Operation Flying Squirrel - Anyone see the video?

[DeanT]

Yesterday at SA, via the Paulick Report.

cyqO5SnFkSg

[jelly]

Good stuff! :ThmbUp:

[The_Knight_Sky]

Yesterday at SA, via the Paulick Report.



Should http://i56.tinypic.com/2ex8r9w.gif lose, PR must change its stance on pro-takeout increases.

[Badactor]

Who was responsible for this misguided effort?
SANTA ANITA: Sights & Sounds (http://www.network54.com/Forum/326105/thread/1295376801/last-1295385701/SANTA+ANITA-+Sights+%26amp%3B+Sounds)

[DeanT]

Who was responsible for this misguided effort?
SANTA ANITA: Sights & Sounds (http://www.network54.com/Forum/326105/thread/1295376801/last-1295385701/SANTA+ANITA-+Sights+%26amp%3B+Sounds)

I'm not sure. We've been looking into this all day. Right now I would consider it a mystery.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Who was responsible for this misguided effort?
SANTA ANITA: Sights & Sounds (http://www.network54.com/Forum/326105/thread/1295376801/last-1295385701/SANTA+ANITA-+Sights+%26amp%3B+Sounds)
Doesn't the banner say Playersboycott.org at the end of it? How was this misguided?

[jelly]

I hope they do it every weekend.

[GameTheory]

Doesn't the banner say Playersboycott.org at the end of it? How was this misguided?Flying a loud machine around & around a venue full of skittish horses and annoying the patrons isn't necessarily the best way to win people over.

[DeanT]

Flying a loud machine around & around a venue full of skittish horses and annoying the patrons isn't necessarily the best way to win people over.

They should ban it at Woodbine. 767's 700 feet over the finish line all day every day. It doesn't seem to bother the horses, but one time on the top patio I almost spit beer on my waitress.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Flying a loud machine around & around a venue full of skittish horses and annoying the patrons isn't necessarily the best way to win people over.
The only people possibly upset with this were upset at the boycott to begin with.
Woodbine has a plane either landing or taking off every two minutes right next door to them. I don't think planes bother horses.

Maybe a few patrons learned about takeout either from friends they were with or when they got home. Nothing wrong with that. Gamblers should know what the gamble is all about.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

They should ban it at Woodbine. 767's 700 feet over the finish line all day every day. It doesn't seem to bother the horses, but one time on the top patio I almost spit beer on my waitress.
Get out of my head :D

[DeanT]

Get out of my head :D

Get outta mine, Woodbine watcher.

It is pretty common of course to see planes over tracks. Derby Day alone has dozens advertising to Derby crowds and you cant even hear them, but Woodbine does take the cake. That is freaking loud. If you have not gone there before it is difficult to even fathom. For some reason at Woodbine, the horses are fine, which is curious.

[chickenhead]

maybe its more annoying if there is hardly anyone at the track, and no exciting races. If the track is silent, the plane would seem louder. I guess I could see that.

I've been on big days with planes circling nonstop, not something you even think about.

[DJofSD]

Rocky, watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat.

Ta Da -- and, he did! Excellent.

Betcha the owner of the plane or the service takes a flutter.

[jelly]

Suffolk Is a couple of miles from Logan airport.planes fly over every few minutes.



If I'm CHRB I'm not happy with this. :D

[JustRalph]

Hollywood park....... the planes fly right over the finish line going into LAX

every 30 seconds or so

[Badactor]

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Hollywood%20Park/hol_frontgate.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Hollywood%20Park/hol_arrival_planes.jpg
Gentlemen, I've played Hollywood Park. I know Hollywood Park.
Hollywood Park is a friend of mine. Gentlemen... Hollywood Park is no Santa Anita.
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/SANTA%20ANITA/100_0956.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/SANTA%20ANITA/100_0963.jpg

Horseplayersbet writes:
"The only people possibly upset with this were upset at the boycott to begin with."

This statement is quite obviously false, as I support idea of the boycott.
I have chosen not to participate in the higher takeout pk3 & pk4 pools
and I would certainly urge other players to 'pull their money' as well.
What I do not support is this "Flying Squirrel" nonsense.
What will it be next: cherry-bombs in the bathrooms?

One does not stand in the middle of a Las Vegas casino
caterwauling because the table minimums have been raised from $2 to $5.
"Hey goddammit... I usta could play fer two bucks. This ain't fair. This ain't right!!!"

Disruption of service is unacceptable and counter-productive.
The right of each player is to PLAY or DON'T PLAY.
The economic impact is what will be the determining factor
in any decision to rescind the raise in takeout... not Guerrilla Tactics.

Dell Yount
http://upinclass.blogspot.com/

[Horseplayersbet.com]

Dell, how was this a disruption of services? It was simple advertising. Are you saying that billboards are guerrilla tactics companies use to try to make us buy their products?

Were any races delayed because of the plane?

[Badactor]

No Horseplayersbet...
no races were delayed because of the plane. ;)
As advertising, the airplane stunt was an ineffective tactic
and an inefficient utilization of resources. We are not thugs...
we are players with legitimate concerns requiring honest consideration.

