Most overused trainer/rider excuse

[Valuist]

"He didn't handle the racetrack"

Its one thing if the track is a muddy bog or the turf is soggy like at Bel on Belmont day. 99% of the time, this is translatable into:
"I didn't do my job (either training or riding), the horse didn't run well but yes, the day fee bill is due". Santos is claiming this after the Haskell. Sorry, Jose, we're not buying it. If the DRF or other publications had any stones, they would edit out those meaningless quotes.

[andicap]

This goes back to the old "cuppy track" excuse which has since given way to
"the horse didn't handle the track."

The new excuse is a better one -- its more open-ended and wide-ranging.

[rmania]

I know this thread is entitled "most overused excuse" but I just had to share this one.

A number of years ago in SoCal, Eddie D was riding a mare which was the prohibitive (odds-ons) favorite in a 6 horse race and the bridge jumpers were out in force. Her previous race so was exceptional that it had "bounce" written all over it.

As expected (at least by me) the horse didn't even finish in the money.

Eddie D's post race excuse "I think she was in season":eek:

[Observer]

Originally posted by Valuist
"He didn't handle the racetrack"

... Santos is claiming this after the Haskell. ...

Had Funny Cide ever raced at Monmouth before?? Couldn't it be that he just maybe didn't like the track?? Wasn't the plan by Tagg to ship down the morning of the race?? Maybe it didn't agree with Funny Cide this time, and maybe it got him feeling a little sick in the hours leading up to the race, but not sick enough for any outside signs to show, and maybe he didn't handle the track because he wasn't himself .. and by the time they got home, and he was back in his own, natural surroundings, he spiked a fever.

Horses are not machines. They are like people and they have bad days. And there could be any number of reasons why he didn't handle the track. Maybe he just plain didn't like it, or maybe there were other factors involved.

It's amazing what a hero Santos was after guiding this horse to wins in the Derby and Preakness, especially after the "fake foto fiasco" .. and now people are ripping him to shreds.

[Valuist]

Sorry, Observer, but I'm not buying it. How come we never hear a trainer say, "you know what, we got beat by a better horse today." They won't say that because that would be admitting failure (or at least perceived failure).

If Funny Cide truly was a great horse, it wouldn't have mattered what kind of dirt track he was running on.

[VetScratch]

Observer,
Wasn't the plan by Tagg to ship down the morning of the race??
If Funny Cide actually vanned from SAR to MTH on the morning of the race, then Barclay Tagg made a foolish decision. Even after a horse has proven himself as a good shipper, every van ride is still a nervous adventure for Thoroughbreds. Even vanning the day prior to the race would be pushing it, IMHO.

[Observer]

Originally posted by Valuist
... How come we never hear a trainer say, "you know what, we got beat by a better horse today." They won't say that because that would be admitting failure (or at least perceived failure).

If Funny Cide truly was a great horse, it wouldn't have mattered what kind of dirt track he was running on.

First, that's BS .. I have heard trainers on TV saying they were "beat by a better horse today."

Second, who ever said Funny Cide was a "great" horse??? Don't horses have to prove greatness. The word great is way over-used in this game.

If people already believe Funny Cide is great .. then what do they call horses like Secretariat??

[Observer]

Originally posted by VetScratch
If Funny Cide actually vanned from SAR to MTH on the morning of the race, then Barclay Tagg made a foolish decision.

I can't say where I heard it from, because I can't recall .. maybe the evening news, maybe somewhere in print .. but I do know that was the plan .. to ship down very early the morning of the Haskell.

[Observer]

Click on the following link, and read under FUNNY CIDE - (POST 5)

Funny Cide Haskell Plans (http://www.monmouthpark.com/haskell/news.asp?newsid=2805)

[VetScratch]

Nice link, Observer.

Go figure! You would think a guy who has been vanning hunters and jumpers around would know better!

[Valuist]

VetScratch is right. Tagg was the one who decided to ship the day of the race so he has no one to blame but himself.

