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BombsAway Bob
02-01-2011, 02:14 PM
We Need to get SAM HOUSTON
MONDAY AFTERNOON HANA Pick-3 Pool Parties in February!
With a $.50 Minimum & a 12% Takeout, HANA should be doing handstands
supporting this bet at Sam Houston,who've kept this great low rate for years!
There is absolutely no reason we couldn't double/triple pool size,and re-project
a Positive Vibe for HANA supporting handle, useful during their current
Boycott Battle with Santa Anita. "Everyone into the Pool...the Pool!"

JBmadera
02-01-2011, 02:19 PM
We Need to get SAM HOUSTON
MONDAY AFTERNOON HANA Pick-3 Pool Parties in February!
With a $.50 Minimum & a 12% Takeout, HANA should be doing handstands
supporting this bet at Sam Houston,who've kept this great low rate for years!
There is absolutely no reason we couldn't double/triple pool size,and re-project
a Positive Vibe for HANA supporting handle, useful during their current
Boycott Battle with Santa Anita. "Everyone into the Pool...the Pool!"

two :ThmbUp: :ThmbUp:

DeanT
02-01-2011, 02:39 PM
The pool parties were a ton of work - and I mean a ton. We have to contact people for free PP's, pacefigs, etc and offer out some freebies. We have to contact the track as well and see if they want to cross promote.

Having said that, if anyone at all wants to help, please email info@hanaweb.org. We can see if we can get something going. We would need some leadership and help on it though as it is a big job.

We have always promoted the low take pick threes at TX tracks on the blog and will continue to. But this is a good idea, I think. If we get some emails with help offers we can talk about it and make a plan.

DeanT
02-04-2011, 12:42 PM
We'll see how Big Bob progresses on some of his work, but we'll prolly post up some news each Monday about the pick 3 on the blog. Maybe we can get a freebie or some software analysis each Monday. We'll see what we can do.

NTamm1215
02-04-2011, 01:15 PM
So no pool party because it's too much work?

If HANA is not in the business of doing whatever's necessary to promote a wager being offered for a low takeout and low minimum, then what are you guys doing? The original poster in this thread suggested the idea, which has been done in the past and he's met with resistance from a representative from the organization?

I just don't get it.

DeanT
02-04-2011, 01:25 PM
NTamm,

Glad to see you have reasonable expectations of a volunteer organization.

Bob is taking the ball and running with it, contacting TVG etc and we are going to offer support the best way we can.

It takes people to enact ideas they have to make this go, and Bob has taken on the challenge. We're with him. I hope you are too.

NTamm1215
02-04-2011, 01:38 PM
NTamm,

Glad to see you have reasonable expectations of a volunteer organization.

Bob is taking the ball and running with it, contacting TVG etc and we are going to offer support the best way we can.

It takes people to enact ideas they have to make this go, and Bob has taken on the challenge. We're with him. I hope you are too.

Everything in racing is voluntary. If the excuse that you guys are just a bunch of volunteers was going to be employed every time someone asked you about something then you shouldn't have formed the organization.

I think the difference in opinion we have stems from the fact that I think HANA should be as pro-active as they are re-active. Replying with "oh, these are so much work, etc." is just very arrogant and standoffish to me. I'm sure it took very little time to organize the CA boycott and get word out to everyone on your distribution list. Now, the last two times someone on this board has asked a question about something HANA should take great interest in, they've been asked what THEY were doing about it? Is that how it's supposed to work?

DeanT
02-04-2011, 02:04 PM
"replying these are so much work, etc." is just very arrogant and standoffish to me.

I certainly did not mean it that way. I said it because it's the truth. We have a list of suggestions a mile long. If we got to all of them (and some of them are very good suggestions) we would need a full time staff. We have about 30-60 man hours a week to give with the people we have pitching in. If someone wants to offer help, like Bob did, we can hopefully work on making things work, but too much else is simply unachievable.

The previous Pool Parties were good because a couple of members (two of the people who wanted to take ownership of the idea) helped out with blog posts, emails, updates on pace and all the chat boards, a Yahoo email list, media and track contacts, contacting and uploading thorograph sheets, PPs, CJs pace figs etc etc. If we can get that synergy again, it can be a success.

CincyHorseplayer
02-04-2011, 02:08 PM
Everything in racing is voluntary. If the excuse that you guys are just a bunch of volunteers was going to be employed every time someone asked you about something then you shouldn't have formed the organization.

I think the difference in opinion we have stems from the fact that I think HANA should be as pro-active as they are re-active. Replying with "oh, these are so much work, etc." is just very arrogant and standoffish to me. I'm sure it took very little time to organize the CA boycott and get word out to everyone on your distribution list. Now, the last two times someone on this board has asked a question about something HANA should take great interest in, they've been asked what THEY were doing about it? Is that how it's supposed to work?

Why don't you take over the task?You obviously have the interest and energy for it.Instead of finger wagging step up to the plate and make something happen.

Kelso
02-04-2011, 11:11 PM
If the excuse that you guys are just a bunch of volunteers was going to be employed every time someone asked you about something then you shouldn't have formed the organization.
Bob didn't "ask" about something. He suggested DOING something. Enormous difference, wouldn't you say? (Well, perhaps someone such as yourself ... who specializes in demanding that others do things for him ... shouldn't be expected to understand.)

And who in hell are YOU, exactly, to tell anyone why they should or shouldn't do anything? Did YOU put any time or effort into getting HANA started ... or to helping HANA rise to its current prominence? My money's on YOU routinely leaving that sort of annoyance to other people to do.


I think HANA should be as pro-active as they are re-active.
I think YOU should try being pro-active regarding HANA activities. Why don't YOU volunteer some time, instead of just bitching that others don't volunteer enough time in your behalf.

NTamm1215
02-05-2011, 12:03 AM
Bob didn't "ask" about something. He suggested DOING something. Enormous difference, wouldn't you say? (Well, perhaps someone such as yourself ... who specializes in demanding that others do things for him ... shouldn't be expected to understand.)

