PA Syndicate

[PICSIX]

Has there ever been, or, is there a group of members (10 or more) that have formed a syndicate for the purpose of owning race horses?

I used to own a few lower level claimers in Nebraska and would like to get involved with a syndicate or help start one if need be.

Thanks,

Mike

[Mineshaft]

Im in for a grand who is with me?

[HandyKapper]

Count me in if it is done right.

[Shemp Howard]

I'll go in for $1K as well.

Can we race at Penn National? I have a score to settle there.

[lamboguy]

get a syndicate together, i have a bunch of 2 year olds i can sell you. i got a few that won't be ready to run until after september too.
http://www.newepisodetraining.com/

check out the website and see if you are interested in anything, there are others that are not listed either.

[garyscpa]

Has there ever been, or, is there a group of members (10 or more) that have formed a syndicate for the purpose of owning race horses?

I used to own a few lower level claimers in Nebraska and would like to get involved with a syndicate or help start one if need be.

Thanks,

Mike

You're doing this all wrong. First you buy the horse, then you revalue him, then sell shares, plus you get a fee when the horse is sold.

Just ask Barry Irwin.

[Mineshaft]

im all for claiming one. Lets get the ball rolling. Philly has short field with nice purses. Pen has short fields but purses are alright. Monmouth has great purses as well.

[tbwinner]

I'm in for this too guys and would love to see a PA syndicate. I own horses out at Penn and at Arlington Park; all claimers. I also have access to legal documents and resources to start this up. PM me or post here if we get some solid interest to this.

[newtothegame]

I would be interested. But, obviously need a bit more info. If and when this gets going, let me know. Thanks in advance....

[chickenhead]

get McShell to claim something cheap for the PA syndicate...

[turninforhome10]

Handicappers owning horses, together?

[Bettowin]

I would be interested.

[Mineshaft]

looks like we got some interest here. Lets get a head count on who wants in and how much capital we want to raise and go from there.

[lamboguy]

if you guys are going to do anything, i strongly suggest that you find a good trainer first. if you are going to claim a horse its real tough to find a guy that is going to be willing to work for you because they already have long time clients that come first. i never claim horses because i have a steady stream of horses. the horses that i put in claiming races are horses that i want claimed from me. i just had a horse claimed from me out of nw2 race at philly park and there was a multiple shake on the horse. my horses tend to get claimed because they all have solid bottoms on them and they tend to last longer than most others.

when you get things together, i might be able to help you with a good under the radar claiming trainer in new york. i have a horse with the guy and i am happy with him so far. the guy trains horses and is very light on the vet bills. my horse probably won't run until the begining of june in belmont so i will have more of a line on the guy. he had already asked me if i want to claim something, i told him i will send him 3 new york bred's once the two year olds get going there.

i also have a real good guy in deleware, but he is pretty well known now. i started with him last year and he got big.

[CryingForTheHorses]

if you guys are going to do anything, i strongly suggest that you find a good trainer first. if you are going to claim a horse its real tough to find a guy that is going to be willing to work for you because they already have long time clients that come first. i never claim horses because i have a steady stream of horses. the horses that i put in claiming races are horses that i want claimed from me. i just had a horse claimed from me out of nw2 race at philly park and there was a multiple shake on the horse. my horses tend to get claimed because they all have solid bottoms on them and they tend to last longer than most others.

when you get things together, i might be able to help you with a good under the radar claiming trainer in new york. i have a horse with the guy and i am happy with him so far. the guy trains horses and is very light on the vet bills. my horse probably won't run until the begining of june in belmont so i will have more of a line on the guy. he had already asked me if i want to claim something, i told him i will send him 3 new york bred's once the two year olds get going there.

i also have a real good guy in deleware, but he is pretty well known now. i started with him last year and he got big.



I would be happy to claim for you guys.Our horse need for nothing and if time comes to find a good home then I am your guy.If you are interested pm me.Thanks

[massman]

I'd be interested also. Who's going to be the leader?

[CryingForTheHorses]

Calder has some good claims.While the purses arent GP or Momouth,The training fees arent going to bury you.My fee is what it is and no add-on.Lots of trainers will tack on this and that.Vet bills depend on the horse.To have fun start small and build from there.IMO the worst thing you can do is to go to a high prifile trainer that is going to gobble up your money while you make no profit

[PICSIX]

I'd be interested also. Who's going to be the leader?

I can help, but am not qualified to lead this thing. In my opinion this needs to be done the right way. Things to think about; the syndication process itself, communication with share holders, trainer selection, horse(s) selection, race horse shares, insurances, etc.

Please feel freed to add to this list, it will give us a better idea of what it is going to take to get this done.

Thanks,

Mike

[PICSIX]

Calder has some good claims.While the purses arent GP or Momouth,The training fees arent going to bury you.My fee is what it is and no add-on.Lots of trainers will tack on this and that.Vet bills depend on the horse.To have fun start small and build from there.IMO the worst thing you can do is to go to a high prifile trainer that is going to gobble up your money while you make no profit

In your opinion, how much money would the syndicate need to make a reasonable claim and cover expenses for 1 year?

Thanks,

Mike

[Brogan]

To the newbies considering getting involved: Don't lose sight of the fact that if you claim a horse, he's "in jail"...meaning he cant' run at a different track for a period of time after the claim. Sometimes its until the end of the meet, sometimes its a fixed amount of time (60 - 90 days) depending on the jurisdiction.

[CryingForTheHorses]

In your opinion, how much money would the syndicate need to make a reasonable claim and cover expenses for 1 year?

Thanks,

Mike


Your taking a shot thinking you are going to have a claimer for 1 year if he is good..The op/claiming 16k is a good claim with the purses at 28k if you win.I charge 50 a day.The blacksmith is 100 bucks a month and a vet bill will vary depending on the horse.There are no hidden fees in my stable.The best thing to do is get the guys to have enough money for 2 months.During this time the horse will be running and hopefully paying his own way.The trick is to play with their money and not yours.

[maddog42]

Has there ever been, or, is there a group of members (10 or more) that have formed a syndicate for the purpose of owning race horses?

I used to own a few lower level claimers in Nebraska and would like to get involved with a syndicate or help start one if need be.

Thanks,

Mike

I am in for $2. I was going to bet the Pick 6 with this on Preakness day, but what the hell, I can afford it. I suggest we get a horse with an extra long nose, because he will win a few extra races at the finish line. Also I want to own the ears for my $2 worth. Sorry guys I couldn't help it. Good Luck.

[Mineshaft]

To the newbies considering getting involved: Don't lose sight of the fact that if you claim a horse, he's "in jail"...meaning he cant' run at a different track for a period of time after the claim. Sometimes its until the end of the meet, sometimes its a fixed amount of time (60 - 90 days) depending on the jurisdiction.




That is correct at probably every track. But at some tracks you do not have to step up after the claim.

[Mineshaft]

Your taking a shot thinking you are going to have a claimer for 1 year if he is good..The op/claiming 16k is a good claim with the purses at 28k if you win.I charge 50 a day.The blacksmith is 100 bucks a month and a vet bill will vary depending on the horse.There are no hidden fees in my stable.The best thing to do is get the guys to have enough money for 2 months.During this time the horse will be running and hopefully paying his own way.The trick is to play with their money and not yours.





Bingo we have a winner. You hope to pay the day rate with money earned by the horse and not have money come out your pocket.

[Mineshaft]

Im going to say we at least have to raise 10K-20K. Im in for 1K.

Lets raise the money first set up the stable name and go from there. We are not in a hurry but lets get the ball rolling.

[CryingForTheHorses]

That is correct at probably every track. But at some tracks you do not have to step up after the claim.

At Calder you can claim for set amount and run back for the same amount you claimed

[Brogan]

No step up required at Monmouth again this year.

[cj]

How about some training stats for the past year? Two years?

[Producer]

Hay, Oats, Water, low vet bills, and low day rates are great. That is until you want to actually win some races.

If you are going to be claiming a horse, you want a trainer who knows how to move a horse up. Not saying you need a JC Guerrero type by any means, but I would make sure you get a guy who knows what he is doing with claimers if thats the route your gonna go.

[CryingForTheHorses]

How about some training stats for the past year? Two years?

Trainers win a lot of races when they have the numbers to run..When you have cheap claimers,You dont look at wins but ITM is what counts.I know you said this reply to off the guys from me..Go to equibase CJ..Look me up and you will see my ITM is 30%..ALL of them cripples and horses that NOBODY would have ever given a chance to ever race.

[Mineshaft]

Hay, Oats, Water, low vet bills, and low day rates are great. That is until you want to actually win some races.

If you are going to be claiming a horse, you want a trainer who knows how to move a horse up. Not saying you need a JC Guerrero type by any means, but I would make sure you get a guy who knows what he is doing with claimers if thats the route your gonna go.






You want a trainer who can keep the horse in its present form not necessarrily move the horse up. Its a plus if they can move the horse but im looking for a trainer who keep the horses present form.

[Producer]

You want a trainer who can keep the horse in its present form not necessarrily move the horse up. Its a plus if they can move the horse but im looking for a trainer who keep the horses present form.



Why? Unless your claiming a horse for $5000-8000 or some bottom level claimer like that, isn't the ultimate goal for the horse to hopefully move up into allowance or stakes races eventually? Or atleast move up to higher level claiming races? Why else would you even claim a horse?

Do you go in just hoping the horse runs decent a few times and then gets claimed back for the same amount?

[5k-claim]

I am so pulling for this to actually happen.

I give McSchell tons of credit for being brave enough to volunteer for this assignment, even if for the life of me I cannot figure out why. (It sort of reminds me of watching the Bruce Willis character in the movie 'Armageddon'.)

.