Observer-why the defensiveness re: Funny Cide? Did this horse make you good money in the Derby? Its time to move on, and this horse is not at the top of his form cycle. Money will be made betting against, not on him, the rest of 2003.

[Storm Cadet]

I hate it when they van horses from Aqueduct to Belmont on race day or visa versa. I hate to drive on the damn Belt Parkways and then the Southern St to the Cross Island. I can't imagine why Tagg would van the day of the race from Saratoga to Monmouth. It had to be a 6-7 hour drive (3 from Saratoga to the NY-NJ line and then another 2.5 to 3 to Monmouth Pk on a saturday).

Thats why most athletes travel the DAY before to acclimate and get proper rest BEFORE the event. It's not like FC got any rest on that ride down to the Jersey Shore...

[Observer]

Originally posted by Valuist
Observer-why the defensiveness re: Funny Cide? Did this horse make you good money in the Derby? Its time to move on, and this horse is not at the top of his form cycle. Money will be made betting against, not on him, the rest of 2003.

How was I being defensive regarding Funny Cide?? I was the one questioning how people could be calling this horse great.

What I was doing was offering up suggestions as to how there could be possibilities to him not handling the track. You were the one being critical of the comment that he didn't handle the track, and I was merely offering up suggestions as to how that could be possible.

If anything, I am defensive of narrow-mindedness when it comes to horses, and the bashing connections get for "excuses." Like I said before, horses are not machines, they are living, breathing beings .. it doesn't matter that they are animals .. they have aches/pains, good/bad moods, good/bad days and illnesses, too. I don't care who the horse is, I will be defensive when it comes to horses and people expecting them to be machines and not have "silly" excuses.

And I don't need to cash on a big score to be a fan of a horse. If anything, I have been skeptical of Funny Cide, even after his Derby/Preakness win .. that doesn't mean I will not believe he had reasons for a dull performance .. and I wasn't even surprised that it was a dull performance .. but if their could be excuses for his effort being so dull .. then so be it. I'm not the one that has a problem with it .. you were, based on your critque of the "not handling the track" comment made by Santos.

[VetScratch]

Observer,
A lot of savvy handicappers are here, but quite a few wouldn't know what leg to throw up first, if you know what I mean.:)

You sound like you have been around horses.

[Observer]

Even the savviest of handicappers often seem to lose sight of horses being creatures rather than machines.

While I hate losing as much as the next person, I do believe when a good horse throws in a sub-par performance, there is some sort of reason.

And in the heat of the moment, the connections may not know what the exact cause was, and may never know .. but the hungry press wants an answer, as does those following either as players or fans.

But, let me stop myself before I go on another long rant .. yes, I have been around horses, and it really irritates me when horses aren't allowed to have a bad day or are in general labeled stupid.

:D

[Maxspa]

All,
Something is not right with Funny Cide's performance in the Haskell! However, I don't believe that it had anything to do with Barclay Tagg's decision to ship down to Monmouth the day of the race. Barclay Tagg's shipping scenario has been different than some trainers but he has been successful with this type of strategy.So IMHO there are other avenues to pursue. First, like Bobby Frankel, he wanted his horse to have something left in his tank for the Travers( a tough grueling race) probably
his game plan for Jose Santos was be competitive but don't give the horse a hard race. Secondly, the horse appeared to need a race after the layoff and his lackluster performance certainly showed that. Generally speaking, geldings are more consistent
in their performances than their stallion counterparts, in that once they get sharp they hold their form longer. Perhaps he was a short horse and needed a race to be at his best? Then again there may be issues like muscle soreness? Some horses won't try if they are the least bit ouchy! Whatever the reason is for his poor performance, we'll know more after the Travers!
Maxspa
R.Mania- Fillies and mare when they are in season do not race as
well, Eddie D could have been right. Sometimes mares in
heat will give signs in the stall that this situation is
indeed the case. Rubbing their rear ends against the
back of the stall and movement of their outer areas of
their private parts are two specific examples. So it can
happen!

