View Full Version : RONDO! "Experts" still say he's 3rd of 4th best point guard
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 09:16 PM
Its okay to say that Rondo is the best point guard in the league. Whether its ESPN, TNT, etc. They always say, "Rondo is a very good player, but if I had to start a team Id still take Derin Williams, Chris Paul and maybe Derrick Rose" I keep hearing this. I don't know if its because he wasn't a huge name coming out of college or what, but he still doesn't get his due.
Rondo is the best point guard in the league and should be a starter in the all star game and in the MVP voting.
Its okay to say that Rondo is the best point guard in the league. Whether its ESPN, TNT, etc. They always say, "Rondo is a very good player, but if I had to start a team Id still take Derin Williams, Chris Paul and maybe Derrick Rose" I keep hearing this. I don't know if its because he wasn't a huge name coming out of college or what, but he still doesn't get his due.
Rondo is the best point guard in the league and should be a starter in the all star game and in the MVP voting.
His free throw shooting and poor, albeit improving, outside shot are problems. I'd take all of these guys over Rondo in no particular order...remember, he has some very nice weapons around him. I'm not sure he can do things on his own like these guys when needed:
Chris Paul
Deron Williams
Russell Westbrook
I consider Rose and Rondo close, but would probably lean towards Rose. Ask yourself this question. If Rondo switches teams with any of those guys, what happens to the Celtics? What happens to the other team? Look at it that way and you may change your mind.
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 10:00 PM
His free throw shooting and poor, albeit improving, outside shot are problems. I'd take all of these guys over Rondo in no particular order...remember, he has some very nice weapons around him. I'm not sure he can do things on his own like these guys when needed:
Chris Paul
Deron Williams
Russell Westbrook
I consider Rose and Rondo close, but would probably lean towards Rose. Ask yourself this question. If Rondo switches teams with any of those guys, what happens to the Celtics? What happens to the other team? Look at it that way and you may change your mind.
If his shooting was improved he would def be spoken as the #1. I think he's very very important to the Celts. I know they'll still be good without him, but he's very important. I watch every Celtics game and he's just a winner, he does not make many mistakes. Good things happen when he has the ball. Its fun how the NBA has several good point guards now.
Valuist
12-09-2010, 10:02 PM
Right now, D-Rose is as good as any point guard in the league. Going to the game tomorrow night when he takes it to Kobe & co.
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 10:06 PM
Rondo just banked in a 3 at the buzzer 3rd quarter, but don't think he called GLASS.. :lol:
17pts
10ast
Thru 3
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 10:07 PM
Right now, D-Rose is as good as any point guard in the league. Going to the game tomorrow night when he takes it to Kobe & co.
Have a good time. I can't believe it when i saw their record last week. I think they were about a game above .500. Too much talent to be mediocre. Early though
Valuist
12-09-2010, 10:13 PM
Have a good time. I can't believe it when i saw their record last week. I think they were about a game above .500. Too much talent to be mediocre. Early though
They were on the road for over 2 weeks and Boozer just joined the team about a week ago. Rose's numbers this season are damned impressive:
25.1 points/game
8.2 assists/game
4.3 boards/game
1.1 steals/game
Have a good time. I can't believe it when i saw their record last week. I think they were about a game above .500. Too much talent to be mediocre. Early though
Boozer will help, but they have some holes.
I'm biased as a Thunder season ticket guy, but Westbrook is special. Don't forget, in the World Championships Rose was pretty much benched in favor of Westbrook the last few games. He is now 1a to Durant and the most athletic point in the league bar none. He needs to work on his 3s, that is about it.
Rondo's FTs are just horrible, and that will kill them in close games against good teams.
Relwob Owner
12-09-2010, 10:15 PM
Its okay to say that Rondo is the best point guard in the league. Whether its ESPN, TNT, etc. They always say, "Rondo is a very good player, but if I had to start a team Id still take Derin Williams, Chris Paul and maybe Derrick Rose" I keep hearing this. I don't know if its because he wasn't a huge name coming out of college or what, but he still doesn't get his due.
Rondo is the best point guard in the league and should be a starter in the all star game and in the MVP voting.
