Borel's possible derby mount

[Reezy]

Does borel even have a mount with a chance or will he wait and pick up somebodies leftovers and win the derby that way.. its crazy no one is trying to get him on some of the top horses

[lamboguy]

the only place he knows how to ride is churchill. boy does he ever know how to ride that place!

[Reezy]

And meydan haha

[Tom]

He is the Master of Meydan!

[Striker]

You could see a repeat of last year when he goes on one of Pletcher's. Ramon will have ridden both Brethren and Stay Thirsty. Provided both go postward for the Derby with Uncle Mo. Borel could get whichever Ramon doesn't stay with. Just a thought.

[Marlin]

You could see a repeat of last year when he goes on one of Pletcher's. Ramon will have ridden both Brethren and Stay Thirsty. Provided both go postward for the Derby with Uncle Mo. Borel could get whichever Ramon doesn't stay with. Just a thought.I agree with you 100%. If the Derby were tomorrow I'm pretty sure it would end up this way.

[Sundown]

See how Elite Alex ends up in the Rebel at Oaklawn with Borel aboard in two weeks.

[Mineshaft]

he will have a mount just dont know who yet.

[Pell Mell]

I think "Jinks" kind of likes Calvin but don't know if he would be inclined to take a relative off Archie.

[toussaud]

Elite Alex barring injury is going to be his derby mount

[illinoisbred]

Elite Alex barring injury is going to be his derby mount
I don't know...he better win something soon to backup all the excessive hype or he'll be shoved to the curb.

[toussaud]

I don't know...he better win something soon to backup all the excessive hype or he'll be shoved to the curb.
borel's 3 derby wins, won a combined 1 derby prep. he will be fine.

[Dahoss9698]

borel's 3 derby wins, won a combined 1 derby prep. he will be fine.

That's not really fair though. Street Sense was a champion at 2 at won the Juvenile by double digits. Mine That Bird had some okay 2 year old form winning some stakes and Super Saver won a grade 2 at Churchill as a 2 year old and was beaten a nk and 1/2 length in his Derby preps.

His prior winners had soild 2 year old foundation. I know Elite Alex was wide last time, but so was the winner and he disposed of Elite Alex with ease. He hasn't really run a fast race yet and his trip was hardly the worst coming out of that race. I don't think all the hype is justified with this one.

[toussaud]

That's not really fair though. Street Sense was a champion at 2 at won the Juvenile by double digits. Mine That Bird had some okay 2 year old form winning some stakes and Super Saver won a grade 2 at Churchill as a 2 year old and was beaten a nk and 1/2 length in his Derby preps.

His prior winners had soild 2 year old foundation. I know Elite Alex was wide last time, but so was the winner and he disposed of Elite Alex with ease. He hasn't really run a fast race yet and his trip was hardly the worst coming out of that race. I don't think all the hype is justified with this one.
the winner was no where near as wide as Elite Alex. I saw the race "(hell i was on the rail). Elite alex was 4 wide on the first turn, and every bit of 7 wide on the 2nd, borel rode him like he was 4 lenghts better than anything else in the race. AAA on the other hand, caught a good position on the backstretch tucked in horses, maybe 3 or so off the rail and made a move on the turn. AAA got a dream trip actually.


What is it with people here who aruge for the sake of aruging? i Never said elite alex was going to win the derby, nor did I say he was the best horse out there or anything of the like, I did say he's going to be his derby horse if he can get in. Borel is going to ride or die with Elite Alex this year.

[illinoisbred]

Might be time to write the rough draft obituary.

[toussaud]

you might be right but calvin is a pretty loyal dude when it comes to his mounts.

[Dahoss9698]

the winner was no where near as wide as Elite Alex. I saw the race "(hell i was on the rail). Elite alex was 4 wide on the first turn, and every bit of 7 wide on the 2nd, borel rode him like he was 4 lenghts better than anything else in the race. AAA on the other hand, caught a good position on the backstretch tucked in horses, maybe 3 or so off the rail and made a move on the turn. AAA got a dream trip actually.