[freeneasy]

Originally posted by VetScratch
Observer,
A lot of savvy handicappers are here, but quite a few wouldn't know what leg to throw up first, if you know what I mean.:)

You sound like you have been around horses.

hey burt
hey ernie

whats up ernie? you look like someone just got a little cheap shot in on ya. is it that itchy person again? shes got a curveball for just about everything, ern, iam tell'n ya

well, i dont know burt, but, am i the only one on this board that just doesnt know which leg to throw up first when you go to mount a horse? :confused:

oh for petes sake ernie, heavens to betsy no, of coarse your not, your not the only one on this board that just doesnt know a squash from a cumquat. well at least according to itch head or scratch head or whatever her handle is, anyway didnt you know that ernie?

well... whadayamean burt:confused:

ernie... dont you know that theres a lot of savy handicappers on this board, but that hey, theres "quite a few" of them that wouldnt, know which leg to throw up first if they were mounting a horse, ah, if you know what i mean? that is;) ;) right

no i really didnt know that burt, is it true?

no, of coarse not ernie, everybody knows theres only one way to get on a horse

ooooooh i get it burt :) it just depends on which side of the horse you mount him from right burt;)

right ernie;)

so if you mount from the right side of the horse, you start with your right foot in the stirup, and if you mount from the left side of the horse you start with the left foot in the stirup otherwise if you mount from the right side and put your left foot in the stirup or if you mount from the left side and put your right foot in the stirup then your going to end up getting on the horse backwards, right burt !?!

right ernie!

ah well i knew that burt:)

not according to "head scratch" you didnt there ernie

well ok... hey wait a minute burt! i got an idea!

yeah, whats that ernie?

lets put itchey itch to the test;)

ok ern, sounds like a good idea, whadayagot in mind?

iam going to make a statement and put it in the form of a question, and i know that those whom scratch refered to as not knowing "which leg to throw up first" will "get the picture" before shes even finished reading the question.

ok scratch, heres the rules. one statement, looks like a question.

see scratch, its like this, again
if you were a fire hydrant and my dog came up to you and just plain took a wizz on you and your brand new shoes , which leg would he "throw up first" ?

get the picture? scratch? ok let me explain

that can be taken two ways, 1) just about how i feel about you and that is poy for making that lame duck statement and 2) just about how you feel about the men and women on this board in general. and that is getting po by you

well anyway the answer is, hey, it depends, if the object of his affections is to his left or to his right, doesnt matter, he can only piss one way... by throwing whichever leg is closest to the fire hydrent "up"

somehow you got a repreive to getting the boot outtahere and its not even a couple of days later when your back with the snipes and the winkies.

i mean who in the hell on this board are you referring to as your inferior, that they are so dumb that they just cant figure out their butt from a burnt bisquit and this according to you.

now i know i'am one of these but who the hell else are all these "quite a few" other hadicappers out of the "many savvy" hadicappers that you so secretively and seductively referred to? gee i dont think i would mention them by names if i were you either. you might not get the response that those little mouse ears want to hear.

[azibuck]

Well, that was no less readable than anything Derek2U has written.

Isn't the "shipping the day of the race" an angle Frankel uses? I can't remember if it was this BC or the one before it, but he vanned somebody at midnight into the morning of the race. I thought it was a horrible idea and that it had to be tiring for the horse. It did run poorly. Sorry I can't remember the specifics, but I clearly remember it happening. He was questioned about it and he said he did it in California all the time, and it was SOP. And he's the King, right?

[PaceAdvantage]

Most likely he didn't handle the track because his trip was the exact opposite of what was needed to win at 9f on the dirt @ Monmouth Park. So, yes, he didn't handle that track, because the connections were obviously not aware that you MUST be CLOSE EARLY.

[Valuist]

It didn't seem to bother Sky Mesa. He certainly wasn't near the lead.

[Observer]

Originally posted by PaceAdvantage
...you MUST be CLOSE EARLY.

It's a little difficult to get into a contending position early when you get sandwiched coming out of the gate.