And who in hell are YOU, exactly, to tell anyone why they should or shouldn't do anything? Did YOU put any time or effort into getting HANA started ... or to helping HANA rise to its current prominence? My money's on YOU routinely leaving that sort of annoyance to other people to do.

I think YOU should try being pro-active regarding HANA activities. Why don't YOU volunteer some time, instead of just bitching that others don't volunteer enough time in your behalf.

You're right, Bob did suggest something. Take a look at the response he received. That was the whole point of me making a comment.

I didn't engage you in making any comments on here. I asked a question of DeanT, he responded to it, but then you and the poster before you did what has become so rampant on this site, which is to personally attack anyone who might have the audacity to not genuflect at the sight of HANA.

Don't profess to know who I am, what I do, or anything of the sort. As far as I'm concerned, no effort on behalf of anyone from HANA has been done to arrange a pool party for Sam Houston. There were extensive quotes from the president of HANA regarding the success of the boycott of CA tracks in a recent Bloodhorse article. Wouldn't it be nice to complement that with the potential success of a pool party at a track that is doing the things that earn high marks in the HANA Track Ratings? Should the strength of a horseplayer's organization solely be measured in what it can do in a negative way? I guess I think the answer to that question is no, but I'm probably foolish to say that at risk of getting another lecture from the HANA counsel.

FiveWide
02-05-2011, 12:31 AM
Question from a newbie on this board. What exactly is a pool party?


thx,
-Five

DeanT
02-05-2011, 01:29 AM
Question from a newbie on this board. What exactly is a pool party?


thx,
-Five

Getting together and betting a race per week or every two weeks. It started on a conference call with HANA in February of 2009. After a month or so of lining up the industry behind the idea, the first one was at Wil Rogers Downs.

Dana from Hello Race Fans called it a Pool Party and that was the name that stuck.

http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2009/03/jumping-into-pool.html

There were dozens of blog posts, media contacts and stories about it. I think the seven or eight of them must have drawn about $200,000 + in handle for the tracks that were chosen.

HANA members Mike and Ross were the directors of it along with the board and after several months their lives got in the way. They did a hell of a job though; many hours per week working away at it. It was fun.

Monday will not be a Pool Party of course, but a Bombs Away Monday at Sam Houston. Jeff Platt will be Monday's guest handicapper on the blog for the card. Bob I assume will be working it on Twitter.

So if you are interested, download the card for Monday!

BombsAway Bob
02-05-2011, 02:07 AM
BOMBS AWAY! with the Best Value in Racing:
SAM HOUSTON's Rolling Pick-3's with a
$.50 Minimum & Super-Low 12% Takeout!
i'm asking ALL HORSEPLAYERS that are
making bets on Monday Afternoons in February
to "JUMP INTO THE POOL... THE PICK-3 POOL!"
-------------------------------------------------------
SAM HOUSTON 12% takeout: means Pick-3's pay an extra
$10-$14 on EVERY $100 Won than at ANY other racerack!
-------------------------------------------------------

Robert Goren
02-05-2011, 10:02 AM
While 12% on pick 3s is a good deal, the rest of their takeouts border on the obscene. 18% W-P-S, 21% doubles and exactas, 25% supras and Pick 4s. Just a word of caution. I sometimes bet them on mondays, but I don't kid myself into thinking I am getting a great deal.

Charli125
02-05-2011, 02:00 PM
While 12% on pick 3s is a good deal, the rest of their takeouts border on the obscene. 18% W-P-S, 21% doubles and exactas, 25% supras and Pick 4s. Just a word of caution. I sometimes bet them on mondays, but I don't kid myself into thinking I am getting a great deal.

That's very true, but the purpose of a pool party is to show our support for a specific pool at a specific track. I probably won't touch any of their other bets, but I'll definitely dive in with both feet for the pool party.

Regardless, it is important to know what takeout the other bets are as Robert pointed out. Hopefully they'll have such an increase in P3 handle that they'll lower all of their bets to 12%!

FiveWide
02-05-2011, 02:23 PM
Thanks Dean for the detailed explanation. Much appreciated and sounds like fun. I've played SH quite a few times so I think I'll make an effort on Mondays to participate.

-Five

DeanT
02-05-2011, 02:31 PM
Thanks Dean for the detailed explanation. Much appreciated and sounds like fun. I've played SH quite a few times so I think I'll make an effort on Mondays to participate.

-Five

Good stuff. Jeff will hopefully have some good thoughts so check the blog if you are not a regular SAM player.

I am one of those folks who likes playing a day or a card for fun once in awhile, if others are hanging out playing. I found the pool party races kind of fun because of that. I spend tons of time on racing and betting and it is nice to kick back one day and watch the races and play a few dollars without being so serious. Good for the soul :)

I think someone will be on twitter that day with Bombs Away (and hopefully others) playing the card. We all have full time jobs so not guarantees, but we hope to.

PaceAdvantage
02-06-2011, 02:39 AM
I didn't engage you in making any comments on here. I asked a question of DeanT, he responded to it, but then you and the poster before you did what has become so rampant on this site, which is to personally attack anyone who might have the audacity to not genuflect at the sight of HANA.The melodrama is killing me lately. Personally attacked? Really?

Actually, what I think happened in this thread was that you were responded to in kind...you got back exactly what you were dishing out here...you came here in an aggressive fashion and were met with aggression in return. You expected something else? Why?

The fact is that HANA has done the pool party thing in the past at many different venues and is now concentrating on other ways to bring attention to the various issues negatively affecting horseplayers.

I hope you don't consider this yet another in a long line of supposed personal attacks.

JustRalph
02-06-2011, 02:51 AM
So no pool party because it's too much work?

If HANA is not in the business of doing whatever's necessary to promote a wager being offered for a low takeout and low minimum, then what are you guys doing? The original poster in this thread suggested the idea, which has been done in the past and he's met with resistance from a representative from the organization?

I just don't get it.

Here you go......you wanna help....... hit the link and buy something!

http://www.cafepress.com/BoycottCentral

I kind of like this one.......
http://images.cpcache.com/merchandise/89_480x480_Front_Color-White.jpg?region=name:FrontCenter,w:10,h:10,a:TopC enter,id:49453648

Many many of us here at PaceAdvantage have done just that. Get it through you head that these guys are working for FREE!

