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jelly
02-01-2011, 05:23 PM
A Message to Racing Fans
Thoroughbred racing in California is just that. We don’t and can’t rely on slot machines or government subsidies for the success of our business. We rely on our fans, our owners, our trainers, our employees and tens of thousands like you who love and continue to support California racing.

We’re grateful for the input of horseplayers who are unhappy with the recent change in takeout on exotic wagers. We know no one likes to pay more for groceries, gasoline, movie tickets or a Trifecta ticket. However, there are a few facts we’d like you to know about Thoroughbred racing in California:

•California remains the nation’s low price leader in the largest category of bets: win, place and show.
•California Trifecta and Superfecta takeout is among the lowest in the country ofthe tracks currently running.
•The takeout was increased to improve the quality of Thoroughbred racing in California. No California racetrack directly profits from the modified takeout.
•California’s wagering pools are still among the largest in the country.
California continues to offer a variety of wagers on racing at highly competitive prices.
We appreciate your support and are always interested in hearing what our fans have to say.




Cali. adv on paulick report

Maybe HANA should adv. right behind It.


http://www.bigcalpurses.com/openletter.html

cj
02-01-2011, 05:36 PM
You would think the web person would know how to get the �s out of the page.

FenceBored
02-01-2011, 05:40 PM
You would think the web person would know how to get the �s out of the page.

Ooops, need higher takeout to afford to do that.

andymays
02-01-2011, 05:43 PM
We knew this was coming out about a week ago. It's pretty mild. You have to expect them to fight back a little.

Hopefully we'll see some changes this week or next.

Greyfox
02-01-2011, 06:03 PM
:lol: http://www.bigcalpurses.com/images/calracing-sig.png

A group of masked bandits using the signature "Cal Racing," as if that is an individual appeal, gives the impression of a personal caring touch for you and me.

The_Knight_Sky
02-01-2011, 06:10 PM
•California Trifecta and Superfecta takeout is among the lowest
in the country ofthe tracks currently running.

The TOC and the CHRB took away opportunities in my favorite pool: The exacta.
And it's no fun playing the trifecta pool with 6 and 7 horses. Thanks. :faint:

•The takeout was increased to improve the quality of Thoroughbred racing in California. No California racetrack directly profits from the modified :D takeout.

The quality of racing has failed to improve from day 1. And it is the racetrack owners who are suffering thanks to this grotesque piece of selfishness by the TOC/CHRB. When racing dates and/or purses are reduced the owners and trainers will be suffering too.

That's unfortunate because many California owners and trainers can appreciate what a short-sighted move the Takeout Increase is. Other solutions to revamping the California racing industry must be explored. Who is doing that?

• We appreciate your support and are always interested in hearing
what our fans have to say.

Rescind the takeouts to previous levels perhaps the customers will return.
Longer the wait the bigger the loss of clientele moving forward. And the clock keeps ticking.

Stillriledup
02-01-2011, 06:14 PM
Dear Cal racing,

here's the problem.

Whether or not the takeout rates are higher or lower than other places isnt as important as this. If the thoroughbred customers just accept this massive takeout raise, who's to say that there won't be ANOTHER massive takeout raise in the next year or two? I mean, after all, if everyone listened to your letter and just bet like they normally bet, you guys would say, "HUH, check that out, we implemented a massive increase and the bettors kept betting at their normal pace, maybe we should just keep increasing the rates!!"

Also, and here's another thing you didnt consider, if the thoroughbred fans of California just accept this huge raise and don't bat an eye, what's to stop OTHER tracks from doing the same thing? Believe you me, other places are watching this CAREFULLY and if the Calif bettors just kept pouring money into the windows, other places would get 'ideas' and probably also make a move to implement higher takeouts.

Here are two more factors as to why plenty of people arent wagering on the So Cal product.

1) The verbal insults from your 'leaders' towards the fans. Hammerle, Israel, Brackpool and even Jeff Mullins have come out and thrown verbal barbs towards the players. If you shop at Target or JC Pennies and the security guard at the door calls you and idiot, addict and OLD, are you going to shop there? Absolutely not, you're going to take your business else where. A lot of the players who are abstaining from wagering on the So Cal product are doing so simply because they don't need insults tossed in their direction. Horseplayers have feelings, stop insulting them.