"I would like to take you seriously, but to do so would affront your intelligence."
~ William F. Buckley, Jr.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

No Horseplayersbet...
no races were delayed because of the plane. ;)
As advertising, the airplane stunt was an ineffective tactic
and an inefficient utilization of resources. We are not thugs...
we are players with legitimate concerns requiring honest consideration.

"I would like to take you seriously, but to do so would affront your intelligence."
~ William F. Buckley, Jr.
I don't understand how this was a thuggish act? Is it thuggish of Yum Yum brands to advertise their product during the Derby?
The point of advertising is to hit as many viable markets as possible. Are you saying those who attend Santa Anita are not a viable market when it comes to the takeout hike? How many people in the crowd knew about the boycott at the beginning of the day? How do you know it was ineffective? Did you poll enough people during the day?

You even state you support the boycott at least partially. How did you find out about it? It is your right to choose what to do as you pointed out, but Playersboycott.org is out to give people the facts which will help them make an educated choice.

[GameTheory]

Not thuggish, but obnoxious. (Just like lots of other advertising is -- doesn't make it less obnoxious.) And a low-flying buzzing little plane circling around a targeted area is different than a commercial airliner flying by. Anyway, would have left a bad impression with me if I didn't know anything about it, and seriously, in this day-and-age the airplane banner has to be about the least effective way to get a message out.

Anybody taking responsibility for this yet? Was it just a independent rental with no official ties? Maybe the next one they should pretend they represent the CHRB and have it say "F*** YOU HANA!!!"

[Badactor]

I know you don't understand, Horseplayersbet...
it is also clear that you have not paid me the courtesy
of reading my blog-post, so allow me to excerpt a bit for you:
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycottNOISE.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycott_badbehavior.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycott_badbehavior_closeup.jpg
While I support the right to protest,
I do not believe this NOISE at my track
is the appropriate way to effect the change
this group is seeking. For goodness sake...
folks at the track were looking up and saying:
"Takeout, what's that?" - "Lower the price of Takeout, I guess."
"Something about Chinese Food, I think." - "No, it's an ad for In~N~Out."


Buzzing the race track is bad policy... pure & simple.

[DeanT]

Not thuggish, but obnoxious. (Just like lots of other advertising is -- doesn't make it less obnoxious.) And a low-flying buzzing little plane circling around a targeted area is different than a commercial airliner flying by. Anyway, would have left a bad impression with me if I didn't know anything about it, and seriously, in this day-and-age the airplane banner has to be about the least effective way to get a message out.


It's fairly good, as a rule, for adding awareness to the on-track crew who are hard to hit and have to be tackled by grassroots means. It is fairly common at tracks, like this picture ran by SBAOJ (horseman and industry folks) in Jersey last year over the M

http://sboanj.com/pictures/save.jpg

Rich Bauer's banner in 2004 during the "Boycott Magna" issue at SA was well-received in terms of historical precedence, and in fact, was the harbinger of this, (or so I read.)

From a CPM view, the proof is in the pudding, but since people have been talking about it so far, that in itself makes it fairly effective, in my opinion.

[DeanT]

Rich's banner

[GameTheory]

Yeah, I've been at Santa Anita a few times with one of these overhead. If you've never seen one before, it is a novelty. Otherwise, annoying. You notice it when it first comes around, you look up and go "ok, yeah, got it" -- then it usually keeps buzzing around for another 15 minutes to no effect.

[DJofSD]

So, GT, once you've seen it, there's no need to keep flying over the venue?

[DeanT]

Yeah, I've been at Santa Anita a few times with one of these overhead. If you've never seen one before, it is a novelty. Otherwise, annoying. You notice it when it first comes around, you look up and go "ok, yeah, got it" -- then it usually keeps buzzing around for another 15 minutes to no effect.

I would agree with that GT (other than the fact that is has to be there for some time because people are in and out etc). I think the curve for a group who has zero help in the racing press (back in 2004, it took the BH and DRF less than a week to mention Rich's boycott. This year the BH is the only one to touch it, and it took over a month), is pretty determined. The plane, for example, represents awareness of some sort, so the next time something is done (say handing out the flyers or something on the street) some players are aware who saw or heard of the group, and are open to chatting about it - so you are not starting at square one.

That's my take, from a grassroots perspective.

[jelly]

I know you don't understand, Horseplayersbet...
it is also clear that you have not paid me the courtesy
of reading my blog-post, so allow me to excerpt a bit for you:
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycottNOISE.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycott_badbehavior.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n291/UpInClass/Spanky/boycott_badbehavior_closeup.jpg
While I support the right to protest,
I do not believe this NOISE at my track
is the appropriate way to effect the change
this group is seeking. For goodness sake...
folks at the track were looking up and saying:
"Takeout, what's that?" - "Lower the price of Takeout, I guess."
"Something about Chinese Food, I think." - "No, it's an ad for In~N~Out."


Buzzing the race track is bad policy... pure & simple.




Even more reason to educate the public.

[GameTheory]

So, GT, once you've seen it, there's no need to keep flying over the venue?Most everybody has the same experience unless you're the type that locks themselves in one of the interior spaces and then you're not gonna see it anyway. My point is that it:

A) Yes, possibly makes you AWARE.