What is it with people here who aruge for the sake of aruging? i Never said elite alex was going to win the derby, nor did I say he was the best horse out there or anything of the like, I did say he's going to be his derby horse if he can get in. Borel is going to ride or die with Elite Alex this year.

I never said he was as wide, I said wide also. I said he was disposed of easily (fact). If you think Archarcharch got a dream trip I beg you to bet more and bet often.

You made a poor comparison with Borel's former Derby winning mounts and I showed you why it was a poor comparison. I realize you didn't say he is going to win, I didn't either. What I said was I don't think the hype is justified on this one and there were worse trips (Caleb's Posse for one) coming out of the Southwest.

What is it with people who cry when someone has an opinion (and can back it up) that differs from them? I didn't attack you, nor was I disrespectful. I merely disagree with your comparison and don't think much of a horse who was been (to this point) grossly overhyped.

[Saratoga_Mike]

To date, Elite Alex has done nothing from a visual or Beyer-perspective to merit Derby consideration, so I find myself agreeing with Dahoss. If it weren't for the Tim Ritchey/Afleet Alex connection, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, in my opinion.

[toussaud]

To date, Elite Alex has done nothing from a visual or Beyer-perspective to merit Derby consideration, so I find myself agreeing with Dahoss. If it weren't for the Tim Ritchey/Afleet Alex connection, we wouldn't even be having this discussion, in my opinion.
ing with him on what, that elite alex is not a legit threat, i never said he was lol. i said that's who calivn is going to ride in the derby. Him being good, has nothing to do with who he is going to ride.

the only way calvin got on ss in the first place was because he came to oaklawn and had ridden him at churchill, had they went anywhere else calvin would not have went more than likely. He didn't ride him in the tampa bay derby

for that to happen this year, he would have to get OFF elite alex, which isn't going to happen becuase of jockey /trainer politics. Calvin isn't going to piss off Tim Richtey, he gets some good horses and calvin wants to ride them.

so I come to the simple conclusion that if he's in the derby, calvin will be on his back.

[Saratoga_Mike]

ing with him on what, that elite alex is not a legit threat, i never said he was lol. i said that's who calivn is going to ride in the derby. Him being good, has nothing to do with who he is going to ride.

the only way calvin got on ss in the first place was because he came to oaklawn and had ridden him at churchill, had they went anywhere else calvin would not have went more than likely. He didn't ride him in the tampa bay derby

for that to happen this year, he would have to get OFF elite alex, which isn't going to happen becuase of jockey /trainer politics. Calvin isn't going to piss off Tim Richtey, he gets some good horses and calvin wants to ride them.

so I come to the simple conclusion that if he's in the derby, calvin will be on his back.

Fine, I'm saying Elite Alex won't be in the Derby despite your firsthand account of his last race.

[toussaud]

ok, but I have seen (much) worse horses in the derby than EA even if he is a fraud. Sure you don't want to admend that by saying he won't be a factor in the derby?

[Dahoss9698]

What is it with people here who aruge for the sake of aruging?

ok, but I have seen (much) worse horses in the derby than EA even if he is a fraud. Sure you don't want to admend that by saying he won't be a factor in the derby?

That's gold Jerry! Gold!

[Chris G]

I think with a better trip (probably trips...2 preps) Elite Alex gets into the Derby.

[Saratoga_Mike]

ok, but I have seen (much) worse horses in the derby than EA even if he is a fraud. Sure you don't want to admend that by saying he won't be a factor in the derby?

After thinking about it long and hard, I've decided not to admend or amend my previous statement about Elite Alex.

[Dahoss9698]

Hopefully the Elite Alex to the Derby talks end after todays performance.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Hopefully the Elite Alex to the Derby talks end after todays performance.

Shocking development.

[toussaud]

okay you win this horse is pathetic

[Shelby]

I wouldn't give up on Elite Alex yet. He did show improvement today IMO.

[toussaud]

I wouldn't give up on Elite Alex yet. He did show improvement today IMO. becuase the field was much worse lol. this field was BAD. For a second I thought he was going to win it when they hit the turn, then he just, like stopped lol.