[Mineshaft]

Why? Unless your claiming a horse for $5000-8000 or some bottom level claimer like that, isn't the ultimate goal for the horse to hopefully move up into allowance or stakes races eventually? Or atleast move up to higher level claiming races? Why else would you even claim a horse?

Do you go in just hoping the horse runs decent a few times and then gets claimed back for the same amount?



No thats not the goal i have in mind when claiming a horse. My goal is to make some money, run the horse where it belongs and if they claim the horse from me so be it. You claim a horse and expect it to move up up the claiming ladder and into Allowance company you will go broke plain and simple.

When you claim a horse i hope it wins and gets claimed from me. Im not interested in keeping a horse a year like some people do. I want to turn horses over and in that process make money not give it all back in trying to prove that i can move the horse up.


If i was a millionaire yes i would run the horse up the ladder just to see but im not a millionaire so i have to run the horse where it belongs.

[Mineshaft]

I am so pulling for this to actually happen.

I give McSchell tons of credit for being brave enough to volunteer for this assignment, even if for the life of me I cannot figure out why. (It sort of reminds me of watching the Bruce Willis character in the movie 'Armageddon'.)

.




Are you in?

[Shemp Howard]

I'm in for 5% of what ever the group ultimately decides to do. i also defer to MINESHAFT as my proxy for the selection of horse, trainer, and venue.

[Producer]

No thats not the goal i have in mind when claiming a horse. My goal is to make some money, run the horse where it belongs and if they claim the horse from me so be it. You claim a horse and expect it to move up up the claiming ladder and into Allowance company you will go broke plain and simple.

When you claim a horse i hope it wins and gets claimed from me. Im not interested in keeping a horse a year like some people do. I want to turn horses over and in that process make money not give it all back in trying to prove that i can move the horse up.


If i was a millionaire yes i would run the horse up the ladder just to see but im not a millionaire so i have to run the horse where it belongs.


Gotcha. I wasn't trying to be a smart-ass. I was really just wondering what your goal is when claiming a horse. Would your goal change if you were claiming a horse for 40k or more?

[Mineshaft]

Gotcha. I wasn't trying to be a smart-ass. I was really just wondering what your goal is when claiming a horse. Would your goal change if you were claiming a horse for 40k or more?






At this point in time no my goal wouldnt change. If i claimed one for 40K im running right back for 40K unless the horse still has a N1X condition left. Any horse worth 40K should be able to win a N1X.

[Mineshaft]

People in so far...


Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner-Possible
newtothegame-Possible

[lamboguy]

good luck guys, i hope you find a way to win a whole bunch of races with your claim

[Tape Reader]

People in so far...


Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner-Possible
newtothegame-Possible

Please add my name.

Tape Reader

[PICSIX]

People in so far...


Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner-Possible
newtothegame-Possible

I'm definitely in! :)

[5k-claim]

Are you in?Unfortunately, no. I am already in plenty deep enough with my own.

But if this actually happens, as opposed to just withering on the internet vine, then I will put the horse in my Stable Alert messaging and pull for it 100% on the track. I think it would be great to see a bunch of you in a Winner's Circle photo- especially if someone posts the picture and points out who is who.

.

[Mineshaft]

People in so far




Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner-Possible
newtothegame-Possible
PICSIX
Tape Reader

[PICSIX]

No thats not the goal i have in mind when claiming a horse. My goal is to make some money, run the horse where it belongs and if they claim the horse from me so be it. You claim a horse and expect it to move up up the claiming ladder and into Allowance company you will go broke plain and simple.

When you claim a horse i hope it wins and gets claimed from me. Im not interested in keeping a horse a year like some people do. I want to turn horses over and in that process make money not give it all back in trying to prove that i can move the horse up.


If i was a millionaire yes i would run the horse up the ladder just to see but im not a millionaire so i have to run the horse where it belongs.

I agree--I made the most money off the horse I owned the least amount of time. I made the claim, my trainer moved the horse up one level two weeks later and ran 2nd. Two weeks after that we dropped back down to the original claiming level, won the race and the original owner claimed the horse back.

[Mineshaft]

Unfortunately, no. I am already in plenty deep enough with my own.

But if this actually happens, as opposed to just withering on the internet vine, then I will put the horse in my Stable Alert messaging and pull for it 100% on the track. I think it would be great to see a bunch of you in a Winner's Circle photo- especially if someone posts the picture and points out who is who.

.




I hear ya no problem

[Mineshaft]

I sent tbwinner a PM to see if he can point us in the right direction about the paperwork process.

[PICSIX]

I sent tbwinner a PM to see if he can point us in the right direction about the paperwork process.

Thanks for doing that :ThmbUp:

[Shemp Howard]

I'll pdf you tomorrow what BobO charged each partnership to draft an e-mail it to you for reference

[PICSIX]

I'll pdf you tomorrow what BobO charged each partnership to draft an e-mail it to you for reference

Thanks.

[Mineshaft]

If anyone has experience in doing partnerships and all the paperwork im all ears.

[PICSIX]

I think I remember reading in a recent thread that someone managed a syndicate--maybe SonnyP??

I found the thread but I misunderstood what I read. He doesn't manage a syndicate.

[lamboguy]

If anyone has experience in doing partnerships and all the paperwork im all ears.
i have never done a syndication and i have never signed partnership papers with anyone, but i can get you a a standard contract that some big syndications use if that helps you. i would first find someone to run this partnership before you handle anyones money

[Mineshaft]

i have never done a syndication and i have never signed partnership papers with anyone, but i can get you a a standard contract that some big syndications use if that helps you. i would first find someone to run this partnership before you handle anyones money




send it my way lambo


we will get paperwork done and then appoint someone to handle the money.

[Mineshaft]

I think I remember reading in a recent thread that someone managed a syndicate--maybe SonnyP??



i will send him a PM

[Mineshaft]

PM sent.

[Relwob Owner]

Hey guys,

Best of luck with the venture. I started a partnership about 5 years ago and we did OK. After about two years I decided to just do it all on my own but hope that I can help by just listing some questions and concerns to address.

Who will be in charge and have the authorization to make all of the decisions?
Who will be the authorized agent for claims and for funds?
Who will be in charge of the accounting and legal aspects?
What happens if more money is needed than the initial investment?
Wlll the trainer make the decisions on claims and spots or the owners?
What is the plan for horse or horses after they stop running?
Wat is the plan for licensing logistics in different tracks and in different states? If I am not mistaken, most tracks require each owner to be licensed at the track so each has to do the application, fingerprinting, etc and it can be a huge logistical challenge.
If a partner wants out,what happens to his/her equity stake?
What is the distribution schedule for purse funds?


These are just some of the ones that come to mind and there are probably more.......Hope it helps and good luck!

[PICSIX]

Hey guys,

Best of luck with the venture. I started a partnership about 5 years ago and we did OK. After about two years I decided to just do it all on my own but hope that I can help by just listing some questions and concerns to address.

Who will be in charge and have the authorization to make all of the decisions?
Who will be the authorized agent for claims and for funds?
Who will be in charge of the accounting and legal aspects?
What happens if more money is needed than the initial investment?
Wlll the trainer make the decisions on claims and spots or the owners?
What is the plan for horse or horses after they stop running?
Wat is the plan for licensing logistics in different tracks and in different states? If I am not mistaken, most tracks require each owner to be licensed at the track so each has to do the application, fingerprinting, etc and it can be a huge logistical challenge.
If a partner wants out,what happens to his/her equity stake?
What is the distribution schedule for purse funds?


These are just some of the ones that come to mind and there are probably more.......Hope it helps and good luck!

Thanks for the list--We appreciate it.

Mike

[Relwob Owner]

Thanks for the list--We appreciate it.

Mike

No problem....I wish I had someone to guide me but kind of learned as I went.....I am excited for you guys because it is just the most exciting thing to own horses.....just wish it was easier to make money. :)

[Mineshaft]

Hey guys,

Best of luck with the venture. I started a partnership about 5 years ago and we did OK. After about two years I decided to just do it all on my own but hope that I can help by just listing some questions and concerns to address.

Who will be in charge and have the authorization to make all of the decisions?
Who will be the authorized agent for claims and for funds?
Who will be in charge of the accounting and legal aspects?
What happens if more money is needed than the initial investment?
Wlll the trainer make the decisions on claims and spots or the owners?
What is the plan for horse or horses after they stop running?
Wat is the plan for licensing logistics in different tracks and in different states? If I am not mistaken, most tracks require each owner to be licensed at the track so each has to do the application, fingerprinting, etc and it can be a huge logistical challenge.
If a partner wants out,what happens to his/her equity stake?
What is the distribution schedule for purse funds?


These are just some of the ones that come to mind and there are probably more.......Hope it helps and good luck!




Great questions


1-Dont know yet
2-Dont know yet
3-Dont know yet
4-Will come out partners pocket depending on how much you own
5-Both
6-Find a retirement home (Canter)
7-Might have to get a universal license for each partner if we can do that
8-He/she will have to sell there %
9-Any money earned is yours to keep. Might have to do a twice a month you can take ur money out or once a week, would have to talk about it.

[lamboguy]

No problem....I wish I had someone to guide me but kind of learned as I went.....I am excited for you guys because it is just the most exciting thing to own horses.....just wish it was easier to make money. :)i find it very exciting for someone to buy my horses and turn them into champions.

when i race my own horses that i am trying to get even on, i find it everything else in the world other than exciting!

