More challenges for NYRA and Genting?

[NY BRED]

Given the issues with Club Med and the links of destruction apparently
tied to A C and/or "economic profitability",the esteemed Governor
of NY is courting this scenario:
"In a surprise announcement (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/17/nyregion/17casino.html?hp) yesterday, Governor Paterson said he is poised to make a deal with the Stockbridge-Munsee Tribe of Wisconsin that would allow them to build a gargantuan casino complex directly along a one-mile stretch of the Neversink River, in exchange for dropping some pending legal claims involving disputed land in upstate Madison County. "

The proposed 333-acre site is located roughly 90 miles northwest of New York City in the Catskill Mountains, which encompasses the 700,000 acre Catskill Park and reservoirs that supply half the state’s drinking water every day (that’s 9 million New Yorkers, including all of NYC). Building this casino would undoubtedly bring significant negative environmental impacts to area, including a dramatic spike in traffic, increased air pollution, runoff into the Neversink River and new threats to our clean drinking water.


Genting has already announced this plan would adversely affect their operations, and who the hell would envision this could happen
to NY after the turmoil with NYRA these past few years, and
Club Med about to fade away?

:mad: :mad::mad:

[The_Knight_Sky]

Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York, said in his own statement that the deal “would be a huge boost for the economy that will include job growth and tourism, in a region that has been struggling for decades to get back on its feet.”

____________________________________


This is certainly going to affect business at several New York racinos.
I don't think tracks like Tioga and Vernon Downs are happy about this.

[OTM Al]

They'd gone as far as they could getting handouts from the Aqueduct casino, so just got another one to play with and the rest of their previous partners be damned.

[fmhealth]

NYNY is the stock symbol for this baby. As of the close today, 11/22, it's $1.15. I give it odds of about 100-1 that this casino will ever be built. I'm attaching the Yahoo finance page for those who just might be tempted.

http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=nyny

[Zman179]

I don't see this adversely affecting NYRA/Genting; the proposed casino is located 2 hours north of the city with a very difficult drive through the Catskill Mountains. It's far, far easier to drive to AC or Connecticut. If anything, this casino would adversely affect Yonkers (which would get seriously hit by NYRA/Genting), Tioga (2 1/2 hour drive) and will probably kill Monticello (already hit hard by Mount Airy and Pocono Downs.)

[point given]

I don't see this adversely affecting NYRA/Genting; the proposed casino is located 2 hours north of the city with a very difficult drive through the Catskill Mountains. It's far, far easier to drive to AC or Connecticut. If anything, this casino would adversely affect Yonkers (which would get seriously hit by NYRA/Genting), Tioga (2 1/2 hour drive) and will probably kill Monticello (already hit hard by Mount Airy and Pocono Downs.)

You don't think that people would rather drive 1 1/2 hours to A full service casino with table games than slots only in a run down area ? they've been planning such a casino for 20 years in Sullivan county. The weekenders will take their stash up there rather than the Big A or Yonkers , No ? No way is it easier to go to AC or Conn. although traffic during the summer will be a challenge in the catskills.

[GARY Z]

The Catskills offer the availability of woods, nature, lakes golf etc
so that kids(or parents) could enjoy themselves with various activities.
or the parent/parents could play table games ,choose to bet country
wide tracks (T Breds/Standard Breds)not offered at NYRA during
race days.

The serious issue is Genting could possibly withdraw from the racino
plans and even demand a refund of their monies based upon the
secret negotiations of the Governor.This operatr has already stated
a casino in the Catskills would impact their financial goals.

Incredible how various bidders were dq'd based upon
transperacy requirements from NYRA and how this situation could
evolve by the "discreet" actions of the Governor of NY.

[slewis]

The serious issue is Genting could possibly withdraw from the racino
plans and even demand a refund of their monies based upon the
secret negotiations of the Governor.This operatr has already stated
a casino in the Catskills would impact their financial goals.

Incredible how various bidders were dq'd based upon
transperacy requirements from NYRA and how this situation could
evolve by the "discreet" actions of the Governor of NY.

How do you what the entire terms of the Genting deal are?

I haven't read or have knowledge of the contract but if the Genting lawyers didn't put certain criteria into the deal which limits the State's ability to allow competition within "X" number of miles, they have NO claim and should have taken that into account when they wrote their checks.

