Why is Santa Anita delaying their races?

[Stillriledup]

Races aren't going off until at least 5 minutes AFTER the clock hits 0 mins to post. This is new policy, i wonder why they're doing this. :sleeping:

[cj]

Races aren't going off until at least 5 minutes AFTER the clock hits 0 mins to post. This is new policy, i wonder why they're doing this. :sleeping:

Drumming up handle.

[andymays]

Drumming up handle.
Ditto.

[toussaud]

caliente shuffle

[andymays]

caliente shuffle
I was there when they used to do it. :)

[DeanT]

I think (just a guess) they are trying to squeeze like CJ says. They have been getting skewered in the press so they want some good opening day handle.

No one but a mentally challenged porcupine would think they would have a poor handle day on the opener with dirt, so it won't surprise anyone, but that's what I think. I would do that if I was running a business that had anti-customer headlines plastered throughout the racing press the last week or so.

JMO.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I think (just a guess) they are trying to squeeze like CJ says. They have been getting skewered in the press so they want some good opening day handle.

No one but a mentally challenged porcupine would think they would have a poor handle day on the opener with dirt, so it won't surprise anyone, but that's what I think. I would do that if I was running a business that had anti-customer headlines plastered throughout the racing press the last week or so.

JMO.

Why? Most of the horses didn't have dirt lines in their PPs. I looked forward to the switch back to the dirt, but I found it impossible to play SA today, at least the first few races.

[DeanT]

Why? Most of the horses didn't have dirt lines in their PPs. I looked forward to the switch back to the dirt, but I found it impossible to play SA today, at least the first few races.

I dunno. I did not download it to look. I just know they have really been trying to get a pile of people excited for the opener. I would expect a good handle today, but I have not even seen the pools, so maybe I am a porcupine.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I dunno. I did not download it to look. I just know they have really been trying to get a pile of people excited for the opener. I would expect a good handle today, but I have not even seen the pools, so maybe I am a porcupine.

I understand the basis of your statement (most hated the sythetic surface and we're back to dirt...hoo-ray), but from a pratical standpoint it was like throwing darts in the early dirt races.

[toussaud]

I understand the basis of your statement (most hated the sythetic surface and we're back to dirt...hoo-ray), but from a pratical standpoint it was like throwing darts in the early dirt races.
have you looked at the winners today? I think only only horse has paid double digits all day, the 4 in the non graded stakes

[Saratoga_Mike]

have you looked at the winners today? I think only only horse has paid double digits all day, the 4 in the non graded stakes

I was at a simulcasting outlet for the first four races. I had no interest in the races because of the mostly synthetic PPs. I doubt I was the only one.

[andymays]

The races off the turf will hurt handle a little. I still think it will be up over last year.

[Southieboy]

Same crappy racing.

[Saratoga_Mike]

The races off the turf will hurt handle a little. I still think it will be up over last year.

Thru the first 7 races, WPS handle is down about 20% from a yr ago (12/26/09, which was a Saturday).

[InsideThePylons-MW]

Thru the first 7 races, WPS handle is down about 20% from a yr ago (12/26/09, which was a Saturday).

Wait till they add the estimated non-commingled foreign WPS handle into the end of day totals.

[andymays]

Thru the first 7 races, WPS handle is down about 20% from a yr ago (12/26/09, which was a Saturday).

If handle is down over last year they are in huge trouble. They may have run 10 races last year but I don't remember.

[ronsmac]

With no nyc otb I'd expect handle to drop.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Wait till they add the estimated non-commingled foreign WPS handle into the end of day totals.

Would those have been included in last yr's Equibase race-by-race charts and not this yr's???

[andymays]

Thru the first seven races, exotics (everything but WPS) is down about 15%. I need to check stakes race placements and my math!


If that is true and they end the day down significantly then they will all end up downing a bunch of Xanax (anxiety medication) with their cocktails.