I'm willing to give him a pass for this, whatever the excuse may be, but I've always been skeptical of this horse, and remain so.

[VetScratch]

Observer,
It's a little difficult to get into a contending position early when you get sandwiched coming out of the gate.

I have often wondered why racing has made no attempt to improve telecasting while promoting national TV events and simulcasting.

I think sports directors from ESPN or Wide World of Sports should be called in for advice.

However, here is my first stroke at improving our view of each race:

(1) Always show the head-on view of the gate at the start of each race (why wait for the rerun when folks are milling around?).

(2) Build infield camera towers at the epicenter of each turn and shoot down on the field at about a 45-degree angle as they round each turn.

(3) At some tracks, elevate the grandstand telephoto shot of the backstretch run so that the lanes are more evident.

Baseball, football, and hockey have all made their telecasts progressively better. Why not racing?

[Valuist]

I think the WORST thing about ESPN and the other networks IS their camera work. So many camera cuts, its impossible to trip note a race, let alone follow whoever you bet on. I like the idea of the shots looking down on the field but unfortunately the networks love to give us a head on shot going down the backstretch, then cut to a pan shot, then a cut to a head on on the turn. I need Dramamine to watch their telecasts.

[VetScratch]

I think symetrical camera locations and the geometry of ractracks would enable camera transitions to be timed such that continuity would appear almost seamless.

[PurplePower]

Originally posted by freeneasy
.....
so if you mount from the right side of the horse, you start with your right foot in the stirup, and if you mount from the left side of the horse you start with the left foot in the stirup otherwise if you mount from the right side and put your left foot in the stirup or if you mount from the left side and put your right foot in the stirup then your going to end up getting on the horse backwards, right burt !?!..... I could start by saying I don't want to get in the middle of something --- but then if that were true I just wouldn't post. But I've been so busy the past two months that I haven't even been reading until the past couple of days and I'm ready to be back "in the middle" for a while.

Actually "ernie", when mounting a race horse (always from the left side) the rider bends his left leg at a 90 degree angle and the trainer provides a balance point by placing hand under jockey's leg at the ankle. The rider then pushes up with left leg while pressing down on racehorse's withers with hands and swinging right leg over. Watch how some riders will suspend themselves for a second or two on their hands then ease themselves into the saddle. Jockeys would have to be as tall as and more flexible than a Rockette to get a foot in an iron of a racing saddle.

I do post stakes race interviews of jockeys and trainers of horses that finish second or third or a beaten favorite. (Martha gets to interview the winners.) I can almost write the quotes before going out for the interview. In Quarter Horse racing the "ground broke out from under him" is a popular theme. Y'all might be surprised at how many jockeys will say, "I was right where I wanted to be but that other (***word used for horse) wouldn't stop". OR " That (***Endearing term used in place of competing jockey's name) kept me boxed in on the turn and by the time I got clear I couldn't catch the (***another endearing term showing vocabulary versatility).

Interviewing beaten favorites is a tough assignment. Their damn horse just got beat. The trainer is upset -- the jockey may (or may not) have done something the trainer didn't like and they have had a word or two --- and I am supposed to walk up and say"what happened?'. "WE GOT BEAT YOU STUPID ****** ******, WHAT THE **** YOU THINK HAPPENED!!" is the response that I heard a couple of times and one that many more would probably like to say in such a situation. After his 3-5 favorite finished out of the money in a dull performance two year's ago, 2002 leading trainer Steve A. told me, "The LAST person I have to answer to is the PADDOCK HANDICAPPER!" (Ouch!)
Having trained I understand those feelings and often just ask rider to tell me about the trip unless I saw something that begs a question. Some are forthcoming and others are (******** descriptive term that interviewers use for jockeys). But, that is part of sports and I still think this is the best game in town.

[VetScratch]

PurplePower,
Jockeys would have to be as tall as and more flexible than a Rockette to get a foot in an iron of a racing saddle. With the possible exception of "The Stork," a journeyman and reliable off-track boy for many years on circuits in the Midwest/Mideast, but who has always hated his descriptive nickname!

