Bossman this is not personal or an attack on anyone person, it is a personal opinion of mine that NYRA is not being run right and has not been for years, many many years and no one has had the cojone's to stand up and say hey enough of this . why , well because they did manage to put out quality racing , that is not in question, and I think these 2 are different entities, and maybe the racing people should be moved over to the executive level here, they seem to know how to do their jobs, and put out good racing, bet they could follow the money and be willing to show where it is and where it went...

God Bless NYRA, but let's fix this

[PaceAdvantage]

The truth is, the execs at NYRA don't turn a paper clip to earn their salaries. The suits don't make or break racing in the state. It's all political and the everyday folks doing the work get laid off, when there are needs for budget cuts. If you don't think so, go back and read and read some more.

PA supports the NYRA simply because it's the NYRA and his father will be retiring from that organization in the not to distant future. I can understand and sympathize with his support but let's put the bias in the open when debating.I'm glad there is so much misinformation floating the interwebs about me...because with all the nuts that exist out here, why the hell would I want anyone to know the real story behind me?

Yeah, my dad is going to be retiring from NYRA soon... :lol:

Thanks for the laugh Mr. Ignorant.

[PaceAdvantage]

Show me where and how they are losing money, quit stating I do not answer your questions, as I do, but you do not provide me with this info, can you?No, you didn't answer my questions. And you should be able to get all the info you want on NYRA. After all, according to someone else on this thread, they are a public company... :lol:

Let me see a breakdown of all the losing of the monies taken in by NYRA, let me see where all the monies taken in are paid out and to who, is this too much to ask, should be simple enough , money in and money out , please enlighten me as to how this works and show me why we are losing all this money.When you tried to get this info, what got in your way? How did you go about trying to obtain it?

Bossman this is not personal or an attack on anyone person, it is a personal opinion of mine that NYRA is not being run right and has not been for years, many many years and no one has had the cojone's to stand up and say hey enough of this .Who said it was a personal attack? You made your statement and I responded. I think your facts are wrong and your opinion is misguided, and I responded in kind.

[Bruddah]

I'm glad there is so much misinformation floating the interwebs about me...because with all the nuts that exist out here, why the hell would I want anyone to know the real story behind me?

Yeah, my dad is going to be retiring from NYRA soon... :lol:

Thanks for the laugh Mr. Ignorant.


Well inform the ignorant.

[cj]

Well inform the ignorant.

Seems a bit much to make a false accusation, then when told it is false ask for proof. Why not state why you made the accusation in the first place? What proof did you have? I mean, obviously the answer is none since it is wrong, but what made you think you knew?

[Bruddah]

I don't see a point in discussing it with you. It's very clear that you are clueless when it comes to the workings of upper management in any large business concern to be able to make such a statement. Guess you just figure all the stuff that goes on, most of which I'm sure you are completely unaware of, happens by magic. Say that you don't like the product. That's a personal preference that everyone has the right to, but don't make ignorant statements you can't back up and know nothing about.


The only point you have is the one at the top of your head. I have been on the Board of two transportation companies that were on the NY Stock Exchange. I know the inner working of Corporations and Upper Mgmt. quite well. I stand by my statement that upper Mgmt at NYRA doesn't do squat for their salaries. They are walk around empty suits.

[PaceAdvantage]

The only point you have is the one at the top of your head. I have been on the Board of two transportation companies that were on the NY Stock Exchange. I know the inner working of Corporations and Upper Mgmt. quite well. I stand by my statement that upper Mgmt at NYRA doesn't do squat for their salaries. They are walk around empty suits.This coming from the guy who thinks my dad is retiring from NYRA soon...

As TLG likes to say, the silliness never ends.

[Bruddah]

Seems a bit much to make a false accusation, then when told it is false ask for proof. Why not state why you made the accusation in the first place? What proof did you have? I mean, obviously the answer is none since it is wrong, but what made you think you knew?


Going by past posts made by PA. He has said his father was a 20+ year NYRA Teller. So, did PA lie again? He has been known to lie. If I'm wrong then my apoligies. If not, well then, PA has lied again.

[cj]

Going by past posts made by PA. He has said his father was a 20+ year NYRA Teller. So, did PA lie again? He has been known to lie. If I'm wrong then my apoligies. If not, well then, PA has lied again.

You think he lies? Is this a habit of which I'm not aware? I think you are way off base here.

[Cardus]

Well inform the ignorant.

You're on much safer ground when you stick to the "Vive La Revolution" type of posts.

[the little guy]

when did steve christ work for NYRA?

Use google.

The better question is why you constantly post serious misinformation on this board.

And his name is spelled CRIST.

I feel like this is a Monty Python skit.

[lamboguy]

Use google.

The better question is why you constantly post serious misinformation on this board.

And his name is spelled CRIST.

I feel like this is a Monty Python skit.when i grow up some day i want to be just like you my good man

[the little guy]

when i grow up some day i want to be just like you my good man


You play the authority here, yet any time you post about something I specifically know about, you are wrong....which leads me to assume just about everything you post is inaccurate. Trust me, I think it's funny, but there are people that read here that incorrectly may think you have some industry knowledge, and are thus led astray. It's unfortunate.

[Cardus]

Use google.

The better question is why you constantly post serious misinformation on this board.

And his name is spelled CRIST.

I feel like this is a Monty Python skit.

Except that it is not funny.

[Cardus]

when did steve christ work for NYRA?

If memory serves, one board contributor has (or had) beneath his posts a quote of Crist's from his tenure at NYRA.

[pktruckdriver]

http://www.leaderobserver.com/view/full_story/5665941/article-List-of-issues-at-NYRA-just-got-longer-?instance=lead_story_left_column


and then there is the OSC

http://www.osc.state.ny.us/press/releases/jan10/011310.htm


these report show that NYRA refuses to open the books and still this does not show me proof that they did either, but where are the reports of this audit?


Supposedly the Audit , or one of the Audit reports, by the State, 2010

http://www.osc.state.ny.us/audits/allaudits/093010/09s89.pdf

same old same it says here, but maybe not, this time 2011

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-06-23/sports/29710604_1_nyra-fob-top-executives

This is some of my reading and findings , still nothing to make me change my views thou

[pktruckdriver]

The answers to all your questions are not secret...not hidden...NYRA is required to disclose much of what you are asking...why don't you look it up?

I'm not out here looking to lynch NYRA management like you apparently are, so I don't know the answer to your question. I honestly don't know why you are so angry with NYRA management. Are they not putting on a quality racing show? Are people not betting into their product?

It seems to me you're angry at them from a class warfare type of angle...you seem to think they are making too much money...how much money are they making compared to the suits in Southern California? That's a comparable racing venue, is it not?

Bossman , this is almost insulting to me, referring to my class level as an agenda for head hunting here, come on man...we all know I am living below the poverty line here, yet this in no way is why I am upset with the exec's at NYRA, it is there piss poor job, period.

