Horseplayer destruction at TVG

[InsideThePylons-MW]

4 featured tracks being shown by TVG right now


Suffolk----19% WPS, 26% all other bets

Parx----30% tri/sup, 26% p-3/p-4

Turf Paradise----20% WPS, 25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Delaware----25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Amazing that some people actually wonder why the sport is in a freefall.

[andymays]

When the Betfair CEO came out a said he supported the takeout raise in California that was the end for me.

They remind me of Carnival barkers sometimes.

[JustRalph]

4 featured tracks being shown by TVG right now


Suffolk----19% WPS, 26% all other bets

Parx----30% tri/sup, 26% p-3/p-4

Turf Paradise----20% WPS, 25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Delaware----25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Amazing that some people actually wonder why the sport is in a freefall.

Just a question.........what is else is running today?

[Charli125]

Just a question.........what is else is running today?

I'm home sick today and that's a good question. There just isn't much going on. I was really hoping to make some bets today but no such luck.

[InsideThePylons-MW]

Just a question.........what is else is running today?

It doesn't matter who else is running today.

If you owned a TV station and your only possible ad revenue on Mondays was from Bernie Madoff and you knew it was a ponzi scheme because he offered you half of what you brought in, would you put his ads on the air?

Parx, a slot funded track, has takeout rates that are criminal.

Suffolk has takeout rates that are criminal.

TVG profits greatly from these criminal takeout rates because they get the difference between the host fee they pay and the takeout rate.

I'm not saying they can't conspire to rob horseplayers.....They shouldn't and I'm just saying it's amazing nobody in the industry steps up and screams about what this does to the customer.

I hope everybody that is getting destroyed at these tracks decide not to re-up their accounts to bet Churchill this week.

[Mike_412]

When the Betfair CEO came out a said he supported the takeout raise in California that was the end for me.

They remind me of Carnival barkers sometimes.

While that was pretty dumb on his part to say that, don't you think the main reason he supported it is because legalizing betting exchanges in California was directly tied to it? I would say that's a logical assumption. There was an ulterior motive there imo.

[andymays]

While that was pretty dumb on his part to say that, don't you think the main reason he supported it is because legalizing betting exchanges in California was directly tied to it? I would say that's a logical assumption. There was an ulterior motive there imo.

Absolutely.

[duncan04]

It doesn't matter who else is running today.

If you owned a TV station and your only possible ad revenue on Mondays was from Bernie Madoff and you knew it was a ponzi scheme because he offered you half of what you brought in, would you put his ads on the air?

Parx, a slot funded track, has takeout rates that are criminal.

Suffolk has takeout rates that are criminal.

TVG profits greatly from these criminal takeout rates because they get the difference between the host fee they pay and the takeout rate.

I'm not saying they can't conspire to rob horseplayers.....They shouldn't and I'm just saying it's amazing nobody in the industry steps up and screams about what this does to the customer.

I hope everybody that is getting destroyed at these tracks decide not to re-up their accounts to bet Churchill this week.


You could always turn on HRTV and watch horse breaking shows :faint:

[thaskalos]

It doesn't matter who else is running today.

If you owned a TV station and your only possible ad revenue on Mondays was from Bernie Madoff and you knew it was a ponzi scheme because he offered you half of what you brought in, would you put his ads on the air?

Parx, a slot funded track, has takeout rates that are criminal.

Suffolk has takeout rates that are criminal.

TVG profits greatly from these criminal takeout rates because they get the difference between the host fee they pay and the takeout rate.

I'm not saying they can't conspire to rob horseplayers.....They shouldn't and I'm just saying it's amazing nobody in the industry steps up and screams about what this does to the customer.

I hope everybody that is getting destroyed at these tracks decide not to re-up their accounts to bet Churchill this week.Horseplayers are a peculiar lot...and many of them are oblivious to the "evils" of the high takeout rates.

I am well acquainted with two "large" bettors who are also successful businessmen, and they both play exclusively at Chicago-area OTBs...where they face an added 5% surcharge, on top of the regular takeout.

For two years now I have been trying to convince them that an online account is the way to go, but I am wasting my words...

[ukbro00]

This whole post is stupid.

If you don't like the track, don't bet it.
TVG has nothing to do with setting their takeout rates, and takeout rates should have no affect on what they show.

It has been proven that lower takeout doesn't really positively affect handle (look at PM P4, i believe), so tracks would just lose money by doing it.

[Tom]

Just a question.........what is else is running today?

Alb, Beu, FL, PM, TD, Zia.

No brainer.
Actually, TVG had Vic on as a host today - I had not heard him in that spot before and he did a good job - probably better than most of the other hosts. :ThmbUp:

[duncan04]

This whole post is stupid.

If you don't like the track, don't bet it.
TVG has nothing to do with setting their takeout rates, and takeout rates should have no affect on what they show.

It has been proven that lower takeout doesn't really positively affect handle (look at PM P4, i believe), so tracks would just lose money by doing it.


Agree with this post. Its just your average TVG sucks thread. :sleeping:

[Valuist]

This whole post is stupid.



It has been proven that lower takeout doesn't really positively affect handle (look at PM P4, i believe), so tracks would just lose money by doing it.

Where has that been proven? Everything I have heard is the opposite. I don't think you can count one solitary wager offered at one track as evidence.

[CincyHorseplayer]

This stuff is background noise for when I'm paying attention to Belmont.The comedy here is that some of you actually pay attention to it.Good show!Cheers!!

[InTheRiver68]

TVG profits greatly from these criminal takeout rates because they get the difference between the host fee they pay and the takeout rate.
TVG is unlikely to choose their lineup based on takeouts. Do you think they'd prefer to feature a track that has 19% WPS takeout, but only gets them $20,000 in WPS handle through their ADW, or a track that has 17% WPS takeout, but gets them $30,000 in WPS handle? The latter, obviously. Assuming they're paying 5% signal fee, the first track gets them $2,800, and the second track gets them $3,600.

That's like saying your local OTB puts Suffolk on ten screens, and Belmont on only five screens, because they get a smaller slice of a Belmont bet. I don't think the people who run OTBs are *that* stupid.

The decisions are likely made based on many factors, first and foremost being who they have a business relationship (read: contract) with. Suffolk may be paying a premium to TVG for featuring their races, and it may be far and above what TVG gets from Suffok in commission.

- InTheRiver68

[castaway01]

4 featured tracks being shown by TVG right now


Suffolk----19% WPS, 26% all other bets

Parx----30% tri/sup, 26% p-3/p-4

Turf Paradise----20% WPS, 25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Delaware----25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Amazing that some people actually wonder why the sport is in a freefall.

You're still posting the same bullshit Steve Crist misquote you've had up for a long time, so as long as that's still allowed you shouldn't be whining about anything else. Didn't I debunk your misquote weeks ago? I love how you're allowed to continue to post the same BS over and over....favored nation I guess? Libel I guess? Slander I guess? Pussy liar? Definitely.

[ukbro00]

Where has that been proven? Everything I have heard is the opposite. I don't think you can count one solitary wager offered at one track as evidence.

A decrease in takeout will increase handle. That is a fact.

Also a fact: The increase in handle will not make up for the decrease in takeout, causing the track to see a decrease in revenue.

[misscashalot]

Horseplayers are a peculiar lot...and many of them are oblivious to the "evils" of the high takeout rates.

I am well acquainted with two "large" bettors who are also successful businessmen, and they both play exclusively at Chicago-area OTBs...where they face an added 5% surcharge, on top of the regular takeout.

For two years now I have been trying to convince them that an online account is the way to go, but I am wasting my words...

Maybe they're winning horse players and don't give a shit how high the takeout is, or the xtra 5% vig they fork over.

[Valuist]

A decrease in takeout will increase handle. That is a fact.

Also a fact: The increase in handle will not make up for the decrease in takeout, causing the track to see a decrease in revenue.

In the short run, no. But has it ever been done long enough to see the real benefits? I doubt it. Anyone who has played with a rebate knows its a cumulative thing. Day 1 you don't notice it. Play 6 months and you will really notice it.

[InsideThePylons-MW]

You're still posting the same bullshit Steve Crist misquote you've had up for a long time, so as long as that's still allowed you shouldn't be whining about anything else. Didn't I debunk your misquote weeks ago? I love how you're allowed to continue to post the same BS over and over....favored nation I guess? Libel I guess? Slander I guess? Pussy liar? Definitely.

http://www.paceadvantage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=934469&postcount=24

I'm quoting Ernie Dahlman explaining why he moved from NY to Las Vegas.

The exact quote from Ernie is in the above post.

Obviously it's not a misquote and I don't know how you could debunk it unless you know Ernie moved for reasons other than he stated.

Libel and slander quoting someone exactly? Pussy liar?

:D

[comet52]

Horseplayers are a peculiar lot...and many of them are oblivious to the "evils" of the high takeout rates.

I am well acquainted with two "large" bettors who are also successful businessmen, and they both play exclusively at Chicago-area OTBs...where they face an added 5% surcharge, on top of the regular takeout.

For two years now I have been trying to convince them that an online account is the way to go, but I am wasting my words...

Playing online would subject them to having their wagers tracked and winnings taxed.

[turfnsport]

Some of you guys will never get it.

"America's Horse Racing Network" promoting high takeout tracks takes more money out of horseplayers pockets. That is money that can no longer be bet.

They do it with their ridiculous obsession with high takeout wagers like Pick 4 and Pick 6's and by promoting some of these tracks with larcenous takeout rates.

What's the Over / Under on how many TVG account holders made ONE deposit and never a second?

That is bad for all of us.

[lamboguy]

4 featured tracks being shown by TVG right now


Suffolk----19% WPS, 26% all other bets

Parx----30% tri/sup, 26% p-3/p-4

Turf Paradise----20% WPS, 25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Delaware----25% tri/sup/p-3/p-4

Amazing that some people actually wonder why the sport is in a freefall.the ontrack handles for these places are almost non-existant. if you are a decent player the rebates are better in sulfolk then in other places, but you need to be a bigger player. only problem with that is the handles are very weak and you can't bet that much. the product stinks to begin with so you aren't going to get that many weekend warriors or once in awhile punters to the place. in the big scope of things it doesn't make to much a difference if you had ZERO takeout in these places, you would't get to much more business. so instead of improving the product they bleed the customer that are foolish enough to donate their chips to the game. if sulfolk does $1.5 million in handle for the day the hold might be around $50,000. they give away more than that in purses. as you can all see, houston we have a problem.