[Fastracehorse]

The horse flipped his soft pallate.

fffastt

[Show Me the Wire]

PurplePower:

I agree with you the exercise rider or jock mounts on the left side of the horse, but, I think I throw, the exercise rider's or Jock's right leg over the right side of the horse, meaning the rider's right leg is bent close to a 90 degree angle, while the rider grasps the withers springing off the left leg. Since, I do not have my trainer's license yet, I may be doing this the wrong. I just throw whatever leg the rider offers me.

Regards,
Show Me the Wire

Perception is reality

[PurplePower]

Originally posted by Show Me the Wire
PurplePower:

I agree with you the exercise rider or jock mounts on the left side of the horse, but, I think I throw, the exercise rider's or Jock's right leg over the right side of the horse, meaning the rider's right leg is bent close to a 90 degree angle, while the rider grasps the withers springing off the left leg. Since, I do not have my trainer's license yet, I may be doing this the wrong. I just throw whatever leg the rider offers me. It would be kinda hard for rider to get right leg over horse's back if you were holding on to that leg. Rider bends left leg, springs off right, you support left leg and follow it up as rider swings right leg over to "off" side. The physics just doesn't work the other way. :)

[Tom]

I have read enough to know that I have read too much......
NOW we are arguing over how to get on a horse!
Yikes!
* * *
Race excuses: I think it was at Haileah a few years ago?
"Jumper alligator!"
Hosre actually leapt over a small gator on the track.

Forget the track, but a deer ran onto the track and into a horse during a race.

[VetScratch]

Tom,
NOW we are arguing over how to get on a horse!What other argument can possibly help your ROI?

Oops, I guess I forgot arguing about how to get off a horse! :) :) :)

[PurplePower]

I just realized I put this on another post and was too late to edit it off that one. But this has to do with interview of jockey last night.

At SHRP last night Juan Vasquez was my interviewee. He was beaten a long nose in a 400 yard Derby after a 350 yard side-by-side, shoulder to shoulder duel with eventual winner. "He knocked into me pretty hard (replay showed rear end being "scooted" - Reid) but my horse righted and took off and I thought I could beat him. That was a good horse that beat me (4-3-0 from 7 starts this year - Reid), but, damn it I thought I was going to beat him" I like interviewing Juan.

[Show Me the Wire]

Originally posted by PurplePower
It would be kinda hard for rider to get right leg over horse's back if you were holding on to that leg. Rider bends left leg, springs off right, you support left leg and follow it up as rider swings right leg over to "off" side. The physics just doesn't work the other way. :)

Tom and PurplePower:

I am not arguing, just pulling your leg!!!

"Since, I do not have my trainer's license yet, I may be doing this the wrong. I just throw whatever leg the rider offers me."

I probably should not post at aproximately 11:30 pm after being at the barn 5:30 am, going to the races, and socializing without rest.

Regards,
Show Me the Wire

Perception is reality

[Pace Cap'n]

Just heard on TVG:

A trainer explaining a poor run at Hollywood Park---

"He didn't like the airplanes."

Hollywood is near the airport, but..........

[VetScratch]

MISTAKEN IDENTITY: English hoop JD Smith has been found guilty of failing to take all reasonable and permissible measures to ensure his horse was given every chance to win after mistaking a racegoer for the winning post.

Smith was stood down for nine days from next Friday after England's Jockey Club disciplinary committee scrutinised the video of the race at Beverly, where Smith's mount was just beaten. The video showed Smith easing off his mount, Lakatoi, inside the final 200 metres.

Smith later said he thought a racegoer was the winning post.

On realising his error, he tried to atone but was narrowly beaten.

[VetScratch]

Stewards granted permission for Jockey S Snell to ride KING KELTRICE (Trainer Jenny James), one and a half kilogram over the gelding’s allotted weight. At a subsequent inquiry Jockey S Snell was fined $150 under AR-120(b).