Texas considering dropping medicaid

[JustRalph]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/07/us/politics/07ttmedicaid.html?_r=1&hp

Saving 60 billion over the next decade..........

How many other states will consider this?

This will have to hurt the very poor, no matter how they do it.

Once Again, Obama hurts the ones he proclaims to love.

[Robert Goren]

Most Medicaid goes to nursing homes. What are going to do with those people? You can have quite a lot of money and go through very quickly in a nursing home. It now cost over 70k a year a person plus medical costs.

[fast4522]

Most Medicaid goes to nursing homes. What are going to do with those people? You can have quite a lot of money and go through very quickly in a nursing home. It now cost over 70k a year a person plus medical costs.

When you drive every other program into the ground with spending, how can you not expect something not to give. The whole concept of raping the general fund for every single socialist thing will have a profound effect sooner rather than later. And in your lifetime!

[boxcar]

Texas should just fax the Fed and tell them to print more money to fund their Medicaid. Why not? The printing press operators need the OT. That'll stimulate the economy.

Boxcar

[lsbets]

Most Medicaid goes to nursing homes. What are going to do with those people? You can have quite a lot of money and go through very quickly in a nursing home. It now cost over 70k a year a person plus medical costs.

The article says they would continue to pay for long term care, which I would think nursing homes are a part of.

[Robert Goren]

The article says they would continue to pay for long term care, which I would think nursing homes are a part of.Then They aren't going to save much money because that where most of the Medicaid goes. Just another bunch of politicians running their mouths to placate the public. So what else is new.

[lsbets]

Then They aren't going to save much money because that where most of the Medicaid goes. Just another bunch of politicians running their mouths to placate the public. So what else is new.

60 billion seems like a lot to me. It might help if you read the article. The estimated savings by cutting acute care but maintaining long term care is 60 billion dollars from 2013 to 2019.

[Tom]

All anyone needs do to get free health care in this country is show up at an emergency room and tell them your name is Sanchez. 25 million illegals can't be wrong.

(You might ask for a free driver's license while you are there, and an absentee ballot, pre-filled in, of course)

[Robert Goren]

All anyone needs do to get free health care in this country is show up at an emergency room and tell them your name is Sanchez. 25 million illegals can't be wrong.

(You might ask for a free driver's license while you are there, and an absentee ballot, pre-filled in, of course) I think it pretty hard to turn away someone who needs medical care no where they are from. But we should start send the bills for illegals to their home country and their American employers.

[lamboguy]

when i was a kid, i had a pediatrion that came to the house and he charged $10 for the visit. 2 months ago i had a problem and went to the emergency room and i waited for 2 hours to see a doctor who looked at me for not more than 5 minutes, did a few blood testes, and a couple of x-rays and sent me home with 3 different prescriptions. to fill the 3 prescriptions would have cost $270, i passed on all of them. the bill came to me from my emergency room visit later that month because my health insurance did not pay it, the bill was $2900 for the emergency room visit, another $550 for the doctors.

the people running these hospitals all drive cadilac's and have 3 different homes. and they have a friendly govenment to help keep their game alive.

and please, this is not a liberal or conservetive issue. its government sticking it to us. romney came up with this brainstorm, and obama brought it to a higher level. you will see how many political contributions he is going to get from the health care industry on his next run for president.

[johnhannibalsmith]

...because my health insurance did not pay it, the bill was $2900 for the emergency room visit, another $550 for the doctors...

I thought that you had free Romney-care?

[hcap]

All anyone needs do to get free health care in this country is show up at an emergency room and tell them your name is Sanchez. 25 million illegals can't be wrong.

(You might ask for a free driver's license while you are there, and an absentee ballot, pre-filled in, of course)Texas has 3.1 million people on Medicaid. 2.3 million of them are children. Do all these kids show up at emergency rooms when they are sick? Maybe we can rename them Sanchez or Gomez?

Face it, Medicaid and Medicare are part of our country's venture into limited Socialism. Helping the poor and underprivileged as done by all civilized western Democracies. And cannot be replaced without injuring many. Problem is not Socialism but the costs of medical treatment and fraud. Literally throwing out the BABY with the bathwater is not workable.

[boxcar]

Texas has 3.1 million people on Medicaid. 2.3 million of them are children. Do all these kids show up at emergency rooms when they are sick? Maybe we can rename them Sanchez or Gomez?

Face it, Medicaid and Medicare are part of our country's venture into limited Socialism. Helping the poor and underprivileged as done by all civilized western Democracies. And cannot be replaced without injuring many. Problem is not Socialism but the costs of medical treatment and fraud. Literally throwing out the BABY with the bathwater is not workable.