I disagree....I would take Paul in a second over Rondo and the stats bear it out: 3 Year stats:
Boards and Field Goal Percentage-Rondo has a slight edge-50.3 to 49.5 in FG percentage and 4.63 to 4.62 in boards.
Avg 3's-69-12...advantage Paul
Assists-11.10 to 7.78....advantage Paul
Steals-2.59 to 1.97....advantage Paul
Points-21.1 to 12.14 advantage Paul
Free Throw Percentage-85.9 to 62.4 advantage Paul
It isnt even close.......
Add to that the fact that Rondo already has feet and hamstring issues that will bug him all year and it makes the decision even easier IMO.
Valuist
12-09-2010, 10:18 PM
Boozer will help, but they have some holes.
I'm biased as a Thunder season ticket guy, but Westbrook is special. Don't forget, in the World Championships Rose was pretty much benched in favor of Westbrook the last few games. He is now 1a to Durant and the most athletic point in the league bar none. He needs to work on his 3s, that is about it.
Rondo's FTs are just horrible, and that will kill them in close games against good teams.
Rose had turf toe all summer and never should've been playing on that team. Had they chosen, he would've had more minutes than Westbrook, who is a good player no doubt, but I don't think the Bulls regret taking Rose over Westbrook or anyone else in that draft class.
Relwob Owner
12-09-2010, 10:20 PM
Rose had turf toe all summer and never should've been playing on that team. Had they chosen, he would've had more minutes than Westbrook, who is a good player no doubt, but I don't think the Bulls regret taking Rose over Westbrook or anyone else in that draft class.
Tough call...what is great about both Westbrook and Rose is how much better they have both gotten since they entered the league, Rose especially with his 3's....
Rose had turf toe all summer and never should've been playing on that team. Had they chosen, he would've had more minutes than Westbrook, who is a good player no doubt, but I don't think the Bulls regret taking Rose over Westbrook or anyone else in that draft class.
I know they don't, it isn't like there is much between them at all. I don't think the Thunder would trade them either. Nobody expected this out of Westbrook this fast.
Valuist
12-09-2010, 10:35 PM
Now if I had to exclude the guy on the team I root for (Rose), I would go with Chris Paul. I think Paul really makes everyone else better around him. Not that the others aren't good; just that Paul is a special talent.
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 10:37 PM
Good Celts game tonight. Celts up 1 w/ Philly having 1 final possession
I will never get over how many times people leave Ray Allen open for wide open 3s. Just hit one to go up. No one within 5 feet of him. Probably top 3 shooter of all time.
Relwob Owner
12-09-2010, 10:43 PM
Now if I had to exclude the guy on the team I root for (Rose), I would go with Chris Paul. I think Paul really makes everyone else better around him. Not that the others aren't good; just that Paul is a special talent.
Plus, look at who he has had and currently has around him.....West is a decent and consistent player but other that, not much.
Zippy Chippy
12-09-2010, 10:43 PM
Not sure if you guys just saw the end of the CElts. Catch it on SC tonight. Rondo to Garnett alleyoop w/ 1 sec left to win. Great game.
Of course, love the NBA. It was a nice play, and shows you how bad teams lose. A good team would make Rondo beat them outside. I'm not knocking him here at all, he made the play, but terrible defense. If you were in my living room you'd know I said this before the inbounds!
Valuist
12-09-2010, 11:20 PM
Plus, look at who he has had and currently has around him.....West is a decent and consistent player but other that, not much.
Agreed. When I said the "others" I was referring to the other point guards mentioned in this thread; not Paul's teammates, who clearly are not grade 1 level talent.
PhantomOnTour
12-10-2010, 12:17 AM
Chris Paul ain't what he used to be just 2-3 yrs ago. Don't know if it's the knee, his sub par teammates or what, but his point production is down. Westbrook pretty much schooled him the other night.
PREDICTION: really soon everyone will realize what a total stud superstar Kevin Durant is....soon to be known as the best player in the NBA...and on course to threaten the all time scoring mark in league history (Abdul-Jabbar?).
I think the world of this kid.
Dahoss9698
12-10-2010, 12:32 AM
PREDICTION: really soon everyone will realize what a total stud superstar Kevin Durant is....soon to be known as the best player in the NBA...and on course to threaten the all time scoring mark in league history (Abdul-Jabbar?).
I think the world of this kid.