You seem to be late to the POOL PARTY....

Dahoss9698
02-06-2011, 12:48 PM
Bob didn't "ask" about something. He suggested DOING something. Enormous difference, wouldn't you say? (Well, perhaps someone such as yourself ... who specializes in demanding that others do things for him ... shouldn't be expected to understand.)

And who in hell are YOU, exactly, to tell anyone why they should or shouldn't do anything? Did YOU put any time or effort into getting HANA started ... or to helping HANA rise to its current prominence? My money's on YOU routinely leaving that sort of annoyance to other people to do.



I think YOU should try being pro-active regarding HANA activities. Why don't YOU volunteer some time, instead of just bitching that others don't volunteer enough time in your behalf.

I've seen a lot of internet sycophants, but YOU sir continually rise to the top. Congrats.

I don't think anyone told anyone what they should or shouldn't be doing. If HANA is "giving horseplayers a voice" it seems funny that the last few times actual horseplayers (not sycophants) had comments or questioned the organization that is "representing" them, they were greeted with the "what are you doing?" line.

If people think that is a good way of handling things, fine. But I don't see how that is productive and I really don't see how that encourages more people that aren't already members of HANA to respond and interact with HANA.

NTamm1215
02-06-2011, 12:57 PM
The melodrama is killing me lately. Personally attacked? Really?

Actually, what I think happened in this thread was that you were responded to in kind...you got back exactly what you were dishing out here...you came here in an aggressive fashion and were met with aggression in return. You expected something else? Why?

The fact is that HANA has done the pool party thing in the past at many different venues and is now concentrating on other ways to bring attention to the various issues negatively affecting horseplayers.

I hope you don't consider this yet another in a long line of supposed personal attacks.

Really? Some guy telling me who I am and what I do from the comfort of his keyboard. Take off the rose colored glasses with things involving HANA.

Bob didn't "ask" about something. He suggested DOING something. Enormous difference, wouldn't you say? (Well, perhaps someone such as yourself ... who specializes in demanding that others do things for him ... shouldn't be expected to understand.)

And who in hell are YOU, exactly, to tell anyone why they should or shouldn't do anything? Did YOU put any time or effort into getting HANA started ... or to helping HANA rise to its current prominence? My money's on YOU routinely leaving that sort of annoyance to other people to do.

I think YOU should try being pro-active regarding HANA activities. Why don't YOU volunteer some time, instead of just bitching that others don't volunteer enough time in your behalf.

chickenhead
02-06-2011, 02:51 PM
HANA cannot be just 3 or 4 people on the board. Obviously if 3 or 4 people doing something after they get home from work is what HANA is limited to, it's going to be less effective at everything. So, needless to say getting volunteers to do stuff is not just important, it's close to the whole ball game. The Boycott has volunteers. The Pool parties had volunteers. HANA has added volunteers as State Reps. There are more people now focusing on their specific areas, paying closer attention, talking to stakeholders, updating everyone in HANA. Need more of that, it's a big country with lots of tracks.

Getting volunteers is a pretty good indication it's something people care about. I don't know how HANA is supposed to get volunteers for things other than asking. But I do know HANA needs volunteers.

It seems pretty logical that if a horseplayer has self-identified themselves as caring a lot about a single issue -- they are a natural person to ask to volunteer to work with HANA on that issue, because they are fired up about it. "Generalized" volunteerism doesn't work really well, people generally have to care specifically about something, and want to work on it -- for it to happen. BombsAwayBob seems to fit the bill there. He wanted a Pool Party, he's doing stuff about it, and now HANA has guest handicappers and some promotion for it on their blog.

The HANA board has been criticized a lot in the past for NOT involving enough people, for trying to handle everything themselves. Which I basically agree with, but I do understand the flip-side of it. Not many people really want to volunteer, they're busy. But HANA does need to keep asking, because sometimes people say yes, and that's good for everyone. If that is admitting that HANA is not yet where they need to be so far as an organization, I agree -- I think anyone would. They need more people helping out -- and the easiest (tho in no way easy) way to get help is to ask. And their best chance of getting a yes is specifically asking the people who seem to be the most fired up about whatever the issue is.

All HANA is is regular horseplayers volunteering some of their time. That is HANA. If they ask you to volunteer or do something like send an email about an issue you care about it's not an insult or a brush-off, they're just asking you to be a part of HANA.

Dahoss9698
02-06-2011, 03:49 PM
All HANA is is regular horseplayers volunteering some of their time. That is HANA. If they ask you to volunteer or do something like send an email about an issue you care about it's not an insult or a brush-off, they're just asking you to be a part of HANA.

That would be great if this was the case, but it isn't. Perception is everything. Maybe the message is being lost in translation because this is a message board, but I can assure you many horseplayers are turned off by some of the responses lately in these threads from HANA reps.

DeanT
02-06-2011, 03:54 PM
Just spoke to Jeff and he has been working on some stats etc for Sam Houston. Hopefully we'll get it up tonight or early tomorrow. If you are interested in Jeff's take and some stats on SAM, please check the blog!

chickenhead
02-06-2011, 04:28 PM
Maybe the message is being lost in translation because this is a message board, but I can assure you many horseplayers are turned off by some of the responses lately in these threads from HANA reps.

I don't doubt that's true, but I also don't know a lot of ways around it.

I'm both lazy and busy, I don't do much of anything to help HANA so far as doing anything. But if I took an issue to them of course I'd expect them to ask me for help, I just identified myself as someone that cares a lot about the issue. I may care more about this issue than anyone else either inside or outside of HANA. That's how the people I'm talking to got there in the first place, because they cared about something and wanted to work on it.

I think honestly part of the perception problem is that HANA is some group that's separate from players. HANA is not a track, HANA is not a tracks customer service organization. HANA is just a loose collection of horseplayers who have decided to pitch in and are currently working on X, or Y, hopefully to move the ball on that issue. Most of them currently doing something probably care most about X, or Y, that's why they have volunteered to work on them.