And ObaminationCare is our country's venture into limited Communism, is it? After all, some Dems themselves have said that it's all about wealth redistribution! And we know it's not going to stop there. The Witch Nancy has already voiced her concerns about the disparities in our society with incomes, equity and ownership. I can't wait 'cap until they evict you from your home so that the "poor and underprivileged" can take over your digs.

Boxcar

[hcap]

Obamacare is closer to a republican plan set forth as a counter to Hillarycare back when Clinton tried. Pretty centrist and too watered down. No where near enough to a public option and a single payer approach that would have been much more effective

Sorry to disappoint, but the real "communist" plan it's not.

[boxcar]

Obamacare is closer to a republican plan set forth as a counter to Hillarycare back when Clinton tried. Pretty centrist and too watered down. No where near enough to a public option and a single payer approach that would have been much more effective

Sorry to disappoint, but the real "communist" plan it's not.

Yeah, right. That's why it got so much Republican support, right? :rolleyes:
Never forget this, 'cap: The Dems own ObaminationCare.

Boxcar

[johnhannibalsmith]

.... Problem is not Socialism but the costs of medical treatment and fraud...

The problem is insurance, but you basically said that.

[hcap]

Never forget this, 'cap: The Dems own ObaminationCare.

Yeah and the repugs will not be able to repeal it. Only hope is we amend it over time to bring it closer to a public option. That's what brought Social security into the mainstream.

Try repealing that why don't ya.More socialistic than Hillarycare.

[hcap]

... Problem is not Socialism but the costs of medical treatment and fraud...

The problem is insurance, but you basically said that.Look, I am concerned about paying for entitlements. Contrary to what you guys think, I am a capitalist. But recognize the limits and abuses inherent within. Even Adam Smith warned of how greed and non -transparency can undermine free markets. He also positioned his "Wealth of Nations" as an aid to the "commonwealth", the general property and good. Thomas Paine and Benjamin Franklyn spoke about progressive taxes as aid to the poor. Not exactly the forerunners to Marx.

The fact is we pay more per capita for health care than any other western democracy, and as pointed out by myself and others, do not get the "best care in the world" for our expensive buck. The entitlements that add to our debt are Medicare and Medicaid. Social Security is basically self funding and would not take major reforms to keep it solvent. But the health care entitlements are in trouble. Reducing costs 20 or 40% on par with the other western democracies would easily allow us to provide for sustaining both and sustaining those that are dependent on both.

[bigmack]

do not get the "best care in the world" for our expensive buck
Just depends on what criteria you want to look at. For some the glass is half full. For you it's empty and shattered in a million pieces.

Talk about foaming at the mouth. Every stat you ever bring up either makes man an arch enemy of Mother Earth or the US as the worst of the worst.

Weird how that happens.

[hcap]

Still not posting any studies to disprove all the studies I have.....

Instead call me a goof or other nonsense and hide behind your CO2 defense. MAYBE IF YOU HOLD YOUR BREATH, STAND ON ONE FOOT BLINDFOLDED WITH YOUR FINGERS IN YOUR EARS all the little pesky facts will simply go away.

http://www.deedeewarren.com/images/monkeys.gif

Ok, I recognize you and Tom. Who's lucky Pierre?

[johnhannibalsmith]

Look, I am concerned about paying for entitlements. Contrary to what you guys think, I am a capitalist...

I've never accused anyone of being anything (other than stupid, warped, deranged, smart, deceitful... etc) and I don't think you are a communist or socialist or marxist or keynesian ( no wait, maybe...)...

It's real simple on this health care thing - you either need to:

a) basically go the socialist route and have it run entirely by government and hope and pray and everything else that your problems are fairly ordinary in nature because it will be almost totally F'ed up before too long, but functional enough that we'll all be used to it and probably grateful for it in the generations between acclimation and bankruptcy.

b) leave everything basically the same. We know the rules of engagement, they suck for some of us - but rather than stimulating the economy by giving nephew Cheshire Q. Brevertonne XXIV a fifty quadrillion dollar contract to think of good ideas on how to spend whatever money is left -- stimulate some smart capitalists into creating a market driven model which actually works for its customers/extortion victims that can be implemented alongside the current model and force it to play ball with the more efficient, functional model.

c) form a fancy commission to determine that insurers "aka health care providers, etc" have made basic care so ridiculously expensive (by doing little more than getting directly in the middle of two willing parties, a developing industry in this nation of service providers whose only service is to seperate you from your money by doing things that you can do yourself just as easily and quickly) to the average family that these people are forced to purchase policies which they cannot afford and only increase or they arrive at the emergency room for all of their needs. Said commission will be in the bag, it will all be a sham, and they'll decide that it amounts to price fixing or something nefarious like that. They then demand that health insurance be limited to providing against the unforseen or catastrophic, not the seasonal and hypothetical.