[Si2see]

Guys I thought I would give a little bit of info here. My name is Jason. I have posted before about how happy I am with Tom Schell as my trainer, and to this day still feel as good about using him as I did day one. Preakness weekend marks 5 years ( hard to believe Tom ) of us being together in this game which is remarkable. He is a class act, and just needs the chance on being able to claim horses, or be given 2 year olds. That is what I feel like he is best at. Yes he does not win 30% of the races, but it isn't lack of effort or trying.... it is because he does not have the horses. Look up Surrealdeal. He ran second in the Swale stakes. Tom had him as a two year old. And look up 2 of our old horses Judge's Case, or Silversandsoftime. Both horses Tom claimed for me and my partner, but went on to do very well for us.
If you were to use him as a trainer I would interested in helping out, or do whatever is needed for a small percentage of the horse... The only help I would need is the legal help/ agreements to get started. I have talked to Tom about doing this for about 2 years, but everytime I try most people are all talk. Good luck guys, Pm me if you have any questions. Jason

[cj]

Trainers win a lot of races when they have the numbers to run..When you have cheap claimers,You dont look at wins but ITM is what counts.I know you said this reply to off the guys from me..Go to equibase CJ..Look me up and you will see my ITM is 30%..ALL of them cripples and horses that NOBODY would have ever given a chance to ever race.

That simply is not true Tom. Why would you think that? All I asked for was numbers. Hell, I might invest. You could have responded with numbers without trying to make me look like a bad guy.

[Cardus]

Good luck.

Just continue to listen to Lamboguy and you'll be fine.

[tbwinner]

I am in for being an owner and manager/part-manager in the syndicate. I've owned horses on my own and in partnership, operating out of Illinois with horses in IL and at Penn.

I will reply to the PM Mineshaft sent me but here's a few tidbits.

For what I know, to claim in Florida you need to run a horse there under your name or stable name first before being able to claim. Not sure if this has changed since last season but I was told this when trying to claim at Gulfstream. There is a way around this, claim in the trainer's name and then change ownership 30 days later (so we can't run for 30 days).

Also, individual partners will have to be licensed if they own more than 5%. The managing partner will also have to be licensed.

I recommend an LLC-type agreement...just forecasting any negative events happening. Seeing as we all never met each other (except for a few) we need liability protection and protection in case a partner drifts out.

Welcome any more questions here.

[tbwinner]

Hey guys,

Best of luck with the venture. I started a partnership about 5 years ago and we did OK. After about two years I decided to just do it all on my own but hope that I can help by just listing some questions and concerns to address.

Who will be in charge and have the authorization to make all of the decisions?
Who will be the authorized agent for claims and for funds?
Who will be in charge of the accounting and legal aspects?
What happens if more money is needed than the initial investment?
Wlll the trainer make the decisions on claims and spots or the owners?
What is the plan for horse or horses after they stop running?
Wat is the plan for licensing logistics in different tracks and in different states? If I am not mistaken, most tracks require each owner to be licensed at the track so each has to do the application, fingerprinting, etc and it can be a huge logistical challenge.
If a partner wants out,what happens to his/her equity stake?
What is the distribution schedule for purse funds?


These are just some of the ones that come to mind and there are probably more.......Hope it helps and good luck!

These are all great questions and I will attempt to answer what I think here:

We need an LLC or partnership manager. I recommend the LLC format due to the fact of liability protection and having the integrity of being a "business entity". This will be the one responsible for the financial matters and the contact person for the trainer (trainer won't want to talk to 10 partners 2-3x a week about the same horse).

A conservative estimate is the best to use for the initial capital as to avoid any future cash calls. The amount for the claim plus 4 months training expenses ($10-$12k depending where we go) is a conservative estimate.

Managing partner will have final say. Since this is a group PA effort we will all collaborate on spots to race in, what level, along with input from the trainer.

Owners with 5% or greater ownership need to be licensed. In NY it is 3% I believe. We should limit ownership to less than 5% (like 4.75% shares) as to avoid licensing issues.

If a partner wants out, other partners can "bid" to buy their stake.

Purses will be distributed once there is the 4 month training expense "reserve" in the bank as to avoid cash calls.

Anyone think this sound like a good basis?

[newtothegame]

Guys (and gals if there are)...I am really learning alot and listening and reading the responses....
here are my thoughts to date....
I know there are some shady characters in the world BUT, from being here for a few years and seeing most of the post, I have no problem with most of the people in this thread. A smart bunch of guys who want the best for all the individuals.
I agree with the managing partner holding most of the responsibility in communications. NO trainer needs to talk to twenty or thirty people regularly. I would prefer them spending time on developing my partial (lol) horse versus talking to me lol. So I for one would give my rights to the managing partner. Now thats not to say once a month, I wouldnt mind calling the trainer just to say hello and intro myself. But you all know what I am saying. If it's Tome (McShell) he can just communicate here. I am good with that.
But, in the same breath, I would like the managing partner to regularly stay in touch through email or however necessary to provide pertenant info on decisions , funds, etc etc.
I really dont know enough about this game to make decisions, so I will defer to either the managing partner, or allow another member to vote for me.
Would be decided if and when this happens who I would allow to vote for me if needed.
I like the percentages that have been spoken for so far....anywhere between 3-5% sounds reasonable. And it fits in to most state laws from what I have read here.
Keep up the good work guys...Im following closely! :)

[Dahoss2002]

People in so far




Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner-Possible
newtothegame-Possible
PICSIX
Tape Reader

Please add me

[PaceAdvantage]

Just for the record, PaceAdvantage.com has no official connection to anything being discussed in this thread.

As far as this proposed syndicate is concerned, PaceAdvantage.com is acting as a mere coffee shop for you guys to huddle and craft your plans.

[bigmack]

:lol: :lol:

Legal disclaimer.

[PaceAdvantage]

And why shouldn't there be one? With a thread title like "PA Syndicate," one might get the wrong impression that I have something to do with what may evolve from here.

Therefore, when someone feels they have gotten screwed (and that's probably inevitable given the nature of the beast), they won't be tempted to send me angry emails or legal correspondance demanding I make them whole again...

[bigmack]

Best cover your keister by having anyone involved in said venture sign a waiver to that effect. Indemnification by disallowing the association with the esteemed paceadvantage.com registered name is prudent on your part. :rolleyes:

Liability by association is a bitch.

[PaceAdvantage]

I take you feel my post was unncessary. Whatever.

[bigmack]

I take you feel my post was unncessary. Whatever.
Aww. "Whatever" :confused: If it's all for naught just delete it. It'll be like it never happened.

[newtothegame]

Mike,
I fully understand from your point of view the need to feel like you have to post that. And, given the nature, I can't say I wouldnt of posted it myself. But, I also have to believe that anyone choosing to get into this endeavor, also knows that paceadvantage.com is in no way affiliated.
So, does this mean your not "in"??? lol
:faint:

[Relwob Owner]

I take you feel my post was unncessary. Whatever.


I think your post was totally necessary from your end and perfectly timed. You have people openly discussing how to form a business arrangement on your site so that makes it necessary for you to post such a disclaimer. Thanks for providing a forum where this and other discussions can take place.

[serp]

If you all get this up and going would you all consider keeping a public log of some sort of the process and decisions made and your successes and failures along the way? I know that would be a lot of work but it sure would be a great resource for people like myself who have always thought about joining a syndicate but really have no experience on the inside.

Also want to say to PA, the disclaimer was warranted. I would have put it up there too.

[onefast99]

These are all great questions and I will attempt to answer what I think here:

We need an LLC or partnership manager. I recommend the LLC format due to the fact of liability protection and having the integrity of being a "business entity". This will be the one responsible for the financial matters and the contact person for the trainer (trainer won't want to talk to 10 partners 2-3x a week about the same horse).

A conservative estimate is the best to use for the initial capital as to avoid any future cash calls. The amount for the claim plus 4 months training expenses ($10-$12k depending where we go) is a conservative estimate.

Managing partner will have final say. Since this is a group PA effort we will all collaborate on spots to race in, what level, along with input from the trainer.

Owners with 5% or greater ownership need to be licensed. In NY it is 3% I believe. We should limit ownership to less than 5% (like 4.75% shares) as to avoid licensing issues.

If a partner wants out, other partners can "bid" to buy their stake.

Purses will be distributed once there is the 4 month training expense "reserve" in the bank as to avoid cash calls.

Anyone think this sound like a good basis?

The business model looks pretty good. Good luck!

[onefast99]

Guys I thought I would give a little bit of info here. My name is Jason. I have posted before about how happy I am with Tom Schell as my trainer, and to this day still feel as good about using him as I did day one. Preakness weekend marks 5 years ( hard to believe Tom ) of us being together in this game which is remarkable. He is a class act, and just needs the chance on being able to claim horses, or be given 2 year olds. That is what I feel like he is best at. Yes he does not win 30% of the races, but it isn't lack of effort or trying.... it is because he does not have the horses. Look up Surrealdeal. He ran second in the Swale stakes. Tom had him as a two year old. And look up 2 of our old horses Judge's Case, or Silversandsoftime. Both horses Tom claimed for me and my partner, but went on to do very well for us.
If you were to use him as a trainer I would interested in helping out, or do whatever is needed for a small percentage of the horse... The only help I would need is the legal help/ agreements to get started. I have talked to Tom about doing this for about 2 years, but everytime I try most people are all talk. Good luck guys, Pm me if you have any questions. Jason
I had used Tom as a trainer last year, he is a very good horseman and I would recommend him to anyone who is looking for a trainer in south Florida. Since we are now out of the claiming aspect of this business and into breeding I have no horses to send him.