If you come to them with Z, they probably agree with you, they probably agree that Z is a good idea. But that doesn't necessarily mean they are all going to drop X and Y, Z might not be the issue that fires them up, personally, to the same degree as X and Y. Sometimes it will, other times it will take a back seat to X or Y. To absolutely do Z, and do a good job with it, they might need some new people working on Z.

That's just the way something like this works, there isn't any way around it. Even something as simple as a blog post, it takes time, it takes some level of expertise about the subject. If someone wants to see a HANA blog post on something, write a blog post and send it to them -- it'll probably get posted so long as it has some substance. I don't know why people get upset about something like that and instead want to get mad at HANA for not covering something they want to see. You know how the current HANA blog gets written? Some guy writes blog posts about things that fire him up. Why is he the only one? Beats me, no other players want to I guess. The blog has publicly solicited for other players to submit blog posts tons of times...I think one player has ever taken them up on it.

BombsAway Bob
02-06-2011, 09:52 PM
DRF Entry sheet for a quick look-
my favorite... Arabians...to start the card!
http://www.drf.com/race-entries/HOU/USA/2011-02-07/D

Charli125
02-06-2011, 10:16 PM
DRF Entry sheet for a quick look-
my favorite... Arabians...to start the card!
http://www.drf.com/race-entries/HOU/USA/2011-02-07/D

Way to go Bob! Are we playing any particular P3 pool or just the P3 pools the entire card?

BombsAway Bob
02-06-2011, 11:07 PM
Way to go Bob!
Are we playing any particular P3 pool or just the P3 pools the entire card?
where this is a month-long Pick-3 pool party during afternoons,
it's anywhere folks want to jump in & play a Pick-3 or three.
There are decent size fields in 8 of the races,
so the potential for OK payouts may exist.
With TwinSpires offering 0% Takeout on Pick-3 bets made thru
their ADW on Monday Sam Houston Pick-3 Races,why not Play?!?

andymays
02-07-2011, 12:00 AM
I called Sam Houston and they told me they didn't have a pool. :eek:

DeanT
02-07-2011, 12:25 AM
Sunday, February 6, 2011

Bombs Away Monday's at Sam Houston. Selections and More! (http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/bombs-away-mondays-at-sam-houston.html)




http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Vo3QAghRcKQ/TU9x-94nUhI/AAAAAAAAA20/Z1ARu_Coqxc/s1600/bob.png (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Vo3QAghRcKQ/TU9x-94nUhI/AAAAAAAAA20/Z1ARu_Coqxc/s1600/bob.png)

Bombs Away Bob decided he wanted to play Sam Houston Monday's for their low takeout pick 3, and he thought he might bring some friends along. And so he did!

HANA President Jeff Platt has uploaded some reports for Sam Houston, including trainer reports, rider reports and a track profile. In addition he has some selections linked.

It looks like the dirt course is playing a little bit to late and the turf course (small sample) a little bit early.

For a complete look please visit the HANA Site here (http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hou02072011.html). And good luck tomorrow at Sam Houston.

To follow Bombs Away Bob on Twitter for tomorrow's races, you can here. (http://twitter.com/BombsawayBob)
Posted by HANA at 11:24 PM (http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/bombs-away-mondays-at-sam-houston.html) 0 comments (https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&isPopup=true) http://img2.blogblog.com/img/icon18_edit_allbkg.gif (http://www.blogger.com/post-edit.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789) Links to this post (http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/bombs-away-mondays-at-sam-houston.html#links) Email This (http://www.blogger.com/share-post.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&target=email) BlogThis! (http://www.blogger.com/share-post.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&target=blog) Share to Twitter (http://www.blogger.com/share-post.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&target=twitter) Share to Facebook (http://www.blogger.com/share-post.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&target=facebook) Share to Google Buzz (http://www.blogger.com/share-post.g?blogID=1484410456100254393&postID=4923044625997238789&target=buzz)

Kelso
02-07-2011, 01:59 AM
I've seen a lot of internet sycophants,
And I've seen even more ignorami (such as yourself) mindlessly spouting off at every perceived ... and usually embarassingly misunderstood ... offense.

However, before I undertake a response to your ad hominem, which definition(s) of your word-of-the-day did you intend? (Or did you have any idea at all what the word means when you tossed it out?)

And just to show you what a good sport I am when dealing with pretenders (such as yourself) I'll even let Mr. Webster give you some hints:

"Sycophant"
- informer, swindler, parasite
- a servile, self-seeking flatterer


I don't think anyone told anyone what they should or shouldn't be doing.
"I think HANA should be as pro-active as they are re-active" - NTamm1215, post #7

I don't care what you've heard to the contrary on the backstretch, reading for comprehension actually is an important skill!! :rolleyes:

Dahoss9698
02-07-2011, 02:21 AM
And I've seen even more ignorami (such as yourself) mindlessly spouting off at every perceived ... and usually embarassingly misunderstood ... offense.

However, before I undertake a response to your ad hominem, which definition(s) of your word-of-the-day did you intend? (Or did you have any idea at all what the word means when you tossed it out?)

And just to show you what a good sport I am when dealing with pretenders (such as yourself) I'll even let Mr. Webster give you some hints:

"Sycophant"
- informer, swindler, parasite
- a servile, self-seeking flatterer



"I think HANA should be as pro-active as they are re-active" - NTamm1215, post #7

I don't care what you've heard to the contrary on the backstretch, reading for comprehension actually is an important skill!! :rolleyes:

You're going to have to do better than this. A lot better.

Sycophant -a person who tries to please someone in order to gain a personal advantage
sycophantic - bootlicking: attempting to win favor from influential people by flattery


Imagine that, a word has more than a few meanings. Aww shucks!!!! And NTamm said "I think". He was giving constructive criticism, not a demand. Reading for comprehension actually is an important skill, right? But instead of reading what he wrote, you went on the attack, because you want to be top butt kisser. Congrats....YOU WIN!!!!

Truth be told, part of the problem with HANA is they have people like you talking on their behalf in these threads. People like you turn people off to HANA because you rarely have things right, but you are in the middle of conversations just talking and talking.