They really have pissed off a lot of people over the last year. The information about their actions has been distributed like never before and Horseplayers have hollered like never before. I don't bet much anymore but I didn't bet a nickel today and that's probably the first time in the last 25 years that I didn't bet Santa Anita on opening day.

I hope you're right.

[Saratoga_Mike]

If that is true and they end the day down significantly then they will all end up downing a bunch of Xanax (anxiety medication) with their cocktails.

They really have pissed off a lot of people over the last year. The information about their actions has been distributed like never before and Horseplayers have hollered like never before.

I hope you're right.

I gotta re-check my numbers - I scribbled my numbers down...let me put everything in a spreadsheet!

[chickenhead]

maybe it turns out dirt isn't such a uniquely special competitive advantage vs all the other (dirt) tracks, after all. Or less than they've been crowing about, at least.

It's friggin dirt. Been around for awhile.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Okay I definitely have the correct WPS numbers (I'm simply pulling them from Equibase--maybe that's flawed):

2009 (race 1 thru race 7): 257, 342, 453, 508, 616, 584, 794k

2010 (race 1 thru race 7): 228, 310, 413, 466, 446, 589, 413k

You can add them, but they certainly sum to a number lower than last yr.

[toussaud]

what really hurt was the sir beaufort coming off the turf. that hurt. race was a wash.

[Saratoga_Mike]

I'm too lazy to add all the exotics in a spreadsheet, but I'm not confident in my previous estimates (scribbled numbers all over). I did triple check the exacta comparisons. Here they are:

EXACTA POOL COMPARES
2009 (races 1 to 7): 148, 219, 270, 300, 367, 326, 332

2010 (races 1 to 7): 136, 204, 271, 292, 272, 318, 181

Again, down.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Race 8 showed an increase in the WPS pools 783k vs 672k. The exacta pool was also up - 408k vs 362k.

[andymays]

I'm too lazy to add all the exotics in a spreadsheet, but I'm not confident in my previous estimates (scribbled numbers all over). I did triple check the exacta comparisons. Here they are:

EXACTA POOL COMPARES
2009 (races 1 to 7): 148, 219, 270, 300, 367, 326, 332

2010 (races 1 to 7): 136, 204, 271, 292, 272, 318, 181

Again, down.

Thanks for doing the work Mike. :ThmbUp:

[Saratoga_Mike]

Thanks for doing the work Mike. :ThmbUp:

Well someone raised the point of overseas pools, so maybe that's the issue?

[toussaud]

Race 8 showed an increase in the WPS pools 783k vs 672k. The exacta pool was also up - 408k vs 362k.
last year the 8th was the la brea this year the 8th was the malibu

[Saratoga_Mike]

last year the 8th was the la brea this year the 8th was the malibu

Good pt on the comparison - should probably wait for the full card to finish, but I was interested in the seeing the trend. For the first 8 races (using WPS and exactas), it isn't exactly a success (assuming equibase has the right numbers).

[The_Knight_Sky]

With no nyc otb I'd expect handle to drop.



The nation's biggest simulcasting outlet The Meadowlands racetrack
is under seige today. The Blizzard of 2010 under way in the NY metro area.

That also means nearby Woodbridge OTW- Toms River and perhaps Vineland
also figured to contribute very little to the handle.

Expecting more of the same tomorrow (Monday)
as we dig out instead of handicap the races.

[Saratoga_Mike]

The nation's biggest simulcasting outlet The Meadowlands racetrack
is under seige today. The Blizzard of 2010 under way in the NY metro area.

That also means nearby Woodbridge OTW- Toms River and perhaps Vineland
also figured to contribute very little to the handle.

Expecting more of the same tomorrow (Monday)
as we dig out instead of handicap the races.

Good info - thanks.

See Andy if the remaining WPS/exacta pools trend down y/y, they can blame the snow! I know you'll like that.

[DeanT]

It will be interesting to see the numbers.

They have tried the bad weather excuse before (http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=878090&postcount=4), but this time there is no Olympics to add to it.

[andymays]

Good info - thanks.