[turninforhome10]

As somebody who has seen these things go south when partners can't agree, why don't you guys post the horses you see as good claims and follow them for 2 or 3 races and see how you do. As far as moving horses up the ladder, why? Find a good n2l for 12.5-15k and you will make money just getting the conditions even dropping the horse. Conditions are your best friend. Got a horse one time cause I was owed a boarding bill, 850$. Broke his Maiden, got his 2l and 3l and made 45k in 8 months. Gave him away, when I saw his n4 was gonna be too tough and now he is a very happy hunter prospect. CLAIM FOR CONDITIONS. Look for State breds to. Pennsylvania is good place for this.
Here is also a good story. Was talking to a woman at KEE fall sale, who was selling a stakes winning Storm Boot mare. The mare was IA bred so when she was found at Mountaineer running for a nickel, the lady claimed her, brought her home fattened her up, and ran her back through the sale ring 6 weeks later for 45k. Screw racing, I would take 40 k to make a horse happy and have for less than 3 months.
I wish you guys the best off luck and in the famous words of Pittsburgh Phil
"Many killings are attempted but few are accomplished" and "Winners repeat frequently while the defeated are apt to be defeated almost continuously"

[Learned Hand35]

I love the idea and would have been all in last year. My wife and I recently found out we are going to be parents for the first time. Accordingly, the household budget will need a serious adjustment. I am still very much interested if financial changes on the horizon allow.

Would the syndicate consider offering a share prorated for a proportional contribution by me in the form of legal work?

[Relwob Owner]

As somebody who has seen these things go south when partners can't agree, why don't you guys post the horses you see as good claims and follow them for 2 or 3 races and see how you do. As far as moving horses up the ladder, why? Find a good n2l for 12.5-15k and you will make money just getting the conditions even dropping the horse. Conditions are your best friend. Got a horse one time cause I was owed a boarding bill, 850$. Broke his Maiden, got his 2l and 3l and made 45k in 8 months. Gave him away, when I saw his n4 was gonna be too tough and now he is a very happy hunter prospect. CLAIM FOR CONDITIONS. Look for State breds to. Pennsylvania is good place for this.
Here is also a good story. Was talking to a woman at KEE fall sale, who was selling a stakes winning Storm Boot mare. The mare was IA bred so when she was found at Mountaineer running for a nickel, the lady claimed her, brought her home fattened her up, and ran her back through the sale ring 6 weeks later for 45k. Screw racing, I would take 40 k to make a horse happy and have for less than 3 months.
I wish you guys the best off luck and in the famous words of Pittsburgh Phil
"Many killings are attempted but few are accomplished" and "Winners repeat frequently while the defeated are apt to be defeated almost continuously"



Very good points about claiming for conditions and some of the best runs I have had were claiming maidens like you were describing and getting them through their conditions.

I have seen people discussing taking an optional claimer type. One thing to be heads up on there is that optional claiming races can be doubly tough because trainers who have certain "magic" ways can often dominate them. This is due to the fact that they can put them in for the tag knowing that they wont be likely to be taken because new connections may not be able to discover the same kind of "magic".

You mention posting thoughts on possible claims and I am not sure if you mean on here....if so, I would discourage that simply because you dont want current owners knowing you are following their horses, as they may change course to avoid being taken.

Just some thoughts I hope may help.

[turninforhome10]

"You mention posting thoughts on possible claims and I am not sure if you mean on here....if so, I would discourage that simply because you dont want current owners knowing you are following their horses, as they may change course to avoid being taken."

If you run horses where they belong, you can't worry about them getting claimed. Worked for a lady one time, that was so sick about her horses getting claimed she would take them back for more than they worth. People figured this out and would hold her horses for ransom as they knew she would take them back. When we took over as trainers, we ran the bad ones for a tag as there were 85 horses all IA bred. Imagine the surprise, when we claimed back nothing and culled half the barn. If owners change their course of action based on someone knowing that the horse is being watched most of the time they run the horse where it does not belong, and in the long run you will probably get them cheaper. I was taught that a horse is born with the qualities that make them a racehorse or not and it is up to the trainer to find the class they belong in."You can't make chicken soup from chicken s**t"

[CryingForTheHorses]

That simply is not true Tom. Why would you think that? All I asked for was numbers. Hell, I might invest. You could have responded with numbers without trying to make me look like a bad guy.


Hey Guys..Here is my lifetime record for the cheap claimers that I have .had..Dont forget these horses were discarded by other people who didnt give them a chance.There was 1 stakes placed horse in this bunch that finished 2nd in a 150k @ 80-1..A horse can be claimed under McSchell_Racing Inc..The horse can race before 30 days and then can be transfered into the new ownership..You dont ever have to worry about your funds as they are safe with me.The choice is yours!

1054-85-99-120....Earnings 1.068,783.00

[massman]

count me in.

[PICSIX]

And why shouldn't there be one? With a thread title like "PA Syndicate," one might get the wrong impression that I have something to do with what may evolve from here.

Therefore, when someone feels they have gotten screwed (and that's probably inevitable given the nature of the beast), they won't be tempted to send me angry emails or legal correspondance demanding I make them whole again...

I probably should have chosen a different title. I can see where you are coming from.

Mike

[Scav]

These are all great questions and I will attempt to answer what I think here:

We need an LLC or partnership manager. I recommend the LLC format due to the fact of liability protection and having the integrity of being a "business entity". This will be the one responsible for the financial matters and the contact person for the trainer (trainer won't want to talk to 10 partners 2-3x a week about the same horse).

A conservative estimate is the best to use for the initial capital as to avoid any future cash calls. The amount for the claim plus 4 months training expenses ($10-$12k depending where we go) is a conservative estimate.

Managing partner will have final say. Since this is a group PA effort we will all collaborate on spots to race in, what level, along with input from the trainer.

Owners with 5% or greater ownership need to be licensed. In NY it is 3% I believe. We should limit ownership to less than 5% (like 4.75% shares) as to avoid licensing issues.

If a partner wants out, other partners can "bid" to buy their stake.

Purses will be distributed once there is the 4 month training expense "reserve" in the bank as to avoid cash calls.

Anyone think this sound like a good basis?

As a general manager for a horse racing operation, this is, imo, a great way to start and very well thought out. One person making the decisions, the 4 month reserve should be perfect, I wouldn't go any less. You should also have a separate checking account set up specifically for the LLC.

For what it is worth, I wouldn't race in Florida at all. I would definiately consider claiming out of Florida, but I would then send the horse straight to Philly Park. We have three horses there and hoping to get more in the near future. Purses are great for the quality you are up against.

[Relwob Owner]

"You mention posting thoughts on possible claims and I am not sure if you mean on here....if so, I would discourage that simply because you dont want current owners knowing you are following their horses, as they may change course to avoid being taken."

If you run horses where they belong, you can't worry about them getting claimed. Worked for a lady one time, that was so sick about her horses getting claimed she would take them back for more than they worth. People figured this out and would hold her horses for ransom as they knew she would take them back. When we took over as trainers, we ran the bad ones for a tag as there were 85 horses all IA bred. Imagine the surprise, when we claimed back nothing and culled half the barn. If owners change their course of action based on someone knowing that the horse is being watched most of the time they run the horse where it does not belong, and in the long run you will probably get them cheaper. I was taught that a horse is born with the qualities that make them a racehorse or not and it is up to the trainer to find the class they belong in."You can't make chicken soup from chicken s**t"



My point wasnt whether you should not worry about them getting claimed it was about not putting any pre-claim thoughts on a public message board.

I agree that you you shouldnt worry about getting them claimed but your example proved my point about not posting any strategies on here. That lady, like many others are, was worried about getting claimed. If someone like that is dropping a horse in for a tag and finds out someone is interested, they are likely to scratch and you would lose your shot at the horse.

I would be hesitant to post any sort of strategy or anything involving what horses you would like to buy on this or any other public forum.

[Mineshaft]

People in so far:



Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner
newtothegame
PICSIX
Tape Reader
DaHoss2002
massman

[Mineshaft]

My computer at home is fried im using work computer. Hoping to be back up and running Saturday hopefully so my posts will be limited and nothing for me at night.



If anyone wants in just state that you would like to join and i will update the people who are in.

[Mineshaft]

And why shouldn't there be one? With a thread title like "PA Syndicate," one might get the wrong impression that I have something to do with what may evolve from here.

Therefore, when someone feels they have gotten screwed (and that's probably inevitable given the nature of the beast), they won't be tempted to send me angry emails or legal correspondance demanding I make them whole again...






Agree the disclaimer was warranted. You have to protect yourself and most of us would of done the same thing.


Pace maybe this weekend i need to get with you on this. I will send u a PM when i get my home computer this weekend hopefully

[Mineshaft]

Ok im signing off now hopefully i will have computer by this weekend if not i will have to use library computer.




sonnyp i will reply back when i get a chance thanks for the PM.

[mcschellfan]

Guys,
I have known Tommy and Lisa since 2005. You can find nobody better, imho. If you ever watch one of their horses race, Tommy or Lisa is the one walking them around the paddock. They are also the only two, with your horse, EVERY DAY. I may handle your horses 'droppings,' once in a while, but as far as your horse's care goes, they couldn't be in better hands.
In the dead of winter, up here in the north, there is also nothing better than heading to south Florida, to watch your horse race. Something else to think about, if you are gonna give this a 'go.'
There may be better 'horse managers,' but as far as trainers, from what I've seen on my trips down to visit, horseman don't come any better, than this husband and wife team.
You can also pick up a phone any time, and Tommy will be on the other end, to answer any questions. You can also visit, and have the time of your life. I call it my 'horseracing fantasy camp.'
Choosing them to captain your 'maiden voyage,' is something you should definitely consider.

[HuggingTheRail]

Here at the local bullring, Hastings, the leading owner started a syndicate late last year.

Glen Todd and his team formed a syndicate of 100 shares at $1000 per share. They bought 4 yearlings, and claimed a 3 year old maiden at Golden Gate over the winter.