I ,ay not be successful in my career's or my financial security is not there, because I am not smart enough to do the right moves, this is all documented here, I am terrible in this area, and I am not hiding that fact , never have , my failures and plenty and yet those here and many I have met are successful, and I am not mad at them, or headhunting what they have, they all earned what they have, just like you did and other here, and for the ones I am friends with , they can attest to this, as well as you should, when we met, I did think or act liked you owed me anything, no I was honored to meet you and thanked you for your board and you hospitality at the Spa, as with the others I met, I do not hope that I came off as a nutcase, hell bent on vendetta's and jealous of anyone making a living and earning real wages in this day and age, no sir.

Now am I a little bit envious of some of the toys y'all had and the ability to eat at the finest place's in town, while I worked long hard hours for little pay, pay that would never put above the poverty line, yet I did work hard and still do work for slave wages, my stupid choice, but not one I blame on others for, and never ever would I go head hunting because some one was a class or 2 above me, hell every one is above in that level, so please let that lie....my terrible sense of business and work is my own, yet I am proud that I work and thou for little pay, I do work, and one day a better job may come as i am always looking for it , like those in charge of NYRA should do


Maybe NYRA could hire me to haul horse's , they definetly do alot of hauling
around NY, can you use one more driver?

[Bruddah]

You're on much safer ground when you stick to the "Vive La Revolution" type of posts.


And your on safer ground when you're not making posts of any kind. One of the more usless contributors to any discussion.

[Cardus]

And your on safer ground when you're not making posts of any kind. One of the more usless contributors to any discussion.

I am not descending to "you're" level.

[OTM Al]

I am not descending to "you're" level.

Posted much the same when Pricci puked out some badly researched uninformed article on the subject and started calling me names because I called him on it. Great fun that. Everything I've read about the subject on the net is going in cycles quoting each other, so most of what you read is crap. Pricci seems to think he knows it all too, but he doesn't have anything either. Frankly this being NYC I'm shocked they are paid so little. I wonder when the last time was a writer actually left the press box other than when the copier breaks.

[Relwob Owner]

I am not descending to "you're" level.

You initially commented on his post, telling him that "You're on much safer ground when you stick to the "Vive La Revolution" type of posts.".....he responded back and commented on you and your contributions and now you say you are not descending to his level? Makes no sense, as you established the level, didnt you? If I am wrong, let me know but it looks pretty clear to me.

As far as the thread goes, it seems to me that like most organizations, there is much that goes on at NYRA and with the industry in general and that just pointing the finger at "overpaid execs" who are "empty suits" is probably simplistic.

[takeout]

I stand by my statement that upper Mgmt at NYRA doesn't do squat for their salaries. They are walk around empty suits.Why do I find this so easy to believe? Probably because I keep reading stuff like this:

[snip]
"State law grants the FOB the authority to review management and employee compensation plans, but your budget provides no detail on the compensation of senior management," the letter read.

NYRA would not comment.
[snip]

[pktruckdriver]

this was to be a PM instead of a psot, but the PM thingy did not work so hopefully the guys I wanted to send this too will comment here

Gentlemen:
Ok, please tell me where I am wrong here, but 500k is too much for someone not turning things around, isn't it?

I'm not trying to get rid of NYRA, just the people not doing the right things, because most of the people at NYRA are doing awesome jobs, look at the moves they make , so efficiently, the drug testing for horses is above most states, the racing is top notch, so why can not the management be the same.

I always ask a simple question, where is the money going to, please show me exactly where it goes, no one can do this, why.

money comes in, and then money goes out

we know it comes from bettor's, basically

bettors get some back yes, but then where does the rest go, this should not be too hard to show , no?

we know 900k for horse transportation, 1 million for advertising help, etc.., but where is the rest going, please show me, why doesn't the audit show this, I thought it would do that, but it does not, why not?



I really do not want this to get carried away, NYRA isn't the evil empire here, I love it and hope it stays around for a long time, but profitably, before vlt's

people in charge who can run it correctly, before VLT money comes in

Good Night

patrick

[Tom]

What does any of this have to do with the racing product?

[JustRalph]

I'm just trying to figure out who PA's Dad is.

Alright, the cat's out of the bag. It's me..........

[castaway01]

If memory serves, one board contributor has (or had) beneath his posts a quote of Crist's from his tenure at NYRA.

There's no need to bring up that inaccurate misquoted junk again, is there?

[Cardus]

You initially commented on his post, telling him that "You're on much safer ground when you stick to the "Vive La Revolution" type of posts.".....he responded back and commented on you and your contributions and now you say you are not descending to his level? Makes no sense, as you established the level, didnt you? If I am wrong, let me know but it looks pretty clear to me.

As far as the thread goes, it seems to me that like most organizations, there is much that goes on at NYRA and with the industry in general and that just pointing the finger at "overpaid execs" who are "empty suits" is probably simplistic.

OK, Bowler, Amen Bruddah -- not so coveted by intelligent people in this thread -- posts something about PA's dad that is false, and I am establishing a low level?

I am letting you know that you are wrong.

[cj]

Alright, the cat's out of the bag. It's me..........

Does that make you....my Grandpa?

[JustRalph]

Does that make you....my Grandpa?

No, but I think your dad is considering adopting me........which would make him PA's Grandpa..........kinda............

[Rico8812]

I don't understand why NYRA doesn't fire back at the NY State hacks reminding everyone how much they pay the state each year in Tax money from the takeout. YEah, NYRA lost $10 mil. Yet they probably paid NYS $50 million in taxes.

[PaceAdvantage]

Going by past posts made by PA. He has said his father was a 20+ year NYRA Teller. So, did PA lie again? He has been known to lie. If I'm wrong then my apoligies. If not, well then, PA has lied again.Seriously man, and I mean this with all due respect....

WHAT THE FVCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?

My father a 20 year NYRA teller? I don't need more than 10 fingers and toes to count the number of times my father has walked into a NYRA establishment in my LIFETIME.

You seriously need to update your source of information.

[PaceAdvantage]

I always ask a simple question, where is the money going to, please show me exactly where it goes, no one can do this, why.Because we don't work for NYRA and anyone who does here (like TLG) doesn't have access to that kind of information.

If any NYRA "suit" wishes to come out of hiding and post in this thread, maybe you can ask him or her. But if they were to answer your question, they would likely be risking their job.

Maybe you should call NYRA, or maybe the state auditor...maybe they will answer your question. But probably not.

Why would you think any of us would be privy to this kind of corporate information? Can you go to any company and demand to see this kind of accounting? I don't think so...

NYRA isn't a public company. They are a quasi-government entity...not totally public, not totally private.

[saratoga guy]

Show me where and how they are losing money...