[exactatom]

I just watched a replay of the race. I am curious why Calvin had this horse so far off the pace forcing a wide swing and he obviously did his best running in the last 1/8th? I am not blaming him for the loss, just questioning the strategy.

[Shelby]

Well, I love Calvin to death, but maybe Alex needs a change up? Maybe not dropping back to make a late run works for him. I dunno...I'm no expert.

[Chris G]

I think with a better trip (probably trips...2 preps) Elite Alex gets into the Derby.

I was WRONG.:ThmbDown:

[Striker]

Borel is scheduled to work Stay Thirsty at Churchill on Sunday morning, but Pletcher said that doesn't mean he will ride him in the derby. Hmmmm.

[FenceBored]

Borel is scheduled to work Stay Thirsty at Churchill on Sunday morning, but Pletcher said that doesn't mean he will ride him in the derby. Hmmmm.

Why would Pletcher put Calvin on Stay Thirsty in the Derby? He wants Uncle Mo to win.





:lol:

[Sekrah]

Santiva just got Shaun Bridgmohan.

[tribecaagent]

I gotta tell ya, I'm suprised. I thought for sure Desormeaux would end up on Santiva.

[OntheRail]

Why would Pletcher put Calvin on Stay Thirsty in the Derby? He wants Uncle Mo to win.





:lol:
If I read it right... he's working Mo as well. Could it be Pletcher wants to see how they blend? Would make Mo a NON TOSS with Calvin up.

[Dahoss9698]

I thought for sure Desormeaux would end up on Santiva.

Why?

[Dahoss9698]

If I read it right... he's working Mo as well. Could it be Pletcher wants to see how they blend? Would make Mo a NON TOSS with Calvin up.

I think the chances of anyone other than John Velazquez riding Uncle Mo in the Derby (if he runs) is about .000000001%.

I hope Borel rides Stay Thirsty. Stay Thirsty figures to be an underlay anyway, because of his name, he'd really be an underlay with Borel on him.

[tribecaagent]

Why?

Dude, don't be a troll. You know why. There's several reasons and you know every one of em.

[Dahoss9698]

Dude, don't be a troll. You know why. There's several reasons and you know every one of em.

What is it with people who make statements and when asked to clarify them have a tantrum? Is it that difficult to explain yourself?

I'm not sure why it is shocking that Desormeaux isn't riding Santiva in the Derby. Especially because Bridgmohan has ridden him before. I'll have to admit, I haven't kept up on Santiva much the last few months, so I'll ask again, why is this decision so shocking? What am I missing?

If you don't want to, or don't have an answer fine. But the question was sincere.

[PaceAdvantage]

Dude, don't be a troll. You know why. There's several reasons and you know every one of em.And here I thought this was some sort of inside humor between you two... :bang:

[turninforhome10]

I agree Dahoss. Kent is poison right now in KY. Fred Aime just picked up his book maybe that will help. See the link in Indian Charlie. Indian CHarlie (http://www.indiancharlie.com/current/)

Calvin Borel is way cool. I spent the morning with him at his brothers barn at Churchill where he jokingly show me the right way to clean a stall. The trainer I worked for who is also one of my best friends Tee Red Bernis made me feel right at home with all the crazy coonasses. When Tee Red and Calvin were discussing why cajun are such good riders they agreed 1 they are not afraid to ride the rail and 2) they got so good at riding because they were always getting pulled out of school cuz somebody was always runnin their mouth about how fast their was and the next thing you know there was a match race. It was a morning I will never forget.

[tribecaagent]

What is it with people who make statements and when asked to clarify them have a tantrum? Is it that difficult to explain yourself?

I'm not sure why it is shocking that Desormeaux isn't riding Santiva in the Derby. Especially because Bridgmohan has ridden him before. I'll have to admit, I haven't kept up on Santiva much the last few months, so I'll ask again, why is this decision so shocking? What am I missing?

If you don't want to, or don't have an answer fine. But the question was sincere.