The yearlings are now 2...and 2 of them raised in the one 2 yr old race carded thus far - finishing 1st and 6th. The one that placed 6th is back in on Sunday.

I am not part of the syndicate, nor do I know Glen Todd personally. However, he does seem to have the rejuvenating of horse racing here in Vancouver at heart. The website for the syndicate is www.nathc.ca (http://www.nathc.ca) - maybe there is info there that would be informational for some people considering joining the group forming here at PA.

[Brogan]

Guys, I have one suggestion for you. Don't put all your eggs in one basket, go in with the idea of buying / claiming at least two horses.

I've been involved with the one horse concept off and on and its very frustrating that even a little bump in the road can put you out of business for six to eight weeks at a time. You'll be dealing with athletes that have little aches and pains all the time, when something gets a little more serious, your whole team is on the bench when you only have one horse.

[tbwinner]

Good suggestion on the 2 horses Brogan. I'd be up for that as it is a way to diversify BUT we just need to make sure we have the funds and partners to back it up.

I want to stress to EVERYONE that no one should be in this to make money. An awesome goal would be to break even and that is what I do in my horse racing ownership venture.

Someone asked for successes and failures, here are some of mine. I haven't been in the game for too long but I have had my share of both:

East Coaster- claimed for $5k in September 2010, won 3 races @ the $5k level at HAW, ran 3rd @ $5k once at HAW and once at PEN, ran 4th in a STR5000 at HAW, ran 3rd in a STR5000 at MNR, and two 5ths at HAW, claimed out for $5k in April of this year. This one yielded a profit.
Sunny Squall- bought right after a claim from Calabrese. Ran 2nd for $7.5k claim, no good the next two times, ended up selling to a trainer at Beulah to run. Loss on this one.
Red Sierra- claimed for $10k in March, ran 2nd and 3rd in the $32k allowances at Penn, still have the horse.
Harpoon Hattie- purchased privately, ran and won at $7500 at Penn and was claimed. Loss on this one due to the time (Penn cancelled racing on us 5x we were in due to weather, etc.)
Springtime Spell- claimed this one last month for $10k, ran back yesterday for $10k at Arlington and won. So far a profit.

[Scav]

Good suggestion on the 2 horses Brogan. I'd be up for that as it is a way to diversify BUT we just need to make sure we have the funds and partners to back it up.

I want to stress to EVERYONE that no one should be in this to make money. An awesome goal would be to break even and that is what I do in my horse racing ownership venture.

Someone asked for successes and failures, here are some of mine. I haven't been in the game for too long but I have had my share of both:

East Coaster- claimed for $5k in September 2010, won 3 races @ the $5k level at HAW, ran 3rd @ $5k once at HAW and once at PEN, ran 4th in a STR5000 at HAW, ran 3rd in a STR5000 at MNR, and two 5ths at HAW, claimed out for $5k in April of this year. This one yielded a profit.
Sunny Squall- bought right after a claim from Calabrese. Ran 2nd for $7.5k claim, no good the next two times, ended up selling to a trainer at Beulah to run. Loss on this one.
Red Sierra- claimed for $10k in March, ran 2nd and 3rd in the $32k allowances at Penn, still have the horse.
Harpoon Hattie- purchased privately, ran and won at $7500 at Penn and was claimed. Loss on this one due to the time (Penn cancelled racing on us 5x we were in due to weather, etc.)
Springtime Spell- claimed this one last month for $10k, ran back yesterday for $10k at Arlington and won. So far a profit.

Nice claim on this horse, he will be successful this summer at AP. How are the vet bills for Domensky?

[lamboguy]

i like her, she is a good trainer. i ran about 8 different horses this past year at philly park, all broke their maiden, and all of them eventually got claimed from me. i had a very high batting average, i had an awful trainer and i never used drugs other than lassix after the first start. i had a 42% batting average with those horses. my trainer with those wins was less than 10%. so far this 2 yo season my results are much less than stellar. i am 1 for 11. i just had one run dead

[tbwinner]

Nice claim on this horse, he will be successful this summer at AP. How are the vet bills for Domensky?

Thanks...I hope so too! Vet bills are around normal for Tammy. Reasonable for the Chicago circuit. April's bill was $300~ but that was because of the post-race scope. I don't expect this month's bill to be more than $400-500 as the only problem she has is a minor ankle issue that she's had for awhile seemingly.

[Tape Reader]

I want to stress to EVERYONE that no one should be in this to make money. An awesome goal would be to break even and that is what I do in my horse racing ownership venture.

I hear this all the time from a friend of mine who has owned horses. "Stupid" I think to myself, but I bite my tongue.

With no disrespect to tbwinner, we should all "visualize" success, and therefore it may just "manifest" itself.

We are all adults.

[tbwinner]

I hear this all the time from a friend of mine who has owned horses. "Stupid" I think to myself, but I bite my tongue.

With no disrespect to tbwinner, we should all "visualize" success, and therefore it may just "manifest" itself.

We are all adults.

OK, good to visualize it, but just don't expect it !

If you never owned horses before, after paying bill after bill you end up reminding yourself of this. While ownership is a business for some, this approach as a group of internet forum members should be as a hobby and not with any expectation of profit. Would be great if we did though.

[Relwob Owner]

OK, good to visualize it, but just don't expect it !

If you never owned horses before, after paying bill after bill you end up reminding yourself of this. While ownership is a business for some, this approach as a group of internet forum members should be as a hobby and not with any expectation of profit. Would be great if we did though.



Your attitude is spot on IMO.....best of luck to you guys.

[onefast99]

People in so far:



Mineshaft
Shemp
HandyKapper
tbwinner
newtothegame
PICSIX
Tape Reader
DaHoss2002
massman
Good luck to the group, remember it cost $22 bucks for a win photo so you might want to look into a cheap color copier!

[Skanoochies]

Hi HTR, I was just wondering, is Troy Taylor the trainer of all these horses? The man is a great trainer but he is about 80 yrs old and has stated this will be his last year. Do you know who his understudy is? The man has won the last few training titles HP and it will be hard to replace him IMO. :confused: Here at the local bullring, Hastings, the leading owner started a syndicate late last year.

Glen Todd and his team formed a syndicate of 100 shares at $1000 per share. They bought 4 yearlings, and claimed a 3 year old maiden at Golden Gate over the winter.

The yearlings are now 2...and 2 of them raised in the one 2 yr old race carded thus far - finishing 1st and 6th. The one that placed 6th is back in on Sunday.

I am not part of the syndicate, nor do I know Glen Todd personally. However, he does seem to have the rejuvenating of horse racing here in Vancouver at heart. The website for the syndicate is www.nathc.ca (http://www.nathc.ca) - maybe there is info there that would be informational for some people considering joining the group forming here at PA.

[PICSIX]

I'm busy at work today. I will answer PM's and any questions that may have been asked of me, on this thread, tomorrow.

Thanks,

Mike

[HuggingTheRail]

Hi HTR, I was just wondering, is Troy Taylor the trainer of all these horses? The man is a great trainer but he is about 80 yrs old and has stated this will be his last year. Do you know who his understudy is? The man has won the last few training titles HP and it will be hard to replace him IMO. :confused:

Troy Taylor is the trainer. They also have a long-time Assistant Trainer Mel Beveridge, and they utilize a younger trainer as well....Elizabeth Stolzenberg (not specifically for the syndicate horses). I would not be too concerned when TT retires, I don't think this team will miss too much of a step

[Mineshaft]

Using library computer and getting mine back tomorrow or should i say a new one.


So far we only have 8 signed up to join the partnership.


tbwinner (Chris) and i discussed if we want only forum members to join up or do we want to open it up to your friends or any other people that you may know that may be interested. We welcome any friends or family members that are interested in signing up not just forum members.

[newtothegame]

To the members who have basically said.."IN".....
Lets start trying to formulate what we are looking for. What are our initial goals? For example....
is it gonna be a two year old?
A claim? If so, how much are we looking to claim at?
reason I am asking is, I think this will go a ways to determine how much money and how many people we need to try and get.
I have seen several mention "I am in for 1k......"But, with 8 people, that wont get us very far......
Any suggestions appreciated.....

[PaceAdvantage]

Wouldn't those interested in doing something like this be better off getting together and finding an existing syndicate to do business with?

I can't imagine a group of people who don't know each other from a hole in a wall having any chance at being successful without someone in a lead role who is beyond reproach and has the demonstrated experience and professionalism to make this work.

[newtothegame]

Wouldn't those interested in doing something like this be better off getting together and finding an existing syndicate to do business with?

I can't imagine a group of people who don't know each other from a hole in a wall having any chance at being successful without someone in a lead role who is beyond reproach and has the demonstrated experience and professionalism to make this work.

Well Mike,
this is kind of what i was referring to when I originally said I would need more info.
Enthusiasm is one thing. but the ability to get this into reality is quite different. That's not to say there arent some very smart people on here and a ton of horse knowledge.
We can sit here all day and talk about "im in"......but that means very little.
kind of like "Hope and change"....no one knew what it meant...and still dont lol.
I have always wanted to be in a syndicate if you will....but, till I see a HARD, FIRM, copy of whats going on, I will be on the sidelines.
rarely do I venture into something without knowing what the ramifications are....that's why I asked a few of the questions above.
Right now, it appears that people are still being sought to join.
My questions is...join what??
How many people?
What is our stated goals?
What type of horse are we trying to purchase? (this will go aways to answering how many people).
Claimer? Two year old?
Etc etc......
Many many questions, but all I see we have is enthusiasm at this point.

[Edward DeVere]

You're doing this all wrong. First you buy the horse, then you revalue him, then sell shares, plus you get a fee when the horse is sold.

Just ask Barry Irwin.