Well, I'll toss this out there -- when NYC-OTB closed they owed NYRA $28mil. Eventually about a third of that was paid. A third.

it is a personal opinion of mine that NYRA is not being run right and has not been for years

I stand by my statement that upper Mgmt at NYRA doesn't do squat for their salaries. They are walk around empty suits.

I bring up this question every time this NYRA-bashing nonsense kicks in...

Point me to the racing orgnaiztion out there that you think is doing a real bang-up job. Particularly helpful would be pointing to an organization similar to NYRA (three tracks, year-round top level racing) without expanded gaming.

Churchill Downs made money and increased revenue...

Yeah, and Churchill owns two tracks with slots - and one stand-alone casino.

They couldn't make a go of slots-less Hollywood or Ellis Park. A number of longtime regular trainers and owners at slots-less Churchill have moved their strings to more lucrative venues. And as recently as May the CEO hinted that slots-less Arlington could be on the chopping block.

And they've done things that would get NYRA blasted in a discussion like this -- for example, they installed an artificial surface at Arlington which jocks had some safety concerns about -- and last year's HullabaLOU music festival at Churchill is reported to have lost $5mil.

Magna? They're doing OK at slots-boosted Gulfstream, but certainly not as well at slots-less Santa Anita and Maryland.

Del Mar? They're making contingency plans in case short fields cancel dates this season.

Keeneland? The economy forced purses to be cut last fall - for the second year.

I'ts tough all over. The economy. Shrinking foal crops. Increased competition for the entertainment dollar. But please guys - who do you look to out there as the 'white knight' that you think is better suited NY racing? ... And how would they make your life better?

[lamboguy]

Use google.

The better question is why you constantly post serious misinformation on this board.

And his name is spelled CRIST.

I feel like this is a Monty Python skit.you indulge one's spirit, and invoke's one soul

little guy, you are my IDOL

[Relwob Owner]

OK, Bowler, Amen Bruddah -- not so coveted by intelligent people in this thread -- posts something about PA's dad that is false, and I am establishing a low level?

I am letting you know that you are wrong.


Got it. The level you were alluding to was a reference to his comments about PA's Dad, not his comment on your posts? If that is the case, I misinterpreted and stand corrected.

[takeout]

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/NYRA-pay-increases-A-good-wager-1444994.php

[snip]
The top six officers of NYRA received a total of nearly $2.25 million, with pay increases ranging from 2.4 percent to a whopping 7.7 percent.
[snip]
General Counsel Patrick Kehoe's pay climbed to $423,000, a 2.4 percent increase.

Kehoe told the Franchise Oversight Board two weeks ago that the pay of administrators needed to remain private because union and media scrutiny would not serve NYRA well.
[snip]

Comment: Priceless.

[OTM Al]

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/NYRA-pay-increases-A-good-wager-1444994.php

[snip]
The top six officers of NYRA received a total of nearly $2.25 million, with pay increases ranging from 2.4 percent to a whopping 7.7 percent.
[snip]
General Counsel Patrick Kehoe's pay climbed to $423,000, a 2.4 percent increase.

Kehoe told the Franchise Oversight Board two weeks ago that the pay of administrators needed to remain private because union and media scrutiny would not serve NYRA well.
[snip]

Comment: Priceless.

No, what is priceless is that all these raises had to be approved by the oversight board. 11 of the 25 members are employed by the State. All 11 approved. The State, or at least its appointed representatives, already knew all this information. This is simply grandstanding at its best and something a lot more nefarious (though well in line with the standard NYS politico) at its worst. The telebet thing was also approved by the Racing and Wagering Board by the way, so the outrage on that is equally ridiculous.

[lamboguy]

when you compare the head of NYRA's pay to others in this industry, he's not even in the same area code. i am not saying he is worth or not worth the $475,000 he gets, but the comparison to others exist. of course you have CEO's of major public financial institutions like Jaime Diamon of Chase that gets something like $15 million a year plus bonus. Loyd Blankfein gets around the same pay. Chambers from cisco systems has blown up people's retirement funds and he gets big money as well. profit margin's on everything you use or buy these days is unreal. you are getting stuck up no matter what you spend your money on today. take a look at the guys running the auromobile company's here, they are way overpaid, they got bailed out by taxpayers, and they still can't sell any cars here.

i mean seriously, Haywood should get a raise along with all the tellers, touts and valet parking guys that work in the new york tracks.

[point given]

as the NYRA COO in September. That should save some shekels.
http://www.drf.com/news/nyra-handel-resign-chief-operating-officer

[Robert Fischer]

barry swartz
steve christ
his father was a 20+ year NYRA Teller. So, did PA lie again? He has been known to lie. If I'm wrong then my apoligies. If not, well then, PA has lied again.
ARCHIVE

[pktruckdriver]

when you compare the head of NYRA's pay to others in this industry, he's not even in the same area code. i am not saying he is worth or not worth the $475,000 he gets, but the comparison to others exist. of course you have CEO's of major public financial institutions like Jaime Diamon of Chase that gets something like $15 million a year plus bonus. Loyd Blankfein gets around the same pay. Chambers from cisco systems has blown up people's retirement funds and he gets big money as well. profit margin's on everything you use or buy these days is unreal. you are getting stuck up no matter what you spend your money on today. take a look at the guys running the auromobile company's here, they are way overpaid, they got bailed out by taxpayers, and they still can't sell any cars here.

i mean seriously, Haywood should get a raise along with all the tellers, touts and valet parking guys that work in the new york tracks.


Lamb I agree with some of what you say here, the tellers, touts and valet guys, as well as all the others doing real work, for real wages, yes give them all a raise , they do a pretty damn good job, could it be better, of course, but it isn't that bad, and beef is not with these people, they work hard and deserve a raise, but Exec's do not deserve squat, actually they should be kicked to the curb and new blood should emerge and turn NYRA into the giant it can and should be, that is my story and I am sticking to it.

7 years and no progress, and when asked anything about the money they clam up, they should'a been gone years ago, then hire the right Exec's and pay them million dollar salaries, and let them earn bonuses for showing profit's , and this I am sure can be done, but those in charge now are not doing it.

Good day

[lamboguy]

agreeing with me on this board might be a dirty word to some. i am waiting for the cavalry to show up and get me for something wrong that i said today again, but thank you for at least agreeing with what i have posted sometimes.

[affirmedny]

as the NYRA COO in September. That should save some shekels.
http://www.drf.com/news/nyra-handel-resign-chief-operating-officer

I don't see the word "retire" in that article, but anyway this is the best news of all for anyone rooting for NYRA to make a comeback.

[affirmedny]

Also, NJBETS users, Handel is the a-hole behind the blocking of the NYRA signal to NJBETS. good riddance.

[saratoga guy]

, but Exec's do not deserve squat, actually they should be kicked to the curb and new blood should emerge and turn NYRA into the giant it can and should be, that is my story and I am sticking to it.


OK, I'll try this one more time:

"Kicked to the curb" in favor or what? Point me towards the racetrack management team that, in your opinion, is doing a bang-up job - and who, therefore, is some shining example of what you think NYRA can become.

Tell me where NYRA has fallen short - for you, as a customer, as compared to what this other imaginary entity can accomplish here in 2011 given the current circumstances of the racing industry.

Please, enlighten me.

[OTM Al]

I don't see the word "retire" in that article, but anyway this is the best news of all for anyone rooting for NYRA to make a comeback.

Another genius heard from....

[the little guy]

Another genius heard from....


The internet....where lies are truths.

[Tom]

Now my conundrum... do I believe this or not?:confused:

[point given]

Now my conundrum... do I believe this or not?:confused:

Define, THIS ;)

[Rico8812]

Well, I'll toss this out there -- when NYC-OTB closed they owed NYRA $28mil. Eventually about a third of that was paid. A third.





I bring up this question every time this NYRA-bashing nonsense kicks in...

Point me to the racing orgnaiztion out there that you think is doing a real bang-up job. Particularly helpful would be pointing to an organization similar to NYRA (three tracks, year-round top level racing) without expanded gaming.



Yeah, and Churchill owns two tracks with slots - and one stand-alone casino.

They couldn't make a go of slots-less Hollywood or Ellis Park. A number of longtime regular trainers and owners at slots-less Churchill have moved their strings to more lucrative venues. And as recently as May the CEO hinted that slots-less Arlington could be on the chopping block.

And they've done things that would get NYRA blasted in a discussion like this -- for example, they installed an artificial surface at Arlington which jocks had some safety concerns about -- and last year's HullabaLOU music festival at Churchill is reported to have lost $5mil.

Magna? They're doing OK at slots-boosted Gulfstream, but certainly not as well at slots-less Santa Anita and Maryland.

Del Mar? They're making contingency plans in case short fields cancel dates this season.

Keeneland? The economy forced purses to be cut last fall - for the second year.

I'ts tough all over. The economy. Shrinking foal crops. Increased competition for the entertainment dollar. But please guys - who do you look to out there as the 'white knight' that you think is better suited NY racing? ... And how would they make your life better?

Sharp post.

[PaceAdvantage]

Lamb I agree with some of what you say here, the tellers, touts and valet guys, as well as all the others doing real work, for real wages, yes give them all a raise , they do a pretty damn good job, could it be better, of course, but it isn't that bad, and beef is not with these people, they work hard and deserve a raise, but Exec's do not deserve squat, actually they should be kicked to the curb and new blood should emerge and turn NYRA into the giant it can and should be, that is my story and I am sticking to it.Serious question...how do you know any of this? How do you know the tellers, touts and valet guys are:

a) NOT getting raises?
b) are doing a pretty damn good job and/or work hard?

Again, it seems as though you are approaching this from a class warfare perspective. You automatically think those making more money aren't working hard, aren't doing anything productive, and are the sole cause of what you perceive to be NYRA's problems, while the guys making less money are all working their asses off in a virtual slave labor camp.

And no, when I mention class warfare, that is not some knock on you like you interpreted it in an earlier reply when I also used the term "class warfare." Some of the wealthiest people in the world look at the "haves" and the "have nots" in a similar fashion as you seem to be doing here.

[Cardus]

agreeing with me on this board might be a dirty word to some. i am waiting for the cavalry to show up and get me for something wrong that i said today again, but thank you for at least agreeing with what i have posted sometimes.

Simple: if you stop saying "something wrong", then people will stop saying that you're wrong.

[Cardus]

Serious question...how do you know any of this? How do you know the tellers, touts and valet guys are:

a) NOT getting raises?
b) are doing a pretty damn good job and/or work hard?

Again, it seems as though you are approaching this from a class warfare perspective. You automatically think those making more money aren't working hard, aren't doing anything productive, and are the sole cause of what you perceive to be NYRA's problems, while the guys making less money are all working their asses off in a virtual slave labor camp.

And no, when I mention class warfare, that is not some knock on you like you interpreted it in an earlier reply when I also used the term "class warfare." Some of the wealthiest people in the world look at the "haves" and the "have nots" in a similar fashion as you seem to be doing here.

I am not re-reading whatever spawned the "class warfare" angle, but "class envy" was on my mind regarding some of PK's posts.

[Grits]

Ptk, when one thinks of life with the resentment with which you do, with the mindset that you are owed or entitled with which you do--one never is able to remove this deeply embedded thinking. Not any amout of meds, therapy, or winning tickets will change this. Life is not equal, it never has been. Some people were born wealthy, they'll always be so. Some people work their butts off from the bottom to the top, they deserve everything they've worked for. Some people work the same and still struggle. Others do the same and have lost everything they have through no fault of their own. Layoffs, buyouts, etc. Resentment eats one's soul from the inside out.

We are entitled to equal rights doesn't mean we are entitled to equal wealth or opportunity. Life simply does not work this way. And l know you know this. Opportunity doesn't knok on one's front door asking, "yes, you called?"

[lamboguy]

Simple: if you stop saying "something wrong", then people will stop saying that you're wrong.
you see, that's why i need you here, a nut like me needs a guy like you to try to keep me in line. that is good work on your part, keep it up

[pktruckdriver]

Hey Lamb I see what you mean, now I am a classless loser who is jealous of those who made it, dang, that's what happen's when you go after NYRA.


Saratoga Guy, wish you were in Saratoga , I would love to buy you a cup of coffee and discuss this further, but since you are probably not here I will try to let this go after this.

Finding someone to run NYRA could not be that hard to do, there are lots people out there that would love to have the chance to do it, and my opinion we need to find one, that's all.

Patrick

[lamboguy]

i say lets forget about all this, i am going to saratoga for the new york bred sale and try to find a few champions there the second week of august.

[PaceAdvantage]

Hey Lamb I see what you mean, now I am a classless loser who is jealous of those who made it, dang, that's what happen's when you go after NYRA.I'm finished trying to have a rational discussion with you if this is how you choose to respond.

The only one calling you a classless loser here is YOU! Nobody else. Next time, bow out gracefully if you can no longer handle the debate. Don't make stuff up just to try and paint yourself as some victim of a gang up.

It's unfortunate you simply couldn't address the points I raised in my last reply, in the same way I have tried to address your points. Live and learn I suppose...

[PhantomOnTour]

On the whole I will take NYRA over all other state racing associations. The folks here in Louisiana continue to squabble and this season EvD isn't being shown on any racing network.

California any better? Nope
Florida? Maybe
Kentucky? On the way down imo
Maryland? On life support

I will admit that I'm a huge NYRA fan and supporter of NY racing, but there's a reason for that. Overall, the whole year included, NY racing is the best in America imo...90% of my wagering dollar is on NY tracks.

[takeout]

This thread has taken a couple of weird turns.

Just for the record I would knock a zero off of all of those salaries, but that’s just me. ;)

[pktruckdriver]

This thread has taken a couple of weird turns.

Just for the record I would knock a zero off of all of those salaries, but that’s just me. ;)

Finally, :ThmbUp::ThmbUp:

Okay Bossman now I may not be the smartest guy around but even I can read between these lines..
Ptk, when one thinks of life with the resentment with which you do, with the mindset that you are owed or entitled with which you do--one never is able to remove this deeply embedded thinking. Not any amout of meds, therapy, or winning tickets will change this. Life is not equal, it never has been. Some people were born wealthy, they'll always be so. Some people work their butts off from the bottom to the top, they deserve everything they've worked for. Some people work the same and still struggle. Others do the same and have lost everything they have through no fault of their own. Layoffs, buyouts, etc. Resentment eats one's soul from the inside out

Now I am not offended and my ego , well I never had one really, so I am a thick skinned individual as you should know by now, and if this debate as you call it, and that is good, I feel in my opinion a poll is due. Let us ask if raises are due. So I will...

Also you keep stating I am bashing the racing of NYRA and I am not, the racing is the best around, except for a few select meets, maybe, but overall year-round, it is the best and that is how that is, but the CEO is not the one who has it that way, the people behind him are responsible for the product we get. And how could you state that the people of NYRA do not deserve raises, the working people of NYRA.

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

See the question is easy to answer and a public company should have nothing to hide, but NYRA does hide this , why?

[saratoga guy]

Finding someone to run NYRA could not be that hard to do, there are lots people out there that would love to have the chance to do it, and my opinion we need to find one, that's all.

We recently went through a long, torturous franchise process -- there were three bidders, including NYRA. So why you assume "lots of people" are ready to jump into the fray is a mystery.

"...my opinion we need to find one.."

Why? Again, where is NYRA falling short that you feel some other organization would do better?

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

I also have simple question: Why do you care about NYRA's "debt" or "where did the money go"? How does this affect your enjoyment of the racing product?

[Tom]

See the question is easy to answer and a public company should have nothing to hide, but NYRA does hide this , why?

Your failure to look up the answers doesn't constitute hiding.
Where have you been all year? Did you miss the OTB refusing to pay up what was owed to NYRA? How about the 10 year delay in getting the slots off the ground, through NO FAULT of theirs?

Public company? Do you own stock in it? Public company - that means their financial are available. Have you looked for them?

You would be better off whining about the thieves at OTB and the thieves in Albany, where the real problems are.

[pktruckdriver]

http://www.paulickreport.com/news/the-biz/former-nyra-employee-files-suit-concerning-illegal-workers/

It seems the more I look the more I find this stuff instead of the positive stories, please show me where they are, the feel good stories of NYRA.

http://wnyt.com/wnytimages/NYRA-Layoff-notice.pdf

NYRA employees remember this from the CEO

http://assembly.state.ny.us/mem/Philip-Boyle/story/38573/

From NYS Assembly Member Mr. Boyle

More stuff about the 2008 105 million dollar loan

http://poststar.com/news/opinion/editorial/article_d92771ea-09ee-11e0-9bd3-001cc4c002e0.html



Where is the good news, please , where is the plan to make money, VLT's are not the complete answer, running in the RED 1st should be, showing a profit without VLT's should be the goal here, a reachable one I think, always have thought so, you got the best thing going here why can't it be profitable, it should already be.

Show me different and I will state how wrong I am here, I am man enough to say I was wrong, give The CEO a million dollar salary, why not????

[Cardus]

Finally, :ThmbUp::ThmbUp:

Okay Bossman now I may not be the smartest guy around but even I can read between these lines..


Now I am not offended and my ego , well I never had one really, so I am a thick skinned individual as you should know by now, and if this debate as you call it, and that is good, I feel in my opinion a poll is due. Let us ask if raises are due. So I will...

Also you keep stating I am bashing the racing of NYRA and I am not, the racing is the best around, except for a few select meets, maybe, but overall year-round, it is the best and that is how that is, but the CEO is not the one who has it that way, the people behind him are responsible for the product we get. And how could you state that the people of NYRA do not deserve raises, the working people of NYRA.

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

All I ever asked was to be shown how and why NYRA is debt, where did the money go to, and that simple question is not answered, why?

See the question is easy to answer and a public company should have nothing to hide, but NYRA does hide this , why?

No. Really?

[pktruckdriver]

Hey Bossman, I am confused first you said this

The answers to all your questions are not secret...not hidden...NYRA is required to disclose much of what you are asking...why don't you look it up?

I did and I got nothing at all, please show me where...



And then you said this



NYRA isn't a public company. They are a quasi-government entity...not totally public, not totally private.



Which is another way of saying I can not get the info about the loset revenue and why NYRA is broke

[PaceAdvantage]

Also you keep stating I am bashing the racing of NYRA and I am not,I don't believe I ever stated such a thing about you. It's so hard to take you seriously when all you do is misquote me and/or outright make things up.

[PaceAdvantage]

NYRA is broke? How do they continue operating then?

NYCOTB was broke. They are no longer in existence. And I don't ever recall you asking why their head honchos made so much money.

[PaceAdvantage]

I did and I got nothing at all, please show me where...I don't know where, as I was never that concerned to find out. You seem very concerned, so I assumed you have exhausted all available avenues.

There is much transparency in the operation that is known as the New York Racing Association. Apparently, not enough to satisfy you or the politicians that have recently been clamoring for more...

But since there is at least SOME transparency, perhaps if you do your homework, you will find some answers.

Start with the New York Racing & Wagering Board. Then perhaps the New York State Comptroller's office. You remember the guy who used to head that office and went after NYRA pretty hard...Alan Hevisi. You know where he is now, right?

Jail.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/04/15/alan-hevesi-sentenced-to-_n_849655.html

I'm sure all his NYRA witch-hunting was on the up and up too... :lol:

[offtrack]

Having worked indirectly with New York for many years I thought that these would be available in the NYS archives.

This is the link to the previous audit performed in 2007 :

http://www.osc.state.ny.us/audits/allaudits/093008/06s111.pdf

The most recent audit request (2011) will be delivered by NYRA asap, I assume.

Enjoy the reading.

[offtrack]

More NYRA audit information from the NY Office of the Comptroller:

http://osc.state.ny.us/audits/allaudits/093010/09s89.htm

"The New York Racing Association (NYRA) is a not-for-profit corporation franchised by New York State to conduct racing and pari-mutuel wagering at the State’s three major thoroughbred racetracks: Aqueduct Racetrack, Belmont Park and Saratoga Race Course. In November 2006, NYRA filed for bankruptcy, and in September 2008, the State and NYRA entered into a bankruptcy settlement agreement in which NYRA conveyed all ownership rights in its racetracks to the State and the State provided NYRA with a financial assistance package that enabled it to emerge from bankruptcy. In addition, the State agreed to have video lottery terminals (VLTs) with State Lottery games installed at a new gaming facility at Aqueduct Racetrack, and to allow NYRA to receive a percentage of the revenue generated by the VLTs. However, because of ongoing delays in the creation of the gaming facility, NYRA has received none of the expected revenue. Under the bankruptcy settlement agreement, in the event of such delays, the State and NYRA were to negotiate to provide NYRA with the funds needed to support its racing operations. In early 2010, NYRA’s President warned that NYRA was in imminent danger of running out of cash. Accordingly, on May 24, 2010, the State approved a $25 million loan for NYRA.

We reviewed NYRA’s projections of its available cash, as of May 20, 2010, for the remainder of 2010, and found that the projections appeared to be reasonable in all material respects. We therefore concluded that, in all likelihood, NYRA would have run out of cash sometime in early June 2010, if it had not secured the loan from the State. We also identified a number of reasons for NYRA’s inability to remain solvent without State assistance, some of which were beyond NYRA’s control and some of which were within NYRA’s control. In addition, we identified actions that should be taken by NYRA to reduce the need for further State financial assistance in the future. "

[pktruckdriver]

NYRA is broke? How do they continue operating then?

NYCOTB was broke. They are no longer in existence. And I don't ever recall you asking why their head honchos made so much money.


Why , Because they are all gone now, that is why, and yes they were worse than Haywood by far, but since they are shut down they did not warrant my opinions, and yes they did leave NYRA hanging for 28 million dollars, of which they only got a fraction of back, so yes this did hurt the revenue stream, but in my opinion , ok my opinion, it should not have put NYRA into being broke because of it.

Offtrack thank you for your links


Bossman some of the links I put come from the State Comptrollers Office

[pktruckdriver]

The following is directly from the Audit report


Report 2009-S-89


NYRA was also slow to act in an area within its control; the reduction of its operating expenses. NYRA did not begin to make significant reductions in these expenses until February 2010, more than a year after it emerged from bankruptcy. If it had acted sooner, done more to reduce its operating expenses by putting more prudent financial management practices in place after emerging from bankruptcy in September 2008, and not relied for so long on the anticipated VLT revenues, it might have deferred its cash crisis in the short term.

I could post more from the report, but will let this go.


I WAS WRONG EVERYONE, NYRA IS RUN BY THE BEST PEOPLE AROUND....
and after further review I change my mind pay them all a million dollars

[PaceAdvantage]

I WAS WRONG EVERYONE, NYRA IS RUN BY THE BEST PEOPLE AROUND....
and after further review I change my mind pay them all a million dollarsI'm thinking you wouldn't be satisfied with anyone running NYRA who is making above five figures.

[cj's dad]

No worries Patrick, if NYRA goes belly up, I'm sure our exalted leader (BO) will bail them out.

[pktruckdriver]

Forgive me here is a good news story

http://saratogian.com/articles/2011/07/01/news/doc4e0d28af03522860306206.txt?viewmode=fullstory




What can I say I was wrong, maybe, but trying to have an opinion against NYRA can be dangerous to you, so smartly I give in.


Sorry NYRA

[Robert Fischer]

No worries Patrick, if NYRA goes belly up, I'm sure our exalted leader (BO) will bail them out.

roflz. :ThmbUp:. I had just read some stuff where people where buying into (or playing up to the idea) that the president or the political parties are making all these kind of decisions, and combined with trying to read the 2nd half of the thread, this sharp sarcasm really caught me. :lol::lol:

[Robert Fischer]

to be honest I really can't really provide a masters commentary on the NYRA's top men without most of the information needed to do so. :blush:

I wouldn't bet with this lack of information, why would I talk about someone's livelyhood ??

It may be insightful to have a group of outsiders analyze the whole system that these guys operate in. Status Quo is actually important. - The reason being, that if the status quo is at such a conservative reference point, and if there also be a limited amount of room for creativity, then it starts to lower the value of the top men. In those situations regardless of job title, the market value demands that these top men bring in significantly less salary. In the opposite environment, the opposite is true, and the market value may not only be high, it may be hard pressed to reach compensation reflective of the value to the company.

[classhandicapper]

IMO unless you have salary data for NYRA and comparable jobs in the industry it's difficult to discuss this issue fairly.

Above that, without actually being on the inside, you don't know what kind of responsibilities, pressures, etc... NYRA executives and other workers have. So how can you know if some, many, or even most have cushy jobs where they are taking advantage of political connections etc... or killing themselves trying to put out a good product with limited resources?

We all know that racing isn't what it was 30 years ago, but NYRA and other racing entities are so handcuffed by government it's really hard to pin all the blame on anyone within NYRA for the slow pace of positive change and some of the questionable decisions.

[saratoga guy]

new story after news story, all abd, no good news ever

That's just silly - or intentionally ignorant:

In an era of declining media coverage of racing - particularly on the TV side - NYRA managed to get NBC/Versus to commit to eight dates of broadcasting from Saratoga.

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2011/05/03/versus-to-telecast-live-from-saratoga-this-year.aspx

...And franky I'd rank that right up there with some of the best news racing as a sport has had in years.


Where is the good news, please , where is the plan to make money...

In response to NYC-OTB cosing NYRA has opened the Belmont cafe - which has become one of, if not the most successful "OTB parlor" in the state.

They also offered bus service to Aqueduct and partnered with the LIRR to restore train service to Belmont and have seen increases in handle and attendance.



...But again, why are you so concerned with NYRA's financial siuation anyway? How does it affect your enjoyment of the sport?

[PaceAdvantage]

What can I say I was wrong, maybe, but trying to have an opinion against NYRA can be dangerous to you, so smartly I give in.


Sorry NYRAHow ridiculous you are being.

Almost as ridiculous as Bruddah in this thread...but not quite. It will be tough to top him for years to come...

[pktruckdriver]

Good thing I am too stupid or just don't care, one or the other, either way, I am really surprised at the all out attack upon me for this thread.

The between the lines remarks, the sarcasm, the out right , we'll leave that alone for now, but I am kinda sad about this debate.

I put up a thread stating my opinion of the NYRA top executive's getting Pay raises, when in my opinion, they did not deserve then, still think this by-the-way.

Now all I had to go on was the stories I read online and that I Googled and searched for, and man were there a bunch of nefarious stories about the deeds done during the current CEO's run at the top, and these came from all source's, Newpapers, State Office's, Politicians, and other media venues.

The list kept growing of bad stories to put up, all during the current administration and that was kinda strange that only bad press was showing up, this mad me think a bit , as there have been a few things good going at NYRA, not that the CEO was responsible for it thou, but good stuff for sure.

When I asked about where NYRA lost all the money, and all I wanted was a detailed account of where the money was spent and how it , NYRA, needed a 105 million loan and then another 25 million loan after that, and yes NYCOTB went under owing some money, for which they paid back only a little bit of, this I found out googling and searching old stories.