Way to go out on a limb there. If you have a pulse and have watched an NBA game in the last 12 months you know how good Durant is.
PhantomOnTour
12-10-2010, 12:40 AM
Way to go out on a limb there. If you have a pulse and have watched an NBA game in the last 12 months you know how good Durant is.
Your input is always welcome.
Dahoss9698
12-10-2010, 12:50 AM
Your input is always welcome.
So is yours.
headhawg
12-10-2010, 01:16 AM
In order to rank point guards it depends on what you want them to do. Rondo, Paul, and Williams are great point guards because they are a good fit for the teams that they are on. Of the three, Rondo is the weakest because if he didn't have play with the Big Three he would be ordinary, imo. Paul is the best if you look at ball handling and passing, so if that's what you want your PG to do then he's the one.
However, none of those guys can take over a game. This year Derrick Rose can do just that. He turns the ball over too much for my liking and isn't the best passer of the PGs mentioned here, but NONE of the other guards can will their team to win like Rose can. And he's had to because the Bulls really are not an offensive powerhouse. And if he were to play on the Celtics I think that he would not look as good as his skills for a team like that don't fit as well as a PG like Rondo. On the other hand, Deron Williams or Chris Paul would make the Celtics a better team than Rondo.
I haven't seen enough of Westbrook to make a judgment. He and Rose were both pretty ordinary in the game the other night. Playing with Durant can't hurt his numbers, though.
I haven't seen enough of Westbrook to make a judgment. He and Rose were both pretty ordinary in the game the other night. Playing with Durant can't hurt his numbers, though.
Durant has not played that well this year. Westbrook is the reason they are 15-8, not Durant. They are 3-1 without KD, all on the road, and that includes a win against Boston.
He has bailed them out taking over the 4th quarter several times this year. He also is the best rebounding point guard in the league, and that includes Rondo.
Relwob Owner
12-10-2010, 02:25 PM
Durant has not played that well this year. Westbrook is the reason they are 15-8, not Durant. They are 3-1 without KD, all on the road, and that includes a win against Boston.
He has bailed them out taking over the 4th quarter several times this year. He also is the best rebounding point guard in the league, and that includes Rondo.
Gotta ask...not playing that well? I agree Westbrook has improved but I think you may be downplaying Durant to play up your high opinion of Westbrook......your bar must be pretty high for Durant...27.5 pts, 7 boards, 1.47 threes, almost three assists, over a steal a game and 92 percent from the stripe....It is hard to say that these stats dont have something to do them being 15 and 8, no? His FG percentage is down(abt 47 to 42) and his points(abt 30 to 27.5) are a bit as well but it is hard to say those stats are those of a guy "not playing that well" ..... I suspect you are saying it in comparison to what was expected of him.
Gotta ask...not playing that well? I agree Westbrook has improved but I think you may be downplaying Durant to play up your high opinion of Westbrook......your bar must be pretty high for Durant...27.5 pts, 7 boards, 1.47 threes, almost three assists, over a steal a game and 92 percent from the stripe....It is hard to say that these stats dont have something to do them being 15 and 8, no? His FG percentage is down(abt 47 to 42) and his points(abt 30 to 27.5) are a bit as well but it is hard to say those stats are those of a guy "not playing that well" ..... I suspect you are saying it in comparison to what was expected of him.
I watch every minute of every game, usually twice. Durant is shooting poorly, and he is not getting to the line as often as last year. His percentage wouldn't be nearly as high if not for all the dunks Westbrook gets him. He is also turning the ball over more. Most important, when it counts the most at the end, he is not getting it done like Westbrook.
Do not get me wrong, I love Durant and he is a fabulous player. But without any doubt Westbrook is the team MVP this year so far. I expect that to change, but now, it is a no brainer.
Relwob Owner
12-10-2010, 06:54 PM
I watch every minute of every game, usually twice. Durant is shooting poorly, and he is not getting to the line as often as last year. His percentage wouldn't be nearly as high if not for all the dunks Westbrook gets him. He is also turning the ball over more. Most important, when it counts the most at the end, he is not getting it done like Westbrook.
Do not get me wrong, I love Durant and he is a fabulous player. But without any doubt Westbrook is the team MVP this year so far. I expect that to change, but now, it is a no brainer.