Indeed. You buy a product for $10 and try to sell it for more than $10. I believe this is referred to as . . . capitalism.

[PICSIX]

To the members who have basically said.."IN".....
Lets start trying to formulate what we are looking for. What are our initial goals? For example....
is it gonna be a two year old?
A claim? If so, how much are we looking to claim at?
reason I am asking is, I think this will go a ways to determine how much money and how many people we need to try and get.
I have seen several mention "I am in for 1k......"But, with 8 people, that wont get us very far......
Any suggestions appreciated.....

I was thinking a claim a couple rungs up from the bottom level; best case, we can move the horse up and be competitive, if not, stay at the same level and if need be we have room to drop in class as well. My original thoughts were 10 to 15 shares at $2,000. This would allow us to claim in the $10,000-$15,000 neighborhood with reserves for expenses.

The idea, in my opinion, is to own a small part in a horse with the out of pocket being a minimum and no cash calls there after. There is no greater feeling than having some skin in this game--even if you only own the tail! :)

[PICSIX]

Wouldn't those interested in doing something like this be better off getting together and finding an existing syndicate to do business with?

I can't imagine a group of people who don't know each other from a hole in a wall having any chance at being successful without someone in a lead role who is beyond reproach and has the demonstrated experience and professionalism to make this work.

The answer to your question is, yes. When I started this thread I was expecting to get responses from members in existing syndicates that would allow me to buy in. That hasn't happened yet. At this point, those of us that are interested are in the very early stages of throwing ideas around. Thanks to you and this site we have a place to do that. :ThmbUp:

Thanks again,

Mike

[Bettowin]

Put 2K on Animal Kingdom to show today and you will have your stake for the partnership:)

[tbwinner]

Well I agree that we should nail down exactly where we want to race and what we're looking for. As we are all gamblers and wanting near "instant" action as possible, claiming a horse is the way to go here.

There are great claims to be had at all tracks and at all prices. I personally would go with a claim between $10,000 and $16-18,000 as that gives us the room to move up and also room on the bottom to get out if need be. Purchasing a 2YO or yearling wouldn't be wise at this stage due to the immense capital needed to raise and train it through the first few years.

We need to answer these questions:

- Where do we want to race? Will we limit ourselves to one place or go anywhere a claim shows up? I currently have horses in Illinois at Arlington and one at Penn. Penn has great claims to be had, as does Arlington (especially with Illinois breds).

- Exactly what is our budget? If we claim for $10k we still need a $10-12k expense reserve so we don't collect cash calls every month. So that is $22k needed upfront.

- Who is our leader/LLC manager? I volunteer for this position as I have been in ownership for two years, claiming on my own and with a partnership group. I have documents to base the LLC agreement off of and can serve as a central communication person if need be. Also as I am licensed I can cover the shortfall in initial capital (by way of investment) if necessary. Any other licensed horsemen can do this too if they choose (i.e. want to own more than 5%).

Chris

[lamboguy]

Put 2K on Animal Kingdom to show today and you will have your stake for the partnership:)that is probably the best bet of that race. he could pay over $3.00 on that proposition.

[lamboguy]

Well I agree that we should nail down exactly where we want to race and what we're looking for. As we are all gamblers and wanting near "instant" action as possible, claiming a horse is the way to go here.

There are great claims to be had at all tracks and at all prices. I personally would go with a claim between $10,000 and $16-18,000 as that gives us the room to move up and also room on the bottom to get out if need be. Purchasing a 2YO or yearling wouldn't be wise at this stage due to the immense capital needed to raise and train it through the first few years.

We need to answer these questions:

- Where do we want to race? Will we limit ourselves to one place or go anywhere a claim shows up? I currently have horses in Illinois at Arlington and one at Penn. Penn has great claims to be had, as does Arlington (especially with Illinois breds).

- Exactly what is our budget? If we claim for $10k we still need a $10-12k expense reserve so we don't collect cash calls every month. So that is $22k needed upfront.

- Who is our leader/LLC manager? I volunteer for this position as I have been in ownership for two years, claiming on my own and with a partnership group. I have documents to base the LLC agreement off of and can serve as a central communication person if need be. Also as I am licensed I can cover the shortfall in initial capital (by way of investment) if necessary. Any other licensed horsemen can do this too if they choose (i.e. want to own more than 5%).

Chrisif you need $12k in reserve, you have made a bad claim!

[tbwinner]

if you need $12k in reserve, you have made a bad claim!

Lambo, as much as I agree, I want to avoid doing any cash call at a later point. PICSIX's point of not having to put anything more in the partnership after the initial investment is key. Some people may dart the partnership if something bad should arise and leave the me or whomever the manager may be with the bill and his/her stake.

[Mineshaft]

Im back with new computer.




I agree claiming is the way to go and in the 10-15K range which would give us 10K in reserve.

We can do 25 shares at 1K each which we can raise 25K and then everyone would have 4% of the horse which means we do not have to get licenses for everyone? Is this correct tbwinner?


As far as where we want to run im going to look at tracks which offer great purses. Off the top of my head there is Philly, Monmouth, Churchill, Presque Isle, Penn, Arlington. Belmont. I would say California is out i do not want to pay $100 a day for day rate

[PICSIX]

http://lydrstable.com/#concept

Example of a syndicate's structure.

[CryingForTheHorses]

Im back with new computer.




I agree claiming is the way to go and in the 10-15K range which would give us 10K in reserve.

We can do 25 shares at 1K each which we can raise 25K and then everyone would have 4% of the horse which means we do not have to get licenses for everyone? Is this correct tbwinner?


As far as where we want to run im going to look at tracks which offer great purses. Off the top of my head there is Philly, Monmouth, Churchill, Presque Isle, Penn, Arlington. Belmont. I would say California is out i do not want to pay $100 a day for day rate


If I may...ALL the tracks you have listed,Your day rate is going to exced your fun..You guys are making it very compicated for yourselves..You can race under McSchell Racing INC. NObody needs to be licenced..One person looks after the funds.I look after the horse...You are looking at the purses but you still have to win them. For the life of me,I cant understand why you need 12k in reserve.Buying a 2yo is the worst way to get your feet wet.Claim a hot horse,Win with it then turn it over and on to the next one.I can fulfill all of your questions as Im only a phone call away.

[Mineshaft]

If I may...ALL the tracks you have listed,Your day rate is going to exced your fun..You guys are making it very compicated for yourselves..You can race under McSchell Racing INC. NObody needs to be licenced..One person looks after the funds.I look after the horse...You are looking at the purses but you still have to win them. For the life of me,I cant understand why you need 12k in reserve.Buying a 2yo is the worst way to get your feet wet.Claim a hot horse,Win with it then turn it over and on to the next one.I can fulfill all of your questions as Im only a phone call away.





The day rate for those tracks could be a little higher than normal thats one of the factors that could come into play.

Oh i do agree with claiming and turning that horse over just like tbwinner tried to do recently. He claimed one for 10K ran it right back for 10K and won. He didnt lose the horse but he ran him back for what he took it for and won. He wasnt interested in seeing if he could improve the horse up the ladder he wanted to win and spotted the horse accordingly.

[Mineshaft]

Still only 8 in so far. Any more interest from anyone, friends, family members?

[PICSIX]

Still only 8 in so far. Any more interest from anyone, friends, family members?

I have (1) maybe, but nothing definite.

[newtothegame]

Ok...here are a few questions I have....
(well along with a few statements) lol....
I am perfectly fine with TBWINNER being MANAGING partner.
I am perfectly fine with McShell being TRAINER.....
But, I guess we need to ask where McShell (TOM, as I understand it), trains?
This would go towards the next question as to what parks we would be looking at.
Would the managing partner act as secretary/treasurer or do we need another? If so, I would nominate MINESHAFT.
I agree that the object should be a nice claim. The development of a two year old takes time.
Next, if we shoot between 10-16 on the claim, we need to find about twenty people. This would keep the percentages about 5% (1 of 20). Should also leave a few dollars in reserve for bills.
I also like the idea of "flipping".....Let's be honest here, I have no visions of running in the DERBY lol. Now that's not to say if we make a few dollars, re-invest, etc etc...we can at some point buy and develop a good looking two year old, but right now, I am just looking for a bit of fun and KNOWLEDGE.

[Mineshaft]

Ok...here are a few questions I have....
(well along with a few statements) lol....
I am perfectly fine with TBWINNER being MANAGING partner.
I am perfectly fine with McShell being TRAINER.....
But, I guess we need to ask where McShell (TOM, as I understand it), trains?
This would go towards the next question as to what parks we would be looking at.
Would the managing partner act as secretary/treasurer or do we need another? If so, I would nominate MINESHAFT.
I agree that the object should be a nice claim. The development of a two year old takes time.
Next, if we shoot between 10-16 on the claim, we need to find about twenty people. This would keep the percentages about 5% (1 of 20). Should also leave a few dollars in reserve for bills.
I also like the idea of "flipping".....Let's be honest here, I have no visions of running in the DERBY lol. Now that's not to say if we make a few dollars, re-invest, etc etc...we can at some point buy and develop a good looking two year old, but right now, I am just looking for a bit of fun and KNOWLEDGE.






Tom trains at Calder. I dont know what 16K horses run for at Calder but i can look at cond book online and find out.

[PICSIX]

Tom trains at Calder. I dont know what 16K horses run for at Calder but i can look at cond book online and find out.

16 optional claimers run for $25k.

[PICSIX]

If I may...ALL the tracks you have listed,Your day rate is going to exced your fun..You guys are making it very compicated for yourselves..You can race under McSchell Racing INC. NObody needs to be licenced..One person looks after the funds.I look after the horse...You are looking at the purses but you still have to win them. For the life of me,I cant understand why you need 12k in reserve.Buying a 2yo is the worst way to get your feet wet.Claim a hot horse,Win with it then turn it over and on to the next one.I can fulfill all of your questions as Im only a phone call away.