Horseplayersbet.com
02-07-2011, 04:48 PM
John Doyle has nothing but good things to say about HANA. I guess he isn't turned off by those who represent HANA on these message boards. But then again, he might be a HANA member, or maybe he doesn't read these boards.
http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/nhc-champ-john-doyle-interview-player.html

Dahoss9698
02-07-2011, 05:08 PM
John Doyle has nothing but good things to say about HANA. I guess he isn't turned off by those who represent HANA on these message boards. But then again, he might be a HANA member, or maybe he doesn't read these boards.
http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/nhc-champ-john-doyle-interview-player.html

Thanks for proving my point. If you actually read what I said, I said people have been turned off by the responses from HANA members. Not the members themselves, although you're probably on the right track also.

FYI, Doyle is a HANA member.

Kelso
02-07-2011, 11:22 PM
Sycophant -a person who tries to please someone in order to gain a personal advantage
sycophantic - bootlicking: attempting to win favor from influential people by flattery


Now we're making progress. Good for you, little girl. Now, in what way does your minor variant on the definition of sycophant ... as employed in your fatuous first post to me ... apply to my criticism of NTamm1215 for doing what you still refuse to acknowledge that he did; i.e., tell HANA that it "should be proactive" in a manner that would please him, all the while refusing to lend a hand himself.

You're not very bright, are you?

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 12:31 AM
Now we're making progress. Good for you, little girl. Now, in what way does your minor variant on the definition of sycophant ... as employed in your fatuous first post to me ... apply to my criticism of NTamm1215 for doing what you still refuse to acknowledge that he did; i.e., tell HANA that it "should be proactive" in a manner that would please him, all the while refusing to lend a hand himself.

You're not very bright, are you?

Your entire premise is faulty, because you have no idea what NTamm does or doesn't do. You assume and in doing so continue to make an ass out of yourself. You're so deadset on kissing HANA ass that you are looking for stuff to defend that doesn't need any defending.

Very wise of you to ignore the other parts though. Very wise. You're still going to have to do better though. Consult with the other sycophants and maybe you guys can get together and try and insult me. That might work, because on your own, you just don't make the cut, son.

PaceAdvantage
02-08-2011, 05:21 AM
I hope this is going somewhere....

CincyHorseplayer
02-08-2011, 09:28 AM
No kiddin PA.This thread started out as a guy pointing out a positive betting pool and now it has degenerated into this BS.Hey guys,get a room,step outside,whatever.Leave it outside Bob's thread,we don't care.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 12:11 PM
No kiddin PA.This thread started out as a guy pointing out a positive betting pool and now it has degenerated into this BS.Hey guys,get a room,step outside,whatever.Leave it outside Bob's thread,we don't care.

All of the pointless, useless talk on this board and you want to focus your energy on this? Pretty funny.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 12:15 PM
I hope this is going somewhere....

Of course it isn't. So as soon as Kelso gets in his last word, close it up. But Ntamm didn't demand anything and was pretty respectful I thought. I maintain that as an organization, it doesn't help HANA having people like Kelso (previously banned by you for YEARS) being one of their mouthpieces.

NTamm1215
02-08-2011, 12:26 PM
Now we're making progress. Good for you, little girl. Now, in what way does your minor variant on the definition of sycophant ... as employed in your fatuous first post to me ... apply to my criticism of NTamm1215 for doing what you still refuse to acknowledge that he did; i.e., tell HANA that it "should be proactive" in a manner that would please him, all the while refusing to lend a hand himself.

You're not very bright, are you?

Interesting that you ignore my reply to you but invoke my name in a separate post while taking what I said totally out of context. If HANA is solely a volunteer organization and you're this passionate about it, I can only imagine how you'd behave if you were getting paid!

CincyHorseplayer
02-08-2011, 12:50 PM
All of the pointless, useless talk on this board and you want to focus your energy on this? Pretty funny.

When somebody is pointing out a positive situation and people act like a$sholes in response=absolutely.

But this isn't "My energy".Just a reaction to what I think is ignorant and unbecoming.

CincyHorseplayer
02-08-2011, 12:54 PM
Of course it isn't. So as soon as Kelso gets in his last word, close it up. But Ntamm didn't demand anything and was pretty respectful I thought. I maintain that as an organization, it doesn't help HANA having people like Kelso (previously banned by you for YEARS) being one of their mouthpieces.


Just tell us when you joined the Comedy business??

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 03:28 PM
Just tell us when you joined the Comedy business??

This post pretty much proves my point. A board full of ignorant ass kissers. Sweet.

CincyHorseplayer
02-08-2011, 03:37 PM
This post pretty much proves my point. A board full of ignorant ass kissers. Sweet.

How so big man?

Guy puts up a low take and that's to be contemptible?I think you got your underwear in a wad over the secondary comments that you posted,that got shot down,and now you are reduced to this 1 liner BS.

What else you got?

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 03:48 PM
How so big man?

Guy puts up a low take and that's to be contemptible?I think you got your underwear in a wad over the secondary comments that you posted,that got shot down,and now you are reduced to this 1 liner BS.

What else you got?

I think you should go back and read the thread again tough guy.

Is there an appilcation process for #2 sycophant, or were you appointed?

CincyHorseplayer
02-08-2011, 04:00 PM
I think you should go back and read the thread again tough guy.

Is there an appilcation process for #2 sycophant, or were you appointed?

And you still refuse to answer the question.How bout it?You're saying a lot but it has nothing to do with the premise of this thread.

Do you have anything to add beyond your BS?

NTamm1215
02-08-2011, 04:24 PM
Just tell us when you joined the Comedy business??

The funny thing about what I posted, as I also told "Kelso", is that DeanT responded to me in kind. This whole thread went in a new direction when the two of you assumed the task of shamelessly defending all things HANA and decided it was time to put me in my place for being insolent.

Just give it up, I posted my opinion, which this place is FULL of, and my question was addressed. Why you and a number of others here think it's incumbent upon all of you to defend everything done (or not done) by HANA is just silly.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 04:41 PM
The funny thing about what I posted, as I also told "Kelso", is that DeanT responded to me in kind. This whole thread went in a new direction when the two of you assumed the task of shamelessly defending all things HANA and decided it was time to put me in my place for being insolent.