Right but you said he wasn't playing that well and his stats don't support that......he isn't playing well compared to expectations..yeah his fg percentage is off and his turnovers are up but all of his others are definitely not a guy not playing well....plus, he is a little nicked up, correct?
Relwob Owner
12-10-2010, 07:24 PM
I know they don't, it isn't like there is much between them at all. I don't think the Thunder would trade them either. Nobody expected this out of Westbrook this fast.
CJ,
What do they do with Jeff Green? If I am not mistaken, they didn't extend him, correct?
CJ,
What do they do with Jeff Green? If I am not mistaken, they didn't extend him, correct?
He'll be a restricted free agent. Hard to say with Ibaka developing like he is. If he wants the most money, he is gone. He might, however, stay for less.
Westbrook 2, Paul 0, and tonight wasn't close.
Valuist
12-11-2010, 06:50 PM
Was at the UC for the Bulls/Lakers game last night, and Rose certainly looked like the best player on the floor again (thats BOTH teams included, and yes, Mr. Bryant DID play). TV doesn't do justice do Rose's explosive quickness.
Zippy Chippy
12-11-2010, 06:52 PM
Was at the UC for the Bulls/Lakers game last night, and Rose certainly looked like the best player on the floor again (thats BOTH teams included, and yes, Mr. Bryant DID play). TV doesn't do justice do Rose's explosive quickness.
Ya he looked unbelievable. Great game. Didn't look good early! I put it on the the Bulls were down 13, put it back and they were up 6.
Valuist
12-11-2010, 06:56 PM
Every game there's several "oh s-it I can't believe he did that" moments.
You're right. The Lakers led 24-12 at one point early on. Bulls really stepped it up defensively. Lowest point total for the Lake Show this year.
Having said that, your Celtics are still the TEAM to beat in the East. That group in Miami is great at bullying weak teams but struggles against the better teams.
Zippy Chippy
12-11-2010, 07:04 PM
Every game there's several "oh s-it I can't believe he did that" moments.
You're right. The Lakers led 24-12 at one point early on. Bulls really stepped it up defensively. Lowest point total for the Lake Show this year.
Having said that, your Celtics are still the TEAM to beat in the East. That group in Miami is great at bullying weak teams but struggles against the better teams.
I would have to agree that Rose is the best out there right now. I know im a homer with loving Rondo, but there are several moments I feel the same way. (Imagine if he could shoot!)... Its fun watching. I haven't felt like this since the 80s. I used to sit in front of the TV rooting for the games to stay close so Larry would stay in. I love watching Rondo dish the ball to other players. He's so fast.
Relwob Owner
12-11-2010, 07:05 PM
Westbrook 2, Paul 0, and tonight wasn't close.
Paul got interviewed afterwards and said the same thing........how many athletes these days would do that? Hope these two stay healthy along with the other young points in the league...
Paul got interviewed afterwards and said the same thing........how many athletes these days would do that? Hope these two stay healthy along with the other young points in the league...
People still love him here in OKC. Without him and the Hornets, there would be no Thunder. Westbrook hit a couple big 3s yesterday too, that part is coming around.
Valuist
12-12-2010, 09:27 AM
I would have to agree that Rose is the best out there right now. I know im a homer with loving Rondo, but there are several moments I feel the same way. (Imagine if he could shoot!)... Its fun watching. I haven't felt like this since the 80s. I used to sit in front of the TV rooting for the games to stay close so Larry would stay in. I love watching Rondo dish the ball to other players. He's so fast.
His outside shot has been the one knock on Rose but that usually is the last thing the superstars get. But as of the other day, he was at 37% from beyond the arc, which was considerable improvement from his first 2 years. Sometimes he elevates so high on the shot that his feet hit together. He needs to correct that but I'm confident he will.
His outside shot has been the one knock on Rose but that usually is the last thing the superstars get. But as of the other day, he was at 37% from beyond the arc, which was considerable improvement from his first 2 years. Sometimes he elevates so high on the shot that his feet hit together. He needs to correct that but I'm confident he will.
Compared to Rondo he is a sharpshooter. I still can't believe the Sixers played him tight and allowed the lob to Garnett with a few seconds left. Doug Collins is not a good coach.
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