2) Bettors have not seen ONE thing that you have done to improve your product. They havent seen that raising takeout was a LAST RESORT. They havent seen more strict penalties towards drug cheats, they havent seen you go out of your way to improve field size either. You guys run your game as a public service annoucement to horsemen only, damn the bettors. The races are carded for the owners, not the bettors. The takeout raise means purse increases are funded by the horseplayers 100 percent. Why should the players give all their money to the owners/trainers/jocks?

What are the owners, trainers and jocks doing to help the So Cal industry? Are ANY of these guys taking a pay cut? Seriously, has any trainer or jock offered to take a pay cut to 'help out'? No, they not only aren't taking a pay cut, they're getting a pay RAISE. By purses "allegedly" going up, that means the trainers, owners and jocks are getting PAY RAISES.

Pay raises all at the expense of the players.

Nice.

You keep writing your little articles telling everyone its all AOK and we'll keep betting other tracks.

Stillriledup
02-01-2011, 06:16 PM
:lol: http://www.bigcalpurses.com/images/calracing-sig.png

A group of masked bandits using the signature "Cal Racing," as if that is an individual appeal, gives the impression of a personal caring touch for you and me.

Exactly, its SO embarrassing that nobody wanted to sign their name to it. :lol:

johnhannibalsmith
02-01-2011, 06:43 PM
I thought that 99.999999999999999999999999999324612347271% of horse bettors don't have any idea what takeout is and don't care.

This ad sounds like a waste of "limited resources" since nobody cares about takeout.

jelly
02-01-2011, 06:58 PM
Ric Hammerle called the boycott "nonsense".If so,why are they wasting their time with this.

Stillriledup
02-01-2011, 07:04 PM
Ric Hammerle called the boycott "nonsense".If so,why are they wasting their time with this.

Ask, and you shall receive.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78510&highlight=hammerle

toussaud
02-01-2011, 07:12 PM
They've blinked. 1 month ago we sat here debating on how many people cared about takeout, now they are taking out ads basically begging the people to wager. This is gong to get ugly, or pretty depending on what side of the fence you are on.

andymays
02-01-2011, 07:30 PM
Ric Hammerle called the boycott "nonsense".If so,why are they wasting their time with this.
The hardest part of this is knowing who to take seriously and who to ignore. As time goes by we are figuring out who to ignore. One particular guy with a news/smear website would be one of them.

Greyfox
02-01-2011, 07:32 PM
The problem is:
"Once a seasoned bettor walks away, he learns that there is a life outside of horse racing."
Lowering the take out now won't bring a lot of those types back.

andymays
02-01-2011, 07:34 PM
The problem is:
"Once a seasoned bettor walks away, he learns that there is a life outside of horse racing."
Lowering the take out now won't bring a lot of those types back.

I can tell you one thing. My personal interest in the sport has gone way way down over the last year and a half. Especially after being caught in the middle of this soap opera.

Stillriledup
02-01-2011, 07:36 PM
The problem is:
"Once a seasoned bettor walks away, he learns that there is a life outside of horse racing."
Lowering the take out now won't bring a lot of those types back.

They don't care about this. All they care about is how many dollars they can get TODAY. Their business plan doesnt factor in that there might be a tomorrow. They don't care about 'cultivating' a relationship with their customers, they just want to money grab whatever they can as fast as possible.

Horseplayersbet.com
02-01-2011, 07:42 PM
Regardless of whether bettors are cognizant of takeout or not, the economical impact of such a great increase in takeout eventually takes its toll.
I'm unaware of any takeout increase that has lead to sustained larger purses.

A boycott can speed up the inevitable though and it appears that Cal Racing is of the mindset that the boycott is impacting handle and that is why they are running this ad.

Southieboy
02-01-2011, 08:30 PM
The takeout was increased to improve the quality of Thoroughbred racing in California.
Well, where's the improvement?

johnhannibalsmith
02-01-2011, 08:41 PM
Well, where's the improvement?

The purse fund.

johnhannibalsmith
02-01-2011, 08:42 PM
The purse fund.

For the moment.

FenceBored
02-01-2011, 10:33 PM
Just ran across an article that had this passage:
The American Jockey Club has decided to accept his mandate, and so the public will be compelled to pay to Mr. Kelly either 3 or 5 per cent of their money to him for holding it for 20 minutes, according as to whether they bet in the auction or French pools. ... That the public will not consent to pay the exorbitant percentage charged to the manipulators of the French machines and the sellers of auction pools is certain.
-- NYT, April 23, 1888 (http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20916F73C5E15738DDDAA0A94DC405B 8884F0D3)

chickenhead
02-01-2011, 10:51 PM
Thoroughbred bettors everywhere are just that, bettors. We don’t rely on anything but a potentially positive ROI for the return on our bets. We rely on good wagering opportunities.

We’re grateful for the input of tracks and horsemen who are unhappy with the recent change in handle in California. We know no one likes to get paid less for running a horse in a circle. However, there are a few facts we’d like you to know about Thoroughbred racing in California:

California did not sport a low takeout even before the takeout increase. Takeout rates in horse racing are too high everywhere. Raising rates don't make you more competetive, they make you even less competetive.

The takeout increase categorically decreased the quality and quantity of Thoroughbred wagering opportunities in California this year.

Every California bettor directly loses from the modified takeout.

Because of this bettors are naturally playing less, as should be expected.

California’s wagering pools are shrinking, and will continue shrinking.

Being that California relies solely on it's bettors for funding, it's probably not a bad idea to pay attention.

We don't anticipate your support, but it's always fun seeing what you'll come up with next.

signed,

bigcalbettors

owlet
02-02-2011, 01:12 AM
Dear Jelly:

You and the people you carry water for (Harris, Baffert, Sadler, etc.) are a complete and total fraud. And do you think we can't see that? Do you think that the higher purses have ACTUALLY led to better fields and more competitive racing? Do you think that your Orwellian claim that California is the "low cost leader" convinces anyone of anything? Do you think that a 25 percent vig so you phuckers can grab the last dimes out of bettors before the sport goes under is a legitimate rake? Do you think that saving your own ass on the backs of the true customers of this enterprise is good business practice?

And finally do you know how much you are despised? How idiotic you sound? How tired people are of decades of mismanagement and corruption which you now, quite conveniently, ignore?

I didn't think so.

cj
02-02-2011, 01:26 AM
Dear Jelly:

You and the people you carry water for (Harris, Baffert, Sadler, etc.) are a complete and total fraud. And do you think we can't see that? Do you think that the higher purses have ACTUALLY led to better fields and more competitive racing? Do you think that your Orwellian claim that California is the "low cost leader" convinces anyone of anything? Do you think that a 25 percent vig so you phuckers can grab the last dimes out of bettors before the sport goes under is a legitimate rake? Do you think that saving your own ass on the backs of the true customers of this enterprise is good business practice?

And finally do you know how much you are despised? How idiotic you sound? How tired people are of decades of mismanagement and corruption which you now, quite conveniently, ignore?

I didn't think so.

I think you missed the point of jelly's post. He wasn't advocating calracing at all.

BlueShoe
02-02-2011, 01:51 AM
We may soon see more downside to this blunder. The increased takeout was supposed to lead to larger fields in response to the increased purses. Santa Anita was scheduled to race four days in Jan. and Feb. and then go to five days in Mar. and Apr. I would be willing to place a large wager that soon will come an announcement that due to a lack of eligible entrys SA will remain on the present four day schedule the rest of the meeting. With the short fields now, how could they fill cards for five days? Suppose that they could run four or five maiden claiming races a day, but that would hardly do it. Imo, California will continue to be racing free on Wednesdays for quite some time.

owlet
02-02-2011, 02:07 AM
I meant to relay the message through him to calracing. Sorry i wasn't clear about that.

JustRalph
02-02-2011, 02:18 AM
Dear Jelly:

You and the people you carry water for (Harris, Baffert, Sadler, etc.) are a complete and total fraud. And do you think we can't see that? Do you think that the higher purses have ACTUALLY led to better fields and more competitive racing? Do you think that your Orwellian claim that California is the "low cost leader" convinces anyone of anything? Do you think that a 25 percent vig so you phuckers can grab the last dimes out of bettors before the sport goes under is a legitimate rake? Do you think that saving your own ass on the backs of the true customers of this enterprise is good business practice?

And finally do you know how much you are despised? How idiotic you sound? How tired people are of decades of mismanagement and corruption which you now, quite conveniently, ignore?

I didn't think so.

Hey Batter Batter !!! Swing and a miss !! :lol: :lol:

Greyfox
02-02-2011, 03:01 AM
Dear Jelly:

You and the people you carry water for (Harris, Baffert, Sadler, etc.) are a complete and total fraud. And do you think we can't see that?.

I agree with cj. You're shooting the messenger.

Stillriledup
02-02-2011, 04:55 AM
I believe that owlet thought Jelly was posting his own opinion and not the opinion of calracing.

DJofSD
02-02-2011, 08:22 AM
:lol: http://www.bigcalpurses.com/images/calracing-sig.png

A group of masked bandits using the signature "Cal Racing," as if that is an individual appeal, gives the impression of a personal caring touch for you and me.
Just look at the logo that is farthest to the right - TOC. Need I say anything more?

andymays
02-02-2011, 09:08 AM
Sent out via email this morning.

---------------------------------------------------


You must grow handle for the long term health of California Racing. The takeout increase is having the opposite effect!

When you let one segment of the industry, namely the TOC with the assistance of the CHRB, raise the takeout to levels that are significantly above the optimal pricing for the State and the Quality of racing (Short Fields) you get a drop in handle and that’s exactly what’s happening.

Besides having the benefit of HRTV and TVG based in California, the State offered some of the lowest takeout rates in the country. The TOC and the CHRB made one of the biggest mistakes in California Racing history with this move (and there have been many). I am convinced that California Racing would have made a nice comeback this year if they had left the takeout rates alone.

Please understand that it’s not too late to make adjustments.

Please understand that the drop in handle is primarily due to bad publicity from the CHRB going back to the Los Alamitos “trial balloon” where the CHRB and Los Alamitos went back on their word to Horseplayers.

Please understand that the “boycott” is not a movement directed by one person or one group of people who orders everyone to stop playing California Races. It is very rare that Horseplayers agree on anything but it seems that collectively many of them agree that the ignorant comments and policies coming from the CHRB are just as bad as the abusive takeout increases. This is what’s causing most people to stay away from California Racing.

Whether you know it or not the message boards are more powerful than ever and Horse Racing Websites like www.paceadvantage.com have a lot more influence than they did 10 years ago. When someone from the CHRB makes an ignorant comment or treats people rudely who come before the Board of the CHRB it is posted there. Again, the bad publicity has been grinding on Horseplayers for well over year now. It’s as if the Leadership of CHRB and TOC was really the marketing firm of Dewey Cheatem and Howe (say it fast).

Let’s sit down and make some adjustments so California Racing can move forward. The CHRB and the TOC are the only ones so far who haven’t reached out to Horseplayers. Why is that?

Thanks,
Andy

Stillriledup
02-02-2011, 02:18 PM
Sent out via email this morning.

---------------------------------------------------


You must grow handle for the long term health of California Racing. The takeout increase is having the opposite effect!

When you let one segment of the industry, namely the TOC with the assistance of the CHRB, raise the takeout to levels that are significantly above the optimal pricing for the State and the Quality of racing (Short Fields) you get a drop in handle and that’s exactly what’s happening.

Besides having the benefit of HRTV and TVG based in California, the State offered some of the lowest takeout rates in the country. The TOC and the CHRB made one of the biggest mistakes in California Racing history with this move (and there have been many). I am convinced that California Racing would have made a nice comeback this year if they had left the takeout rates alone.

Please understand that it’s not too late to make adjustments.

Please understand that the drop in handle is primarily due to bad publicity from the CHRB going back to the Los Alamitos “trial balloon” where the CHRB and Los Alamitos went back on their word to Horseplayers.

Please understand that the “boycott” is not a movement directed by one person or one group of people who orders everyone to stop playing California Races. It is very rare that Horseplayers agree on anything but it seems that collectively many of them agree that the ignorant comments and policies coming from the CHRB are just as bad as the abusive takeout increases. This is what’s causing most people to stay away from California Racing.

Whether you know it or not the message boards are more powerful than ever and Horse Racing Websites like www.paceadvantage.com have a lot more influence than they did 10 years ago. When someone from the CHRB makes an ignorant comment or treats people rudely who come before the Board of the CHRB it is posted there. Again, the bad publicity has been grinding on Horseplayers for well over year now. It’s as if the Leadership of CHRB and TOC was really the marketing firm of Dewey Cheatem and Howe (say it fast).

Let’s sit down and make some adjustments so California Racing can move forward. The CHRB and the TOC are the only ones so far who haven’t reached out to Horseplayers. Why is that?

Thanks,
Andy

Them not reaching out to horseplayers is the same reason a Wall Street executive with a 3k suit won't reach out to the guy sitting in the gutter begging for a quarter.

They're above the horseplayers, they're better than us.

Just ask them.

The_Knight_Sky
02-02-2011, 03:48 PM
Please understand that the drop in handle is primarily due to bad publicity
from the CHRB going back to the Los Alamitos “trial balloon”
where the CHRB and Los Alamitos went back on their word to Horseplayers.



They were http://i55.tinypic.com/2wbzs4p.gif