Desormeaux has won the derby a couple of times, no? Desormeaux has won many races for Kenneally, no? In fact, a successful angle I've been using at Gulfstream for the past few seasons has been Kenneally runners dropping from maiden special weight to maiden claiming (typically with a short blowout a few days prior) and switch to Desormeaux.
Granted, Kenneally's been using Leperoux but he's already on Dialed In.

You're a sharp guy. This is not news to you.

[NTamm1215]

Desormeaux has won the derby a couple of times, no? Desormeaux has won many races for Kenneally, no? In fact, a successful angle I've been using at Gulfstream for the past few seasons has been Kenneally runners dropping from maiden special weight to maiden claiming (typically with a short blowout a few days prior) and switch to Desormeaux.
Granted, Kenneally's been using Leperoux but he's already on Dialed In.

You're a sharp guy. This is not news to you.

You're a patient guy. Desormeaux has not ridden one horse for Kenneally in the last 18 months and hasn't ridden for him at GP since 2009. How many has he ridden for him dropping from MSW-MCL at GP? One in the last five years.

The jockey standings for the year are pretty interesting, especially when you take a look at who is directly above Desormeaux. It is Amanda Tamburello, who has one more victory, a higher win percentage, and a significantly higher ROI. Desormeaux has been riding like garbage for a long time and why anyone would want him on their horse (whether he has 3 Derbies or not) is crazy.

[tribecaagent]

You're a patient guy. Desormeaux has not ridden one horse for Kenneally in the last 18 months and hasn't ridden for him at GP since 2009. How many has he ridden for him dropping from MSW-MCL at GP? One in the last five years.

The jockey standings for the year are pretty interesting, especially when you take a look at who is directly above Desormeaux. It is Amanda Tamburello, who has one more victory, a higher win percentage, and a significantly higher ROI. Desormeaux has been riding like garbage for a long time and why anyone would want him on their horse (whether he has 3 Derbies or not) is crazy.

Desormeaux's low win percentage and ROI is a direct result of his relationship with Mott.
Riding like garbage? That's subjective.

[turninforhome10]

You're a patient guy. Desormeaux has not ridden one horse for Kenneally in the last 18 months and hasn't ridden for him at GP since 2009. How many has he ridden for him dropping from MSW-MCL at GP? One in the last five years.

The jockey standings for the year are pretty interesting, especially when you take a look at who is directly above Desormeaux. It is Amanda Tamburello, who has one more victory, a higher win percentage, and a significantly higher ROI. Desormeaux has been riding like garbage for a long time and why anyone would want him on their horse (whether he has 3 Derbies or not) is crazy.
They dont call him "sleepy" for nothing

[turninforhome10]

Desormeaux's low win percentage and ROI is a direct result of his relationship with Mott.
Riding like garbage? That's subjective.
Sleepy cant sit still on a horse never could. His relationship with Mott has nothing to do with it.

[NTamm1215]

Desormeaux's low win percentage and ROI is a direct result of his relationship with Mott.
Riding like garbage? That's subjective.

You ever think that Mott's numbers are bad because of Desormeaux?

Of course opinions are subjective but Desormeaux has not ridden well this year at all.

[turninforhome10]

Desormeaux's low win percentage and ROI is a direct result of his relationship with Mott.
Riding like garbage? That's subjective.
Huh?
Sleepy has won 27 races this year 7 for Mott roughly 1/3

[PhantomOnTour]

Sleepy cant sit still on a horse never could. His relationship with Mott has nothing to do with it.
I guess he's a restless sleeper.
Seems an odd description for a guy nicknamed Sleepy.

[turninforhome10]

I guess he's a restless sleeper.
Seems an odd description for a guy nicknamed Sleepy.
Cause he won't get up in the morning to get on horses and his brain falls asleep during the race, remember Japan. Not being subjective just the word on the backside

[Dahoss9698]

In fact, a successful angle I've been using at Gulfstream for the past few seasons has been Kenneally runners dropping from maiden special weight to maiden claiming (typically with a short blowout a few days prior) and switch to Desormeaux.