I still never found the complete audit that shows where NYRA lost money and exactly where it all went , what I found was only an overview, and it said NYRA should not be broke, but it is, why? NYCOTB and VLT's come on, they were broke before that.

Now I was trying find out if they actually deserved the raise's, and if someone could show me why they did, I was willing to change my views on this issue, but that did not happen, instead I was dismantled and made to look like someone jealous of people who got money and success, because I have not yet been able to achieve those things, this is was puerile behavior.

Bossman , I asked you some questions , simple in my opinion, why is NYRA in debt, where did all the money go, and after 7 years of being in debt , why is the CEO, still the CEO, let alone getting a Pay Raise.

Now you anwered me like a seasoned politician would, you gave me no answer's, but instead asked me questions, and then more questions , instead of ever answering mine and showing me where I might be wrong, but the actions you par-took made me believe there was something to this , because of the sleazy politician move you pulled on me, something this slow minded man, yeah me, can clearly understand, as someone once told me you never answer a questions with more questions, unless you are trying to hide something, now I think that you are not hiding anything, you just can not answer my questions, so you pounce and start the barrage of why this and that, and then, there is the... there you go contradicting yourself again, among others here too.

Why is it, not one person tried to show me why NYRA is in real bad shape and open my mind to seeing the reason for all the tough times, and that it is not because of the iniquitous actions of the top people at NYRA , but instead a reasonable explanation of events, and maybe some mis-management, or something like this , instead I get bashed , trashed and laughed at by more educated people than me, and it is sad because I was not going that way with this, but had to defend myself when attacked, a natural reactions for less educated people, I think.

While most people here are college educated , and it may be true I am more along the lines of Forrest Gump, well maybe not that smart, I do try to learn and get better, I ask many questions and get some great responses, that 6 months later i go back and then understand them, as a few people helped do so, instead is assuming that I knew this or that, because they did, well I do not know all that, my mind is not so broad that it sees all sides of a situation, I am more tunneled vision, I see what is in front of me, and with NYRA the stories I find are all bad news, and make me wonder why the CEO is still there, what else am I to think, you seen all the news stories, I read NYRA refused to open their books, of course that makes me say what the hell is going on here, and after time they did, but what happened in the time they had to fix them a bit, that is what I wonder, my tunneled vision mind see's thing that way, not well eventually they opened the books to the State, and yes I saw the overview, or what must be an overview, as it stated previous recommendations were not done and NYRA should not be in debt after the original loan was made, this is what I read in those reports, so what am I to believe, and still there is not definintve trail of where the money went, why they are in debt.

No one can explain this to me, instead insist I am witch hunting or NYRA Hating, for which I am not , I LOVE NYRA and the racing is the some of the best anywhere, and you can not tell me if CEO Haywood took 2 years off starting in 2009, that NYRA wouldn't have been better off, or still where they are now, or maybe even in better condition then now, who knows for sure, but they need a change after so long and to me no progress.


Why can not anyone show me the progress Haywood made since coming here 7 years ago, how long does it take to turn things around , would the , Late Mr. Steinbrenner waited 7 years to make a change if NYY lost that long, or any other scenario, what is average turn around time, less than 7 I think.

Ok I am tired and yet have more to put up, but it may be taken out of context, if not done properly and , God forbid that happens here, so I will sleep and finish later.

All I wanted was an explanation of why NYRA is broke and someone who has been around as long as this guy and has yet to turn things around, should get a raise , and instead get the boot, but instead I got...

And I am not bashing NYRA or it's product, which would be there whether or not Haywood is, right, of course, really people lighten up and show someone under educated the working of NYRA and how and why they are always broke and needing a hand-out from the State of NY, please.

:sleeping::sleeping:

[OTM Al]

His name is Hayward and the simple fact that you don't even know his name explains the extent of your knowledge of this situation.

[rastajenk]

I'm thinking you wouldn't be satisfied with anyone running NYRA who is making above five figures.Five figures? I'm almost surprised someone hasn't posted the opinion that there should be someone out there so dedicated to the game that he'd work for a buck a year until it gets right, a la Roger Goodell or Lee Iacocca.

:rolleyes:

[pktruckdriver]

His name is Hayward and the simple fact that you don't even know his name explains the extent of your knowledge of this situation.

Sorry I meant Wayward, you know what I meant as I was tired, and apparently still no one offers any help to understanding this, but 1 thing is clear.

Nobody fffing cares whether I understand why NYRA is in debt and continues to be on Hayward's watch, heck double his salary, why not, what is another half million dollars of debt. Make sure he gets a chopper for the hops to Saratoga too, ( you know this sarcasm, some of you may not, so my disclaimar).

I guess it was this pig-headed stubborness that cost me my trucking business too, by not getting out when I should of, and it goes here too, as I should have left this alone by now, but snip after snip just gets to you, and that is to be expected, but what is clear is this...

No one can explain to me the exact reason for NYRA being constantly in debt, with the best racing around, in the biggest city in the US, it should be thriving like no other, anybody agree with that.

Quit crying about NYCOTB and VLT's and get into the profitable , then get your raise's for a job well deserved. I think I deserve a raise, I delivered more than anyone else this week, but no raise, even had time to make a post or two, and work the 4th too, wow.

What Rico8812 put in his post to me was one of the most informing post's put up here except maybe one by offtrack , as it put the picture a bit clearer to me, and that was why make too much money if all it would do is revert to the State, this to me makes me think in a different way, and wished someone could have taken this and explained it more , instead I get stupid patrick doesn't even know his name, ok maybe stupid was left out, but the message was the same.

i thought this board has individuals who know this stuff and could enlighten some one who for some unknown reason is interested in this stuff, but I get named as the next Bruddah, no offense Bruddah, but come on, I am not trying to offend , only be informed,


Show me the....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xl6NfQyNLto


Have a Happy Fourth of July

patrick

[OTM Al]

No, the one thing that is clear is that you don't understand what happened. There was not a 105 million dollar loan. If memory serves, that was the amount (or at least mostly) in back property tax the State claimed NYRA owed while at the same time claiming they themselves owned the tracks. It was forgiven in exchange for NYRA agreeing that the State did indeed own the tracks. You may not understand this, but given the property, that was a cheap price to pay.

Calling the $25 million a loan is not quite right either. When the franchise was awarded, the State promised to have the Aqueduct casino up and running by April 2009. It was written in the agreement that if this was not the case, then the State owed NYRA to make up for lost revenues. Add to that the fact that it was the State that own NYCOTB and how much that organization owed NYRA (and others). Not sure but last I heard, the State had paid less than half of this amount.

The bankruptcy procedings and restructuring plan for NYRA were predicated on those casino revenues and the existance of NYCOTB making its statutory payments (that means they were required by law, but that didn't help either). So why should you be surprised they are not yet in the black? Why would you buy into anything the State officials say on this issue when it was they who caused this situation by feeding of the kickbacks from potential casinos suitors for 10 years?

