Monmouth Racing dates to be settled Friday (maybe)

[The_Knight_Sky]

Monmouth Dates Request on Regulators' Agenda (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/61866/monmouth-dates-request-on-regulators-agenda)
by Tom DeMartini

The latest rumor has Monmouth running 80 days for about $400,000 a day
in purses, though the New Jersey Thoroughbred Horsemen’s Association
must sign off on any reduction in dates.

http://i53.tinypic.com/5a017p.gif New Jersey THA president John Forbes said a reduction of dates
was “non-negotiable” unless purses are at or near 2010 levels.

[Robert Goren]

Monmouth Dates Request on Regulators' Agenda (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/61866/monmouth-dates-request-on-regulators-agenda)
by Tom DeMartini

The latest rumor has Monmouth running 80 days for about $400,000 a day
in purses, though the New Jersey Thoroughbred Horsemen’s Association
must sign off on any reduction in dates.

http://i53.tinypic.com/5a017p.gif New Jersey THA president John Forbes said a reduction of dates
was “non-negotiable” unless purses are at or near 2010 levels.I hope they call the NJTHA's bluff. Let them try to find someplace outside of NJ where those NJ breds can win.

[David-LV]

I hope they call the NJTHA's bluff. Let them try to find someplace outside of NJ where those NJ breds can win.

Robert,

What do you have against New Jersey, do you have a vested interest. It was a great place to grow up.
Even most of the people are pretty decent.
Give them a break, we went through this same dialog last racing season.

_______
David-LV

[Robert Goren]

I stated over and over again that I hope that NJ finds a way to make Monmouth Park a standalone profitable race track. That is not what NJTHA wants. They want high a long a meet with outrageous purses. I believe that kind of greed and what has to be done to satisfy it is the major problem that is killing off horse racing. It is my hope that powers that be in NJ stand up and say "enough is too much already". Last year I said that what NJ was doing would only make things worse. I was right. They need to compete for gamblers, not horses. I said that last year and I am saying it again this year. The increase in purse money did not raise enough revenue to match it on a dollar for dollar basis. I have never seen purses increases help the profitability of a track. Monmouth needs to tighten its belt until it turns the the corner. Then they can talk about more days and higher purses.

[Robert Goren]

Why doesn't the NJTHA just take over the running of Monmouth? The track here in Lincoln was run by Nebraska's horsemen's group, NHBPA , last year and will be again this year. They were a major improvement over the group that ran it before.

[Brogan]

Why doesn't the NJTHA just take over the running of Monmouth? The track here in Lincoln was run by Nebraska's horsemen's group, NHBPA , last year and will be again this year. They were a major improvement over the group that ran it before.
The NJ horsemen are one of the groups in the mix to take over Monmouth already.

[Canarsie]

I stated over and over again that I hope that NJ finds a way to make Monmouth Park a standalone profitable race track. That is not what NJTHA wants. They want high a long a meet with outrageous purses. I believe that kind of greed and what has to be done to satisfy it is the major problem that is killing off horse racing. It is my hope that powers that be in NJ stand up and say "enough is too much already". Last year I said that what NJ was doing would only make things worse. I was right. They need to compete for gamblers, not horses. I said that last year and I am saying it again this year. The increase in purse money did not raise enough revenue to match it on a dollar for dollar basis. I have never seen purses increases help the profitability of a track. Monmouth needs to tighten its belt until it turns the the corner. Then they can talk about more days and higher purses.

If you were right how come so many bidders are flying out of the woodwork to lease the joint?

[Zman179]

Robert,

What do you have against New Jersey, do you have a vested interest. It was a great place to grow up.
Even most of the people are pretty decent.
Give them a break, we went through this same dialog last racing season.

_______
David-LV

More like a great place to throw up. Highest property taxes in the country, third highest car insurance rates, hellish backups trying to drive into New York City. I've always wondered why all of the toll bridges and tunnels to NYC and Philadelphia always charge you to LEAVE New Jersey.

Just kidding. :lol: New York ain't freakin' better.

[The Hawk]

I hope they call the NJTHA's bluff. Let them try to find someplace outside of NJ where those NJ breds can win.

It seems to me (I could certainly be wrong) that the horsemen currently have leverage, in that the law now states that there will be a 141-day meet. From what I understand, the only way it changes is if the horsemen agree to a change, which will of course involve some concessions that are favorable to them. What do you mean by "call their bluff?"