Sure they could walk away, but I doubt they'll get a dime of money back.

What case do they have? The STATE OF NY regulates gambling in THE STATE OF NY and they do this on behalf of the PEOPLE of the state. Unless it specifcally states in the Genting deal that they cant, they can.

If you are a taxpayer of any state you WANT your politicians to use every bit of leverage to generate revenue for the state including your stated "lack of transperancy" which they are NOT required to engage in.

The reality here is that a Catskill casino is light years off and even if and when built, will have minimal impact on the Genting situation.

[toussaud]

How do you what the entire terms of the Genting deal are?

I haven't read or have knowledge of the contract but if the Genting lawyers didn't put certain criteria into the deal which limits the State's ability to allow competition within "X" number of miles, they have NO claim and should have taken that into account when they wrote their checks.

Sure they could walk away, but I doubt they'll get a dime of money back.

What case do they have? The STATE OF NY regulates gambling in THE STATE OF NY and they do this on behalf of the PEOPLE of the state. Unless it specifcally states in the Genting deal that they cant, they can.

If you are a taxpayer of any state you WANT your politicians to use every bit of leverage to generate revenue for the state including your stated "lack of transperancy" which they are NOT required to engage in.

The reality here is that a Catskill casino is light years off and even if and when built, will have minimal impact on the Genting situation.
This.

The state, has to look out for the best interest of everyone in the state, not just horse players. If they can put another revenue machine up there, and make money off of it, they are obligated to do that.

[The_Knight_Sky]

This.

The state, has to look out for the best interest of everyone in the state,
not just horse players.




hmmm.

I don't recall "horseplayers" naming a certain NY horse: We Need VLT's.

[Zman179]

You don't think that people would rather drive 1 1/2 hours to A full service casino with table games than slots only in a run down area ? they've been planning such a casino for 20 years in Sullivan county. The weekenders will take their stash up there rather than the Big A or Yonkers , No ? No way is it easier to go to AC or Conn. although traffic during the summer will be a challenge in the catskills.

First of all, that is not an 1 1/2 hour drive. Having driven up Route 17 to Monticello every Friday night for two years, that is a 2 hour drive from the Bronx. Yeah you could do it in 90 minutes...at 1 am. It's always one of two things that nails you: the Thruway or the Tappan Zee Bridge. In addition, Route 17 is loaded with Troopers since the road is known for drug trafficking (I've been nailed with tickets twice on that sucker). Plus Route 17 and the Thruway are pitch black at night; you've got street lighting about 60% of the way to AC and CT.

Second, that drive is murder on your car. You're going up steep mountain hills in both directions and your car drinks up gas as if there's a hole in the gasline. I drive to/from Foxwoods from Queens and I use about 5/8's of a tank of gas round-trip. To the Catskills? 3/4's ONE WAY. Plus you'll hit winter snowstorms on the way to the Catskills whereas it's still dry as a bone in NJ and CT. Not to mention you don't have to pay any tolls to drive to Connecticut via Merritt Parkway.

So in a nutshell, I find it 100% easier to drive to Mohegan Sun/Foxwoods than I do to the Catskills. To AC? Maybe/maybe not, depends on where you live. But what NYRA/Genting and Yonkers have over all of the full-service casinos is the convenience factor. Why drive 2+ hours when you can do 10 minutes?

[thespaah]

Given the issues with Club Med and the links of destruction apparently
tied to A C and/or "economic profitability",the esteemed Governor
of NY is courting this scenario:
"In a surprise announcement (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/17/nyregion/17casino.html?hp) yesterday, Governor Paterson said he is poised to make a deal with the Stockbridge-Munsee Tribe of Wisconsin that would allow them to build a gargantuan casino complex directly along a one-mile stretch of the Neversink River, in exchange for dropping some pending legal claims involving disputed land in upstate Madison County. "

The proposed 333-acre site is located roughly 90 miles northwest of New York City in the Catskill Mountains, which encompasses the 700,000 acre Catskill Park and reservoirs that supply half the state’s drinking water every day (that’s 9 million New Yorkers, including all of NYC). Building this casino would undoubtedly bring significant negative environmental impacts to area, including a dramatic spike in traffic, increased air pollution, runoff into the Neversink River and new threats to our clean drinking water.