Do you know that the State was full well aware of salary levels (as disclosed March 2010) and had their own appointees ratify the raises in December of last year? 10 of 11 approved the raises and all 11 approved the budget for 2011.

So esssentially you have behaved in exactly the way our vaunted NY politicians wanted you too. A complete kneejerk reaction without understanding a single fact. And this is why people got on you. Don't believe everything you read, especially from turf writers who never bother to leave the pressbox unless the copier breaks. Otherwise you are making a fool of yourself.

[Spendabuck85]

Times Union editorial board opinion:
Here’s what Mr. Hayward had to say about those pay raises as he appeared at a news conference Monday more eager to talk about the upcoming season at Saratoga Race Course. The top officers at NYRA, which was in bankruptcy protection just three years ago, need that extra money. It had been three years since their last pay increase. Meanwhile, they have to pay more for their health insurance.

Sounds to us like the real world, where the public that bailed out NYRA with a $25 million loan last year toils. The ranks of both horseplayers, and taxpayers who couldn’t care less about racing are full of people who must make do with less. Why should the top jobs at an outfit that expects to lose more than $11 million this year be any different?

Horse racing is in trouble in New York. Yes, NYRA has cut its costs slightly. Yes, there’s money presumably on its way from video slot machines at Aqueduct Race Track that should have materialized years ago. And yes, NYRA has turned the demise of the New York City Off-Track Betting Corp. into a windfall. Profitability is not such a long shot, NYRA says.

Perhaps when NYRA gets out of the red, it could make a case for pay raises for those in charge
Full article at:
http://blog.timesunion.com/opinion/more-outrage-at-nyra/12698/


















'

[PaceAdvantage]

Patrick, I answered your question. I told you I didn't know the answer.

I gave you two places where you could look for the answers...the NYSRWB and the NY Comptroller's Office. Someone followed that up with links to documents from the Comptroller's office that I thought provided you with some helpful information.

I'm not sure what more you expected of me, when I admitted to you I can't answer your question. However, it is my opinion that it is not outrageous to believe that it is fair to get a raise after three years of no raises.

Don't you think that's fair, regardless of whether or not the operation is booming?

And like OTM Al stated, those raises and the entire budget was APPROVED by those overseeing NYRA's operation at the state level.

Perhaps you ought to investigate who approved that budget.

[pktruckdriver]

No, the one thing that is clear is that you don't understand what happened. There was not a 105 million dollar loan. If memory serves, that was the amount (or at least mostly) in back property tax the State claimed NYRA owed while at the same time claiming they themselves owned the tracks. It was forgiven in exchange for NYRA agreeing that the State did indeed own the tracks. You may not understand this, but given the property, that was a cheap price to pay.

Calling the $25 million a loan is not quite right either. When the franchise was awarded, the State promised to have the Aqueduct casino up and running by April 2009. It was written in the agreement that if this was not the case, then the State owed NYRA to make up for lost revenues. Add to that the fact that it was the State that own NYCOTB and how much that organization owed NYRA (and others). Not sure but last I heard, the State had paid less than half of this amount.

The bankruptcy procedings and restructuring plan for NYRA were predicated on those casino revenues and the existance of NYCOTB making its statutory payments (that means they were required by law, but that didn't help either). So why should you be surprised they are not yet in the black? Why would you buy into anything the State officials say on this issue when it was they who caused this situation by feeding of the kickbacks from potential casinos suitors for 10 years?

Do you know that the State was full well aware of salary levels (as disclosed March 2010) and had their own appointees ratify the raises in December of last year? 10 of 11 approved the raises and all 11 approved the budget for 2011.

So esssentially you have behaved in exactly the way our vaunted NY politicians wanted you too. A complete kneejerk reaction without understanding a single fact. And this is why people got on you. Don't believe everything you read, especially from turf writers who never bother to leave the pressbox unless the copier breaks. Otherwise you are making a fool of yourself.

Finally something that enlightens me to my being misled by what I do read and find by googling NYRA, plenty of scandalous stories, and most fed by the State, as I have been seeing for my self when researching it, even the Audit I did find would not go into detail, but did manage to agree and not pursue matter's further, and accepted NYRA's condition without to me any more flamboyant accusations, and very little in way of recommendations, or one that make real sense to me, as the 1 about horse transportation being cut was ridiculous, and so where a few other about advertising and hiring outside help for better rates, this one I am on the fence with, isn't NYRA a big enough agency to gets reduced rates as it is, you see yes I read the aduits that were available to me from the internet, not from the actual state office, or NYRA, so was it only an over-view or an in depth audit report I saw, I'm not sure.

Thank OTM AL

I really am just trying to figure this out, because I have no life and bored with losing at the horse's I needed something else to think about and NYRA pay raises fit perfectly, at the time. again thanks


Patrick

[pktruckdriver]

Patrick, I answered your question. I told you I didn't know the answer.

I gave you two places where you could look for the answers...the NYSRWB and the NY Comptroller's Office. Someone followed that up with links to documents from the Comptroller's office that I thought provided you with some helpful information.

I'm not sure what more you expected of me, when I admitted to you I can't answer your question. However, it is my opinion that it is not outrageous to believe that it is fair to get a raise after three years of no raises.

Don't you think that's fair, regardless of whether or not the operation is booming?

And like OTM Al stated, those raises and the entire budget was APPROVED by those overseeing NYRA's operation at the state level.

Perhaps you ought to investigate who approved that budget.


Okay, perhaps you are right I should, but honestly I did not see that you stated you did not know the answer's, not that you didn't say it that I did see it, or understand it, if so sorry about that, but look who you're talking to okay, a little elaboration goes along way here, okay , sorry I am not able to grasp every insinuation properly, i try thou, and after persistence normally get it, well sometimes I get it, let's be honest here, not always.

i think this was great debate thou, and enlighten me a bit into the dirty politics at play here, everyone has a hand out here and there, and the funny things is no one in this whole affair, NYCOTB, VLT's and the possible payola in that process, as Al stated years of negotiating , meaning years of lobbying monies, but why and how no one is ever going to be convicted of anything here is amazing, but then not really , as these people are above that I guess, just stay away from hooker's...

patrick

[takeout]

SARATOGA SPRINGS — The New York Racing Association on Monday withdrew a lawsuit trying to prevent the state Division of Budget from making public its 2010 and 2011 financial records.

“NYRA will have no further objection to the release of this information pursuant to FOIL,” said a statement provided Monday evening by NYRA spokesman Dan Silver, referring to the state Freedom of Information Law. “NYRA has informed the Attorney General’s office that we are immediately withdrawing this lawsuit.”

Why the lawsuit in the first place?

“No comment,” Silver said.

Why the change of heart?

“No further comment.”
[snip]
http://saratogian.com/articles/2011/07/12/news/doc4e1b8426993ae969341251.txt