Just give it up, I posted my opinion, which this place is FULL of, and my question was addressed. Why you and a number of others here think it's incumbent upon all of you to defend everything done (or not done) by HANA is just silly.I am not a HANA member, nor do I feel compelled to defend them in any way...and I don't mean any disrespect toward you, as far as your opinion is concerned...but do you think that it is right for US to decide what issues the HANA volunteers should be involved in...and then to question them when they are reluctant to do so?

What are WE doing for the betterment of this sport...and why should HANA be held to a higher standard?

IMO...we should not be telling people what to do, unless we either A) Pay them...or B) Elect them into office.

NTamm1215
02-08-2011, 04:48 PM
I am not a HANA member, nor do I feel compelled to defend them in any way...and I don't mean any disrespect toward you, as far as your opinion is concerned...but do you think that it is right for US to decide what issues the HANA volunteers should be involved in...and then to question them when they are reluctant to do so?

What are WE doing for the betterment of this sport...and why should HANA be held to a higher standard?

IMO...we should not be telling people what to do, unless we either A) Pay them...or B) Elect them into office.

Did you read the whole thread? This has all started because I opined that HANA should be more pro-active than re-active. I didn't DEMAND anything. I didn't SUGGEST anything. I simply put forth my opinion. Would the reaction have been the same if I said HANA is doing a great job? That would have been the same thing as what I posted, simply an opinion.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 04:51 PM
So no pool party because it's too much work?

If HANA is not in the business of doing whatever's necessary to promote a wager being offered for a low takeout and low minimum, then what are you guys doing? The original poster in this thread suggested the idea, which has been done in the past and he's met with resistance from a representative from the organization?

I just don't get it.Does this not qualify to be called a "suggestion"?

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 05:09 PM
Did you read the whole thread? This has all started because I opined that HANA should be more pro-active than re-active. I didn't DEMAND anything. I didn't SUGGEST anything. I simply put forth my opinion. Would the reaction have been the same if I said HANA is doing a great job? That would have been the same thing as what I posted, simply an opinion.Yes, I read the whole thread...and you did more than opine "that HANA should be more pro-active than re-active."

You stated that DeanT's comment - that pool parties are too much work - was "very arrogant and standoffish."

In my book...arrogance is when we put ourselves in the position of telling other people what to do, without having the authority to do so.

NTamm1215
02-08-2011, 05:50 PM
Yes, I read the whole thread...and you did more than opine "that HANA should be more pro-active than re-active."

You stated that DeanT's comment - that pool parties are too much work - was "very arrogant and standoffish."

In my book...arrogance is when we put ourselves in the position of telling other people what to do, without having the authority to do so.

Another soapbox preacher weighs in, but at least you adopted the shroud of not being a HANA member/apologist from the beginning.

My reaction to DeanT's post in response to BombsawayBob was made clear. I questioned it because it was the complete opposite of what I, and most of the free world outside the Pace Advantage Forum, would have expected. He addressed it BUT ONLY THEN did all of the devoted HANA backers, both those that unabashedly make their stance clear and yourself, weigh in with a condemnation of anyone who questions anything involving HANA.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 05:53 PM
And you still refuse to answer the question.How bout it?You're saying a lot but it has nothing to do with the premise of this thread.

Do you have anything to add beyond your BS?

Yes, your contribution to the thread has been tremendous. Thanks for putting in my place (finally).

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 06:01 PM
I am not a HANA member, nor do I feel compelled to defend them in any way...and I don't mean any disrespect toward you, as far as your opinion is concerned...but do you think that it is right for US to decide what issues the HANA volunteers should be involved in...and then to question them when they are reluctant to do so?

What are WE doing for the betterment of this sport...and why should HANA be held to a higher standard?

IMO...we should not be telling people what to do, unless we either A) Pay them...or B) Elect them into office.

When you go to the HANA website, directly under the title of the organization it says "Giving horseplayers a voice."

Here is the HANA mission statement:

H.A.N.A. is committed to giving horseplayers a voice. By banding together we can bring about change and compel the horseracing industry do something it has never done: actually listen to its customers. By making them aware of customer needs and wants we can motivate track management and horseman's groups to reverse course and start doing the things needed to bring the game of horseracing back to the prominence and greatness it so richly deserves.

IMO, responding arrogantly to actual horseplayers and their concerns is sort of the direct opposite from what their mission is as defined by the statement. You are right, no one elected them. But if they are going to act as "our voice" then horseplayers should be able to make suggestions without being responded to arrogantly and without clueless butt kissers being on the attack for daring to question HANA.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 07:20 PM
When you go to the HANA website, directly under the title of the organization it says "Giving horseplayers a voice."

Here is the HANA mission statement:

H.A.N.A. is committed to giving horseplayers a voice. By banding together we can bring about change and compel the horseracing industry do something it has never done: actually listen to its customers. By making them aware of customer needs and wants we can motivate track management and horseman's groups to reverse course and start doing the things needed to bring the game of horseracing back to the prominence and greatness it so richly deserves.

IMO, responding arrogantly to actual horseplayers and their concerns is sort of the direct opposite from what their mission is as defined by the statement. You are right, no one elected them. But if they are going to act as "our voice" then horseplayers should be able to make suggestions without being responded to arrogantly and without clueless butt kissers being on the attack for daring to question HANA.You know that I respect your opinion, and I'm not looking to get into an argument with you...but help me understand something...

A group of volunteers get together in order to bring about some positive change for the players...in a game that sorely needs some reform.

Does this mean that these volunteers are obligated to jump at every suggestion thrown their way? Why should HANA do "handstands" whenever some racetrack creates a low-takeout bet, as a gimmick, in order to deflect from their otherwise oppressive takeouts?

riskman
02-08-2011, 07:57 PM
When you go to the HANA website, directly under the title of the organization it says "Giving horseplayers a voice."

Here is the HANA mission statement:

H.A.N.A. is committed to giving horseplayers a voice. By banding together we can bring about change and compel the horseracing industry do something it has never done: actually listen to its customers. By making them aware of customer needs and wants we can motivate track management and horseman's groups to reverse course and start doing the things needed to bring the game of horseracing back to the prominence and greatness it so richly deserves.

IMO, responding arrogantly to actual horseplayers and their concerns is sort of the direct opposite from what their mission is as defined by the statement. You are right, no one elected them. But if they are going to act as "our voice" then horseplayers should be able to make suggestions without being responded to arrogantly and without clueless butt kissers being on the attack for daring to question HANA.

Figures that you would take a contradictory view about HANA'S mission statement. You did preface that it was IMO and that, it is. By the way what is an "actual horseplayer"? There are members here who defend your position in various situations. Are they "clueless butt kissers" ? Your attempt to explain your way out of some of your arrogant posts is crappy. But please, keep trying anyway. DaHoss you disappoint me. I honestly thought you could to better than that. I really have no idea if you are being sincere with the content of your posts or not, or if you are just laying out bait in order to see who responds. I bit this time, but I am cutting off the line before you reel me in. Slán

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 08:06 PM
Does this mean that these volunteers are obligated to jump at every suggestion thrown their way? Why should HANA do "handstands" whenever some racetrack creates a low-takeout bet, as a gimmick, in order to deflect from their otherwise oppressive takeouts?

I'm not really sure where this is coming from. Who said anyone has to jump at every suggestion? No one is saying that. Not even close.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 08:14 PM
Figures that you would take a contradictory view about HANA'S mission statement. You did preface that it was IMO and that, it is. By the way what is an "actual horseplayer"? There are members here who defend your position in various situations. Are they "clueless butt kissers" ? Your attempt to explain your way out of some of your arrogant posts is crappy. But please, keep trying anyway. DaHoss you disappoint me. I honestly thought you could to better than that. I really have no idea if you are being sincere with the content of your posts or not, or if you are just laying out bait in order to see who responds. I bit this time, but I am cutting off the line before you reel me in. Slán

Oh boy. You give me a lecture, while totally not understanding my post and then decide I'm not worth your time. Thank god you had time to give me the lecture.

I'm not contradicting the mission statement. If you had actually read my post or the one I was responding to (does anyone actually read anything before responding?) I was explaining that while HANA wasn't elected, they have chosen to act as the voice of horseplayers. So, when a horseplayer has a concern, it makes no sense to me to respond arrogantly to them. You might not agree, and that is fine.

An actual horseplayer is someone that actually bets. Lots of people here talking about the game that don't bet and I think it's obvious.

By the way, did you actually have a point, or were you just submitting your application?

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 08:50 PM
I'm not really sure where this is coming from. Who said anyone has to jump at every suggestion? No one is saying that. Not even close.BombsawayBob, in his initial post, stated that "HANA should be doing handstands supporting this bet at Sam Houston"...and then, NTamm1215 chimed in with "If HANA is not in the business of doing whatever is necessary to promote a wager being offered for a low takeout and a low premium, then what are you guys doing?"

And so I ask again:

A track is offering a 12% takeout on a pick-3, as a gimmick, to deflect from their 18% WPS, and 25% trifecta takeouts...is it so big a deal that HANA should be doing "handstands" promoting it?

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 08:58 PM
BombsawayBob, in his initial post, stated that "HANA should be doing handstands supporting this bet at Sam Houston"...and then, NTamm1215 chimed in with "If HANA is not in the business of doing whatever is necessary to promote a wager being offered for a low takeout and a low premium, then what are you guys doing?"

And so I ask again:

A track is offering a 12% takeout on a pick-3, as a gimmick, to deflect from their 18% WPS, and 25% trifecta takeouts...is it so big a deal that HANA should be doing "handstands" promoting it?

You're asking the wrong person. I'm not the one that said it. Ask the person that did.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 09:02 PM
You're asking the wrong person. I'm not the one that said it. Ask the person that did.YOU were the guy who asked where this was coming from...that's why I am referring to you.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 09:18 PM
YOU were the guy who asked where this was coming from...that's why I am referring to you.

Well it seems pretty obvious Bombsawaybob was kidding with the handstands part. I was referring more to this line from your post.

Does this mean that these volunteers are obligated to jump at every suggestion thrown their way?

Well, no one suggested that. Not even close. So I ask you again, where is that coming from? However, since you seem to have an issue whith what Bob posted, you should take it up with him, right?

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 09:28 PM
Well it seems pretty obvious Bombsawaybob was kidding with the handstands part. I was referring more to this line from your post.

Does this mean that these volunteers are obligated to jump at every suggestion thrown their way?

Well, no one suggested that. Not even close. So I ask you again, where is that coming from? However, since you seem to have an issue whith what Bob posted, you should take it up with him, right?I don't have an issue with anybody...and I am neither "a soapbox preacher", nor "a clueless butt kisser".

All I am saying is that, IMO, we should find better things to do with our time than to be critical of a group of volunteers, who try to bring about some positive change in this game...while asking NOTHING from the rest of us.

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 09:31 PM
I don't have an issue with anybody...and I am neither "a soapbox preacher", nor "a clueless butt kisser".

All I am saying is that, IMO, we should find better things to do with our time than to be critical of a group of volunteers, who try to bring about some positive change in this game...while asking NOTHING from the rest of us.

Spinning and avoiding. There is the Thaskalos I know.

You don't fool me and never have.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 09:36 PM
Spinning and avoiding. There is the Thaskalos I know.

You don't fool me and never have.If only your sense of humor was as solid as your pecs...

Dahoss9698
02-08-2011, 09:39 PM
If only your sense of humor was as solid as your pecs...

My sense of humor is the only thing that keeps me sane in this bizzarro world.

thaskalos
02-08-2011, 09:45 PM
My sense of humor is the only thing that keeps me sane in this bizzarro world.Keep smiling my friend...nothing is so bad that it can't get worse.

Take it from me...I am a lot older than you are, and I know a few things...

Jeff P
02-08-2011, 09:52 PM
Added work or not, we took Bob up on his suggestion. We promoted the Feb 07, 2011 Sam Houston card on the HANA Blog here:
http://blog.horseplayersassociation.org/2011/02/bombs-away-mondays-at-sam-houston.html

I took a shot at playing guest hanciapper here:
http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hou02072011.html

Handle on Sam Houston's Mon 2/7 card was up vs. their Mon card from a week earlier on 1/31... from both a total handle perspective as well as avg handle per race.