[MaTH716]

I stated over and over again that I hope that NJ finds a way to make Monmouth Park a standalone profitable race track. That is not what NJTHA wants. They want high a long a meet with outrageous purses. I believe that kind of greed and what has to be done to satisfy it is the major problem that is killing off horse racing. It is my hope that powers that be in NJ stand up and say "enough is too much already". Last year I said that what NJ was doing would only make things worse. I was right. They need to compete for gamblers, not horses. I said that last year and I am saying it again this year. The increase in purse money did not raise enough revenue to match it on a dollar for dollar basis. I have never seen purses increases help the profitability of a track. Monmouth needs to tighten its belt until it turns the the corner. Then they can talk about more days and higher purses.

But if you attract the horses (full fields) won't the gamblers follow (and I thought that they did)? It sounds like they had the right idea, they just have to tweak some of the numbers.
Wouldn't cutting the purses bring the track back to the days of 5 horse fields and the even worse 3 horse fields when they wash off the turf?
Let's face it, the "Jersey Meet" that took place after Labor Day was not good racing by any stretch of the imagination. I really can't see gamblers flocking back to that type of meet again and I think there was a drop in the numbers after Labor day to prove it.

[alhattab]

It seems to me (I could certainly be wrong) that the horsemen currently have leverage, in that the law now states that there will be a 141-day meet. From what I understand, the only way it changes is if the horsemen agree to a change, which will of course involve some concessions that are favorable to them. What do you mean by "call their bluff?"

I believe you are correct Hawk. The 141 day agreement is tied to simulcast import and NJ Bets. The horsemen have the right to cut off simulcasting if they don't get the 141 dates. My guess is that the horsemen's position is that the new operator has a choice, all of which suck: 1) get buried trying to run 141 days, 2) try to run for less $ than last year (per day), in which case we won't allow and cut off all simulcasts and on-line betting or 3) rather than lose your blouse and piss off your fans with options 1 and 2, just make the "investment" in us and pay us close to last year. By my count, last year's money was around $46 million (about $800k/day over 50 day "elite" meet plus $300k/day over 20 day Fall meet). The rumor of $400k/day over 80 days gets you $32 million. So the new operator would have to come up with roughly $8 million to meet in the middle of $32 million and $46 million.

This could end up being a classic shit-eating contest in which the biggest losers are the fans- no live racing and no simulcasts because the horsemen cutoff. I hope we have good beach weather this summer!

[Robert Goren]

The people bidding on it are hoping to some day get slots.
To the horsemen: Where is the money coming from to give you what you want? There is no 30 million from the casinos this year. Why are fighting so hard against making Monmouth Park a self sufficient profitable racing operation? Why aren't you willing to give up a little to bring gamblers back to the track?

[ronsmac]

But if you attract the horses (full fields) won't the gamblers follow (and I thought that they did)? It sounds like they had the right idea, they just have to tweak some of the numbers.
Wouldn't cutting the purses bring the track back to the days of 5 horse fields and the even worse 3 horse fields when they wash off the turf?
Let's face it, the "Jersey Meet" that took place after Labor Day was not good racing by any stretch of the imagination. I really can't see gamblers flocking back to that type of meet again and I think there was a drop in the numbers after Labor day to prove it.
After Labor day wasn't as good as before labor day, but was still much better than last yr based on handle and field size. Going back to 5 days a week would be a disaster. 2010 was the best Monmouth meet I've seen since the 80's and was a better meet to bet than Saratoga.

[Robert Goren]

But if you attract the horses (full fields) won't the gamblers follow (and I thought that they did)? It sounds like they had the right idea, they just have to tweak some of the numbers.
Wouldn't cutting the purses bring the track back to the days of 5 horse fields and the even worse 3 horse fields when they wash off the turf?
Let's face it, the "Jersey Meet" that took place after Labor Day was not good racing by any stretch of the imagination. I really can't see gamblers flocking back to that type of meet again and I think there was a drop in the numbers after Labor day to prove it.Even you think the meet didn't lose money after discounting the 30 million from the casinos, you are still going have to tweak that 30 million. That is a lot of tweaking.
If you want more gamblers, you need to give them a better deal. The takeout rates in NJ are way too high. 17% for WPS compared places like NYRA and CD's 16% and California's 15.4%. Not once have I seen anything written about the NJTHA wanting to address that problem.