You're a patient guy. Desormeaux has not ridden one horse for Kenneally in the last 18 months and hasn't ridden for him at GP since 2009. How many has he ridden for him dropping from MSW-MCL at GP? One in the last five years.


This was a pretty funny exchange. 1 in the last 5 years....:lol:

[keithw84]

One in the last five years.
Did that one win? If so, the MSW-MCL-KD at GP angle has been a great one for five years!:lol:

[Rapid Grey]

Borel to Stay Thirsty as many of us thought. ;)

[dnlgfnk]

Did that one win? If so, the MSW-MCL-KD at GP angle has been a great one for five years!:lol:

If the commonly reported 1% to 2% figure of consistent winning horseplayers is correct, there are a lot of storytellers on this forum.

I'm roughly $3K ahead since August 28, 2009. I manipulated parts of 2 pick threes into a personal pick 4 at Del Mar (Autocue, Powerofvoodoo, Fanatical, and Black Mamba), getting back 6K before taxes. Looking for trip excuses, I perused the charts for lower odds horses who finished behind longer odds counterparts, and it all came together one night. It is surely not a "spot play angle", and knowing that, I have largely made mental bets since (losing only my mind) due to the illegality of internet wagering in Mo.

[Jasonm921]

Borel to Stay Thirsty as many of us thought. ;)


Is this confirmed? I know he worked him the other day. This horse should be 40-1 on Derby day...wonder what his odds will be with Borel on him (15-1?). If he wins with this horse they should just have the Hall of Fame present him with the Derby trophy and his HOF plaque the same day.

[Rapid Grey]

Is this confirmed? I know he worked him the other day. This horse should be 40-1 on Derby day...wonder what his odds will be with Borel on him (15-1?). If he wins with this horse they should just have the Hall of Fame present him with the Derby trophy and his HOF plaque the same day.

Local Wave3 station here in Louisville reported it last night. Stay Thirsty will be overbet some but mostly in the WPS pools, not so much the gimmicks.

[Jasonm921]

True. The gimmicks will provide value. I wouldn't pick Stay Thirsty but I can't exactly throw him out now either. There is a very slight possibility that Stay Thirsty may be similar or dare I say it, lower odds than Uncle Mo depending on how much laymen money is thrown towards Borel. Dont forget the 8-1 on Super Saver last year...and that 100 grand bet from NBC will most likely be put on Borel. I have seen Jockeys affect odds on horses before ie. Bailey in his prime but it will be nothing like what we may possibly see in 13 days. In the eyes of the public its 19 horses and one Borel entering that starting gate.

[FenceBored]

Stay Thirsty with a bullet 1/19 (1:00.00) [Okay, the video shows him running second to Bridgetown].

96U5t0gKBdQ

[Jasonm921]

stay thirsty was on the rail.

[FenceBored]

stay thirsty was on the rail.

:bang: You're right, reversed them in my head for some stupid reason. :bang:

[Spendabuck85]

Borel to Stay Thirsty as many of us thought. ;)
Although Borel worked Stay Thirsty, Pletcher said he has no rider firmed up yet for the Derby. Borel and Pletcher teamed up to win the 2010 Derby with Super Saver.

“We haven’t done anything yet regarding a rider,” said Pletcher. “I’ll talk to Mike and see what he’s thinking first.”

Full article at drf.com
http://www.drf.com/news/clocker-report-mucho-macho-man-stay-thirsty-stay-schedule

[Rapid Grey]

Although Borel worked Stay Thirsty, Pletcher said he has no rider firmed up yet for the Derby. Borel and Pletcher teamed up to win the 2010 Derby with Super Saver.

“We haven’t done anything yet regarding a rider,” said Pletcher. “I’ll talk to Mike and see what he’s thinking first.”

Full article at drf.com
http://www.drf.com/news/clocker-report-mucho-macho-man-stay-thirsty-stay-schedule

Thanks for the link, guess the local station here tried to get the first scoop on the story, I do still think Borel is a good fit and find it interesting that in the workout this morning Calvin had Stay Thirsty right on the rail. ;)

[turninforhome10]

Watching the work, Stay Thirsty is still fighting with his leads by the wire. With the track sealed and floated the time was good, I guess they don't use dogs at CD in the AM.