See Andy if the remaining WPS/exacta pools trend down y/y, they can blame the snow! I know you'll like that.
:lol:

It's been one ignorant comment after another from the leadership in California and their comments have been widely distributed. I guess that had a huge effect along with the off the turf races. We'll see what they say tomorrow.

[Saratoga_Mike]

:lol:

It's been one ignorant comment after another from the leadership in California and their comments have been widely distributed. I guess that had a huge effect along with the off the turf races. We'll see what they say tomorrow.

Snow and there's one less race this yr vs last, but we'll just compare WPS/exacta pools for the first nine races and see how it looks.

[owlet]

Sadler Mullins Mitchell Baffert get theirs on the backs of the betters and the crappy, non competitive fields. Toss in a big speed bias and it's the same old same old.

[Horseplayersbet.com]

$11,707,276 in total handle if Equibase is right. I think that is a modern day record for Santa Anita opening day (on the low side).

I thought we'd see a much better handle day, moving back to dirt and all.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Race 9 compares:

2009 WPS $786k (Malibu Stakes)
2010 WPS $429k

2009 Exacta $454k (Malibu Stakes)
2010 Exacta $262k

So on the day, I don't see how the WPS and exacta pools weren't down year over yr (excluding the last race from last yr). The point about the Meadowlands is an interesting one. Perhaps it's that or horseplayer frustration with the takeout, I'm not sure.

[Stillriledup]

Race 9 compares:

2009 WPS $786k (Malibu Stakes)
2010 WPS $429k

2009 Exacta $454k (Malibu Stakes)
2010 Exacta $262k

So on the day, I don't see how the WPS and exacta pools weren't down year over yr (excluding the last race from last yr). The point about the Meadowlands is an interesting one. Perhaps it's that or horseplayer frustration with the takeout, I'm not sure.

Maybe players thought the takeout raises happened today, and stuck with Wips, after all, wips isn't going up in rate.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Maybe players thought the takeout raises happened today, and stuck with Wips, after all, wips isn't going up in rate.

could be, but some seem to think the snow was a bigger factor...in any case, today won't settle this!

[DeanT]

could be, but some seem to think the snow was a bigger factor...in any case, today won't settle this!

Pretty tough for them to spin the weather. On track down, and intra state down. I am pretty sure it wasn't snowing in LA or San Diego today.

BTW, it appears I am a porcupine.

[andymays]

Pretty tough for them to spin the weather. On track down, and intra state down. I am pretty sure it wasn't snowing in LA or San Diego today.

BTW, it appears I am a porcupine.

Good weather all day in LA and San Diego.

[Stillriledup]

Good weather all day in LA and San Diego.

And, another factor was the hard rains for 5 straight days in LA. That means, people stayed home and saved their cash. There was no simulcasting or anything for a while, bankrolls should have been padded and ready.

[Saratoga_Mike]

Pretty tough for them to spin the weather. On track down, and intra state down. I am pretty sure it wasn't snowing in LA or San Diego today.

BTW, it appears I am a porcupine.

Hadn't seen that - was there an earthquake somewhere? :)

[Stillriledup]

Hadn't seen that - was there an earthquake somewhere? :)

Maybe David Israel can convince the earthquake center to send out a press release? :liar:

[Saratoga_Mike]

BTW, it appears I am a porcupine.

I suggested your porcupine status earlier before I even started to crunch numbers! Now give me a prediction on handle for the meet and you can redeem yourself! :)

[andymays]

I suggested your porcupine status earlier before I even started to crunch numbers! Now give me a prediction on handle for the meet and you can redeem yourself! :)

Everyone out here thought handle would be up. I know I did but like I said the races off the turf hurt and the snow back east may have hurt but not to the point of being down 10% or more.

[ronsmac]

Everyone out here thought handle would be up. I know I did but like I said the races off the turf hurt and the snow back east may have hurt but not to the point of being down 10% or more.
Everyone didn't think handle would be up.