THANKS go out to all who participated. It was fun and I think we'll be doing this again.


-jp

.

Kelso
02-09-2011, 01:19 AM
Your entire premise is faulty, because you have no idea what NTamm does or doesn't do.
Which is precisely why I asked him if he has done anything to help accomplish what he is so insistant that HANA do for him.

God, you're dumb.



You're so deadset on kissing HANA ass that you are looking for stuff to defend that doesn't need any defending.
You still haven't revealed exactly how or why I might want to do that of which you so recklessly accuse me. (But I can certainly your desperate reluctance to avoid admitting that you were shooting blanks with that one.)

Kelso
02-09-2011, 01:24 AM
Interesting that you ignore my reply to you but invoke my name in a separate post while taking what I said totally out of context.

OK, fair enough ... even though I considered your lame denial to be sufficient proof that your only purpose in posting was to get HANA to do something that you think it "should do" for you.

I did not ... I repeat, I did not ... in any way describe you or what you do or what you do not do. I asked what, if anything you have done to accomplish what you so freely expect HANA to do for you. You have, to date, not answered any of my questions.

Your refusal to answer THAT question tells us all we really need to know about you.

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 01:50 AM
Your refusal to answer THAT question tells us all we really need to know about you.

For someone that was banned for 2 years for acting like a douche, you've got a lot of nerve. A lot of nerve.

NTamm1215
02-09-2011, 02:20 PM
OK, fair enough ... even though I considered your lame denial to be sufficient proof that your only purpose in posting was to get HANA to do something that you think it "should do" for you.

I did not ... I repeat, I did not ... in any way describe you or what you do or what you do not do. I asked what, if anything you have done to accomplish what you so freely expect HANA to do for you. You have, to date, not answered any of my questions.

Your refusal to answer THAT question tells us all we really need to know about you.

This just in, I'm not the self-proclaimed "Voice of Horseplayers in North America." What have I done to help thoroughbred racing? Wager, that's what. And "what I so freely expect HANA to do for me?" I guess I was out of my mind thinking that HANA would be interested in organizing something to focus on a track with a low takeout/minimum wager. I'm not the GM of Sam Houston, so sadly, increased Pick 3 pools there have no direct impact on me in that regard, but I'm more than happy to wager into them regularly.

Has Gulfstream not had tons of praise heaped on it for their 50 cent pick 5? These are the types of things HANA made clear from the beginning that they're interested in, and their track ratings weighted heavily low takeouts/minimums.

PaceAdvantage
02-09-2011, 09:43 PM
An actual horseplayer is someone that actually bets. Lots of people here talking about the game that don't bet and I think it's obvious.
this whole "actually bets" mantra is getting tiresome...as if you know beyond a doubt...

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 10:21 PM
this whole "actually bets" mantra is getting tiresome...as if you know beyond a doubt...

:lol:

Yeah okay.

bigmack
02-09-2011, 10:32 PM
:lol:

Yeah okay.
Hey, a little laughing fellow.

What's the funny part?

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 10:34 PM
Hey, a little laughing fellow.

What's the funny part?

I figured you'd be around eventually.

A better question might be what part isn't funny.

bigmack
02-09-2011, 10:37 PM
I figured you be around eventually.

A better question might be what part isn't funny.
I'm late to the party. Fill me in on the funny part.

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 10:41 PM
I'm late to the party. Fill me in on the funny part.

You're very needy. But since you made the trip up from off topic, I'll oblige.

It's funny that of all of the tiresome things here, me calling it like I see it is tiresome. IMO a lot of the discussions about horseplaying are populated and dominated by people that aren't actually playing.

I obviously have no way of proving it, but I know I'm not alone in thinking it.

bigmack
02-09-2011, 10:52 PM
Right on, Brother. :ThmbUp:

Speaking of needy, has it ever occurred to you that your need to find others to kick around the game with has you swimming in pool of dolts that never quite rise to level of discussion you'd rather?

So many fools. So few you can actually connect with. :(

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 10:59 PM
Right on, Brother. :ThmbUp:

Speaking of needy, has it ever occurred to you that your need to find others to kick around the game with has you swimming in pool of dolts that never quite rise to level of discussion you'd rather?

So many fools. So few you can actually connect with. :(

You said it, not me.

But as always, I appreciate the lesson. Now get back to off topic and the never ending conversation, where you and your ilk gang up on anyone with an opposing view of the world.

What fun that must be. :jump:

bigmack
02-09-2011, 11:05 PM
Are you a member of HANA?

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 11:12 PM
When is the last time you made a bet?

bigmack
02-09-2011, 11:16 PM
When is the last time you made a bet?
:lol: Mr. Deflect back with a question that he's accused 48 others of doing.

Enough of this.

thaskalos
02-09-2011, 11:18 PM
When is the last time you made a bet?In your opinion, how big does a bet have to be, in order to qualify to be called a "bet".

Dahoss9698
02-09-2011, 11:32 PM
:lol: Mr. Deflect back with a question that he's accused 48 others of doing.

Enough of this.

That long huh?

Cardus
02-11-2011, 02:11 AM
Are you a member of HANA?

Are you?

Robert Fischer
02-11-2011, 12:03 PM
if only there were a game of skill, that offered a reasonable amount of challenge and complexity, we could have something to discuss instead of petty shit.
alas.....

DeanT
02-13-2011, 09:46 PM
We should have Jeff's data up again for this week for those who are interested.

MONEY
02-13-2011, 10:29 PM
I like hearing from gamblers & former horse players.
The only ones that I don't like are the mega-posters. Those are the ones that posts hundreds of numbers every day for many different tracks & never post results. They are just a waste of bandwidth.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j244/Simulcaster/Losers.jpg


http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j244/Simulcaster/Winners-1.jpg

DeanT
02-14-2011, 11:53 AM
Jeff has this weeks Sam Houston stats, etc up.

http://www.horseplayersassociation.org/hou02142011.html