Genting has already announced this plan would adversely affect their operations, and who the hell would envision this could happen
to NY after the turmoil with NYRA these past few years, and
Club Med about to fade away?

:mad: :mad::mad:Environmental concerns? Is that a quote from the source? or is that your editorializing the quote?
And please, next time you quote a source, please provide a link.
Thanks!
And Genting is blowing smoke. People do not drive down from the Catskills to go to NYRA tracks. The drop off if any would be minimal.

[thespaah]

First of all, that is not an 1 1/2 hour drive. Having driven up Route 17 to Monticello every Friday night for two years, that is a 2 hour drive from the Bronx. Yeah you could do it in 90 minutes...at 1 am. It's always one of two things that nails you: the Thruway or the Tappan Zee Bridge. In addition, Route 17 is loaded with Troopers since the road is known for drug trafficking (I've been nailed with tickets twice on that sucker). Plus Route 17 and the Thruway are pitch black at night; you've got street lighting about 60% of the way to AC and CT.

Second, that drive is murder on your car. You're going up steep mountain hills in both directions and your car drinks up gas as if there's a hole in the gasline. I drive to/from Foxwoods from Queens and I use about 5/8's of a tank of gas round-trip. To the Catskills? 3/4's ONE WAY. Plus you'll hit winter snowstorms on the way to the Catskills whereas it's still dry as a bone in NJ and CT. Not to mention you don't have to pay any tolls to drive to Connecticut via Merritt Parkway.

So in a nutshell, I find it 100% easier to drive to Mohegan Sun/Foxwoods than I do to the Catskills. To AC? Maybe/maybe not, depends on where you live. But what NYRA/Genting and Yonkers have over all of the full-service casinos is the convenience factor. Why drive 2+ hours when you can do 10 minutes?
I am originally from Northern NJ. It was 40 miles from my house to Aqueduct. I can tell you it never took less than 1 1/4 hrs to get to the Big A. Even on a Saturday or Sunday.
So yes ,for those of you from Brooklyn, Queens and Nassau, CT casinos are much closer. For those on the west side of the Hudson,a trip to the Catskills is a short hop.. And Rt 17 isn't as bad as you present here. I can certainly understand your concerns given that you are accustomed to well lit urban interstates. To us suburbanites, that's why they put headlights on cars.

[thespaah]

Senator Charles E. Schumer, Democrat of New York, said in his own statement that the deal “would be a huge boost for the economy that will include job growth and tourism, in a region that has been struggling for decades to get back on its feet.”

____________________________________


This is certainly going to affect business at several New York racinos.
I don't think tracks like Tioga and Vernon Downs are happy about this.Hmm Vernon Downs is 15 minutes from Turning Stone.
Tioga could lose some from the Binghamton area.

[thespaah]

You don't think that people would rather drive 1 1/2 hours to A full service casino with table games than slots only in a run down area ? they've been planning such a casino for 20 years in Sullivan county. The weekenders will take their stash up there rather than the Big A or Yonkers , No ? No way is it easier to go to AC or Conn. although traffic during the summer will be a challenge in the catskills.
It depends on highway access to the Catskill casino.
As far as major highway access is concerned, looking at where some other Indian casinos are located, I find it highly unlikely this tribe would have chosen a site very far from a limited access highway. So the possibility of a tough trip into the mountains on twisty two lane roads is nil.

[GARY Z]

[QUOTE=thespaah]Environmental concerns? Is that a quote from the source? or is that your editorializing the quote?
And please, next time you quote a source, please provide a link.
Thanks!


A; The article came from the NY Daily news the day I posted to PA.


In the Wed edition(11/24) page 4(how's that for drilling down?):

Stan Friedman, spokesman for Genting said " the new Casino would be devastating to the State's taxpayer gaming industry ,which would now be forced to compete on a dramtically uneven playing field"

The real issue isn't traveling to the Catskills or to Queens, and by the way
as a fan and owner I do both and both trips can provide issues as
stated by other parties.

Due dilligence to the State /people without providing transparency IS
the issue based upon the troubles previously facing NYRA which
may resurface based upon the PR statement coiming from Genting's
reps.