Tom, If we did this, wouldn't McSchell Racing, Inc. be the official owner of the horse?

Thanks,

Mike

[CryingForTheHorses]

McSchellRacing INC has been the owner for many partnerships,I have several guys that race under this name and nobdy has ever got beat for any money..Jason who posted on here will tell you that. Him and Dan have been with me for 5 years..16op claimers run for 28k..When the hors makes money the treasurer whom you appoint will recieve a check to disperse of the money to the proper people as soon as the money clears..No worries,I have a impecable record,No violations,No positives or rulings against me.McSchellRacing INC has been a corp for over 7 years.This takes all the worry out of everybody having to go thu all the red tape. You are dealing with a upscale guy who has only good intentions for you guys.Your investment is safe with me.Nobody but my wife and I touch your horse everyday.Yu horse willl want for nothing...Too bad someone didnt live here to come check out my barn.If anybody wants my phone number just ask..I am also not a trainer who you can never get a hold of.I pride myself on my horsemanship and I promise you..You will be happy.

[sonnyp]

i don't think you want to be posting about claiming and racing horses in someone else's name on a public forum. be careful.

[Mineshaft]

16 optional claimers run for $25k.




Thats good money.

[tbwinner]

Keep in mind the $16k/N1X allowance options that run are often won by runners going for the N1X condition and not necessarily the claimers. There is tough competition down at Calder for that especially with the presence of FCC this year.

Tom, how many horses do you have in training? What is your day rate and owner's average vet bill?

With no disrespect to you Tom, I am a little hesitant in not having an ownership structure for this PA partnership. Part of my business is setting up legal entities for small business startups and can't tell you how many stories I have of great ideas turned wrong due to informal agreements or no documentation, etc.

Also, where do you all live? It would be nice (but not #1 point) to claim something at a track the majority of us are all close to so we can possibly meet for races. I am in Illinois.

[CryingForTheHorses]

Keep in mind the $16k/N1X allowance options that run are often won by runners going for the N1X condition and not necessarily the claimers. There is tough competition down at Calder for that especially with the presence of FCC this year.

Tom, how many horses do you have in training? What is your day rate and owner's average vet bill?

With no disrespect to you Tom, I am a little hesitant in not having an ownership structure for this PA partnership. Part of my business is setting up legal entities for small business startups and can't tell you how many stories I have of great ideas turned wrong due to informal agreements or no documentation, etc.

Also, where do you all live? It would be nice (but not #1 point) to claim something at a track the majority of us are all close to so we can possibly meet for races. I am in Illinois.


I live in Hollywood fl...15 mins from Calder and 5 mins from GP...As I stated in earlier posts,My day rate is $50 a day with no hidden costs.Yes you are right in saying the comp is tough but dont forget you have them horses that have already won there nw1,nw2,nw3alw dropping down in that op16k just to win the 28k pot.NOBODY claims these horses hardly ever and the same horses keep winning the 28k pot. Competition is tough at any track.There is always 1 to beat. Like I said a vet bill varies on the horse.Average vet bill would be $250 to $300..Im big in replenishing my horse after their races with double jugs to keep them hydraded because of the heat.People that screw people because no formal agreement was made are turds.I was brought up with a handshake and a persons word were set in stone.I havent ever had a problem because I have always held my end of the bargain. I now have 5 horses in training and have never had a problem with getting max starts from my horses with no breakdowns..Your in this to make money and if the horse is traing good eating well and feeling good he will run..You dont have to win each and every race.As long as your horse is paying his way. I feel for you if you or one of your friends got shafted, the biggist problem for owners today...Big outfits Big sob stories and no money and a shortage of horses.If you claim a horse,Run him where he belongs and you hopefully will make money.I have a beautiful 3yo filly that we just bought from a man and lady who gave this filly to a trainer,Took 70 a day from them for 3 months(,They lived 3 hours away) and all the filly did was run around in a paddock. Stuff like that makes me sick.I also ask you to reread all of my posts(I have been a member since 2004) on this thread and maybe research my posts on PA and you might get a different feel for me.I understand what you are saying.I have made a few people mad from my brashness,I tell it like it is and I wont bullshit you.I hate incompitence and I run a tight ship with my stable,There isnt a thing anyone (blacksmith) (vet) does to any of my horses with out me being there.Love you to take a day and come see for yourself.What else can I say...The choice is your. Thankyou

[newtothegame]

Tom, I really (in my opinion), do not think the issue is you personally. the single biggest obstacle that I see is the distance between most of the members here. Personally, I have no problem NOT being in the winners circle. Nor, a long distance trainer and a horse who is several states away. I am in a business that requires alot of those same issues so its really not a biggie for me. But, I can see how for some it would be a major issue.
Mineshaft, I believe, is the closest to me. I am a few hours east of EVD and I believe he is near there.
But, from a logistics standpoint, there are members as far away as Illinois and further. It would involve trust.....
you know what..crap I hate all this typing...let me look back and grab your number lol....

[Shemp Howard]

I'm in with McShell if everyone/anyone else is. I like Calder and have no interest in getting my picture taken. I'm in it to hopefully make a few bucks and cash a few bets.

[Mineshaft]

No interest in seeing my horse run in person thats why i got TVG and HRTV.


Tom has been on this forum for a awhile and is a straight up person. I have communicated with him several times even before we decided to do this partnership.


Any more people want in?

[Mineshaft]

There are (2) 16K claiming races tomorrow at Calder if anyone wants to check those horses out.

[Mineshaft]

Ok just for shits and giggles who would you want to claim out of the 7th and 9th races at Calder Sunday?

[highnote]

Very interesting thread. I managed a syndicate 10 years ago. We raced at a midwestern track. Our plan was to claim $7,500 horses and then run them back at the same level or drop them because the purses were so big from slot subsidies. There were 5 or 6 members and we all put up $2,500 and never put in another dime except for our individual licenses.

We claimed one and bought one and at the end of a couple of years we discontinued the operation, but everyone got a check for $250. So we all lost 90% of our investment, but we had 2 years of inexpensive and exciting entertainment.

Andy Beyer wrote about a stable called Non Sequitor Stables in Maryland. They were a group of 4 or 5 lawyers. They were also handicappers. They insisted on working with a trainer who would take direction from the syndicate manager about where to place the horse. The trainer's job was to keep the horse fit. The syndicate manager's job was to find the claims and place the horse.

So that was the model our syndicate was supposed to use. It didn't work out as planned. And that's basically my fault. The trainer was persuasive and said she had knew of a good claim for us. So I took her advice. Big mistake. She claimed a horse from a man that had come up from another state with a few horses and was keeping them in her stalls. Talk about conflict of interest!

The horse ran well once and never ran well again. I told her the horse was a miler based on pedigree and physique. She would not run him at a mile. We ended up selling the horse to a local stable for a few hundred dollars. I gave the new owners my research and told them the horse was a miler. They entered the horse at a mile and won. I was happy and pissed at the same time.

I learned to be a pretty good paddock handicapper from a friend who is an expert paddock handicapper. We spent single every weekend at the NYRA races for a solid year looking at horses in the paddock and judging their optimal distance based on physique. I know you can tell what distance a horse is suited to by its looks because I learned to do it. I had seen thousands of horses and knew we had a miler.

I made another mistake. Our original plan was to NOT claim maidens. Our trainer said she found a good, unraced gelding for us that she could buy cheaply from a friend. We figured it was only $400 so it seemed like a cheap gamble. Still, it was in conflict with what I told our members we would do. We bought -- or should I say she bought it for us. Another conflict of interest by the way -- buying it from her friend. It had a breathing problem when it worked hard. She called it "roaring". I said to try using a tongue tie. Now, if you look at the horses in NY in the paddock you will see a lot of tongue ties. I had never seen more than a couple at this track. She said they were too much trouble to put on and they don't work. I said, what can it hurt? Nearly every horse in NY wears them. So they must do some good!
The horse eventually broke its maiden. We were offered $4,000 for it after the race. I wanted to sell at a profit. The other members wanted to keep racing it -- which was disappointing to me. I knew it would never win another race. And it didn't. We eventually gave it away and it became decent hunter jumper.

One final mistake I made. Gasper Moschera had trained a pretty good graded stakes horse in NY. I had seen this horse run many times on the NYRA circuit. The horse disappeared and then showed up in a claiming race for $4,000 at my midwestern track. I told our trainer we had to claim this horse because it was a graded stakes winning horse in NY. This horse was way better than a $4,000 claimer at my track. She said it wasn't worth it and it wasn't any good any more. That horse finished in the money or won it's next several races and with TLC probably could have had a decent career. Again, I knew I was right, but deferred to the so-called "expert".

My point is that if the manager is an expert handicapper then the manager should make all the decisions because chances are the trainer is not an expert handicapper. If you let the trainer make the decisions or if you let the members make the decisions by committee you are setting yourself up for disappointment.

The only way I would own horses in a syndicate is if I made all the decisions about which ones to claim and where to place them. Or I would own them myself, but I would still only hire a trainer who will do as I say. If I think the horse needs to work in company in the morning then the horse should work in company.

My midwestern trainer thought I was from the moon. She had never heard of working in company.

I would give them long gallops everyday -- if they are able. I understand some claimers are constantly sore. She would never take the time to gallop them everyday. Some days they just walked the shedrow.

One time our horse worked so slowly that the clocker asked her what time she wanted to report because if the clocker reported the actual time our horse would not be eligible to race!