Option C is obviously partially sarcastic, but I think in terms of actually fixing the root problem - it's the closest thing to a solution. I know that it has become somewhat passe to believe that "tort reforms" are needed as Senator Sumdumshmo pointed out that "only" some small percentage of cost containment could be attained by such measures.

But see, he's on the surface with that number. Stop stuffing money into the pockets of your goofy lawyer friends that long ago forgot about trying to save the world and right the wrongs and injustices in the universe.

When there isn't a jackpot at the end of the rainbow, physicians can practice outside of the bubble that surrounds them with mandates and burdens to diagnose and treat patients in such a way that the resources wasted protecting AGAINST malpractice are incalculable. It costs $2,000 to get half of my medical history when I have a problem and I'd give the whole thing to them for free if they weren't afraid that I am lying and out to sue them.

This shouldn't need to be part of any bill or come from any particular party, this should simply be done tomorrow.

My problem isn't at all with the entitlement programs themselves or anything that the people decide their taxes should support - my problem lies in politicians always avoiding real solutions and speaking in vagueties that are solved with a law with their name attached to it.

You guys turn to politicians acting like politicians and expect politics to solve a social problem. We don't vote for people brave enough to do things like that.

This is a little off the topic... sorry... rambling...

[hcap]

My point all along is that there are models out there that are more cost effective and do at least as well if not better in terms of medical efficacy. Free markets are not always the best solution by themselves. There is no divinity residing in the invisible hand. Just as there is no divinity in a bloated governmental bureaucracy

Sometimes government contrary to Reagen, is the solution, and sometimes the best thing is a market solution. Since the end of WWII, most of the world has moved to a synthesis of both. The health care models that work in western democracies-other than the US-are just that.

And all of them use less resources ( money ) per capita than we do

[Tom]

What should government do to help HC access?

First off, seal the borders, then sweep the country for illegals, then make it mandatory to check citizenship at hospital emergency rooms.

Stop the freaking handouts to foreigners who have already failed to make their own country any better than a cesspool from driving ours down as well.

Then, invade Mexico and take care to the drug lords that run the damn place. We have far more business going there than Afghanistan. Mexico is our ENEMY and a real threat. Deal with it.

Clean up what Mexico will not.

That should start costs going down.

[JustRalph]

What should government do to help HC access?

First off, seal the borders, then sweep the country for illegals, then make it mandatory to check citizenship at hospital emergency rooms.

Stop the freaking handouts to foreigners who have already failed to make their own country any better than a cesspool from driving ours down as well.

Then, invade Mexico and take care to the drug lords that run the damn place. We have far more business going there than Afghanistan. Mexico is our ENEMY and a real threat. Deal with it.

Clean up what Mexico will not.

That should start costs going down.

Now cut that out!! (Think Jack Benny)

You're making way too much sense............

[JustRalph]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/05/us/05transplant.html?_r=1&hp

Arizona goes all in on Medicaid cuts

"What distinguishes the reductions recently imposed in Arizona, where coverage was eliminated on Oct. 1 for certain transplants of the heart, liver, lung, pancreas and bone marrow, is the decision to stop paying for treatments urgently needed to ward off death.

The cuts in transplant coverage, which could deny organs to 100 adults currently on the transplant list, are testament to both the severity of fiscal pressures on the states and the particular bloodlessness of budget-cutting in Arizona."

related:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/03/us/03transplant.html?_r=1&hpw

[boxcar]

All states should follow suit. I heard that now with so many Republican governorships, that there are already 20 states joining together to file a lawsuit against ObamaCare.

There's also some Republican who will, in the next congress, present a bill in the House that would allow for a constitutional amendment for overturning unpopular bills by a super majority vote of the states. Doubt seriously this will gain any traction before 2012, and even then it's dubious because such a bill would put too much power into the hands of the people. But all these things go to show how unpopular socialized medicine really is. I can't remember when there was such an uproar over a major piece of legislation. Maybe someone can jog my memory.

Boxcar

[redshift1]

"Maybe someone can jog my memory"

ROM without RAM is the probelm