[Robert Goren]

After Labor day wasn't as good as before labor day, but was still much better than last yr based on handle and field size. Going back to 5 days a week would be a disaster. 2010 was the best Monmouth meet I've seen since the 80's and was a better meet to bet than Saratoga. It was a disaster when you compared costs to revenues from the racing operation. I do agree that a 5 day a week schedule is a very bad idea at this time.

[Bluto Blutarsky]

Goren says-
"I hope they call the NJTHA's bluff. Let them try to find someplace outside of NJ where those NJ breds can win."

I'm pretty sure NJ breds made significantly more money in open company races last year as compared to say- Nebraska breds.

The NJTHA will back off on their demand to run 141 days.
Even Forbes isn't that stupid.
There will not be a 5 day race schedule- that would be suicide. Forbes and the horsemen know it.

[onefast99]

Goren says-
"I hope they call the NJTHA's bluff. Let them try to find someplace outside of NJ where those NJ breds can win."

I'm pretty sure NJ breds made significantly more money in open company races last year as compared to say- Nebraska breds.

The NJTHA will back off on their demand to run 141 days.
Even Forbes isn't that stupid.
There will not be a 5 day race schedule- that would be suicide. Forbes and the horsemen know it.
Fasten your seat belts everyone, I think it will come down to Stronach versus Brunetti, winner takes it all.

[onefast99]

Monmouth Dates Request on Regulators' Agenda (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/61866/monmouth-dates-request-on-regulators-agenda)
by Tom DeMartini

The latest rumor has Monmouth running 80 days for about $400,000 a day
in purses, though the New Jersey Thoroughbred Horsemen’s Association
must sign off on any reduction in dates.

http://i53.tinypic.com/5a017p.gif New Jersey THA president John Forbes said a reduction of dates
was “non-negotiable” unless purses are at or near 2010 levels.
The total purse amount per day is a very significant part of the deal for the new suitor. They will need to make sure that the losses from the track operation can be made up with the OTW revenue stream as well as the internet betting. Once the new lessee is in look for a lot of waste being cut out as it seems there is plenty.

[Bluto Blutarsky]

The quote of the week comes from the Monmouth Park RFP meeting-

Little Silver NJ resident and Hialeah Park owner John Brunetti said,
" I expect to prevail in the current auction. I didn't come here to lose."

FYI- Brunetti owns NJ breds. He does not own a Nebraska bred.

[ronsmac]

Even you think the meet didn't lose money after discounting the 30 million from the casinos, you are still going have to tweak that 30 million. That is a lot of tweaking.
If you want more gamblers, you need to give them a better deal. The takeout rates in NJ are way too high. 17% for WPS compared places like NYRA and CD's 16% and California's 15.4%. Not once have I seen anything written about the NJTHA wanting to address that problem.
They have a better takeout on exacta's pick 4's and pick 5's than So Cal. With the 6 horse fields u get in Socal there is no chance of an overlay unless the take was closer to 5% on wps. Plus the Socal bettor is a little more sophisticated . Churchills Tri and Pick 3 takeout is decent. Monmouth needs lower take on tri's and pick 3's.

[BIG49010]

They have a better takeout on exacta's pick 4's and pick 5's than So Cal. With the 6 horse fields u get in Socal there is no chance of an overlay unless the take was closer to 5% on wps. Plus the Socal bettor is a little more sophisticated . Churchills Tri and Pick 3 takeout is decent. Monmouth needs lower take on tri's and pick 3's.


If that criminal Brunetti gets the track, he was king of the high takeout, he'll kill racing in NJ.

[onefast99]

If that criminal Brunetti gets the track, he was king of the high takeout, he'll kill racing in NJ.
Without someone like him taking a shot at making it work it will die a slow death in the hands of the NJSEA.

[ronsmac]

It was a disaster when you compared costs to revenues from the racing operation. I do agree that a 5 day a week schedule is a very bad idea at this time.
I'm a bettor, not a racetrack operator. From a betting perspective it was a huge success.

[The_Knight_Sky]

Without someone like him taking a shot at making it work
it will die a slow death in the hands of the NJSEA.



I'm not sure about that. It's the business philosophy that has failed both the NJSEA and Brunetti in the past. If it was focused on the horse racing product itself they'd both be alive in horse racing. Instead they're both gasping for air.





Monmouth needs lower take on tri's and pick 3's.



Agreed.
The trifecta pools were underperforming compared to the other wagering pools last summer. Clearly the Tri takeout is prohibitive and must be corrected.