I have thought more than once about taking out a trainer's license or training the horses on my farm and then running them in the name of a trainer -- if that is allowed?

Lastly, you will probably want to form a limited liability company. You'll need to send out tax statements to your members. I have an accounting background so was able to do all the tax document preparation. If you have to pay an accountant, you will have higher accounting costs than my syndicate had, obviously.

So that's my experience running a syndicate.

[tbwinner]

Mineshaft I don't really like much in those races tomorrow at Calder. The only one I see that has potential is Miss Muffin running in the 9th but she is running under the allowance condition and not able to be claimed.

swetyejohn thanks for your insight. Although you said you had a fun and memorable experience, seems you had a bunch of bad racing luck especially with that trainer you started with. If you wouldn't mind could you PM her name to me? Also what track did you race at?

I'm still in the camp that says we should race as an LLC. As much as we seemingly "trust" each other online we don't know each other personally (again, with the exception of a few) and it does make for easier tax reporting.

Chris

[InsideTheRaces.com]

You guys need to Claim a Horse out of PARX.
Claim a Filly or Mare with good breeding that has some speed out of a claiming 7500n2 or n3. The purse on a 7500 claimer at PARX is 22k. Basically a good running 7500 horse at PARX is a 10k-15k conditional claimer at most of the other tracks in the area. If you get a well bred Filly even if it comes up with problems you can still sell them for something unlike a gelding where you almost have to give them away.
Find out how long a horse is in Jail at PARX after a claim I think its 30 days.
This is what I would suggest if Jail Time is 30 days.
Claim a 7500 filly out of a conditional claimer. Send the horse to Colonial Downs and try it on the turf or dirt in a 10k-15k conditional claiming race. The fields are weak at Colonial and easy pickings compared to other tracks in the area.
If the horse can run some knuckle head will claim it at Colonial for the 10-15k plus you'll probably win some purse money.

If you claim a horse at Calder the only options you have is run at Calder or a $700-$1000 bill for shipping to try another track.

My Advice is Prepare for the Worst and Hope for the best.
Even if the horse wins at a 10% clip it's a break even game.

All of you should get a racing license a national license is $100 something. With the license you can get into the tracks for free plus get on the backside. If you've never been on the backside the price of the license is worth it so you can see what goes on. It will be a eye opener if you hang around long enough and pay attention.

[Mineshaft]

Mineshaft I don't really like much in those races tomorrow at Calder. The only one I see that has potential is Miss Muffin running in the 9th but she is running under the allowance condition and not able to be claimed.

swetyejohn thanks for your insight. Although you said you had a fun and memorable experience, seems you had a bunch of bad racing luck especially with that trainer you started with. If you wouldn't mind could you PM her name to me? Also what track did you race at?

I'm still in the camp that says we should race as an LLC. As much as we seemingly "trust" each other online we don't know each other personally (again, with the exception of a few) and it does make for easier tax reporting.

Chris





I agree about the 7th and 9th races. Miss Muffin and Ventania are the only 2 i would look at and they are both under Allowance conditions.

I just wanted the members to try and get use to the racing form and to see why some of would claim a horse and why we wouldnt claim a horse.

[tbwinner]

I am putting the horse Pablito P in my stable mail. It's racing at Penn on Tuesday for $12,500 under N2L conditions. Just claimed for $10k...if it comes back for $10k or does well for $12.5k and comes back at that price I think it has solid potential. Good looking horse racing in those tough allowances at Parx now moves back to claimers at Penn.

[onefast99]

If I may...ALL the tracks you have listed,Your day rate is going to exced your fun..You guys are making it very compicated for yourselves..You can race under McSchell Racing INC. NObody needs to be licenced..One person looks after the funds.I look after the horse...You are looking at the purses but you still have to win them. For the life of me,I cant understand why you need 12k in reserve.Buying a 2yo is the worst way to get your feet wet.Claim a hot horse,Win with it then turn it over and on to the next one.I can fulfill all of your questions as Im only a phone call away.
Our first claim was Aspenflower a hot horse in the claim box, 20k claim at the Meadowlands we ran her back 1 month later at Aqueduct in a 20k claimer with John Valasquez up, we lost by a neck she was claimed. Took her back 2 months later for 20k finished 3rd with her and she was claimed again from us for 25k. Kelly Breen was our trainer he did a great job placing her in spots we had a chance to win and get claimed in . Tom you hit it right on the head a hot claimer is the way to go!

[Mineshaft]

Our first claim was Aspenflower a hot horse in the claim box, 20k claim at the Meadowlands we ran her back 1 month later at Aqueduct in a 20k claimer with John Valasquez up, we lost by a neck she was claimed. Took her back 2 months later for 20k finished 3rd with her and she was claimed again from us for 25k. Kelly Breen was our trainer he did a great job placing her in spots we had a chance to win and get claimed in . Tom you hit it right on the head a hot claimer is the way to go!






Love it..

[onefast99]

Love it..
If you remember a horse named Stolen Time, I claimed him for 25k at MP in a 7 way shake. Ran him in an optional claimer finished 2nd. Had two more seconds with him before we sent him to NY for the winter where he was claimed for $30k. Hot horses in the claim box get you your money back!

[PICSIX]

Question for those of us who are in...Would we not want our trainer to have a stake in the horse as well?

My trainer in Nebraska would claim any horse I wanted (unless he found out, through his network, it had problems).

I did OK with horses (broke even or didn't lose too much) I thought I should claim.

I did much better when my trainer offered to go in on a couple that we found together or he told me we should claim.

Basically, he knew more (which he should, it's his job) then I did about which horses were good claims.

He knew which trainers he should claim from and which ones he shouldn't.

When I would go watch workouts in the morning I was amazed that he knew almost every horse that was on the track, who trained it and if it was looking better or worse than it had in the past.

I don't know Tom Schell personally but from what I've read I think he is this type of trainer.

Just some things to think about.

[Mineshaft]

Question for those of us who are in...Would we not want our trainer to have a stake in the horse as well?

My trainer in Nebraska would claim any horse I wanted (unless he found out, through his network, it had problems).

I did OK with horses (broke even or didn't lose too much) I thought I should claim.

I did much better when my trainer offered to go in on a couple that we found together or he told me we should claim.

Basically, he knew more (which he should, it's his job) then I did about which horses were good claims.

He knew which trainers he should claim from and which ones he shouldn't.

When I would go watch workouts in the morning I was amazed that he knew almost every horse that was on the track, who trained it and if it was looking better or worse than it had in the past.

I don't know Tom Schell personally but from what I've read I think he is this type of trainer.

Just some things to think about.





Have no problem with the trainer buying into the horse.

[Mineshaft]

10-12.5K claimers at Philly running for a 30K purse. Only 6 in the race.


That is a damn good purse for 12.5K claimers

[Si2see]

I'm in with McShell if everyone/anyone else is. I like Calder and have no interest in getting my picture taken. I'm in it to hopefully make a few bucks and cash a few bets.

Cash a few big money bets is what you will. Look back at Gulfstream Jan 12 2007 Silversandsoftime

[Mineshaft]

Question for those of us who are in...Would we not want our trainer to have a stake in the horse as well?

My trainer in Nebraska would claim any horse I wanted (unless he found out, through his network, it had problems).

I did OK with horses (broke even or didn't lose too much) I thought I should claim.

I did much better when my trainer offered to go in on a couple that we found together or he told me we should claim.

Basically, he knew more (which he should, it's his job) then I did about which horses were good claims.

He knew which trainers he should claim from and which ones he shouldn't.

When I would go watch workouts in the morning I was amazed that he knew almost every horse that was on the track, who trained it and if it was looking better or worse than it had in the past.

I don't know Tom Schell personally but from what I've read I think he is this type of trainer.

Just some things to think about.






Trainers pretty much know most horses that are running at the track. Also they know what a trainers motive is also i.e. are they stealing a race? or they trying to unload the horse?

When you pick a horse out on form you have to have some info on the horse and thats where the trainer or groom comes into play .Sometimes you cant find out about the horse but you should at least to try and find out.

[PIC6SIX]

I would be interested in a part ownership. Please keep my login ID handy in case anything seriously begins to take shape with organizing a partnership. Please notify me if that happens. :) :confused:

[buffaloxp]

Has there ever been, or, is there a group of members (10 or more) that have formed a syndicate for the purpose of owning race horses?

I used to own a few lower level claimers in Nebraska and would like to get involved with a syndicate or help start one if need be.

Thanks,

Mike
Formed a syndicate to owne a race horses , 90% of the time , you will lose, because 90 % of the horse can not make to pay themself, and your need to help to play.
IF your formed a BETTING syndicate , 99% of the meet, your will make some money, i will said 30% to 250%

[newtothegame]

Formed a syndicate to owne a race horses , 90% of the time , you will lose, because 90 % of the horse can not make to pay themself, and your need to help to play.
IF your formed a BETTING syndicate , 99% of the meet, your will make some money, i will said 30% to 250%

Can ya "play it again sam"????

[Spendabuck85]

For anyone that may be interested tonight's NTRA Night School subject is Horse Ownership.
Following is from an email just received:
This week's Night School session will explore horse ownership. Monday’s session will include guests Joe Kristufek and Beginner's Host Jeremy Plonk, along with special guests Terry Finley, President of West Point Thoroughbreds, and Dan Metzger, President of the Thoroughbred Owners and Breeders Association (TOBA). Elliott Walden, President/CEO of WinStar Farm, and Daily Racing Form correspondent David Grening will offer special video insights during the session.

The 90-minute program will begin with a 30-minute panelist discussion on horse ownership, then follow with a 30-minute question-and-answer session during which racing fans worldwide can ask the experts about the evening's subject matter

[buffaloxp]

Can ya "play it again sam"????

50/50