[joanied]

Thanks for the link, guess the local station here tried to get the first scoop on the story, I do still think Borel is a good fit and find it interesting that in the workout this morning Calvin had Stay Thirsty right on the rail. ;) I beleive they want Stay Thirsty on the rail with someone to his outside, more of his learning process...and as long as things look 'iify' for Uncle Mo, they won't name Calvin as Stay Thirsty's rider...if Mo don't go...Johnny V gets Stay Thirsty.

[Striker]

Repole announced today that Ramon will ride Stay Thirsty in the Ky derby and that Borel worked ST as a favor for Pletcher.

[Robert Fischer]

How about the Sunland Derby winner? Twice the Appeal.

[Striker]

How about the Sunland Derby winner? Twice the Appeal.
On the DRF contender page it lists Santiago Reyes. Bejarano is free at the current moment.

[Badactor]

Hoping to keep the dream
and my future wagers alive...
Calvin Borel - Anthony's Cross.

[Pell Mell]

I read somewhere yesterday that Calvin's agent was interested in getting one of two horses for Calvin. One is Master Of Hounds and I thin the other was Twinspired but not sure about that.

If he could get MOH he would have a helluva shot at winning another one.
Backstretch really likes MOH! :ThmbUp:

[FenceBored]

I read somewhere yesterday that Calvin's agent was interested in getting one of two horses for Calvin. One is Master Of Hounds and I thin the other was Twinspired but not sure about that.

If he could get MOH he would have a helluva shot at winning another one.
Backstretch really likes MOH! :ThmbUp:

Mike Smith has been announced for Twinspired.
Hall of Fame jockey Mike Smith will ride Keeneland's Toyota Blue Grass runner-up Twinspired in the (http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20110426/SPORTS08/304260093/1037/Mike-Smith-will-ride-Twinspired-Kentucky-Derby-2011#)Kentucky Derby, said Daniel Johnson, managing partner of the Alpha Stables syndicate that co-owns the colt, after speaking with trainer Mike Maker.
-- http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20110426/SPORTS08/304260093/1037/Mike-Smith-will-ride-Twinspired-Kentucky-Derby-2011

[Pell Mell]

And I can't find where I read about it. Chalk it up to old age!:lol:

[FenceBored]

And I can't find where I read about it. Chalk it up to old age!:lol:

Yeah, Borel's agent has mentioned Master of Hounds as an angle he's working (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/62713/dominguez-to-ride-stay-thirsty-in-derby), but there's also the question of whether MoH will go in the 2k Guineas (http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2011/04/26/master-of-hounds-still-possible-for-guineas.aspx) and pass on the Ky Derby.

[GregReinhart]

I read somewhere yesterday that Calvin's agent was interested in getting one of two horses for Calvin. One is Master Of Hounds and I thin the other was Twinspired but not sure about that.

If he could get MOH he would have a helluva shot at winning another one.
Backstretch really likes MOH! :ThmbUp:

Gomez is also in the running for that horse and has the inside track per some tweets I have seen.

[picojim]

borel to ride twice the appeal

http://www.drf.com/news/kentucky-derby-borel-ride-twice-appeal

[dogkatcher]

Borel is riding Twice the Appeal, mystery is over!
Really sucks for Christian Santiago Reyes who rode
him to win the Sunland Derby. Next......

Sorry for the repeat, type to slow.

[Pell Mell]

Dumb move :ThmbDown:

[mistergee]

that just dropped the horses odds in half or more

[Jasonm921]

that just dropped the horses odds in half or more
Agreed. I think its a good mount for him. He has a decent shot at number 4.

[Robert Fischer]

How about the Sunland Derby winner? Twice the Appeal.
borel to ride twice the appeal

http://www.drf.com/news/kentucky-derby-borel-ride-twice-appeal

allright... good to hear

[Striker]

Bejarano to ride Watch me Go.

[salty]

Good, don't need to worry about that one. Unless borel moves horses up by ten lengths automaticaly in the derby.