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kid4rilla
09-11-2010, 11:57 AM
Is there a simple reason why tracks like Fairplex, who are playing around with lower takeout to increase handle, wouldn't shout it to the rafters?

It should be on the overlay of the simulcast feed. Those who didn't understand would ask and it would start getting on the lips of many folks. Most guys at the simulcast venue are completely oblivious to pool/takeout and how it effects them.

When Ellis Park tried the 4% take out pick 4 you'd have had to known an insider to discover that it was even happening.

Why isn't it thrown around more. Slots say 99% payout, which even those who don't understand like to hear.

BillW
09-11-2010, 12:50 PM
They're doing a great job of keeping it secret. I haven't heard about it. :blush:

Any links you can provide for the Fairplex take drop?

Is there a simple reason why tracks like Fairplex, who are playing around with lower takeout to increase handle, wouldn't shout it to the rafters?

It should be on the overlay of the simulcast feed. Those who didn't understand would ask and it would start getting on the lips of many folks. Most guys at the simulcast venue are completely oblivious to pool/takeout and how it effects them.

When Ellis Park tried the 4% take out pick 4 you'd have had to known an insider to discover that it was even happening.

Why isn't it thrown around more. Slots say 99% payout, which even those who don't understand like to hear.

Robert Goren
09-11-2010, 12:54 PM
Fairplex, really? Which pools and by how much?

Horseplayersbet.com
09-11-2010, 01:02 PM
Is there a simple reason why tracks like Fairplex, who are playing around with lower takeout to increase handle, wouldn't shout it to the rafters?

It should be on the overlay of the simulcast feed. Those who didn't understand would ask and it would start getting on the lips of many folks. Most guys at the simulcast venue are completely oblivious to pool/takeout and how it effects them.

When Ellis Park tried the 4% take out pick 4 you'd have had to known an insider to discover that it was even happening.

Why isn't it thrown around more. Slots say 99% payout, which even those who don't understand like to hear.
Fairplex? News to me. Do you mean Cal Racing Saturday Pick 4's?

There is a good reason why low takeout experiments get little exposure, and that is because the majority of tracks, simulcast centers, and ADWs do not like them because they make a lot less money on each bet.

Personally, I would love to see takeout go down to 12% on everything. I would exist with much lower margins, and it would come down to service as to who will win out getting the most players. However players would be plentiful as the game would see exponential growth.

I promoted Retama in my weekly email blast last week. I doubt many others if any other ADWs did the same.

kid4rilla
09-11-2010, 01:25 PM
Sorry...Tioga

I read here that they are looking to try to get it down to 9%.

kid4rilla
09-11-2010, 01:36 PM
There is a good reason why low takeout experiments get little exposure, and that is because the majority of tracks, simulcast centers, and ADWs do not like them because they make a lot less money on each bet.

I get that all of the above do not like to make less money on each bet, but this appears to be a test by Tioga Downs to see if the reduced takeout will have enough effect to increase their handle and therefore cash on volume.

Also, since most of the handle comes from off-track simulcasting, wouldn't Tioga Downs like to differentiate their product in the parlors with a large 12 PERCENT TAKEOUT sign right on the simulcast screen?

BillW
09-11-2010, 02:43 PM
Sorry...Tioga

I read here that they are looking to try to get it down to 9%.

Tioga kept a banner splashed across their feed saying something to the effect of "Lowest takeout in the nation". I'll have to look to find a picture.

BillW
09-11-2010, 02:44 PM
Here's one, from their site ...

http://www.tiogadowns.com/images/racing/TDlowesTAKEoutVB.jpg

DeanT
09-18-2010, 01:48 PM
John Pricci at HRI bangs the drum today.

"Newsflash Reduced Takeout = Handle Growth"

http://www.horseraceinsider.com/John-Pricci/09172010-news-flash-reduced-takeout-handle-growth/

Space Monkey
09-18-2010, 05:22 PM
I can find all the info on takeout I want, but where do I find a list of the high rebate tracks? I'm getting alittle tired of seeing my 8-1 ML horses get hammered down at the smaller tracks. I suspect the whales are killing the odds at these venues due to the rebates. I had an 8-1 bet down to 3-5 last week at Northlands. That's an extreme example, but 6-1 to 8-5 is a pretty common occurance. I believe it would be in my best interest to stay away from the tracks that give the best rebates and attract the whales. A list of tracks and their rebate % would be helpful.
Thanks.

InsideThePylons-MW
09-18-2010, 07:22 PM
I had an 8-1 bet down to 3-5 last week at Northlands. That's an extreme example, but 6-1 to 8-5 is a pretty common occurance.

That's whale money for sure.

Northlands is one of the tracks with the highest % of whale handle.

Will Rogers, Assiniboia and Camarero would be a couple of other just off the top of my head.

Space Monkey
09-18-2010, 08:19 PM
Thanks, NP has a low win takeout, (.158) but it doesn't mean a damn thing if the whales like your horse. I'm wondering if there is a link somewhere that lists them all, similiar to HANA's track ratings. I remember Dave mentioned them during one of his webinar's. I'll check his website out.

Zman179
09-19-2010, 10:11 AM
Will Rogers, Assiniboia and Camarero would be a couple of other just off the top of my head.

Ah, Camarero (formerly El Comandante). The track with a 41.6% takeout.

http://www.puertorico-herald.org/issues/2001/vol5n26/PRTakeOuts-en.html

Robert Fischer
09-24-2010, 01:29 AM
Ah, Camarero (formerly El Comandante). The track with a 41.6% takeout.

http://www.puertorico-herald.org/issues/2001/vol5n26/PRTakeOuts-en.html

"we treat the horseplayer like harrison bergeron"

Robert Goren
09-24-2010, 08:44 AM
I can find all the info on takeout I want, but where do I find a list of the high rebate tracks? I'm getting alittle tired of seeing my 8-1 ML horses get hammered down at the smaller tracks. I suspect the whales are killing the odds at these venues due to the rebates. I had an 8-1 bet down to 3-5 last week at Northlands. That's an extreme example, but 6-1 to 8-5 is a pretty common occurance. I believe it would be in my best interest to stay away from the tracks that give the best rebates and attract the whales. A list of tracks and their rebate % would be helpful.
Thanks.You might want to avoid tracks with small pools period. If you bet even a couple of hundred into those pools your odds will be cut dramatically.