B) Also, it makes you annoyed at the thing you've just become aware of, i.e. you will NOT want to support whatever it is just on principle, like when you see a commercial on TV that offends you. Turns you off to the product, you know?

So,
A) Mission accomplished
and
B) Fail

[Horseplayersbet.com]

GT, if banner ads were so ineffective or were so annoying, there would be
A) Laws against them
B) No one in the business of flying banners

[GameTheory]

GT, if banner ads were so ineffective or were so annoying, there would be
A) Laws against them
B) No one in the business of flying banners

A) There are laws against them. They can't go flying planes around just anywhere. They are barred from all sorts of places. There would never be laws just on the basis of their ineffectiveness advertising-wise, though.

B) As long as the airplane operators can make you THINK they are effective they'll be in business. Plus they do a lot of "stunts" that aren't really advertising -- marriage proposals from the sky, etc. And decades ago it was more "cool" so it has a legacy (like horse-racing does, doesn't mean it is doing well) but I do think at this point it is almost a scam. But unless someone has an airplane banner effectiveness study to point to we are all just speculating aren't we? Or maybe it is dirt cheap? It has got to cost something for one of these, right?


BTW, you are a very strong defender here -- this wasn't your doing by any chance, was it?

[Horseplayersbet.com]

GT, I appreciate inventive ways to advertise. If I thought it would help, I would use this form of advertising too. I'm pretty limited in advertising Horseplayersbet for example. Facebook won't take gambling ads, and you have to be very creative to get by the Google censors, etc.

I think when it comes to selling a product, this is not the best way to go, but when it comes to awareness of a cause, I think it is a very good way.

I'm pretty sure Playersboycott.org is behind it. I can't see any other organization paying to put Playersboycott.org (sponsored by HANA) for this ad. Can you?

[InsideThePylons-MW]

Doesn't the Patriot Act or something like it outlaw stuff like this?

"Fight" and "boycott" are real close to terroristic threats which should fall under the above and also would apply to being on the no-fly list.

[GameTheory]

I'm pretty sure Playersboycott.org is behind it. I can't see any other organization paying to put Playersboycott.org (sponsored by HANA) for this ad. Can you?Well, Dean said they didn't know who did it, so it sounds like a mystery.

Anyone have an idea what this would cost?

[cj]

Well, Dean said they didn't know who did it, so it sounds like a mystery.

Anyone have an idea what this would cost?

Most make you request a free quote, but I found one that charges $500 per flight (one hour) in Virginia.

[bigmack]

Anyone have an idea what this would cost?
http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u70/macktime/airbanner.png

[GameTheory]

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u70/macktime/airbanner.pngWouldn't bug me at all at a NASCAR event!

[Charli125]

Wouldn't bug me at all at a NASCAR event!

Ha, good point.

I do have to say that this is a common thing. Banners have been flown over SA before, and they'll be flown again. I don't understand the complaints that it was obtrusive since it's a common thing, and I think we should get back on point. I think back to the helicopter flying over the last BC at SA and how disruptive that was. I guarantee the banner(which has rules on how low they can go, etc.) was nowhere near as disruptive as that damn helicopter.

[DJofSD]

I wasn't at the SAX BC event, so, I don't know what the details were with the helicopter. However, when Alan Paulson was alive and living near Del Mar, it was a daily (or almost daily) occurance for his helicopter to fly over the track and to land outside the small training track on the backside. Never caused a problem that I'm aware off.

[Charli125]

I wasn't at the SAX BC event, so, I don't know what the details were with the helicopter. However, when Alan Paulson was alive and living near Del Mar, it was a daily (or almost daily) occurance for his helicopter to fly over the track and to land outside the small training track on the backside. Never caused a problem that I'm aware off.

I was there, about 20 rows up, about midway between the starting gate and the finish line. It was loud.

[DeanT]

I was there, about 20 rows up, about midway between the starting gate and the finish line. It was loud.

A helicopter or a jet at Woodbine might be bad for the fans, but it is weird how it aint bad for the horses.

In harness racing it was commonplace for a helicopter to land in the infield when drivers had mounts at Yonkers and the Meadowlands and needed to get cross towm quickly. The same thing happens today. It has happened at tbred tracks too. The fans get a bit of a charge, but amazingly the horses seem to just go about their business.

One time at a track there was a band playing beside the track (with a full set of drums etc). That spooked them and they had to move, never to be there again, but not with helis etc.

[affirmedny]

Isn't Aqueduct right next to JFK airport with jets(not prop planes) flying over all day long?


It sure looked like andymays behind the wheel of that plane to me!
:D

[GameTheory]

Of course I may prefer a more relaxing time than some. I used to prefer SA when the horses were over at Hollywood. If I had nothing going on for a while I'd lie in the infield on a picnic blanket and take a nap or read a book...

[The_Knight_Sky]

It sure looked like andymays behind the wheel of that plane to me!

:D

Andy is too good a pilot for that assignment.

http://i55.tinypic.com/2wexq8p.jpg

Think he was in Foxboro on Sunday. :ThmbUp: