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cj
10-18-2010, 09:57 PM
Hard not to notice the strike zone is just a hair bit bigger for Pettite with the pitch tracker in action. I wonder why that is since both throw similarly.

bigmack
10-18-2010, 11:37 PM
Holy Macaroon, Lee made ZaYanks look silly.

SILLY!

cj
10-18-2010, 11:44 PM
He was dazzling. It is pretty clear outside of CC the Yanks are weak on the pitching front. They better hit to have a chance.

redshift1
10-19-2010, 12:37 AM
Toss up for the worst performance tonight The Yankees or the Jaguars.

PaceAdvantage
10-19-2010, 01:49 AM
He was dazzling. It is pretty clear outside of CC the Yanks are weak on the pitching front. They better hit to have a chance.Well...CC hasn't pitched all that well in the post season this year...but the Yankees have won those games despite him...

Pettitte has pitched brilliantly thus far, including tonight. You can't fault the way he pitched.

Phil Hughes can be lights out...he had an off game last time out...don't think that will happen again...

Burnett (who goes tonight) is the definite weak link...

The bullpen has been a source of strength all year long...don't look to Monday night's late game breakdown by the bullpen as an indicator of form going forward.

I totally disagree that outside of CC, the Yankees are weak on the pitching front.

OTM Al
10-19-2010, 08:45 AM
I think the Yankees are a better overall team than Texas, but they look completely flat and pretty much have all but the 3rd game against Minnesota. Washington can't manage his way out of a paper bag, but he isn't having to. Not over by a long shot, but they need to wake up soon.

Valuist
10-19-2010, 08:04 PM
Hard not to pull for Texas here, unless one is from NY. Would love to see the Rangers get to their first World Series. Burnett looks very susceptible here.

ElKabong
10-19-2010, 08:36 PM
You know what I find most interesting of all? The so-called die hard Yankee fans that don't have butts in prime seats from the tv camera views. I recall this during the regular season (i have Directv extra innings) but it absolutely FLOORS me to see these seats unoccupied in the ALCS.

One of our radio sports crews here went to the game last nite, never stopped talking about how the crowd had thinned to nothing during the 8th. WTF is that?? The yankee fans deep down are no better than Dallas cowboy fans....give them a winner, they're "rabid". When things don't go their way they hit the exits.

One of them made a great comment that "Yankee fans are no different than anyone else's fans, it's just that their appetite for winning has been whetted over the years. Give them a crap team like the late 80's & they don't show up. Give them the 1996 team and all of a sudden they're "rabid baseball fans"

Cowboy fans are the perfect example of bandwagon fans, Yankee fans are example 1a....I see a lot of empty seats behind the plate and down the baselines on tv

The series itself...This is a treat for me b/c it's the one and only time in my lifetime I have the chance to see the R's make a run. Economics of the game dictate that. Next yr when Lee is a Yank, we stand no shot at beating this team.

bigmack
10-19-2010, 08:45 PM
You're a right field umpire and you can't figure out a foul ball from a fair ball when the ball goes on the outside of the pole?

Speakin' of foul balls & certainly worth a well deserved encore; I give you the classic, Foul Ball, Spilled Beer & Thrown Pizza clip:
http://videosift.com/video/Foul-Ball-Spilled-Beer-Thrown-Pizza?loadcomm=1

Rise Over Run
10-19-2010, 08:53 PM
Speakin' of foul balls & certainly worth a well deserved encore; I give you the classic, Foul Ball, Spilled Beer & Thrown Pizza clip:
http://videosift.com/video/Foul-Ball-Spilled-Beer-Thrown-Pizza?loadcomm=1

This one just never gets old.

ElKabong
10-19-2010, 10:39 PM
Looks like game 5 is going to be a good one afterall...Needed Bengie's hr there b/c if Wash puts Oliver in we're doomed. Ollie's arm is dead from abuse early this season & Wash won't realize it

Gotta find a way to get Ogando / Rapida /O'Day to hand the ball to Nefti with a 2 run lead in the 9th....somehow, someway

Girardi left AJ in too long, but did he have a choice? With only one lefty in the pen plays to the R's in a big way. They have to use Boone wisely

ElKabong
10-19-2010, 11:39 PM
:bang: yep, this is a crazy game....we get a 4 run lead and our pen starts walking batters....makes me ill. No excuse for this. Game 1 all over again?

ElKabong
10-19-2010, 11:58 PM
top of the 9th inning
ALDS game 4
Series is at 2-1, Rangers......
And there are more empty seats behind home plate than there are people occupying seats.
Yankee fans are NO different than any others. Your fortunate enuff to have great teams thru the years, but when it comes to die hard fans, please keep the nonsense to yourselves. This series proves how far the loyalty goes

Another HR, that outta empty the joint out-

Valuist
10-20-2010, 12:11 AM
I can't believe Oliver is still in the league.

Hamilton or Pujols, who do you take?

ElKabong
10-20-2010, 12:19 AM
Pujols. Hambone has only 2 100+ seasons in his bag & he's about to turn 30

The best allaround player is definitely Hamilton, but he misses too many games....even now he's hurt- even w/ the hr's

After the last out I turned on the radio just in time to hear Dave Barnett say "and in front of what is a spring training sized crowd, the Rangers go up 3 to 1 on the Yankees". Yankee fans here locally are taking it more than they've ever given it. Win or lose, they've shown themselves to be what they are.

Great franchise. Class organization. Tremendous tradition. Frontrunner fanbase (just like everyone else- no better....no worse)

Valuist
10-20-2010, 12:22 AM
Really hoping for Rangers/Giants and it looks like a legit possibility. MLB needs some parity and nothing is worse than seeing the same usual suspects in the World Series.

cj
10-20-2010, 12:24 AM
Well...CC hasn't pitched all that well in the post season this year...but the Yankees have won those games despite him...

Pettitte has pitched brilliantly thus far, including tonight. You can't fault the way he pitched.

Phil Hughes can be lights out...he had an off game last time out...don't think that will happen again...

Burnett (who goes tonight) is the definite weak link...

The bullpen has been a source of strength all year long...don't look to Monday night's late game breakdown by the bullpen as an indicator of form going forward.

I totally disagree that outside of CC, the Yankees are weak on the pitching front.

Care to retract? This isn't the Os and Indians they are playing now.

bigmack
10-20-2010, 12:25 AM
DaYanks looked silly tonight.

SILLY!

cj
10-20-2010, 12:27 AM
You're a right field umpire and you can't figure out a foul ball from a fair ball when the ball goes on the outside of the pole?

Speakin' of foul balls & certainly worth a well deserved encore; I give you the classic, Foul Ball, Spilled Beer & Thrown Pizza clip:
http://videosift.com/video/Foul-Ball-Spilled-Beer-Thrown-Pizza?loadcomm=1

That was sad, how could he miss that? Baseball as a whole should be embarrassed by the physical condition of a lot of the umpires. Nobody will convince me being unfit doesn't hurt performance.

I was watching after the replay decision, and as they walked on the field I wasn't sure if the game was resuming or a buffet line opened nearby.

bigmack
10-20-2010, 12:44 AM
I was watching after the replay decision, and as they walked on the field I wasn't sure if the game was resuming or a buffet line opened nearby.
Although the blown call was made by one of the more svelte of the bunch. Always thought it would be a hoot to see baseball ump's go ref an NBA game. Two baskets and they'd need CPR with a spritz of O2. Must have something to do with the tradition of baseball ump's being rotund.

Rangers were able to get homers off Yank pitching as easily as I got gumballs out of a faulty machine @ 6. I worked it for weeks.

ElKabong
10-20-2010, 01:14 AM
If I'm a yanks fan, I wouldn't worry too much. If the R's take the series, it's our only shot....ever. Not so for NY

The Yanks will sign Cliff Lee. That's almost a given now, no? Steinbrenner Jr will want to make a splash in his 1rst full yr at the helm, Cliff is the catch of FA's and no one will outspend the Yanks.

Look at it this way (reality). The R's match up well vs the Yanks set up men. Cliff basically eliminates the need for Jabba, Boone, et al. He either finishes the game, or hands it to the closer. That saves a bullpen beyond their wildest dreams.

The Yanks pen will only get better w/ Cliff there and they don't have to add a quality arm in the pen to do so.

This is basically what he did for us. The R's pen was beginning to tire out in late June. Oliver was looking like last yr's version of Jason Jennings- abused early and had little left....Rapida and Ogando were either on the farm or used sparingly. Oday held down what he could.

Then we got Lee....changed everything, and I do mean everything. Even when he was losing games by scores of 2-1 and 3-2, he ate innings and saved the pen for Colby, BigGame, CJ, Feldman/Holland/ Harden.

When Lee goes to the bronx, the only thing that keeps them from winning every yr is injuries to multiple starters...other than that they're a lock

PaceAdvantage
10-20-2010, 03:31 AM
Care to retract? This isn't the Os and Indians they are playing now.Phil Hughes won 18 games and Pettitte was 11-3 on the year, so to say it's weak once you get past CC is a little off to me.

As for the pen, Chamberlain and Wood have pitched well enough in the post season...it's just Robertson who has decided to deflate at the very worst moment followed by Boone Logan...they weren't this way all year long, that's for sure...

PaceAdvantage
10-20-2010, 03:37 AM
Yankee fans are NO different than any others.Who said they were?

And those seats behind home plate, some are $1,250 a pop or more! They've had trouble filling those seats since the stadium opened (and in the beginning, those seats cost $2,500 a pop...they cut the price in half).

I guarantee you there would have been empty seats in Fenway given the same situation the other night (expensive seats or no expensive seats).

OTM Al
10-20-2010, 08:33 AM
The Rangers are without a doubt a hot team at the right time and are playing the best of the 4 remaining teams so they have a real shot....in spite of Washington, who may be one of the worst managers in baseball, tactically at least.

The 3rd inning call was the stupidest thing I've seen in some time. AJ has just walked a guy and then hit another (trying to sacrifice). He's had a bad year with real control issues and what do you do? Give him a free out. Huge opportunity right there to knock the pitcher out of the box and you give away an out. Small ball is not always smart ball and that was just plain dumb and they were lucky to get 2 runs out of it. He's lucky the Yanks have been so bad as he hasn't had to make any tough decisions. Beware a World Series managerial meltdown...

rgustafson
10-20-2010, 09:43 AM
Who said they were?

And those seats behind home plate, some are $1,250 a pop or more! They've had trouble filling those seats since the stadium opened (and in the beginning, those seats cost $2,500 a pop...they cut the price in half).

I guarantee you there would have been empty seats in Fenway given the same situation the other night (expensive seats or no expensive seats).

The thing that I find laughable is top of the first inning of the game, nobody on base and all these fans standing, screaming and clapping when the hometown pitcher gets two strikes on a batter as if it was the last inning of the seventh game of the world series.( Previousy I thought this behavior only happened at Fenway, kind of disappointed to see it last night.) Many of these same fans were occupying those empty seats that you saw later in the game.

ElKabong
10-20-2010, 08:46 PM
Who said they were?

And those seats behind home plate, some are $1,250 a pop or more! They've had trouble filling those seats since the stadium opened (and in the beginning, those seats cost $2,500 a pop...they cut the price in half).

I guarantee you there would have been empty seats in Fenway given the same situation the other night (expensive seats or no expensive seats).

"Who said they were"? Look, for 30+ yrs people down here have heard the horseshit from NY (and bosox) fans about how "rabid" and into games they are. Someshit about how they KNOW baseball on a higher plane than everywhere else.

They had to shut up for a 10 yr period before the great resurgence of superstars and great pitching they brought on in 1995-6....but we had to hear that "rabid fan" BS again.

And WTF is the deal with people all over th eballpark leaving early? Not talking about just hi $ seats, it's all over. If you don't believe people from Texas ROTFLTAO at yankee fans hitting the exits early, check out links below.

Yanks fans are no better, no worse than fans anywhere else.

http://espn.go.com/blog/los-angeles/dodger-thoughts/post/_/id/9022/9022

http://www.angelswin.com/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=44134

http://www.thebestdamnpoll.com/Default.aspx?tabid=112&g=posts&m=307602

Lots of empty seats in Yankee Stadium today. Are you serious? How is that possible? The New York Media led the assault on Atlanta during the early part of this decade when the Braves fell a couple thousand short of a sell out. Now this? The last two nights we have seen "the best and most knowledgeable fans" in baseball fleeing the scene of the crime before the 9th inning. This is almost laughable.

http://www.lockerpulse.com/News/Yankee-fans-surrender-S482759/

I don't ever want to hear a Yankee fan again criticize Dodger Stadium fans about leaving early. There were already empty seats in a quiet ballpark when the ninth inning of Game 3 of the American League Championship Series began, more empty seats even when the game was still in doubt, and now Yankee fans are fleeing the ballpark tonight like they found out the world is ending.

there's much much more, but you do get the idea....

RaceBookJoe
10-20-2010, 10:31 PM
The thing that I find laughable is top of the first inning of the game, nobody on base and all these fans standing, screaming and clapping when the hometown pitcher gets two strikes on a batter as if it was the last inning of the seventh game of the world series.( Previousy I thought this behavior only happened at Fenway, kind of disappointed to see it last night.) Many of these same fans were occupying those empty seats that you saw later in the game.

The 2-strike clapping started and has been going on since 1978 with Ron Guidry. rbj

ElKabong
10-20-2010, 11:04 PM
when did leaving early in big games begin? 1966? 1988?

I think it's cool to have energetic fans, but when those same fans hit the exits in the 7th and 8th innings of a winnable game it's time to call it what it is....Fair weather fans

PaceAdvantage
10-21-2010, 02:13 AM
"Who said they were"? Look, for 30+ yrs people down here have heard the horseshit from NY (and bosox) fans about how "rabid" and into games they are. Someshit about how they KNOW baseball on a higher plane than everywhere else.

They had to shut up for a 10 yr period before the great resurgence of superstars and great pitching they brought on in 1995-6....but we had to hear that "rabid fan" BS again.Oh, so sorry sir... :lol:

Not sure where you are hearing this from...do you get a lot of Yankee and Red Sox fans down where you are telling you this kind of thing? Or is this some kind of media creation?

OTM Al
10-21-2010, 09:07 AM
Oh, so sorry sir... :lol:

Not sure where you are hearing this from...do you get a lot of Yankee and Red Sox fans down where you are telling you this kind of thing? Or is this some kind of media creation?

Don't raz the guty too hard. He sounds like he may be one of the 3 Ranger fans in existence. If the Cowboys or the 'Horns were top flight teams this year Texas would have forgotten about baseball's existance back in September.

lsbets
10-21-2010, 10:59 AM
I'm a lifelong Yankee fan, but I've been living in Texas for 10 years. Back in August there were next to no Rangers fans, in September before it became obvious to even the diehards that the Cowboys suck, there were next to no Ranger fans. At the start of the Tampa series barely anyone was paying attention.

Now everyone is watching the Rangers. Will it have a lasting effect on the fan base? Doubt it. This is a football town. By May next year the Rangers will be lucky to get 25K in the stands for a game. The average person here can't name more than 4 players on the team, most no more than 2 - Hamilton and Lee.

Hell, you can see the difference in youth sports. My son is 8. Baseball is on 4 fields with small bleachers. Football is in a mini stadium with seating for close to 1,000 and a PA announcer doing the game. It was a struggle to get 11 kids on his baseball team, his football team filled up on the first day of signups. Friday nights in the fall are slow at the restaurant because of high school football. The rest of the year its our busiest night. Baseball has everyone's attention right now, but even if the Rangers win the WS it won't change the fact that Dallas is a football town.

But for now, the town is baseball crazy. Its good for the game, and hopefully it does bring some more fans in. With the population of the metroplex, there is no way the Rangers should be a mid market team. The new owners are committed to growing the fan base, hopefully they can.

ElKabong
10-21-2010, 09:45 PM
you 3 guys miss the point, but that doesn't surprise.

PA,
During the 70s thru current day we've had a large influx of people from NY and elsewhere. It's amazing, these NY folks are loud and proud when the Yankees are hot (77-85'ish, and 95-present) but you couldn't find a Yankee fan to save your life in between. Fair weathered bandwagon fans who had broken ankles in the mid 80s from jumping off that bandwagon.

These people are in your face type of ignorant. We have plenty of them here.

Al,
Not to worry, son. TEXAS football games are sold out thru 2015. All 99,000 + of them. As for the Cowboys, who gives a shit? They're no better than Yankee fans...Fair weather losers just looking to latch onto a winner.

lsbets,
Tell Rockwall to get off its ass and build some ballparks.....of course your post is simply made for effect, I know there are plenty there. The fact your shop does less business on Friday nights is a compliment to football here. It IS big, and we produce a lot of nfl players for the very reason we put a lot of importance in it......same with baseball, check the Yanks roster and you'll find some Texas boys.

How many new yorkers are on the Yanks roster???? Do they even play HS ball there or do kids just sit in front of tv's there with joysticks and 52 oz soda cannisters between their legs all day? (there's my post for effect. Tit for Tat)

Fact is, baseball is big here. We play it (there are 2 HS ballparks that seat 2500+ less than 4 miles from my house), we watch it, our college programs (plural) are as good as you can ask. The reason====It's a big deal here.

The Rangers? THE most mismanaged franchise in mlb recent history until Daniels arrived....and he no doubt will replace Cashman if the yanks don't win it all by next yr. You know the deal...The Ballpark is in the worst location possible to draw fans, the drive is horrible.....the Management here prior to Daniels was maddening- so many great young arms traded for the likes of Lee Mazzilli. Hard to attach yourself to this situation, but Daniels has changed a lot.

This is our one shot. We may or may not win the series but it's fun. If we had the built in economic advantage Boston and NY had we;d have NY yankee style fans...expecting to win every year & heading for the exits in ALCS games in the 7th inning when things look bleak.

PaceAdvantage
10-21-2010, 11:09 PM
This is our one shot. We may or may not win the series but it's fun. If we had the built in economic advantage Boston and NY had we;d have NY yankee style fans...expecting to win every year & heading for the exits in ALCS games in the 7th inning when things look bleak.You keep repeating this theme as if it's supposed to mean something...or hurt...I can't quite figure out which one...must be the dumb ass Yankee fan in me... :lol:

bigmack
10-21-2010, 11:23 PM
must be the dumb ass Yankee fan in me... :lol:
Every Tuesday in the basement of a building...

Cup o' Joe, sit in a circle of like minded loons, wait your turn & exclaim...

"My name is Miguel, & I'm a Yankee fanatic".

Group chimes, "Hi Miguel" :D

http://funnyfidos.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/yankees_fan.jpg

ElKabong
10-21-2010, 11:32 PM
PA,
Well then, you can start looking for a ballplayer for the yanks right now that was born and raised in NY. Chop chop!

I can't think of a single one from NY in pinkstripes. Not a one. Must not be many baseball fields for youngsters up there, eh? Time to post about too many cricket pitches in the city, robbing the athletic youth of NYC the opportunity to play baseball. I know those cricket matches on Tuesday nights leave the reStaurants empty in Manhattan. Boo hoo

:)

PaceAdvantage
10-21-2010, 11:45 PM
PA,
Well then, you can start looking for a ballplayer for the yanks right now that was born and raised in NY. Chop chop!

I can't think of a single one from NY in pinkstripes. Not a one. Must not be many baseball fields for youngsters up there, eh? Time to post about too many cricket pitches in the city, robbing the athletic youth of NYC the opportunity to play baseball. I know those cricket matches on Tuesday nights leave the reStaurants empty in Manhattan. Boo hoo

:)An interesting side note related to this topic:

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/birthplace.php

Looks like NY is third on the list. Or maybe they all moved out of state a few years after birth like A-Rod.

I don't quite get what crawled up your ass. I've never had a beef with you over this kind of thing, yet you keep driving home these empty seats and state of origin points like it's supposed to mean something. :lol:

Frankly, I couldn't give two shits if the fans leave early. I personally would not leave early, even if they were losing 8-2. I also don't give two shits if a few seats in the $1,500 a seat section remain empty, even for a playoff game.

All I care about is winning the next two games.

But that's just me. The dumb ass Yankee fan.

bigmack
10-22-2010, 12:05 AM
But that's just me. The dumb ass Yankee fan.
Such narrow-minded thought. I'll have you know that some of us think in a more sophisticated fashion.

"Talk to the hand" you hooligan.


http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u70/macktime/payanks.jpg

ElKabong
10-22-2010, 12:18 AM
Birthplace? F that man, I'm talking about growing up thru a program. Kids born in NY that grew up in FL or TX doesn't mean a thing.

So I'm supposed to think Roger Clemens is an Ohioan? Spring (tx) High school might have a beef with that thinking.

Oh, and turn on your sarcasm meter. Most of this back n forth is pure schtick. Nothing crawled up my ass other than the toilet paper with Tshithead's face on each sheet....

But the fans leaving early is something that IS big here in north Tx. Lot of NYers here that make arses of themselves, but you wouldn't know that up there.....Here tho we've put up with the nonsense from NY fans for yrs (detroit in 84-85 too). nice to see the Yankee fans hit exits early, it shuts up people down here.

Forever.

PaceAdvantage
10-22-2010, 12:32 AM
Hey man, whatever floats your boat. Have at it...

ElKabong
10-22-2010, 12:34 AM
An interesting side note related to this topic:

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/birthplace.php

Looks like NY is third on the list. .

Shit man, are kidding me? This list goes back to the 19th century.

ok, so NY had a lot of ballplayers in 1885. I'm not worthy :lol:

Good luck to your NO York Yankees next year.

bigmack
10-22-2010, 02:02 AM
Good luck to your NO York Yankees next year.
You seem unhinged. What gives?

OTM Al
10-22-2010, 09:00 AM
You seem unhinged. What gives?

People have as many problems dealing with success as with failure.

ElKabong
10-22-2010, 10:05 PM
Mack, did you not see my comment about PA's sarcasm meter not being on? Dude, anyone who knows me knows this is nothing to take serious. I''ve met a lot of folks on the board, they'll tell you this stuff is for fun.

R's up 5-1...someone's coming unhinged but it ain't me. :)

ElKabong
10-22-2010, 10:09 PM
People have as many problems dealing with success as with failure.

I'll bet you're a real kick at parties. Have explain jokes twice to you...You gals need to lighten up, this is an internet board, not a Trig exam

cj
10-22-2010, 10:50 PM
I'll bet you're a real kick at parties. Have explain jokes twice to you...You gals need to lighten up, this is an internet board, not a Trig exam

Al is a lot of fun, I'm sure you are as well. I'd love to meet you. Lighten up, Francises.

ElKabong
10-22-2010, 10:53 PM
That's Franklin to you, Sea Jay...

Next time you're in town, let me know. First beer's on me.

cj
10-22-2010, 10:55 PM
He was dazzling. It is pretty clear outside of CC the Yanks are weak on the pitching front. They better hit to have a chance.

I think it is safe to say I nailed this one. Regular season pitching is one thing...I was never impressed with the Yankees staff.

Who would have imagined the Rangers beating the Yankees with Lee pitching one game?

KingChas
10-23-2010, 12:32 AM
Anyone think with Lee pitching just 1 game, maybe left him a lot of time to house shop in the greater NY/NJ area for the near future? ;)

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 12:43 AM
I think so, Chas (and game 4 and maybe 7). He's about as good as gone. We can only hope he stays

Lee's wife has made comments that she's appreciative of the R's giving Cliff a day or two off to go to Benton between some starts. That's Texas' only hope-- his wife convinces him to stay.

I think the union will pressure him to take the highest bid and we all know who'll pony that up. The Yanks will get the best money game pitcher of the era, amybe of all time.

Plus he's a great teammate. CJ Wilson has praised Lee for his sharing his thought process on pitching (google up the subject, CJ said this during the angels series when the R's pulled away from anahiem). Sabathia said in Cleveland, Lee taught him how to relax on the day he pitches. He's the most valuable commodity in baseball.

Wish we could keep him, but it likely won't happen....but I'm going to enjoy his being here while i can

KingChas
10-23-2010, 12:57 AM
Wish we could keep him, but it likely won't happen....but I'm going to enjoy his being here while i can

Kind of inevitable,money talks.
Anyway enjoy Lee and enjoy the ride while you can.
Best of luck in the Series. :ThmbUp:

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 12:59 AM
Thank you, Chas. Win or lose, I'll do exactly that (enjoy) !

KingChas
10-23-2010, 01:28 AM
Yankee Logic;
If you can't beat'em..........buy'em. :D

Wouldn't suprise me to see a Phillie in pinstripes next year either.
Hint; If the contracts Werthy. ;)

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 01:53 AM
if they get Werth and Lee, turn out the lights.

Would they trade Granderson? Gardner? Swisher? Werth is more talented than those guys, but still it w/b hard to part with one. And if you don't play em all they'll get disgruntled.

As long as A Rod is there there they'll underachieve as they have for 7 yrs. All that talent and only one WS to show for it. Amazing (and I'm not picking an arguement, just stating the obvious).

The best 1B in baseball, "slump proof swing" Cano, Jeter (getting old), Macontent superstar at 3b, and an outfield that has a ton of talent. The best closer in baseball history. A rotation that should matchup w/ 28 of the 30 clubs.....solid everywhere but catcher (we ran Posada stupid early on) and maybe at SS for the future b/c of age.....everywhere else they have it all. Lose an all star 1B, run another one in.

Gotta wonder why that franchise has underachied since the A Rod trade.

OTM Al
10-23-2010, 05:00 AM
The blame A-Rod thing lives somewhere between jealousy and stupidity. Calling 6 times in the playoffs in the seven years underachieving and blaming it on one person? Texas couldn't win with him because they wouldn't or couldn't put a team around him. The Yankees are a whole different matter. Why not blame Cano as well? He's been there pretty much the same amount of time. Alex wasn't giving up an average of seven runs a game. No one wins a series like that.

My biggest disappointment though is that's the last game I'll see. I have Cablevision.....

KingChas
10-23-2010, 10:54 AM
if they get Werth and Lee, turn out the lights.

Would they trade Granderson? Gardner? Swisher? Werth is more talented than those guys, but still it w/b hard to part with one. And if you don't play em all they'll get disgruntled.



Why trade any?
With the addition of Werth who can also play centerfield.
The platooning could well rest these four.
One of the four taking the day off defensively,
but being used in the DH spot keeping all happy.

budman
10-23-2010, 12:31 PM
I'll be surprised if Lee leaves Texas Rangers. The much, much better team won the AL and I think he will stay with a winner. Nolan said that he would do whatever to keep him here. As many have said here in the Texas, the Yankees are old and worn out and got smacked by a team coming out of financial woes.

The only run the yanks got in G6 was a gift from the ump. And thank you Arod for making the last out as it did Ranger fans good after all the crap shoveled out of his mouth about the Rangers.

Anyway GO RANGERS!!!!!

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 01:08 PM
The blame A-Rod thing lives somewhere between jealousy and stupidity. Calling 6 times in the playoffs in the seven years underachieving and blaming it on one person? Texas couldn't win with him because they wouldn't or couldn't put a team around him. The Yankees are a whole different matter. Why not blame Cano as well? He's been there pretty much the same amount of time. Alex wasn't giving up an average of seven runs a game. No one wins a series like that.

My biggest disappointment though is that's the last game I'll see. I have Cablevision.....

Not acknowledging the Yanks have had the talent over the past 7 years to get to more than ONE world series is the very definition of stupidity. :)

So would be blaming Cano.

So would leaving a game in the 7th inning of a winnable game in the ALCS.

Living here and following the Rangers, it's well known that getting A Roid outta here made the R's a better TEAM. When she left, we won 30 + more games the following season. The princess left, the team became more cohesive.

When she left Seattle the Mariners won 115 or so games....the addition of Ichiro more than made up for princess leaving. Theri record proved it.

Get rid of A Roid and you'll have a better team. You won't be so jealous either, lol

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 01:33 PM
I'll be surprised if Lee leaves Texas Rangers. The much, much better team won the AL and I think he will stay with a winner. Nolan said that he would do whatever to keep him here. As many have said here in the Texas, the Yankees are old and worn out and got smacked by a team coming out of financial woes.

The only run the yanks got in G6 was a gift from the ump. And thank you Arod for making the last out as it did Ranger fans good after all the crap shoveled out of his mouth about the Rangers.

Anyway GO RANGERS!!!!!

I was pleasantly surprised to listen to Greenberg say on The Ticket late last nite (recorded, played at ~1am) that "Cliff Lee is in the budget", said it with total confidence. I dunno if he thinks they have an agreement in general, or if they're going to unload whatever it takes to keep him. If we could keep him that'd be awesome. He's the difference between a decent team and a WS contender.

I'll believe it (signing Lee) when I see it. IF it does happen, it's going to make this town go crazy b/c our front ofc for the first time in 39 years knows what it's doing. So many good arms traded, it was disappointing to say the least....So I sure hope you're right!

And you're kinda right about the yanks getting old....That window of opp for this particular group is shutting down....time to sign a new SS and catcher at the very least (and dump the Princess, of course)

OTM Al
10-23-2010, 01:34 PM
It's quite sad that you have no real joy in seeing your favorite team do something they've never done before and can only get off by trashing other people as if you were the one who did something.

Here's a baseball lesson for you. Money does not buy championships. It does get you to the playoffs though. Let me know what other team has made it six of the last seven years and then we can compare quality.

Of course Texas got better when they traded Alex away. They got good players out of the deal and were able to upgrade the rest of their team because they weren't spending all their money on one player. I guess you're the kind of guy who would tell his employer to pay him less though.

That Mariners team was so good by the way that they got waxed in the playoffs by............the Yanks.

Enjoy it while you can. New York will be back again next year. Texas, probably not so much.

ElKabong
10-23-2010, 01:42 PM
Sad? I'm playing you like a puppet and you can't see it. Dance for me, Goat :lol:

The Jonkees were insignificant for 10 years prior to free agency. They had to BUY their way to championships again.

PaceAdvantage
10-23-2010, 09:00 PM
Sad? I'm playing you like a puppet and you can't see it. Dance for me, Goat :lol:

The Jonkees were insignificant for 10 years prior to free agency. They had to BUY their way to championships again.Buy?

Did they BUY Cano?
Did they BUY Posada?
Did they BUY Jeter?
Did they BUY Rivera?
Did they BUY Pettitte?
Did they BUY their 18 game winner Hughes?
Did they BUY Joba?
Did they BUY Robertson?
Did they BUY Gardner?

I love this talk as if most of the core players on the Yankees the past couple of years have been nothing but free agent guns for hire.

FYI, there are 13 out of 25 guys on the Texas active roster who started their career in Texas, and there are 13 out of 25 guys on the NY Yankees active roster who started their career with the Yankees.

If the Yankees are doing nothing but buying their way into championships, how are the two teams equal in home-grown talent?

ihatenyra
10-23-2010, 11:31 PM
It's sad to see people still dog arod. Thought all that silliness ended after his historic playoff run last year where he carried the yankees to a championship

18 rbi's in 1 post season run and the yanks are better off without him :eek:

cj
10-24-2010, 12:14 AM
Buy?

Did they BUY Cano?
Did they BUY Posada?
Did they BUY Jeter?
Did they BUY Rivera?
Did they BUY Pettitte?
Did they BUY their 18 game winner Hughes?
Did they BUY Joba?
Did they BUY Robertson?
Did they BUY Gardner?

I love this talk as if most of the core players on the Yankees the past couple of years have been nothing but free agent guns for hire.

FYI, there are 13 out of 25 guys on the Texas active roster who started their career in Texas, and there are 13 out of 25 guys on the NY Yankees active roster who started their career with the Yankees.

If the Yankees are doing nothing but buying their way into championships, how are the two teams equal in home-grown talent?

Stop spinning. Check the salaries. Game. Set. Match. Every team has plenty of home grown talent, but the rest is the difference.

ElKabong
10-24-2010, 12:50 AM
It's sad to see people still dog arod. Thought all that silliness ended after his historic playoff run last year where he carried the yankees to a championship

18 rbi's in 1 post season run and the yanks are better off without him :eek:

One good postseason outta 7 yrs in ny. She's allsome!

According to baseball-reference A Rod hit .194 in the series...... Must be That Time of the Month for her, eh? This being Red October down here and all

ElKabong
10-24-2010, 01:50 AM
I'll be surprised if Lee leaves Texas Rangers. The much, much better team won the AL and I think he will stay with a winner. Nolan said that he would do whatever to keep him here. As many have said here in the Texas, the Yankees are old and worn out and got smacked by a team coming out of financial woes.

Anyway GO RANGERS!!!!!

Budman,
I go to this site linked below often, was surprised to see this and other quotes from Cliff about possibly staying. While I do think he'll be a yank in 2011, if I see more of these quotes we may see him back here or maybe in STL or a midwest team that wants to pony up.

http://www.newbergreport.com/article.asp?articleid=2075

Lee told Jon Paul Morosi of Fox Sports on Friday: “I love this situation I’m in. I love this team. I love my teammates. It’s been a fun ride. It’s been an unbelievable experience. . . . It’s the closest to home I’ve ever played. This is great for my family, to be this close to home. . . . I would like to think there were a lot of Arkansans watching this game. Hopefully we can make them proud and bring home the World Series championship.”

PaceAdvantage
10-24-2010, 08:38 PM
Stop spinning. Check the salaries. Game. Set. Match. Every team has plenty of home grown talent, but the rest is the difference.What spin? You act as if my list is comprised of mostly bench warmers...

ihatenyra
10-25-2010, 04:33 PM
One good postseason outta 7 yrs in ny. She's allsome!


Not a good postseason, a historic one that led to a championship. Not only did he hit hr's but he did it in clutch situations. What a terrible postseason player with a .290 career average

cj
10-25-2010, 04:37 PM
What spin? You act as if my list is comprised of mostly bench warmers...

Obviously the Yankees have done a decent job with the farm system, I'm not denying that. But most teams have 10 guys at least that are good and came up through the system. Many of the Rangers guys came up through the system, I watched them in AAA here in OKC.

There is simply no way to deny the money is the big factor. What is it, like 200 million to 50 million for the Rangers? The fact they win as little as they have should be embarrassing.

ElKabong
10-25-2010, 08:24 PM
Not a good postseason, a historic one that led to a championship. Not only did he hit hr's but he did it in clutch situations. What a terrible postseason player with a .290 career average

Something about "the last thing you do, is the first thing they remember".....

"I travelled to Arlington, and all I got was this lousy ass kicking" ;)

PaceAdvantage
10-25-2010, 10:05 PM
There is simply no way to deny the money is the big factor. What is it, like 200 million to 50 million for the Rangers? The fact they win as little as they have should be embarrassing.I'm not denying anything. I'm just pointing out that the perception of the Yankees as nothing but hired guns at the core is way false.

ElKabong
10-25-2010, 10:21 PM
not to jump in, but...I agree with you PA. The Yanks have had a very good organization and grew a lot of excellent talent thru the farm.

But the fact is when the Yanks wanted a FA, they usually got one. About 25 + other franchises don't have that luxury. Clubs like Texas couldn't afford a Texiera, had to trade him away to dump the salary (and oh what a great haul we made on that one!). Sure would be nice to be able to pay 200 mill in salaries, I would think other clubs could & would go to the WS more than once in 7 yrs with that kind of latitude

PaceAdvantage
10-25-2010, 10:41 PM
not to jump in, but...I agree with you PA. The Yanks have had a very good organization and grew a lot of excellent talent thru the farm.

But the fact is when the Yanks wanted a FA, they usually got one. About 25 + other franchises don't have that luxury. Clubs like Texas couldn't afford a Texiera, had to trade him away to dump the salary (and oh what a great haul we made on that one!). Sure would be nice to be able to pay 200 mill in salaries, I would think other clubs could & would go to the WS more than once in 7 yrs with that kind of latitudeThe Mets have had a pretty big payroll in comparison with the rest of the league...when was the last time they sniffed the WS? 2000?

Red Sox have been there twice...also a large payroll in comparison to the rest of the league...

Not sure why the Yankees are being busted upon...

They have appeared in SEVEN of the last FOURTEEN World Series. Winning FIVE of those SEVEN.

I guess having the biggest payroll DOES lead to winning after all.

ElKabong
10-26-2010, 12:34 AM
7 outta 14 is nice, but only 1 in 7 is no better than a team 2 months out of bankruptcy court and was unable to sign a top flite FA for awhile.

From 1996-2003 was greatness, but the last 7 yrs the yanks haven't lived up to their payroll. With that kind of payroll you expect more. If you disagree then I'll respect that.

Personally I think A Rod will get roasted by that clubhouse once he leaves just like he did here. It's no coincidence teams he leaves gets better....much better....each time.

So let me ask you, what FA's do the Yanks need to get back to the WS? TB will be a shell of itself, the Bosox will be the only al east threat....If Texas gets a top pitcher (Lee or whoever) then I'd think we maight be in the mix, and the Halos might be back if they sign Crawford and another top arm.

bigmack
10-26-2010, 12:55 AM
The Mets have had a pretty big payroll in comparison with the rest of the league...when was the last time they sniffed the WS? 2000?
Red Sox have been there twice...also a large payroll in comparison to the rest of the league...
Not sure why the Yankees are being busted upon...
They have appeared in SEVEN of the last FOURTEEN World Series. Winning FIVE of those SEVEN.
http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u70/macktime/10_25_10_18_13_01.png
"Not sure why the Yankees are being busted upon..."
That's why.

"Sal's like that bred Prima Donnas"

PaceAdvantage
10-26-2010, 03:13 AM
That's why.

"Sal's like that bred Prima Donnas"They're being busted upon (by my good pal Elkabong) for somehow underperforming despite top payroll. I don't see how appearing in 7 of the last 14 World Series is underperforming while winning 5. My good pal wants to just concentrate on the last seven or eight years, and that's fine.

But then again, I'm just a big dumb ass Yankee fan... :lol:

And I disagree with this whole fixation on A-Rod. Maybe in Texas he was this huge deal where the entire team revolved around him, because let's face it, it was the Texas Rangers back in 2001...he WAS the Texas Rangers for all intents and purposes...he hits 109 home runs in his first two years with the team, and is the MVP in his final year with Texas, and Elkabong says they were a better team without him... :lol:

But back to the point...The New York Yankees are not the Texas Rangers of 2001-2003. The whole team does not revolve around A-Rod. And I seriously doubt they are going to be a MUCH BETTER team when he is gone.

ElKabong
10-26-2010, 10:34 PM
They're being busted upon (by my good pal Elkabong) for somehow underperforming despite top payroll. I don't see how appearing in 7 of the last 14 World Series is underperforming while winning 5. My good pal wants to just concentrate on the last seven or eight years, and that's fine.

But then again, I'm just a big dumb ass Yankee fan... :lol:

And I disagree with this whole fixation on A-Rod. Maybe in Texas he was this huge deal where the entire team revolved around him, because let's face it, it was the Texas Rangers back in 2001...he WAS the Texas Rangers for all intents and purposes...he hits 109 home runs in his first two years with the team, and is the MVP in his final year with Texas, and Elkabong says they were a better team without him... :lol:

But back to the point...The New York Yankees are not the Texas Rangers of 2001-2003. The whole team does not revolve around A-Rod. And I seriously doubt they are going to be a MUCH BETTER team when he is gone.


Answers...

Paragraph one. NYY have gone to the series once in the past 7 years. So has Texas. The discussion was the A Roid era Yanks. Once in seven years. It's
called reality, and it sucks when A Rod is in your organization.

Paragraph 3. His numbers were a product of steroids and PED's. Total fraud, his entire career was roid aided. Again, the reality thing.

Paragraph 4. So when a team revolves around A Rod, they suck...Tell us something we don't know..... Now we find out a team that went to the world series 5 times in 7 years without A rod, signs A Rod, then goes to the world series once in seven years.....Tells me what I need to know! :)

ElKabong
10-26-2010, 10:38 PM
A Rod bitter? ;)

http://www.theunticket.com/musers-talk-to-fake-a-rod/

PaceAdvantage
10-26-2010, 10:53 PM
Answers...

Paragraph one. NYY have gone to the series once in the past 7 years. So has Texas. The discussion was the A Roid era Yanks. Once in seven years. It's
called reality, and it sucks when A Rod is in your organization.

Paragraph 3. His numbers were a product of steroids and PED's. Total fraud, his entire career was roid aided. Again, the reality thing.

Paragraph 4. So when a team revolves around A Rod, they suck...Tell us something we don't know..... Now we find out a team that went to the world series 5 times in 7 years without A rod, signs A Rod, then goes to the world series once in seven years.....Tells me what I need to know! :)You're almost as good at spinning as mosty...

a) So the Yankees with A-Rod and the Rangers without A-Rod have both gone to the series once in seven years. Well, actually, it's once in 10 years in the case of the Rangers, cause shouldn't we count those three years they had A-Rod when they didn't make it?

b) What's the difference? Are you saying those runs counted any less in the Texas box score? The point is, those numbers should be enough to help ANY team immensely...the fact that you can say they were a better team without that kind of production is insane.

c) I never said WHEN a team revolves around A-Rod they suck. I said the team (other than A-Rod), SUCKED...thus, when he came to town, the whole world revolved around him...thus a much greater chance for resentment and whatnot in the clubhouse. Not the case here with the Yankees, thus I don't see A-Rod having a similar negative impact here in NY. Therefore, no mythical "team better when he leaves" nonsense. Compared to when he was with Texas, here he is just another cog in the wheel.

PaceAdvantage
10-26-2010, 11:01 PM
And let's remember...all three years A-Rod was in Texas, they finished in LAST PLACE, despite his stellar numbers.

In all the years A-Rod has been a Yankee (seven), they have made the playoffs in six of those seven years, winning the division outright four times.

ElKabong
10-26-2010, 11:20 PM
Yes, the Rangers with A Rod finished last place for the 3 yrs he was here....as soon as he left the team improved and was in the al west race in the last week of the season.

With A Rod = Suck
Without A Rod= much improved

Same with a rod and Seattle

PaceAdvantage
10-26-2010, 11:23 PM
So, even though A-Rod set record after record, hit homer after homer, and drove in run after run...it's his fault the rest of Texas Rangers during those years sucked?

I get it now. This A-Rod fixation messes with your mind...

Hey look...I'd be pissed too if I spent a boatload of cash on a guy and I still finished in last place for three straight years. Not sure how you can blame A-Rod though...steroids or no steroids, the numbers were there...the rest of the team wasn't...

Blame management, not A-Rod...

ElKabong
10-26-2010, 11:30 PM
Me, pissed? Surely you jest. I thought I set you and Billie Goat straight on that many posts ago :)

We were glad A Roid took his act down the road. No one here is pissed. Hell, the Princess even watched strike 3 go by without as much as protecting the plate.

Thank you, Princess! Me so happy you no swingy. :) :) :)

PaceAdvantage
10-26-2010, 11:37 PM
Me, pissed? Surely you jest. I thought I set you and Billie Goat straight on that many posts ago :)

We were glad A Roid took his act down the road. No one here is pissed. Hell, the Princess even watched strike 3 go by without as much as protecting the plate.

Thank you, Princess! Me so happy you no swingy. :) :) :)Obviously, you don't come at this with a logical mind.

Guy hits 156 home runs and drives in 395 runs while he's with your team for three years. Team finishes last every year, and it's the fault of the guy who hit 156 home runs and had 395 RBIs.

Alrighty then...

Like I said...I'd be pissed too if I spent that kind of money and the team still finished last, despite monster numbers from my #1 investment. Still, taking out that frustration on A-Rod seems a bit misplaced based on his output during the Texas years...

ElKabong
10-27-2010, 01:05 AM
Actually, I come at this following my Rangers into the World Series. Meanwhile, you're playing fun with numbers. Alex Rodriguez' stats are the baseball equivalent of Empty Calories. Might I suggest a diet that is proven to shed problems in the clubhouse? ....DUMP A ROD

Oh shoot, keep him. You guys think stats = winning ballplayers. She's all yours :)

OK disappointed Jonkee fans, my work with youse guys is done. Time for me to focus on the World Series. The AL Pennant winner Texas Rangers are in the spotlight along with the San Francisco Giants. It'll be fun!

OTM Al
10-27-2010, 09:03 AM
I've seen this logic lately. It seems Cleveland is better off without LeBron James as well, 'cause who needs a guy like that?

RaceBookJoe
10-27-2010, 09:56 AM
I've seen this logic lately. It seems Cleveland is better off without LeBron James as well, 'cause who needs a guy like that?

Cowboys should be much better without " 1 playoff win" Romo. Kitna all the way !!!! :rolleyes:

cj
10-27-2010, 09:57 AM
I've seen this logic lately. It seems Cleveland is better off without LeBron James as well, 'cause who needs a guy like that?

There are plenty of guys that have good stats but are bad for teams. Kevin Martin was a top 5 scorer in the league and leaving Sacramento sure helped them.

Randy Moss is another guy that brings heartache, despite good numbers. This isn't fantasy sports.

cj's dad
10-27-2010, 10:01 AM
T.O. has sure helped the Bengals.

BTW - Lee vs. Pettite - Gone but not forgotten !

OTM Al
10-27-2010, 11:38 AM
There are plenty of guys that have good stats but are bad for teams. Kevin Martin was a top 5 scorer in the league and leaving Sacramento sure helped them.

Randy Moss is another guy that brings heartache, despite good numbers. This isn't fantasy sports.

Guys with good stats are very good for teams. Generally the problem is not that player but the rest of the team. Seems to me the Pat's did awfully well with Moss, not only with his catches but taking enough extra attention onto himself to open up guys like Welker. Don't know the other fellow as I don't follow basketball, but I don't recall Sacramento ever really being that good.

The biggest fantasy is sports is "team chemistry". Been plenty of teams that won that despised each other and been plenty of teams who loved each other that stunk.